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2x8 What's up with all of this cage returning tunneling that happing in every match now?
I was playing with a friend and they were upset about the cage retuning killers. I was like, "I never know where the cages are when I play killer, other then when I randomly happen upon them." They replied that the killers down someone and then run straight across the map. I didn't believe it until I saw this happen five games in a row. What's going on? I thought 2x8 was suppose to be chill and stuff. Why are killers acting like they do in 1vs4?
Answers
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Yeah it was happening in some of my games and it's always Wraiths, they cage you then meet you as you're getting unhooked lmao. Once you play 2v8 enough you get an idea of where the cage is gonna pop up. I got to the point as survivor that I could predict it when I saw a team mate go down. I dunno why they do it, I guess the queue times aren't long enough lol
25 -
yea it happening to me too a lot now if this mode returns cages need to be more random.
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I haven't played for a day or two, but it might be the nature of the players willing to sit in a Killer queue for 15-20 minutes as much as anything else. There's no way the more casual Killer players are willing to sit in a queue for that long. I don't know about anyone else, but I've definitely given up queuing for Killer games.
7 -
Know what most killer mains in here will tell you in this mode there is no such thing like tunneling camping and slugging when it IS DEFINITELY EVEN EASIER IN THIS MODE ALREADY
They downtalk everyone who critisize it
20 -
Yeah, I've seen this happen a few times now as well. I've seen both Huntress and Trapper do this. In one game we had this Nick who was caged until second stage because the Huntress kept following people who tried to go for the rescue and because the mechanic is basically Pyramidhead's cages they'd just teleport away. Holding this poor Nick hostage until the Huntress messed up and chased the wrong survivor (aka my duo) which allowed me to get the rescue. But, by then it was too late, as her "strategy" caused everyone to lose too much time trying to rescue this one player (we were down to five survivors at four gens at that point because her duo, a Wraith, was also hearding people away from gens and rescues.)
I mean I get it's a valid strategy, but it's still pretty goshdarn scummy.
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Well, I can tell you having 3 m1 killers, 1 insanely difficult character, and then huntress. So unless you play huntress the 100,000 pallets make the game a nightmare
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You're doing it wrong if you commit to chasing a decent player around pallets/windows. Wraith is all about hitting and running and finding people that are vulnerable. Trapper is about trapping and trying to funnel survivors into your traps. Hillbilly is about speed and positioning. You didn't mention nurse but obviously she ignores pallets too. Don't forget you have a team mate too. It is not optimal to stay in close proximity to the other killer but that doesn't mean you can't take advantage of the other killer. Pay attention to what the other killer is doing and take advantage of them when reasonable. Just don't over commit. With 8 survivors, there are probably 6 that can't run the killer worth a damn. Worry about the good survivors when the bad survivors are dead.
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Probably the best way to counter the massively parallel gens that I've seen these past three days.
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maybe you just had bad luck… happen more than you can think you know? besides, if the killers are willingly doing so probably it's because survivors are particularly toxic (rarely i get people respectful in my lobbies. most of the survivors tbag knowing that you can't catch them if the other killer isn't around due to the HUGE quantity of pallets present in the map… some even trashtalk in the endchat just for the sake of being toxic) or simply put rush gens, even under your nose (in that case it's fair to apply the concept "you tunnel generators so i tunnel survivors")
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I think this is happening for two reasons: 1. The mode has been out long enough for players to start figuring out how to optimize the fun out it. At the end of the day, people play to win and will use whatever strategy that helps them win the easiest. 2. There's not as much RNG built into 2v8 as you would think. It only seemed chaotic at first because it was new. Killers figured out the synergies faster because there's only two of them and fewer skill combinations to understand.
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Not healing near generators helps. If I anticipate a Wraith trying to guess my unhook location I'll Urban Evade away and find somebody else to heal me or just sneak off and do a gen injured
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Recently unhooked survivors should have some defence like ds or longer endurance.
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It's every match to be honest. You get caged and then the killer or their duo meets you on the other side of the map just as you get free.
12 -
survivors are adapting however and intercepting to body block during a cage tunnel
1 -
this happen to me yes.
I was having fun in 2v8 killers ruined it.
Post edited by EQWashu on6 -
Me the humble Trapper: TRAP TRAP TRAP TRAP TRAP TRAP
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Once you figure out how the system works, it is easy to traverse the map as Wraith just in time for the rescue. It wouldn't be so bad if it weren't for the 2-3 survivors who came to heal you and now they bodyblock your escape or stay camping the pallets as you try to defend yourself.
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What else are survivors supposed to do? They only have one objective to get out and that's gens? "Gen rush so ill be toxic as a response?" Are you serious? HOW DARE SURVIVORS DO THE ONLY OBJECTIVE THEY HAVE!!! Like… bruh…
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game sweat fest now not fun at all.
funny thing is you don't go up pips or grade nothing but there it is sweat sweat everywhere.
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I've only seen the skiddish survivors that run at the first sign of a heartbeat. So I can't concur on that one.
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Because killers have lot more time pressure than 1v4, without even any kind of slowdowns
1v4 is already an tunnelfest due to sheer speed of generators, now we have better sprintburst better pallets less gens and no slowdown, why did you thought it will be a "chill and fun" even
Hell, tunneling is literally the only way to stop survivors from "denying killers from playing a game", as game will ends in sub 3 minutes otherwise
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first of all tunneling isn't toxic, you can call it extremely unfun, but toxicity lies elsewhere (letting people bleeding on the ground despite hooks are available, hitting on the hook, keep walking on a dying survivor, etc etc)… it's a strategy and quite effective and secondly are you currently blaming the killer for doing their objective as well? please, at least be honest without having double standards… i'm not a guy that tunnel (i don't like it since i know how it feels when you are constantly chased without a break), but if i see people that actually play to win (aka play optimally: taking hits with basekit bt in order to protect their savior, sabotage my hooks when i'm trying to hook someone, don't fear of the killer and keep doing generators under your nose despite being really close to them) or are mean (tbags) i will adapt my gameplay as well because you are giving me no choices but to play in that way if i want to do at least some points
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It's counting hooks except on a 8 player scale. Even seasoned players like Otz and Hens were keeping track of Survivors they first hooked even though they probably didn't need to and could just go for chases.
It's the optimization mindset setting in
If it was 9 or 10 gens being required to fix, Killers could probably go for more chases instead of hooks but since there's only 8 gens and lots of pallets on the maps, Killers will have to use strategy to make up for the time shortage
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Never had this happen in my matches. At worst, sometimes a killer is run to me after I am uncaged and getting healed.
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I would imagine for some it is just habits. Those who tunnel regularly in normal matches probably do so. I think for some they may see it as genuine efficiency (I’ll let others debate that one) but for some I suspect they enjoy the feeling of power in tormenting someone else. It’s kind of like that player who knows they’re throwing the match but as long as they kill that one person they have set their mind to, they don’t care.
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lol but that pallet was my way out of chase…
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Applying your logic:
If the survs are willingly doing so probably it's because killers are particularly toxic (rarely do i get people respectful in my lobbies. Most of the killers greet you just after getting unhooked or hump you and virtually violate you for several minutes straight until you bleed out. Most of the killers do the former because it's so easy to know where cages spawn and the latter once it's down to three survs because they know its impossible for survs to complete the gens and they can scour the entire map to find them. Some even trashtalk in the endchat just for the sake of being toxic) or simply put tunnel and ignore pushing survs off gens (in that case it's fair to apply the concept "you tunnel survivors so I tunnel generators")
Like the hell? Even if that logic were true on either side it neither justifies nor excuses being toxic. (plus, I think you just equated survivors doing gens at all - since they cant really gen rush in this mode since they cant bring the tools - with tunneling? if guides had a basekit bnp and spawned in with a commodious tb....maybe. but that isnt the case.)
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killers habe insane gen regression basekit plus basekit nth to definitely find whoever was doing that hen and is still close. A nearly done gen regresses to zero in virtually no time.
- Plus survivors have to traverse a huge map to get to a cage, and the potential to not even get there is quite big due to two killers likely being between them and the cage. That's massive passive slowdown. they also have regular aura read to be able to quickly find and surprise survs,which balances out the abundance of pallets (tho i do think both the aura read and the sheer amount of pallets could be tuned down a little).
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My games have been lasting up to 15 minutes on killer without any tunneling and same playing as survivor. Quick matches only happen when killer players have no idea what they are doing. Even in 1vs4 those matches are pretty much as fast. Even when I played 8 man swf we could not gen rush in 2vs8 as consistently as in 1vs4. Killer swf:s could counter us.
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2v8 suffers the same problem for killers in 1v4. If you don't have someone dead and a few on death hook by 3-4 gens you'll most likely lose. It's natural to target someone that is injured or you've hooked before. As far as tunneling goes I've not really seen anyone hooking and going for the unhook. In that scenario you basically have 1 killer trying to hold the map so gens will fly.
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Fist of all tunneling isn't toxic, people should put this in their minds once and for all (like survivors sticked on generators), you like It or not this is the truth (irritating? Probably. But still a strategy nevertheless) and secondly this concept can be used even as survivor: if i see a killer that is tunneling someone be sure that i'll stick to generators because it means that the killer is actually trying to win rather than playing for fun. So i'll change my gameplay accordingly. As you said It goes both ways... In any case you should witness all the BS that i've aganist as killer then perhaps you'll see why i said those things... Regarding the 2vs8 mode survivors can genrush even here if they want (tbh it's even easier if they aren't potatoes) due to having tons of pallets at disposal and the map being bigger make all more easy…
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… You kinda missed the point of the post 😅 I assumed you came out of a bad killer match so I just wanted to give the equally biased survivor version of it - a bit tongue in cheek. But I suppose we somewhat agree on the bottom line so all good?
The one thing I can't get behind though is survs being able to "genrush" in 2v8. "focusing on any given gen" is not "genrushing" just like "managing to keep chases with any survivor short" isn't tunneling. The "going absolutely out of your way and (ab)using game mechanics toward that end" is what qualifies something as genrushing and tunneling. The big difference between killer and surv in this regard is if survs do this without bringing special builds/special tools this leads to them having a disadvantage, while a killer doing this will usually lead to them having an advantage (the exception being if they choose the wrong survivor and massively overcommit). There are killers that are more and killers that are less suitable for this but they never need to bring a specific "tunnel build" - I kinda wish they had to; just to get some tangible data on what people intend to do; you don't equip perks as a reaction to how the match goes. In any case, that brand of genrushing and tunneling is also the (only) one I consider detrimental to the match experience for anyone but the offender - that's somewhat clunky but for the sake of avoiding the word toxic since it's a throwaround term at this point. And I think these things shouldn't be in the game. That's my opinion though, feel free to disagree.
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Not gonna lie, I feel like this is where you start to see the mindset of some people when they play killer. Where their idea of playing the game is to actually play it as little as possible, and the only thing they want is for the number of players to go down. Honestly these people feel like the kind who would rather the game start with everybody on hook lmao.
Also you can see the lie where some people playing the killer have a victim mindset because they're alone versus a team. If the same behaviour comes up when they play with a teammate what is the reason? Or is it just habit?
To be fair, though, it's still the majority of killers who would rather play and catch you with skill, and tbh I live for a well placed axe from across the map - whether I'm the one throwing on getting hit 😁
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leave it to the dbd community to take the fun out of any and everything :)
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Tunneling in 2v8 is ridiculous, in 1v4 there is a penalty that the rest of the survivors could leave them on hook and just do gens. However 2v8 doesn't have this built in penalty. And I've seen them run clear across the map to move the hooked survivor back and forth. "Strategy" or abusing the system designed to prevent hook/cage camping. I feel it's the latter. You are welcome to your opinion but it's a scummy tactic like taking a knee in football to run out the clock or hitting someone with the ball so it goes out of bounds against the opposing team. It's just unsportsman like.
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Again is It aganist the rules? No. Is It pleasant to go aganist? Decisely No. Can be defined toxic? No since it's literally the killer's goal to kill survivors (it's like literally calling survivors toxic for doing generators... It's dumb since gens are their main goal).
Regarding the 8vs2 mode consider It an alpha version of what It could be in the future... Don't forget that devs are actually TESTING this mode in the live version of the game (we can't consider It a full developed mode for many obvious reasons)
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I definitely hope 2 vs 8 doesn't become a live version of the future of the game. I have played a lot of killer rounds, but I am not interested in the instant hooking aspect. I like the challenge of deciding how to pursue people base on the fact that I have to hook them. I am not a fan of kicking someone so that I can continue chasing nearby people. As far as the "how" is concerned, I completely understand that some people choose to tunnel. To me, tunneling is like littering because someone doesn't want to find the trash can. I don't mean to sound offensive, I just felt that something about the 2 vs 8 may be broken if many are resorting to tunneling.
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Always a Wraith doing this
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short answer: People who always feel they have to win at all costs have now optimized all the fun out of the game mode. This is with any game though. Once they discover the META then that’s all they run and the game becomes stale, boring and the same thing every match. Just like regular mode.
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These long killer queue times are not that bad, at least you can watch one or two yt videos in the meantime, progressing your watch lost. With near instant survivor queues I cannot even watch one 10 minute video on one evening xD.
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There are 8 survivors on the map. When a survivor is caged they pop up on the other side of the map. Since most survivors run in the opposite side of the killers, the killers will stop finding survivors where they are and move to the side of the map where the caged survivor is at. Since survivors group up to heal and auras poping everywhere. There's a good chance the killer is going to find a recently unhooked survivor. Any killer will go towards the injured survivor. Take note there's no indication to the killer you were just unhooked. You look like any other injured survivor and there's too many to keep track of.
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What made you think 2v8 is supposed to be chill? It is the same competitive game, only with twice as many Survivors and twice as many Killers. I think you are operating under an incorrect assumption. My guess is that the code tends to throw the Survivor to the cages furthest away from were downed. Killers have figured out the pattern and now cut across the map by the shortest route (a straight line) toward the section of the map furthest from the point where they stomped. This gives them very good odds of getting there fast. I've seen the Wraith doing this job very well given the speed. The Wraith then proceeds to take a free hit on the one unhooking, and then decides which to run down from a selection of two targets.
When you have really good coordination between Killers they have a 100% accurate rate of getting to the cage since the Survivor ends up at one of the two furthest away cages, so if in communication they just make sure one of them goes to each. Then the moment a sight-line is established the one who got the right one can relay the info to the other Killer and get joined for a conversion.
This is the reality of the 2v8, and a very effective tactic. You have to expect that Killers are going to get better at maximizing their performance. They KNOW that with such a large number of Survivors that a rescuer is already on that side of the map or on the way. It is efficient, therefore, to be where your targets are going to be.
Post edited by Rumplestiltskin on0 -
The amount of gaslighting in this thread is nauseating.
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Exactly, Killers have more pressure laid upon the Survivors in 2v8 with the removal of hooks on the Killer's end, so they have even less justification to intentionally tunnel.
1v4 is only good to tunnel when the Killer is horrible at the game compared to the Survivors they are facing. It is the only way to squeeze a win out of a deserved loss. This artificially inflates egos, making those Killers think they 'earned' their win, and puts them in this psychological death spiral of "I need to tunnel to win", and losing is merely "I didn't tunnel enough". Once they actually gain enough skill to walk without crutches, they can easily win the vast majority of matches without them.
The gameplay loop for Killer is 1 on hook, 1 in chase, 1 going for the rescue/heal, and 1 on gens. It takes 90s*5-7, or 7m30s-10m30s, for the gens to pop with a base Killer who can actually fill that gameplay loop, far from the 3m from an AFK Killer that you allege is normal.
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I think there are 2 reasons why:
- You can see the aura of the survivor healing them when a gen pops. The survivor that was uncaged doesn't have their aura revealed, which was a nice attempt to reduce tunnelling, but when you see someone across the map healing thin air it's pretty obvious what is happening.
- There's so many survivors and a lot of overlap in character (there's always like 2-3 Sable's and Lara's every game in my experience) that often you forget who you are even chasing and happen to find them again.
There's no way to fix the second one but they could easily fix the first one by making it so your aura is hidden when healing a teammate that was uncaged in the last 10 or so seconds. Or just simply hide your aura for a couple seconds after uncaging/being uncaged someone.
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or because wraith and billy are strategic good for tunneling and eliminating someone out of the game early is key to slow down generators in 2vs8.
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If I hit them, and see that they're emitting white, I usually don't pursue them. I get it though, when it's on accident.
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I get why killers are doing it - it's a quick way for an easy win, especially if the survivor isn't good in a chase. There's also nothing to discourage the tunneling. They learned the cage spawns, there's aura reading everytime a gen finishes, they can easily avoid BT, and there's no DS to worry about. It definitely doesn't help when survivors are choosing to rescue in front of the killer instead of waiting 2 seconds for the cage to move.
BHVR could implement something in the next iteration to protect the survivor from being tunneled out as quickly. Maybe a basekit DS where the survivor jumps up to stun the killer and then given haste to run away, that may help discourage tunneling and make the killers start going after the other nearby survivors instead of the rescued survivor.
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More like killers realized the time pressure in 2v8 is nowhere near comparable to 1v4, and since there is no perk builds or anything they are just forced to tunnel someone out if they want to play the game
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I've also been in games like that, and honestly it's just bad luck. You aren't going to win every match, and you shouldn't expect to. Killers have plenty of tools to deal with the apparent genrush. Pressure in 2v8 doesn't work the same way as it does in 1v4. Look at it like this: In 2v8, if two survivors are occupied that leaves six survivors, or three groups of two.
Three groups of two can work on three different generators and complete them faster because they're working together. This runs in contrast to 1v4, where if you're chasing one survivor, that leaves one group of two to work a generator and complete it in around 52 seconds while the one remaining survivor has to spend 90 seconds to complete a generator.
The more survivors you have off gens at any given time in 2v8, the better your odds are of winning.
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