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Can someone tell me why killers need 20 aura reading perks?

Is patrolling gens that hard? With hook camping/tunneling being at a game breaking high do they really need more aura reading? Get hooked, aura read, get unhooked, aura read, break a gen, aura read, pallet drop, aura read, lose chase, aura read, gens finishes, aura read. Why do killers need so many different perks that do the same thing? Get some damn variety. Anyone remember when killers actually had to do work to find survivors? Like you know "hunt" them as huntress? Like holy hell, survivors had ONE aura hiding perk. Then because tunneling was an issue they gave off the record until you perform a "suspicious action". Like why do survivors hide? Because that's all we can do anymore and yall made it that way.

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Comments

  • KaTo1337
    KaTo1337 Member Posts: 550

    Because the game is overloaded with stuff, so its a lot copy + paste in the perks.

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,947

    I have used distortion, I know it can be strong and I do know it is also used (or abused?) by survivors who hide rather than interact. That is boring in itself and not fun for killer either… but there has to be a middle ground surely?

    Well either way it doesn't matter now as they essentially killed Distortion so I guess the aura reading meta is in full swing now.

  • Spare_Them_Mori_Me
    Spare_Them_Mori_Me Member Posts: 1,681

    Im not. Object is much more fun.

    And focus on word choice instead of substance, fine by me. My 'proof' is experience and other word of mouth. Definitely not BHVR stats or nitelight BS.

    You should learn to make more moderated statements. Do I need to tell you how it otherwise sounds?

    I say what I mean. Your opinion of it can be whatever you want. Its all about your perspective.

  • Autharia
    Autharia Member Posts: 391

    Survivors have 137 perks in game atm and killers have 118. A large chunk of survivor ones have big stipulations for a small buff for non critical objectives.

  • AssortedSorting
    AssortedSorting Member Posts: 1,348

    Zone control perks (see boons). Seeker Perks (Searching for a Chest-like Item to interact with it, but for Killer). Meme-able perk like No Mither/Bardic. Disinformation Objective (See Dream Pallets/Mirrored Illusion). Ability Override Perk (see Blighted Serum, arguably Exhaustion Perks). Resource manipulation (See: Any Means Necessary).

    You know, speaking of that, the Killer has zero chase resources. Maybe they could include a Perk that lets the player lay down a tripwire trap?

  • Roaroftime
    Roaroftime Member Posts: 433

    20 Aura reading perks and survivors had 1 mid perk to counter them which has now been ruined because killers moaned too much about survivors trying to enjoy themselves.

  • Spare_Them_Mori_Me
    Spare_Them_Mori_Me Member Posts: 1,681
    edited October 27

    I see. I can't argue with this because its correct. Thank you.

    Yeah, apologies. I was using my own experiences as the de-facto reality and that's clearly not the case. Perspective expanded.

    Please define PITA? Not familiar.

    Edit: Nevermind, I understand it now lol

  • Seraphor
    Seraphor Member Posts: 9,421

    You mean: One bottom tier perk. Two mid tier perks. And a top tier perk which invalidated the other three until it was nerfed back to an upper-mid tier.

    Off the Record and Shadow Step are still great perks, and new Distortion is still good so long as you are chased by the killer at some point in the game.

    Sole Survivor is still very niche but it exists.

  • Ryuhi
    Ryuhi Member Posts: 3,826

    All good friend 😀

    our personal experiences do a lot with our overall outlook, so its understandable.

  • Qjeh_raikos
    Qjeh_raikos Member Posts: 1

    You know what's funny? If you'd say that in 2016, you'd have been criticized.

    Unrelenting Description: You recuperate faster from any attack made with your main weapon. The cooldown of missed attacks is reduced by 16/22/30%. The cooldown of successful attacks is decreased by 10/16/22%.

    Pair that with STBFL.
    STBFL Description: For as long as your Obsession is alive, the following effects apply: Reduces the cooldown duration of missed basic attacks by 14/18/20%. Reduces the cooldown duration of successful basic attacks by 25/29/33%.

    We used to call it "Machine Gun".

  • Ryuhi
    Ryuhi Member Posts: 3,826

    Its kinda wild how a lot of both sides complaints basically boil down to removing options from the other side. It would be nice if that was considered more often, regardless of role.

  • Spare_Them_Mori_Me
    Spare_Them_Mori_Me Member Posts: 1,681

    +

    _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

    Bhvr, this should fix the game. It's an equal trade. Just axe all aura and second chance perks.

    Honestly, I'd wonder what the metas would settle on if that happened. 🤔

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,846
    edited October 27

    We are talking about killer perks. Territorial perks for killers are generally not a good idea because they would be effective in 3gens and not much else. Maybe on a small map like The Game or Midwich but these maps are already not good for survivors. You generally have very limited capabilities to decide the direction a survivor will run in because they are the one that is running from you, not the other way around.

    Seeker perks are fundamentally not in tune with the killer role. Putting a second objective on the killer can only work, if it was somehow stronger than going after survivors. Which would immediately result in the perk either being broken or incredibly weak. Not to mention, that it would take away interaction between the killer and the survivors.

    Meme perks are a fine idea, although we do have some of those already. Distressing is mostly a meme perk and though Two Can Play doesn't nerf you directly it's pretty close to a meme perk as well.

    Disinformation perks similar to Freddy's dream pallets might sound like a good idea but the problem is that they need some restrictions and are likely not going to work against SWFs (see original Legion concept). These restrictions could either come with these perks being hex perks or something else. Hex perks in general are probably not the best approach anymore. Let's be honest, there is a reason why they are quite unpopular. Other restrictions again are very hard to balance. There is also the issue that as of now 2 killers already have fake pallets (Doctor and Freddy).

    I have no idea how you would even attempt to balance an ability overriding perk. Not to mention, that these would also need some restrictions so that you couldn't just dash and immediately get a M1. Otherwise, playing against a Myers or Ghostface would be a horrible time. Exhaustion perks for killers have the same general flaw in concept.

    Resource manipulation counts as chase perks. We do have some of these already. Bamboozle, Crowd Control and Blood Favour come to mind. What else would you do? Something like Mage Hand? That's literally a killer power, so that will never happen and with good reason. If it was Mage Hand for windows, that would be horrible to play against and I guarantee you such a perk would be hated. Unless of course it came with a downside so terrible that the perk would never be used. Remote pallet breaking is already a part of Knight's power, so that is not an option either. Not to mention that people would hate such a perk as well.

    You only have so many options and you need to keep in mind that these perks could synergise with killer powers. We already know that the devs are not too keen on the idea to ban some perks from specific killers, so that issue can't be disregarded.

  • LordGlint
    LordGlint Member Posts: 8,545

    Just wanted to add devs try to avoid perks that are used to buff killers powers since it makes balance a headache. Remember the original function of tinkerer?

  • I_Cant_Loop
    I_Cant_Loop Member Posts: 624

    I play about 50/50 survivor/killer, and I feel that nerfing Distortion was a terrible decision by the devs. They essentially eliminated stealth playstyle as an option for survivors who prefer to play that way, either because they enjoy it more or because they aren't great at looping. It's really frustrating that perks get nerfed not because they are OP (which old Distortion was not), but because they are "used too frequently". Nobody ever bothered considering that the reason it was used frequently is because it is the only way to viably play a stealth playstyle due to the crazy amount of aura reading abilities available to killers now.

  • AssortedSorting
    AssortedSorting Member Posts: 1,348
    edited October 27

    Hmm, what about:

    Remnant: Solitude - See the Auras of Dull Totems. You can interact with them to create a Remnant: Solitude Totem (Similar to a Rekindled Totem). You gain the Undetectable Status while within 32m of this Totem and for 6/8/10s after leaving it.

    (Remnants are cleansed/blessed faster than other Totems and are consumed by The Entity when cleansed.)


    Emissary: Telltale - Blood Ravens spawn within the Trial. The Aura of Blood Ravens appear to you within 16m. Interaction with a Blood Raven will reveal the Aura of Survivors within 32m for 10s. Survivors can disturb Blood Ravens, however you will not.


    Fair, there are some meme perks.

    Regarding resource manipulation, that is also fair. Though I was thinking about a perk that introduces a new resource, rather than a removal or blockage of one. Though I don’t know what a Killer resource could be, perhaps:

    Graverobber - Searching a locker disturbs a restless spirit. The next time a Survivor moves within 8m in front of this Locker, a Haunt will burst from it. Survivors disturbed by this Haunt will Scream and become Hindered by 10% for 4/5/6s

    Scourge Hook: Twisted Ties - After Hooking a Survivor on a scourge Hook, gain a Token. While you have a Token, standing underneath an Empty Scourge Hook allows you to press the Ability Button while looking at another Empty Scourge hook to teleport to that location.

  • Caiman
    Caiman Member Posts: 2,897

    It doesn't matter what the new meta would be, because every perk in it would suddenly become "unfair" and "oppressive" and players would demand it be removed too.

  • Rokku_Rorru
    Rokku_Rorru Member Posts: 1,308

    it would be a simple as including the aura read notification from 2v8 in 1v4. That had to be one of the best new player experience improvements they've added in years. BUT learnt NOTHING from it as per usual.

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,846

    Yeah, I haven't played at the time but I'm aware of the original effect. Good point.

    Remnant Solitude sounds like a pretty strong perk on small maps but much less impactful on big maps. Getting value out of it would require a survivor to be somewhat close to that area. Plus, if they see you, the undetectable effect is useless, so you also need some large LoS blockers.

    If we compare that to other undetectable perks that is quite niche. On smaller maps on the other hand you would be undectable for pretty much the entire match. I'm not 100% against such a perk but it would be quite a pain to play against on something like Midwich.

    Emissary: Telltale sounds like an interesting perk although we are back at aura perks. The general concept of these could be nice though, if we were to redesign them to act like a little trap. Say you put a Blood Raven somewhere and when it is disturbed, the survivor that disturbed it gets some kind of debuff.

    I like the general concept a lot, however each Blood Raven would need to have a pretty small range, you would need to be able to place multiple ones (otherwise it would only work for a more territorial play style) and survivors would need some kind of way to get rid of them. At that point it's complex enough to be the foundation of an entire killer power. It would probably also need a downside that Blood Ravens remain inactive for some time when you place them because otherwise it would end up similarly to Skull Merchant's drones where you just place one at whatever loop you are when chasing a survivor.

    Graverobber sounds a little difficult to balance. It could be pretty strong on indoor maps. It would probably counter the shack and some of the other strong structures as well. Although that would depend on how many lockers can be affected simultaneously. If it's multiple ones, that could make this perk very strong (although probably not very fun to play against since there is pretty much nothing you can do once you are at a loop with such a locker), if it was only one that would make this perk very niche. Again, I very much like the concept but there would need to be a lot of fine tuning.

    I'm not sure what to think of Scourge Hook: Twisted Ties. It would be massively RNG reliant but it could be a pretty powerful perk with a bit of luck.

    Honestly, I respect your creativity. These are some very interesting indeas. If you haven't done so, you should definitely make a post in Feedback and Suggestions.

  • AssortedSorting
    AssortedSorting Member Posts: 1,348

    appreciate the kind words, might post those there, and moreso appreciate the feedback, good points.

    And in regards to the Aura part of Emissary’s, yeah. Unfortunately the main cornerstones of the game have already been leveraged by many existing perks, don’t think there’s new area to tread: Information, Mobility, Lethality, Delay. At this point it’s a question on how you package everything.

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,846

    That was the point of my first post in this thread. We have something for pretty much every niche already and with the amount of perks both sides have, it's not very surprising that any category will have a lot of perks that fit into it.

    The idea certainly wasn't to give killers a specific amount of aura perks but it's a natural outcome when there are so many perks in the game and many of them are hybrids that fit multiple categories because one effect on its own might be too difficult to balance or straight up useless without the other (Friends Til The End is one such example).

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,947

    Yeah I don't understand it, particularly when buffing so many aura perks/addons over the last while.

    I get why killers find stealth playstyle annoying as survivors who constantly hide can make for boring plays but on the other hand I also get it and I don't feel the need to tell these players how they should enjoy the game.

    I spent a lot of my first hours in the game absolutely terrified and hiding (lol) and avoiding chases whenever possible and I still had fun doing that, believe it or not. I ended up being the complete opposite thousands of hours later but I personally don't hate immersed players as I get it…. just so long as they do the damn gens I am fine with taking chase