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What perks or mechanics would you make basekit?
You know how some folks say survivors should have basekit Unbreakable or killers should have basekit old BBQ? Well, what perks do YOU think should be basekit? They can also be mechanics that do not currently exist as perks.
Personally, I vouch for basekit Corrupt Intervention and Unbreakable. I think that survivors having access to one (1) instance of self pick-up would alleviate the slugging issue a lot. Whereas some killers struggle a lot with the early game and Corrupt Intervention is a necessary staple to their builds, leaving them with a permanently occupied perk slot. BEAR IN MIND that incorporating these two perks as basekit would require other adjustments to be implemented into the game so that they are balanced.
Comments
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Shattered Hope.
It would be kinda pointless now, but I think having its effect basekit would allow for future Boon perks / changes to be better and more in-line with what those perks should be.
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Whispers, in some form. A method to deal with survivors that hide too much, but not as impactful as aura reading.
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Decisive strike.
Before I get crucified, hear me out. Having a perk that offers game health locked behind a paywall is absurd. However, I do understand, that tunneling is sometimes a necessary evil for killers to create some pressure. Therefore I would not add ds just in it's current state, but with limitations.
Something along the lines of this:
- It becomes weaker the further the match progresses until it completely deactivates in end game.
- The survivor with it active cannot bodyblock off hook for another survivor. I don't know how this could be implemented effectively, but it would need to happen to disincetivice the offencive usage of it.
- The duration of the stun is increased when using ds as a perk, just like bt.
- Some form of slowdown mechanic for the killer that rewards spreading hooks between all 4 survivors, that is actually worth going for. (would have to be adjusted in strength depending on each killers power level independently for obvious reasons)
This could maybe help to tackle the most egregious cases of tunneling and shift the game towards a more enjoyable experience overall.
Obvisouly this would have to be tested at great length and my proposal is by no means a perfect solution.
I'll gladly hear ideas and opinions! ^🐽^
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Rather than base-kit, I think it should just become a general perk that every Survivor has access to and Laurie would just get a new perk. It should be buffed back to a 5 second stun and reveal the users Aura to their teammates for 10 seconds so they can try and coordinate help. I dont think it should ever be base-kit because too many people would try and weaponize it.
Anyways, perks I want base-kit:For Survivor:
- Self-Care. It hurts terribly when I see my teammates rush off into the wilderness in order to heal while I’m bleeding out on the ground or about to hit second stage on the hook. With it being base-kit more people could bring in Botany and help everyone get back in action faster. (I understand balancing will need to change so Killers can have a new slowdown that takes the place of current Self Cares slowdown, but that’s up to the Developers to figure out)
- Tenacity. While I’m all for Killers being able to play as they want within the games rules and not be disparaged for their choices, being a slug is not fun. So I propose an increase to crawl speed after being on the ground for 30 seconds. If all remaining Survivors are slugged, they get the option to bleed out faster after 60 seconds.
- Not a perk but I’m pretty sure that the Mobile Game has a toggle button that displays a rear view mirror for Survivors so they can see behind them while in chase. I want this in the main game. Even after 6k hours I can’t look behind myself and loop 😭😭😭. I dunno what’s wrong with my motor and hand-eye coordination 😭😭😭
For Killers:
- Whispers. It would help not waste too much time looking in empty areas. They shouldn’t have to bring in a perk just to know Survivors are near. I’d also take Spies from the Shadows as an alternative.
- Undying. Killers get one free transfer for a hex as base-kit to help when they spawn directly across a generator or on a hill like a light house.
- Shattered Hope. It should have always been base-kit.
2 - Self-Care. It hurts terribly when I see my teammates rush off into the wilderness in order to heal while I’m bleeding out on the ground or about to hit second stage on the hook. With it being base-kit more people could bring in Botany and help everyone get back in action faster. (I understand balancing will need to change so Killers can have a new slowdown that takes the place of current Self Cares slowdown, but that’s up to the Developers to figure out)
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I think gen slowdown should've always been basekit and tailored to each killer. No generator perks. Gen speeds and slowdown could've been used to help balance each killer individually. Perks get tweaked and changed constantly because they're too strong on this killer or that killer while they were just fine on a lot of other killers, but perks are usable on all killers which is where a lot of the problems start. Generator speeds are there to help determine match length, and some killers have slower gameplay while others are faster, and gen speeds and slowdown should've been tailored to each one individually to balance all that out.
That's how I personally feel about it, anyway.
I think this would be a decent band-aid in situations where too much times passes with no killer-survivor interaction. A little icon pops up telling the killer that Whispers is in effect, and it sticks around until he finds a survivor. Not too short of a time period, but not so long the server's about to shut down the match anyway.
Whispers was extremely helpful back when I'd run it and survivors would hide and do nothing else. Sometimes I consider putting it back on… but I hate using a perk slot to counter one thing that doesn't happen every match and shouldn't be happening in the first place. I'm stubborn enough I will stand around and let the server kill them. They're wasting their own time, not mine, I don't have to do anything while they have to move around to avoid birds.
A conditional basekit Whispers would be nice.
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Thats why I proposed limitations. Im very aware of how the playerbase thinks. Forcing ds and bodyblocking are the majoor issues I would see, therefore the anti bodyblock- and weaker throughout the match- mechanic. If a killer wants to create some pressure when they lost 3 or 4 gens, then tunneling is absolutely fine in my book. When a nurse starts to tunnel at 5 gens, i think she should get punished heavily. She does not need to do that.
Your solution tackles the problem, however, we would be in the exact same situation that we had with bt. A perk that everybody has to bring to have a game healt - effect. Thats not good in my opinion. Its why bt got changed.
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I think gen slowdown should've always been basekit and tailored to each killer
- This is a great idea, and could help weaker killers without map traversal (like trapper) to better pressure gens.
- It could also help balancing the game more, so that more killers become viable picks.
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WoO: I had multiple friends quit the game because they couldn't keep a chase going for more than a few seconds. I also always use it because I don't get to play frequently enough to memorize maps.
Yeahyeahyeah crutch-comments etc incoming ... I just want to have fun playing my games, sue me.
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Thanatophobia, 10% slow but it only works on a wounded survivor
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No more basekit perks for anyone.
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Basekit more chests, "bleed self out" or 120s basekit unbreakable, basekit 15s corrupt for gens and totems, basekit 5s decisive strike and no collision with killer for basekit BT, basekit 10% pop and 60s block for nearest gen upon unique hook seems like a decent start
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Agreed then boons can be strong again
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Everytime something is made basekit it takes away perk variety and cements the current meta more and more. If you think "maaaaan, I wish I had this and that perk, they should make it meta" then find room for it in your loadout. If a perk is worth wanting as basekit, its probably worth selecting as one of your perks. People are so hung up on meta perks and pretty fast to call out something as "utterly worthless" or "borderline throwing" if you chose it, and that is just the utterly wrong mindset.
The internets drive to mathematically perfect everything leads to the so common meta-brain-rot: most people can only follow the meta and can't fathom looking left or right and are obsessed with perk-value, perk-value, perk-value. A lot of the off-meta perks can be fun and yield success, even though if they aren't as consistant of old DH or Iron Will. So in general I would not make anything basekit, as players should not always get their cake and eat it too, if they want a certain effect, let them take off one of their precious meta perks, that they apparently can't live without, of their build.
That being said, there is ONE instance where I think a basekit effect would be benficial to the game, and its a killer perk: BBQ
Old BBQ was equipped univerally by practically every killer for its BP bonus effect. If you don't know, old BBQ gave a counter for the first hook on every survivor, and every counter gave +25% BP multiplier. Many killers made it their metagame to hunt all four survivors and get a full set and it was a valid incentive to spread hooks. BBQs other effect, ie showing the auras of survivors 36m away, was welcomed, but not the main pull for most killers, BUT it showed them opportunities that they might not have expected and peeled them off the hook and send them to the other side of the map. Many survivors bemoaned the constant aura reading the perk provided and how "it was in basically every build! Buhuhu!", but failed to see what valuable function the perk served.
Now hear me out: give the killers both as basekit.
- +25% BP bonus for each uniquely hooked survivors, but only increase the counter as long as all survivors are still alive. So if the killer wants to complete the set and get the full +100% BP bonus, they can't tunnel someone out asap.
- Upon hooking show the killer the aura of one of the yet unhooked survivors, thus hopefully peeling them away from the hook and sending them to fun little chase.
BBQ would then be at a slightly better spot then Borrowed Time: equipping it would show the killer all survivors auras (beyond a certain distance) and many killers would happily live without its full effect, but some killers, like Huntress, Artist or Dredge could still benefit from its full effect, so it wouldn't be a dead perk. For real, when was the last time you saw an honest to god Borrowed Time in the game? The basekit effect is SO good, that no one needs BT anymore and opts to equip a perk that offers a unique other effect. I equipped BT a couple of times when I ran a savior build, and its fun to mess with killers who counted to 10 and still got hit by the endurance effect, but its actually more beneficial to chose any other perk.
Thats my two bloodpoints in this matter.
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unbreakable and ds (with increased stun and can be used 2 times) for survivors and noed (without totem) and rancor for killers… since the devs are making all the strongest killer strategies weak (and others like hit and run were nerfed so much that are almost useless) because they are unfunny for the survivors they should get some compensations at least in the end game (mind you, at this point for implementing this change you should sod off statistics, which isn't a bad thing unlike people used to think)… in that way people won't be mercilessly tunneled out of the game from the start and can play without worrying too much (and to avoid possible exploits survivors should lost their hitbox for 15 seconds once they were unhooked, in that way they can't exploit bodyblocks with something that was supposed to protect you in case of hard tunneling)
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You know what? When I started reading your comment, I wanted to dismiss it after I read UB and DS … and then it got even better with 2 usages - what would be the point to use the real perk then? 7s stun? But then I read on and your train of thought any too bad, actually. Force killers to mostly play "traditionally" and "fair", OR ELSE! But then turn their lethality up during endgame and let them rip. Its basically making both sides OP, while still somehow maintaining a balance between the two and I would actually love to see a PTB or time limited mode with this rules enabled.
The big concern would be, as always, SWFs. With so much basekit safetynets, nothing is hindering two dedicated survivors with flashlights, DH and OrR to try to harrass the killer all game, while the others pump gens. The killers lethality during endgame won't be deminished, due to the basekit NOED, but it would still be quite the slog, especially with everyone running Hope.
And on the killers side, endgame builds would skyrocket! Terminus, Remember Me, No Way Out, Bloodwarden would all go up in value and in the end everyone would complain about genrushing, toxic bodyblocking and insufferable endgame builds ^_-
Still, this could be really fun to try out.
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Plot twist but without the ability to do the whole self pick up with full heal and sprintDeerstalker in short range would be nice
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Decisive Strike - Can now guaranteed be found in chests, the perk just lets you start the match with one, but is consumed when used and can only hold one at a time (doesn't take an item slot). Still deactivates at end game but can perhaps be given a blood point event if you've held onto it until that time.
Unbreakable - The ability to lift yourself up from the ground once is now given to you after you break a totem. Perk functionality stays the same however circumventing the need for a totem and the increased recovery speed. Tempted to say this effect should last even in end game to match the perk.
As a result the game also slows down for the Killer as both finding and opening/cleansing takes time but hopefully weens them more to play in a traditional manner since these are global factors. Shattered Hope basekit for Killer and Boons can be risk/reward since it blocks off Unbreakable meaning they can be buffed accordingly.
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Eh, that’s kinda the risk you take just leaving the survivor there.
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Self Care= med kits are trash even with the 2 now rare ultra rare add on, one franklins is just gg to it, even the flashlights or tool boxes dont feel bad being lost like a med kit.
Iron will= No explanation needed am sure.
Ds= cause yeah.
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Self-Care. It hurts terribly when I see my teammates rush off into the wilderness in order to heal while I’m bleeding out on the ground or about to hit second stage on the hook. With it being base-kit more people could bring in Botany and help everyone get back in action faster.
I would expect this to have the opposite effect to what you intend.
Making Self Care basekit is no guarantee anyone will bring Botany, but you will almost certainly see more survivors running off to corners to spend 45 seconds healing.
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Oh hush up and let me live in my delusions 😭😭😭
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I get the intention, but it wouldn't do anything. Something having very strong counterplay has never given survivor perks the leeway they need to be strong enough. Basekit Shattered Hope would result in a 25% increase to heal speed on CoH, then a lot of complaints, and then it would get reverted within the month and that's it. There's a problem with perception focusing on the pay-off, but not the investment, so any buff to boons, even if they could only be set up five times, would immediately be complained about until nerf.
One thing I think could be good for the game is something I believe VHS did, which was a spawned in, contested objective, and I think that could be useful for breaking '2 survivors left' stalemates. For example, 120 seconds after the second survivor is executed, a glyph spawns somewhere on the map. If the killer takes the glyph, he gets killer instinct on the survivors for 20 seconds. If a survivor takes the glyph, the hatch spawns immediately.
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kindred & bond
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Basekit corrupt intervention and basekit kindred
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For killers:
- All hex totems that have to meet a certain condition before they have an active benefit should be a dull totem at the start of the trial. Only when the conditions are met (blood favor, devour hope, crowd control, etc.) should a dull totem become a hex one.
- Reward in form of bonus regression when hooking different survivors / decide against the tunnel playing style
For survivors:
- when slugged for 2 minutes, a pop-up with a 5 second time period to return to the injured state
- a soft version of kindred should be basekit (other surv aura yes, no killer aura), anit camp bar globally shown for every surv
- a surrender vote option when specific conditions are met
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30 seconds basekit corrupt . This could even deactivate when you enter chase . This way top killers would loose it in 5 seconds but low tiers could make use of those 30 seconds.
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I second this. The fact they made it a perk and not a base ability is to weird. If they were to make the ability basekit, I would rework the perk to now rebuild a broken totem and reignite a Hex perk in the killer's build once per trial (similar to Pentimento, and it would be randomized if there were multiple hexes brought, excluding Undying). That way Hexes get just a bit more value in game, and the killer can actively make the call as to when they bring it back into play.
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Honestly, basekit corrupt is essentially a good idea.
But I would find it better in conjunction with an extra starting objective for survivors. Something like, "cleanse corruption" that needs to be done before you can repair a generator. Otherwise, at the beginning the survivors just stand around bored or open a few chests.
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Then they would complain, but this time an actual counterplay would be there. It would be up to them to actually use the counterplay, and if they didn't then that is on the players, not the perks.
This.
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As a killer main, I kind of agree, but I think decisive is most effective as a surprise attack, and thus we need something else to push for anti tunneling basekit.
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You got an idea?
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Sadly, no. I do think the game should further incentivize ant-tunneling mechanics with stuff like base kit BBQ, but I don't have an actual solution yet.
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None. I'd rather minor tweaks, such as changes in recovery from hitting a Survivor, or minor alterations to speed boosts when being hit.
Making perks basekit will just be opening the flood gates. If "Unbreakable" became basekit, then many would ask for consessions from the otherside. If "BBQ" was basekit, then many would ask for consessions from the other side, and it would keep rolling onwards. One side would feel hard done by, then the other would, and because of how dramatic some perks can change a game, it would just get stupid.
I'm more in favour of altering what is already there and tweaking. Whatever is made basekit will only lead to more avenues of problems further on, I feel.
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Understandable. Its a very tricky problem to solve. BBQ in regard to aura would be an interesting idea. However, id make it killer instinct and not aura reading.
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I'll plug again my suggestion that has very little chance of ever being implemented; a debuff to gen repair speeds while all survivors are alive coupled with the debuff being replaced by a buff once a survivor has been killed and the buff increasing each time a survivor has been killed. For those who haven't read my previous discussions of this this would theoretically change it so the most likely chance to get a 4K would be spreading hooks so every survivor is on death hook. The gen speed debuff is there to help alleviate pressure on the Killer when the Survivors are at their strongest so spreading hooks isn't as hard and the gen speed buff is there to punish tunnelling by making it more likely the other survivors will escape if someone gets tunnelled. Also, if it shifted the balance to 1 to 3Ks being more common than 4Ks and 4Es that would be a benefit in my opinion.
I also like @Akumakaji 's BP bonus and aura reading. I don't think it would deter tunnelling enough by itself but it would be good to implement at any rate.
The glyph suggestion @Firellius made was also good. If something like that couldn't be implemented I'd like the idle crow timer to start when someone isn't either in chase, healing, doing gens, cleaning totems, etc etc so anyone not progressing the match gets crows regardless of whether they're idle or not (eg locker hopping to avoid crows would now get crows unless the survivor came out to do gens or something similar)
As well, I'd like that as soon as there are only two survivors in a match then there is a bleed out quick option. A mini game for slugged survivors to speed up their recovery rate similar to what VHS did or a buff to crawling speed would also be welcome.
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I agree with you all on the Unbreakable.
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None.
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Plunderer's Instinct.
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distortion should be base to stop the reliance on aura builds
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I kind of get behind that in the sense of aura reading perks vs aura reading stuff. However, I think killer instinct has a soft rule of being killer related, so instead we do it like Rancor, where you get see a survivor via a notification. This ways it's that it's related to the hooking. Additionally, Survivors who are revealed should get a warning "Hey, you've been revealed," so newer players who can't understand how far 40 meters is can get the idea down.
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Thrilling tremors except it affects all gens and only for the duration of carrying the survivor (it stops the moment you hook a survivor).
Feel like survivors got way too good at utilizing that free pressure / time that comes from killer having to spend additional time carrying a survivor to the hook which sometimes is part of the rationale behind slugging.
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My reasoning was, that killer instinct isnt something that can be denied. At least until now.
If you implement a mechanic that is supposed to lead the killer away from the hook, just for this mechanic to be shut down, then the killer will stay at the hook and camp or tunnel. The mechanic would be worthless.
Like a bbq but instead of aura, its killer instinct. You wouldnt need to give survivors an indication, they would know that after every hook, the killer gets a new direction to go. They would / should be prepared.
Only problem is, that bbq would become redundant and would need to be reworked.
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Yknow....I had this genius idea to buff Inner Strength like they did with Overzealous by making it work off booning but then I realized that would just bring back the old Circle of Healing problem but if Shattered Hope we're basekit I think Inner Strength could possibly see that buff.
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Kindred. There are some quirks in its design that actually make it worse when multiple survivors have it. Let's say two survivors have Kindred. One instance of Kindred is a waste of a perk slot for someone when the other survivor with Kindred is on the hook. 3 survivors with Kindred? You're wasting 2 perk slots as a team when any of those 3 survivors are on the hook. Remember, it works when you're on the hook for everyone and personally for you when someone else is on the hook. But that second effect is completely redundant when someone on the hook has Kindred.
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I’d like to see them try out any means necessary as a basekit feature that way killers will always have to think twice about breaking pallets which = yay for survivor because the killer has to kick everything
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Unbreakable basekit with a RANDOM timer between 20-120 seconds. That will deter excessive slugging because no one will know how much time before the survivor is able to get up. The lower times of course will be more rare to receive than the higher times. 20 seconds could be a 10% chance. 30 Seconds a 15% chance. 40 seconds a 25% chance. 50 seconds a 60% chance. 60 seconds and up you have a 75% chance. Spitballing random numbers, but that would be an idea that would make it fair for both sides not knowing. Carrying the perk will give you the recovery speed bonus plus one extra up. Prioritize the base kit first or maybe the perk. They would have to PTB that to see if there is a hindrance or not on which one goes first.
As for killer: 100% agree with corrupt intervention. being a good basekit for killers but instead of only the furthest away, have it be random. Could be furthest, could be closest, could be middle, or could be mix and match. Either way though, it will give the killer an advantage to get situated.
Or Hex: Crowd control…
or better yet base kit will be a random hex. Survivors won't know what it is, killer won't know, it will be completely random. Survivors could get lucky and its only something like ruin or undying. Killer could get lucky and it be something like Devour or Third Seal or Two can Play.
One thing I will never advocate for is any basekit that includes aura reading. So any hexes or perks like that definitely would not be part of it. Part of the fun is actually looking and finding the survivors. The "thrill of the hunt" if you will. lol
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I think that if a killer goes immediately after you right after you get unhooked, you need to get a token. And every time you get a token (up to two obviously), not only do you get extra bp for everything you do in the challenge after that, you get a resilience generator repair buff. So now, in order to hard tunnel you, the killer has to risk you slipping away and speeding through gens.
For killers, I think there needs to be more rewards for not doing stuff like hard tunnel and camp. For instance, every time you immediately leave the hook and don't tunnel people, you get extra haste and bp in the endgame, or the ability to remove progress to an exit gate that's been worked on. Stuff that makes killers think, "Hey, if I don't do this or this, look what I get instead."
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