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Killers weak so much
If you are a Survivor main who can say "No" to what I say, if you haven't played yet or if your killer mmr is low, I recommend you to play killer. With each update, powerful perks come to the survivors, while only trash comes to the killers. Also, if you have high mmr and are playing a standard killer (Not Blight, Nurse, Spirit etc.), it is impossible to catch the survivor unless he makes a mistake. Have you ever seen that when you injure a single person, only 2 gens remain? While the mistakes made by Survivors can be compensated by their teammates, a single mistake you make while playing Killer (failing to win Mindgame, missing 50% pallets or m2, eating Dead Hard, etc.) can cause you to lose the game. Gen perks get nerfed every few months anyway. Why do we killers have to equip 4 gen perks when Survivors can play matches with fun build? Even if the Survivors you are playing against know a little bit about the game and only do average gen repair, you can still lose the game with a superior performance. Why do we earn 30K BP and get 0 kills? Do Survivors want to see Nurse, Spirit or Blight against them every match? From here on it's edit1. If you are playing SoloQ and you call it weak, the biggest reason for this is because of the players who only hold left click on a Gen and occasionally press space and watch their teammates chase 4-5 Gen in the back (There are players who don't even do this, I'm not even talking about them). Mmr increases every time he escapes from the exit door, but game doesn't care how he escapes. You can get out of the gate by just making Gen, or by making long chases. If you've come across players whose MMR only increases by repairing Gen, SoloQ is weak. On the contrary, if you come across Mmr players by rolling good Loops like you and there is no P100 Nurse in front of you, you will most likely run away. Leaving SoloQ aside, I want to tell you about a dilemma that only killers know about. Let's say there are 1-2 genes left, and you injured one of the Survivor who is on a Gen. Will you take that person down or will you control the other Gen Lee and let him heal? Consider this question because in both possibilities the Gen is being repaired. Or imagine that there are 1-2 Genes left in a tryhard game, what will you do to the survivors who walk away as soon as they hear your TR and continue to repair Genes as soon as you go back? All the possibilities I mentioned are valid for Survivors who increase their MMR by Looping like you (Even Survivors who know how to loop a little something on the map, in short, who do not spend the entire match hiding in a bush). Otherwise, I am not advocating the weakness of Killer playing against weak SoloQ teams that do not have the characteristics I mentioned.
Comments
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No.
Sincerely, some one who is just better
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When you find that better person on YouTube, let me know because I probably won't be able to find it.
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Improve yourself, I know you can do it, I trust you.
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If you think there is a problem that I have, keep thinking that way because neither I nor you can stop you from thinking that way, but I can say this, watch more killer videos. However, do not write something like "I beat 10000 hour bully squad" into the search engine so that you will see more average videos instead of videos where people put their best gameplays in their lives.
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This will stop being a problem for you once you get more experience. What looks like one mistake snowballing the match is usually many mistakes that less experienced players don't even notice.
High level Swfs can be pretty strong but even high level killer players like Ayrun and Hens frequently get matched against average survivors and manage to win with "standard killers". This notion that "high mmr" is some sweatfest with strong survivors is simply not true.
Even if you reach a high mmr level you will still be matched against average survivors frequently because the matchmaker prioritizes speed over fairness to an absurd degree.
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just played a game as wraith with an intentionally mediocre build (Thrill, Undying, Retribution, Haunted Ground) and got to 8 hooks with 2 gens left even after giving up 2 flashlight saves so sounds like a skill issue tbh
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To be honest, while I don't disagree that the genspeed on some teams is crazy I also won't just agree that it's like this in any case.
I did around 22 adepts in the last 2-3 days and it's honestly very dependend on map, team, killer your playing, perks and addons. I got most of them first try or maybe second to third, even against team with 2-3 people with 3k hours in it. That's not insanely much if I think about the fact I play against 5-7 sometimes 10k, but it's enough against weak killers without perks are really struggling... well my point is that even then they only got to 1-2 gens xD
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It never changes, no matter what level you're at. These naysayers keep thinking you're new and just need to improve. Little do they know, it doesn't matter even if that's true, because you're living the same experience as a high level killer. Can't play anyone but Nurse/Blight or else they stand no chance. Most of the people saying killer is fine only look at those 2 killers. It makes no sense, what they say, otherwise.
You're right. The survivors don't even play well, and they just win. Meanwhile, you're sweating the whole time. The moment you chase 1 decent looper, it's over, because there's no-mindgame spots where they always have the advantage at, and waste a guaranteed amount of your time. Time that you can't afford. They're playing meme stuff like multiple exhaustion perks or Urban Evasion, but you've got 4 slowdown perks and it does nothing. I want to go into more detail, but I think most people on this thread have made up their minds. Killers just don't lose if they're good, apparently.
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i could not agree more. Survivors are absolutely busted and every game is pretty much unwinnable without hard tunneling. Beeing good alone is not enough anymore. Survivors need to be nerfed hard.
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it is impossible to catch the survivor unless he makes a mistake
I mean, it's true in some specific cases, but every second killer has some chase/antiloop power. And if you good with it, it's definately not impossible, not even close. Good looper on strong map for survivors as m1 killer? Yeah, he can loop you as long as he wants. But with majority of killers it's not true at all.
Overall I agree with your points, mistakes on killers are way more punishing and you can't play without slowdown if you want to have a chance to win, but "killers are weak" is false statement. On high level it's true, killers always will be underdog, simply because game balanced around majority of players – Lithe Sable player, who can't look behind her with 3k hours. But even on high level it's not that hopeless, you still have some chances. Yep, those chances in majority are just survivors mistakes.1 -
Simple answer, tunnel, camp, slug.... Survivors might not like it but in high MMR with 4 person swf thats actually good on a survivor heavy map I'm doing what I can to get the kills lol. If I concentrate on tunneling and slugging worst case scenario I get 2k best case scenario I get 4k. If I let my concentration slip and lose track of my target messing up the tunnel then it can lead to a 4 escape.
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So you prefer going against bots, right? Because if surviviors get even more nerfed, there will be not much of them left.
I win every killer game with 3 or 4k. As a survivior I escape like maybe 50% of the time.
I will never agree that game is survivior sided. It might only be if you put 4 great surviviors together. Casual lobbies are getting shredded.9 -
The questionable part here is the claim that it's over if you face one decent looper. How are you not able to mindgame survivors even if they know how to loop? That definitely sounds like you still need to improve some more.
There are plenty of killers with strong chasing abilities with which you can counterplay survivors on most tiles. And the killers that don't have strong chasing abilities often have other abilities that help them with other aspects of the match, leaving a chase in a unfavorable situation is the right play with those killers.
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it seems to be the most challenging thing to implement but, I honestly think that a more successful implementation of MMR matching is probably the only solution.
let’s say for example, the game balances around higher MMR - the argument is that it will make soloQ and casuals even more unbearable in some cases (not all - as @Reinami illustrated with an example of how a nerf/adjustment to shack might make affect higher MMR swf more directly, though may not impact lower MMR survivors (who may not be able to run it efficiently anyway and get downed regardless of the strength of shack).
All of this really leads to the solution truly being making matchmaking more relevant and then whatever changes or balances will affect players proportionately.
Otherwise, what will happen is that the strong swfs will probably find a solution to win no matter what advice or strategies given. The whole slug, camp and tunnel for the win will definitely work.. but on the lower level soloQ and casuals who are the ones that don’t need that strategy done on them to win anyway?
If you want to balance at the top, make it so the top players truly face each other. Otherwise it genuinely makes the game less and less viable for lower level players (like myself).
A killer won’t know who they’ll face so they go in with the intent to face swfs and therefore will want to play with maximum efficiency. Then they’ll realise midway that they are just stomping solos but because some may have lost to swf, pent up anger or frustration leads to them raking it out on lower casuals anyway. These casuals will either stop playing, or in turn, crank up their own sweat builds to counter and thus continues the cycle of misery.
best solution is to improve match making first and then balance in whatever way needed4 -
Killer is the strongest it’s ever been, and it absolutely outclasses survivor in terms of strength, currently. The game is set up so that you win 60% of your matches as killer.
Perhaps you need to improve your personal skill or fall to a an MMR level suitable for your current skill.
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p22 Ghostface Main here. I play commonly with Grim, Thrilling, an info perk and a rotator. That's it, that's all. I do not have a chase power. I do not run hardcore addons. I run Leather Sheath and another addon (used to be Matchbook but I don't need it anymore since his minor buff).
I still win 9/10 of my games. Yes, against "good Survivors" who know what they are doing and coordinate. Yes, against "good Survivors" on unfavorable maps for stealth/M1. Yes, against "good Survivors" who bring the strongest stuff in the book. How do I do it? I just know this Killer really well and know how to use him, on a good day I actually have to SLOW MYSELF so I don't skyrocket my MMR.
It's possible. You can win as Killer against Survs without playing too nasty (though admittedly Ghostie isn't THAT strong and sometimes I do need to play sorta nasty, just business nothing personal). If a High C to low B tier Killer can get decent results you can do it with anyone else. If you re struggling to catch people, that indicates you need to brush up on M1 chase, your power and how it can/can't help in chase, and your mindgaming. It's bread and butter for a reason, everyone needs to know how to do it to understand ANY Killer.
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that's not even remotely true a good billy or huntress that are not in indoor map dominate high mmr singularity in high mmr completely destroy high mmr swf if you're good at him artist, plague are also high mmr killers that win really good when you know how to play them i could go on but in reality if you know what you're doing around halve of the killer can win massively in high mmr some are more map dependent the rest is more of hard grind minus some of the bottom ones that you won't win more on average
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No matter who I post youd probably just nitpick it anyway lol
But hey if you insist, I know a handsome young man who plays Trickster who may or may not be willing to post a few matches
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This is just so untrue, you obviously never played DBD in it earlier years.
Killers have never had it better, any decent killer won most of their games before but now it is ever easier.
Current solo queue survivor is absolutely miserable and this is made very clear by the fact the incentive is pretty much always on survivor these days.
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MMR matchmaking does not exist I am convinced of this. It's like just throwing people in the next que and that's it.
I will be the first I am not the greatest at killer but two patches ago I was ranked pretty evenly with the teams (not winning all but etching out at least a 1k each game if not 3). Since then I am going against teams and it's just amazing the gens that fly. Or it's what you said all the casual decent players are dropping off and you're left with the sweats and not so nice players. I see this in soloq too. I'm not one to hang around but most do or in almost all of my games it's dumb players. It isn't burn out because I am playing less and less just the way everyone is playing. Having a match last only 2 minutes isn't fun, the killer is weaving in and out of the face camp so your meter isn't going up. Teammates that run the killer into you while on a gen or going in and out of a locker. It's as if the only ones playing are hardcore killer mains and lazy players or sweats. It's becoming unpopular to play.
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From what I've heard, the gen kick meta surpasses current DBD in terms of being easy for killers. But I wasn't here for that, so I am not sure if this is true.
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That's also false?
If the survivors get stronger with yourself at roughly the same speed and you already struggled then yes, you'll continue to struggle. But if you're just way better... you're way better, I played many times on the account of a friend or my girlfriend and it both cases it wasn't more than a bad joke how easy it was to win those rounds I even played killers I'm super bad with and didn't even sweat a bit. Your statement is only true if the survivor are just as good as you or better, otherwise it's easy to kill them for the most part xD
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This sound like the usual I raised my mmr so high via tunneling/slugging/camping and got destroyed by competent survivors post.
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you just suck at killer.
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it seems to be the most challenging thing to implement but, I honestly think that a more successful implementation of MMR matching is probably the only solution.BHVR has said that their data shows the MMR pretty consistently matches people of the same skill level, though this is not as true during off peak hours. I think this is generally correct and there are a number of perception issues that play into why people don't think it works:
1: The game has a lot of random factors, in terms of what map players get sent to, how things spawn, as well as the builds that are brought. I used to play support builds a lot but if I ran into a Plague, or got paired with another survivor running the same build, we were in trouble.
On the other end of the spectrum, in soloq once without coordination I and the three other survivors all ran old distortion against a full aura read killer.
2: Early game is massively important. The first chase can really determine the course of the game given its snowball nature. This means a game result can look radically unbalanced just because of the first chase.
Example: I was playing survivor against a Pinhead. I was the first chase target and I took the first hit relatively early and was running to main. Pinhead goes to hit me with a chain and in pretty much a 50/50 guess, I dodge it, then make main. I proceed to run him until 2 gens are complete and he drops chase. If he hits that 50/50 chain he has a massive advantage with one survivor on a central hook and likely 4ks with gens remaining.
3: When the game tips in the killers favor, it tips hard. Survivors start strong, but, on most maps, once they deplete their resources the downs should come quickly for the killer.
4: BHVR has really built 'sweat' in the game, with the ability to take strong addons on either side. So MMR can't tell if a killer who normally plays chill with brown addons and meme perks suddenly decides to throw on a meta build and tunnel.
I think those factors are just some of what play into people thinking MMR doesn't work. This doesn't even get into at how at the extreme levels all MMR systems break down.
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thanks for your insight - definitely one that gives food for thought :)
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Hey, can you show us maybe what we are all doing wrong? Maybe record some matches using OBS and post them on youtube. Both things are totally free and you don't need to really do any editing as i'm sure nobody would expect crazy editing or commentary. Just some footage of your matches which gives everyone a chance to learn?
Looking forward to learning from you!
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I'll say the same to you i said above, can you post some videos of your games? Would love to learn what we are doing wrong from someone who seems to be having a different experience.
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k what killer
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The killer likes to patrol, but my teammates don't seem to know what the killer wants to do.
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The gen kick meta was miserable, I stopped playing during these dark days
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I saw it in action at the very start, in late 2022, but briefly. Wasn't around for most of the madness.
I didn't play DBD for most of 2023, to be honest. Mostly because I was interested in other games at the time. By the time I got back to the game Chucky had just been released and many things had already been changed.
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Lucky.
It was terrible, killers no longer bothered to really chase you, they just returned to gens constantly and it was always the same builds. Like I say, I quit playing for months until they fixed that ######### it was just so bad
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You already know he's gonna request whatever killer makes it easiest to downplay and say "you only won because your opponents are potatoes". Play whatever killer you're comfortable with
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Exactly. Whatever video you show, the answer from them will be something along the lines of "well, you just played against bad survivors. MY survivors would have had the gate open within the first minute"
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It's me, I was the handsome Trickster all along!
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Trapper. Lets see ANYONE have issues with this lol
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Well aware of that, I just have lots of free time during most weekdays since my work schedule isnt as packed.
If he didnt give me an answer though I would go with the dynamic 3: Trapper, Trickster, Dredge
Ya already know bb ;)
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Yeah, from what I've heard it was that bad.
Though I do think they nerfed Call of Brine a little too harshly. It was one of the perks that I used quite a bit because I really liked Sadako when she first released, but now it seems kinda useless.
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How about Freddy, my friend?
Every win with Freddy makes a statement. Plus he is my favorite killer, so I really love to see people playing him :)
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Guess we'll do a 4th game :)
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Hell yeah!
Good luck, my friend! Haunt their dreams for me.
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We went from the gen kick Meta to the MFT meta. Sadly I started playing during that time.
I do not have kind words for people who want busted metas back. We just found a balance. We don't need more broken stuff.
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Yeah there have been gross metas on both sides, any killer who played through the original Mettle Of Man days and is still playing the game has a high tolerance for misery. Can you imagine every survivor having a free 3rd chance? And it was pretty much every survivor in a lobby as why would you not run it?
Currently killers are abusing the ridiculous state of Thrill, so hopefully they sort that or at the very least kill switch it in the meantime.
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Old MoM was easily one of the most infuriating perks they've ever designed.
Playing a M1 killer back then was genuinely miserable.
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Thanks for taking my request, friend, always happy to watch some Freddy gameplay!
And you did really well, that was good!
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Thanks for actually doing this, it is pretty rare that people actually respond.
I watched the videos a bit, and i do plan on not only taking some notes and probably make a "reply" to your videos here, but that will take a bit of time. But also i want to record my own matches using your same builds and killers there (attempting to try and get the same maps even with map offerings but that will depend if i have them or not), as i want to compare them.
Don't take this the wrong way, because i absolutely don't mean it as an attack on YOU or YOUR gameplay. These survivors you are going against are NOT the same kinds of survivors that I go against. For example, in your first game as freddy, survivors didn't finish the first gen until about 150 seconds after the match started. In the matches that i play, i would play similar to you and do some of the same things (pushing survivors off of multiple gens, not committing to one chase very long). But in the games i played? I would have probably lost 2 gens at the 100-120 second mark.
I will say again, that this is NOT an attack on YOU or YOUR gameplay and not meant to be, i actually think you played very well in these games for what its worth. My purpose for asking for footage was because i genuinely think that people are simply not experiencing the same kinds of things in their games as some others are and that this is precisely what leads to this great divide.
I suspect that a lot of the people on the killer side who think survivors are "too strong" are going against the kind of teams that others rarely see which gives them the perception that tunneling/slugging and generally playing scummy is not only "ok" but necessary.
And on the flip side the ones who think survivors have a horrible time are the ones experiencing the killers playing nurse/blight/billy and slugging and hard tunneling immediately into the match before anyone even has time to touch a gen. I think this ultimately boils down really to matchmaking being as wild as it is, or maybe its time of day, or region or some other unknown factor and has little to do with the actual state of the game balance.
Again, i will spend some time this weekend going over your videos in more detail, and posting my own matches using your same builds (and then maybe a few with the things that i tend to play) so you can see things from my perspective and the kinds of things i am going against.
Thanks again for doing this and i'll try and get this all done on my side as soon as i can, but i do have a busy weekend with the holidays and such coming up.
Post edited by Reinami on3 -
The best part is that the rationale was "3 gens" but then they fixed that with the regression event cap, and never went back to revert CoB. It would be completely fine now, but BHVR only has a 10 second attention span, so they never reverted it.
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Were you around when COB and Eruption were a thing??? Or when Ruin reached it's peak in use
On one hand yes I do understand why you made this post but on the other have you played Survivor without any of the Perks that you deem "OP"???
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