The finisher mori needs to be reverted.
All its done is increase slugging. And by slugging I mean not only slugging for the 4K every single match is but also 4 man slugging people instantly at the start.
The is literally no point to the hatch mechanic anymore because no survivor can survive long enough with the slugging for the 4K. We’ve now gotten to the point where the game is over when 2 survivors die which isn’t supposed to be the case for every game, yet now it is. All for a stupid animation.
People said this wasn’t a good idea the first time they bright it up along with basket unbreakable. Then they came back but removed the basekit unbreakable aspect and went ahead with the mori when we all said it was gonna increase slugging every match.
Let’s also talk about how it’s increased the last two survivors stalling the match hiding it out and waiting for someone else to get caught. Everyone keeps saying they need to implement a system to give survivors crows but that’s not the solution to the main issue. In that case all you’re doing is demanding survivors just give up when there are two people left and again, that should not be expected or required to just hand the killer a 4K when two people die.
Comments
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What is the connection between round-start slugging and the finisher mori?
And matches have been all but over by 2 dead survivors for, what, years? Unless they have only 1 gen left, they have very little chance to win. What does finisher mori have to do with that?
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I personally like the finisher mori. And I think Killers will continue to slug for the 4K regardless of its presence in the game.
I don't see a problem with giving both of the last two Survivors base-kit UB. If Survivors can pick themselves up, the Killer has to hook. Then it's up to the Killer if they want to proxy their hook or go hunting or for the last Survivor to decide if they want to hide or go in for the save. At least the game will be progressing without one player being forced to lie on the floor doing nothing except maybe slithering about the map in the hope that hatch might spawn nearby.
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This is not true at all. In the years I’ve been playing I’ve had countless many games where in a 2v1 at least one survivor got out. No one is saying slugging for 4K didn’t already happen we are saying it has increased since the finisher Mori and it has with the slugging META that we are now in. Because now everyone wants that stupid finisher animation to end the match.2 -
Pretty sure it wasnt the finisher mori that caused 4 man slugging. Pretty sure it was because of someone wanting to do an experiment and the extra 20 seconds on hook.
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To my recollection it’s an extra 10 second hook stage but that’s also true. No one asked for an extra 10 second hook stage either. The devs love adding stuff to this game that no one asked for, including finisher mori, that make the game worse to play, while ignoring legit requests to make this game better,
In any case my main point and the vast majority of my post is about the 4K slugging issue and the effect it has had on the game in 2v1 situations. Which now killer mains are basically calling for mechanics to force survivors to forfeit a game at 2 kills which is ridiculous and unreasonable.2 -
The connection between whole team slugging and the finisher mori is that killers may be inclined to pursue any method to make it more likely to get to the last survivor. I don't think this particular behavior will increase too much outside of super high mobility killers (e g. Blight, Billy, etc.) since it's not likely too viable in most matches with slower killers. But a lot of people have talked about tunneling, camping, and slugging being more common in their matches after the finisher mori went live.
It may be that killers are seeing that there's a goal at the end of the match that they want to get to and feeling a bit more inclined to push to get to the finisher mori. Personally, I've seen much more aggressive use of what would normally be considered bm tactics in my own matches, and often feel less inclined to play survivor as a result since the update.
The connection with the finisher mori and two survivor left condition is that when a killer wants the finisher mori, they'll be more inclined to slug for a 4k when there's a prize for doing it. This I think is more prevalent now.
Hatch is meant to make the endgame not into a death hunt with no chance for the last survivor because then why would the last survivor even want to play it out? But slugging for the 4k forces that situation to happen, and now there's a reward for doing it.
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Totally agree
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No it doesn't. Bring unbreakable and you will see that you never really get slugged. Brought it 40 times in the past few days and got to use it 2 times. This is a made up epidemic.
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100%!
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In case you haven't followed recent discussions, slugging has currently more worth than hooking. (Not good but, sadly, true.) It has surged around the 70 seconds hooks.
This was a big subject a bit before he mori got changed.
I don't slug more than before the mori change.
That is, I still slug either the whole team or for the 4k as I would normally do.
The only difference is that now sometimes I use the mori because it's faster than grabbing and trying to find a hook. Avoiding the sacrifice time is already a big plus.
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Reverting the end game mori wouldn't change anything. Killers have been slowly realizing that hooks are simply not worth a lot and often the effort to hook survivors is worse than just leaving them on the ground.
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Unbreakable stays in my build and I still get slugged. LMAO It’s a single use meaning you use it the first time you get slugged but it doesn’t help you when slugged again. But go off. 🤣
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I don't believe any of this. Killers were apparently slugging, camping, and tunneling 24/7/365 if you take this forum as fact for the past three years. Killers have always slugged for the 4K even when it was only hooks. Killers, especially mobile ones, have gone for only-slugging tactics before the finisher mori was introduced. All these problems already existed, and the finisher mori is barely a "prize" to actually motivate killers to play any harder to receive; it's an animation, nothing more. To say the finisher mori is making these problems significantly worse, I can only call that confirmation bias.
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lmao
it’s so funny people are actually acting like slugging has not increased exponentially when we are right smack in the middle of a new slugging META that we didn’t used to be in. Posts right here have had people saying slugging is the new META but it hasn’t increased. Sure Jan4 -
Confirmation bias is definitely a possibility. You're not wrong. But I have found that my experience has been much worse following the update. In the past, it was quite rare for me to see hard tunneling at the match start, and I've absolutely seen killers go out of their way to get their endgame mori.
I've even been hit on hook over and over again because the killer had the fourth downed near my hook when that survivor came in for a save before I could give up and give them a chance at hatch. The killer wanted me to give up instead of picking up the last survivor, which would have risked them using some wiggle off related perk and getting one of us a chance at getting out.
So there are at least some verifiable behaviors that have arisen as a result of the update. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the increased incidence of nominally bm playstyles I'm seeing is related as well. I do also definitely appreciate the opposing viewpoints from you and others; both are needed for a useful discussion :)
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Haven’t the devs said on a livestream or something that they intend to sell alternate mori animations? I would think this has driven the decision to push the finisher mori forward. At day’s end, BHVR is a profit-driven company with a bottom line. That’s going to influence most if not all of their choices.
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The game should stop wasting people's time and automatically end when the 2nd survivor dies, unless all gens are done
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Lol I brought No Mither and got slugged in 3 matches back to back. I already opened a thread about this experience
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Yep, and if you were honest you would admit that you get to use it maybe 1 in every 20 games. Just played another 10 and have only got to use it once.
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Compare that to my 50 matches where I got to use UB a grand total of 3 times. You got a string of bad luck is all. Definitely not common even remotley.
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oh did they? do u remember what stream
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What a strange scapegoat to blame finisher mori for 4 man slugging at the start, that's nonsense and they have nothing to do with each other. Slugging for the 4k I agree with though. Wish BHVR would just clean up the 3k-4k/last survivor mechanic already, give killers an official way to "take" the 3k and end the game instead of needing to 50/50 for hatch and gates.
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Absolutely disagree on Finisher Mori being reverted. Moris should be more prevalent in the game, especially if we're getting purchasable Mori's in future.
What would be better though is they need some kind of additional requirement, a reward for the killer taking a riskier path to victory and making more of a game of it. At the risk of being a broken record,I vote for grant it if and only if the 3rd survivor dies while the last survivor is not in the dying state.
It makes lore sense, since the whole point of the trials is to cause as much desperation and fear as possible, and a pre-requisite to that is hope. A slugged player has basically no hope of survival, thus this is against the goal of the trial. If the player is trying for hatch and has a realistic chance of getting it, their lost hope in the trial is more satisfying for the Entity. It works similarly with the mori offerings, where the Entity basically grants "permission" for the killer to kill the survivor for serving the Entity well.
The Finisher Mori becomes a kind of "true victory condition", that would see slugging for the 4k right itself in the community. You can slug for the 4k, but you didn't get a Finisher Mori, so did you actually win?
That to me seems the most healthy and lore safe version of the Finisher Mori, and it actually improves the end game experience, rather than hinders it.
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i'd rather take being slugged 9/10 matches than be tunneled out of the game with a whopping 1.5 min of gameplay 10/10 matches any day.
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"increased exponentially"
Please learn what "exponentially" means.
That statement is ridiculous enough without it.
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No, but I do recall the finisher mori coming out maybe a few patches later.
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What I find interesting is how just having an animation has removed killers compassion. So, I get it- having the 4k is important. But, a lot of the time- killers would give the last person hatch if they played a good game, if everyone else botted out, if they just felt like being nice. Gone. 100% I have not seen a single survivor get hatch since this change took effect. I've watched killers carry the survivor to the hatch just to shut it and then mori them or carry them to the door and do that. Like, how did this one small change make people lose their compassion?
I have to use all of my perk slots to compensate for the fact that I can't see to play, but now- because of the way killers are playing- I've had to give up being able to see for being able to not see the team get slugged or make it easier to get out as the final survivor. (I'm not a final girl type of survivor. I fight for my random teammates- even if there are only two of us left, but sometimes- I just end up being the last one standing)3 -
It's ironic, yet was predicted by myself and many others when it was announced (and anyone with a modicum of experience saw this coming), that the Finisher Mori system, which was (in part) advertised as a way to reduce slugging for the 4k/hasten endgame alongside making Mori animations more common (likely for future paid Mori animations purposes) just made it worse and also made the "Last 2 Survivors hiding forever to not be the last" worse at the same time.
Like, we don't even want it gone, just healthy. And it wouldn't be that complex;
When the second-to-last Survivor either escapes or dies by sacrifice/Killer-unique Mori/RBT (NOT by bleedout) and the last Survivor is healthy or injured, the Killer can use the Finisher Mori if they manage to down the last Survivor before they escape and this would grant some extra bp.
The goal isn't to punish people who slug for the 4k because of adepts/tome challenges, the goal is to make the Finisher Mori a reward for playing the entire trial and not wasting 4 minutes instead of encouraging endgame slugging.
There's a pessimistic part of me that almost believes that the current iteration of the system is making 4k slugging worse on purpose so that, as it was rejected by almost the whole playerbase last time, people give up and just ask for basekit Unbreakable to not deal with endgame slugging basically every games anymore despite that it will create more problems than it solves and void any effort BHVR does to bridge the gap between SWF and SoloQ.
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