MMR is still not fun
There are probably a ton of posts on this. However, it needs to be said again. MMR is just not fun on either role. Once you get into high MMR, it honestly becomes impossible to enjoy the game. I play both roles pretty evenly. Once I reached high MMR or at least I assume I am, when I see I am paired regularly with people a 1000 hours and above, the game seems impossible.
If I play survivor, it is always a killer that is running the usual gen regression meta build and cannot be mind games. If you don't have a safe loop or god pallet, you are done for. Then as killer, it is even worse because you are up against 4 people that cannot be mind gamed doesn't matter solo or SWF. I am forced to play using killers that can ignore loops, which is not really fun for the survivors or myself. It becomes stale quick playing only the same few killers so you stand a chance of at least a 2k.
I am a working adult now. I used to be a student when I started playing years back and could keep practicing to be as good as possible. That is kinda impossible to do when working. So, I am perpetually stuck at the lower cap of high MMR ever since I got there. I am unable to drop further for more relaxed games on either role because of the cap. The only option I have is literally to get good. Which is easier said than done while working.
Which is why I find myself only playing DBD now when there are game modes. The base game mode is just not fun. I think the lower MMR cap should be removed or at the least allow players who lose constantly at high MMR for a few days straight to drop to mid or low MMR to match their skill level currently.
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I agree, I don’t like having to try in this game (I’m being 100% serious, I don’t want to play this silly game in high MMR because I can’t run my funny builds T_T)
I still feel like MMR just dosent work for a game like this, with its ever changing balance and new broken (I use broken very lightly because I’ve seen some killer and survivors go crazy over stupid stuff) combos/perks every two weeks
Post edited by totallynotamegmain on1 -
Totally agree. The old matchmaking was not perfect. Like, you had people deranking to bully newbies. Despite that, it was still more tolerable. The game difficulty was pretty varied. Sometimes I get stomped 5 games in a row and other times I get 5 easy games in a row. So, it was more palatable. However, playing the game now? If you are stuck at the lower cap of high MMR, you are done for. Either try to get good playing only a couple hours a week or just get used to losing constantly.
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Imo the old rank system was superior to the current mmr. The worst thing about the current system is killers sharing mmr within a certain range, so if you play a killer you have never used before you will still be put in tough lobbies right away
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Makes the game way to sweaty, needs to be removed.
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Stop playing sweaty.
2 Hook everyone. Bring Rancor. Mori the Obsession at the end for some flair. Let the other three escape.
If that's too difficult, keep trying (and losing) until your losses accumulate to the point your MMR tanks to that level. Works for me.
If it's too easy, just whiff and miss attacks/farm, try to give the impression of trying but failing. You'll maintain/lower your MMR further until it's mind-numbingly easy at which point meme around or stomp for a few rounds if you want a challenge.
If your "funny builds" involve remaining competitive and getting 2+ kills, guess what, you'll be put in competitive lobbies.5 -
MMR as a concept isn't the issue. The devs could just fix it to the way it was at the start. You lose a lot? Low MMR. You win a lot? High MMR. With plenty of different levels in between. And then use that data to determine what balance decisions are good. You're complaining about sweaty matches... which will still exist if they just get rid of MMR, except they will be out of nowhere because "random matchmaking is such a good idea!" and you'll be stomped because you weren't prepared. Your solution doesn't solve anything.
I always find it funny: Even as you're talking about wanting to play the game chill, you're still complaining about killers bringing gen defence, which btw is SO last year. I don't know what it's gonna take for people to realize that gen defence doesn't work anymore. "Oh, but it beats bad players! That makes it meta, right?!" You bet! 👍🙄
You also sound like you care about survivors' fun while playing as killer, so all this probably falls on deaf ears. No other game's community prioritizes their opponents' fun over all else. I don't care about my opponents. That doesn't mean I bully them, a popular pastime of most of this game's players, but I do want my kills or escapes. You wanting that, but also caring about your opponents' fun and not getting good, does not compute. The game should not be balanced around out-of-game issues.
I do agree that if they're going to have MMR, at least make the dang thing work. 1 night recently it was just a loss fest for me. 12+ games in, none of them being wins, the game kept feeding me ridiculously difficult matches. I should have been put in lower MMR for easier matches, but that day the MMR just decided not to. This is why I don't want us going back to random matchmaking. Give me consistency. Same goes for balance. Why would you nerf killer perks into unusability, but survivor perks are always functional afterwards? I.e. the Hangman's rework compared to the Buckle Up rework. Why would you say you're nerfing Pain Res because the killer "simply hooks the survivor," but you don't acknowledge the survivor perks that have been meta since 2017? Just put people up against like-hours/like-skilled opponents, and balance off it. That's it.
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wish I at least knew my mmr tbh
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I am sure it will be difficult to implement but probably needs to be tested - it seems the mid MMR (where I’d imagine the vast majority of players are) might be with worth splitting into sub ranges?
I think very high MMR and very low MMR probably have a relatively lower number of people in it but the mid MMR range possible has those teetering on the edge of both ends of the spectrum meaning far more likely to provide mismatches when matchmaking throws them together?
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losing on purpose isn’t “not playing sweaty” that’s just losing on purpose.
It amazes me how many killers think if a survivor brings DS DH etc. they are always “sweaty” and how many survivor think a killer getting more then 1 kill is “sweaty”
Winning a game isn’t playing “sweaty” bringing full gen regression/progression builds and rushing to end the match as fast as possible is sweaty.
I shouldn’t be forced to lose on purpose just to have fun in the game, that’s not how any game should be made.
Getting 2+ kills dose not make you competitive 😂 if I bring backpack bubba (RIP old space Billy) and not hook anyone until I down everyone with starstruck because everyone ran into me that’s not being competitive that’s running a meme build that worked.
Being competitive is defined as: “having or displaying a strong desire to be more successful than others”
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Congrats, you reached softcap and ended up on the bottom of the foodchain again. Enjoy your stay.
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You know what?
I have way more fun in the modes and events both sides than the main game too now and rarely like to play except for practice or a rift. All it is, is the same sweaty full four generator perks against the same sweaty Survivor Meta perks as always. It sucks as a hybrid player who likes both sides. And this issue is perennial. The second you win too hard regardless of hours, that's when you unlock true sweats and it's not any fun anymore.
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Your intent isn't what's being recorded, it's the result, as the result is generally what is impacting the experience of other players.
Unfortunately, 2+ kills is what the current MMR seems to see as a "winning/stalemate condition". And as such, those who hit that mark are deemed to have been competitively successful for a match. Even if it's a meme build, it's a build that worked, ergo: "sweat".
And while by definition of the system I'm "losing", I heartily enjoy going for 8 Hooks 1 Kill as my resulting lobbies allow me to be more of a director of action: I can try for jumpscares, what I think are cinematic moments for players/myself, tense gameplay for them, etc.: creating an atmosphere (which is what I find fun). Without needing to be tethered to the clock or perfecting time efficiency in order to be able to waste time on such endeavors.The devs should take a look at why people want kills even if they're not "competitive".
Frankly, I'd like to see what the community reaction would be to a game mode where there were no hooks (or if there are it will instantly sacrifice the survivor), the Killer can Mori a dying survivor whenever, there's basekit infinite Unbreakable, killed survivors respawn, Killer gets a lot of bloodpoints for Mori'ing a survivor, and survivors get a decent chunk of bloodpoints for destroying Totems that periodically randomly respawn around the map (also Totems can now spawn in glyph spawns, bloodpoints probably given to nearby survivors too, but not globally). Game ends after a certain period of time. Pallets could possibly respawn, breaking Totems could possibly do something extra too (gameplay wise) and actualy probably just use glyphs instead of totems to avoid animation issues/terrain clipping.
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Honestly, even though I think before MMR my games were better (I've had in the past people realize to do gens before unhooking a basement Bubba or camping/proxy camping Trapper/Hag in basement) - I think even if you rip MMR out of the game, people have developed certain techniques and perk builds to go back to casual DBD.
Even though I prefer a more chill and casual Dead By Daylight experience as both killer and survivor, I don't think it would change anything.
People would still run gen defense (even against lower ranked people with less knowledge and experience) or meta perks such as Resilience and just staying on a gen to progress the game. I do believe even if some of my randoms are confusing in what they do, they play in a more competitive way and taking it out of the game would just cause all the knowledge the players have gained from MMR being introduced and making both survivor and killer gameplay being a steamroll without it in place.
I personally dislike MMR to a certain extent, but taking it away would just make games more of a toss-up than what they already are.
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I've been wondering how would a perk related MMR work. Like, if survivors have mostly the most used perks, then they go against a killer with metaperks that are mostly used… This is just a rough idea I have been thinking
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"gen defence, which btw is SO last year"
Except for the fact among the statistics published by the devs, gen regression perks are still among the top 10 perks picked. If they were so last year, they would have disappeared. I can give you an actual meta build that died. The machine gun build, unrelenting + STBFL. In their original version, they gave killers essentially zero attack cooldown. You don't see anyone run that build anymore. Gen defence was nerfed but they are still used especially at higher MMR, you will not see a killer run zero gen regression perks.
"You also sound like you care about survivors' fun while playing as killer"
So, you got I care more about survivor mains from reading this ?
" Then as killer, it is even worse because you are up against 4 people that cannot be mind gamed doesn't matter solo or SWF."
Interesting indeed.
Maybe you don't but into neutrality. I do. There is no us vs them. Both sides deserve to be fun to play. Now you are right it is not your job to care about the other side. However, it is the same mentality that leads to sweat on both sides. All the unfun tactics that both side complain about is the results of this.
I play fair when I play both sides. As survivor, I don't go out of my way to bully the killer. If the killer is near me, I try for a flashlight safe, I don't chase them around the map to ruin their day. That is because it sucks for the killer player when you have survivors that are up in their face. As a killer, I always go for a new target, never tunnel or camp. I could make my life as killer way easier by tunnelling out survivors near death hook. However, I know it sucks for that survivor player. So, I go out of my way to go for new targets. Which is also what the devs are pushing for killers to do. However, that is easier said than done at higher MMR.
"1 night recently it was just a loss fest for me. 12+ games in, none of them being wins, the game kept feeding me ridiculously difficult matches. I should have been put in lower MMR for easier matches, but that day the MMR just decided not to."
That is because there is a soft cap for MMR. You will never go below that soft cap no matter how many times you lose. So, if you make it to mid MMR or high MMR. You will lower in MMR until you hit that soft cap and stay there. There was a twitter post by a Halo developer on MMR. Even he ensured MMR allowed for variety, some games you get easy games, some you get stomped, and others that are a close call. That is not the case with DBD's MMR system.
"Same goes for balance. Why would you nerf killer perks into unusability, but survivor perks are always functional afterwards? I.e. the Hangman's rework compared to the Buckle Up rework. "
I think you are exaggerating when you say survivor perks are always functional. Definitely not. There are a couple that did become useless. However, they do certainly take longer to hit survivor perks compared to killer perks. That I have definitely noticed. I assume because there is some bias. Which may or may not be true. I have noticed that some of the devs share that same us vs them mentality when speaking about killers. It could also be from a business perspective, they decided catering to the majority is better. You need 4 survivors for every killer. I am sure survivor mains will disagree on that.3 -
I always love reading people comments when they envision how much fun would be if matchmaking worked based on <literally anything they can come up with> instead of kills and escapes.
Of course those concepts are all laughable.
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This is the answer. People need to die more often than they survive as survivor or average more escapes than kills as killer in order to lower their MMR.
The most fun way to do that as killer is to run off-meta builds, spread out hooks, focus on scaring people or making them laugh as opposed to 100% efficiency, etc.
The most fun way to do that as survivor is to run off-meta builds and play very altruistically (e.g. always go for endgame/basement saves even if it's likely to get you killed).
It feels like people fall into the vicious cycle of win more > matches get hard > switch to better build > win more. Just stop sweating and don't be afraid to die / not get a 2k+. This is a casual game and you will have a better experience if you treat it that way.
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