Please Remove No Mither from Chaos Shuffle
What a terrible perk. This perk almost have zero use. Easy tunnel, easy down. Having it with random perks makes the case even worse because you don't have good perks to defend yourself.
Surprisingly this perk is pretty popular in Chaos Shuffle. Please ban this terrible perk, mode will be so much better without it.
Comments
-
In theory, I like the randomness and the challenge of rolling bad perks.
But in practice the match is over for you as soon as you’re dealt No Mither so honestly I wouldn’t mind seeing it go.
5 -
Yeah, you wont believe the amount of complaining my team-mates do when they get it. The hope to win the match is destroyed from seconds one of the match. This is also weird, because from what I remember BHVR talking about No Mither is that is supposed to be a challenge perk. If its supposed to be a challenge perk, remove it from being randomly selected in the perk pool.
Come on BHVR make a survey about it if you have no will on the Team to take No Mither out of the Random perk pool.
This perk is the only perk, where you are forced to engage in the challenge, Invocation and other perks that does this can be activated OPTIONALLY. No Mither is NOT optional, it flat out takes 3 possible chases.This is another seemingly easy quality of life update.
4 -
I liked the suggestion (can't remember who originally said it, but I know I've parroted it a few times), that No Mither worked exactly the same, just you don't start the trial injured. Once you are injured, that's it, you're perma-broken, but until then the game isn't given away.
This would actually make No Mither not terrible eith the synergies it has, and even give it some interesting options to hide it, Invocations being the stand out example, but even Deliverance or a one time FTP.
4 -
This is also a good suggestion, but that would only make the imposed chase potential decrease be 2 instead of 3.
But if BHVR sees No Mither as a challenge Perk, then they would have no motivation to change it, because its supposed to be hard its to challenge your skill.Which is why I think it should not be the Chaos Shuffle Rotation.
3 -
Yeah it does still have a problem for Chaos Shuffle, but I believe with this change it doesn't immediately stuff you right out of the gate. You as the player have the chance to go "Oh no… No Mither", and deliberately switch to a more careful and safe playstyle without the killer being made immediately aware.
No Mither complaints come up every single time Chaos Shuffle comes around, and the perks only real issue is people see it like a red flag to a bull and gun for it…. Even though it doesn't make sense to tunnel the No Mither if you think about it, since tunneling a non No Mither is only 4 chases won instead of 3, and you've got 1 player that can't effectively go for saves/trades once you've successfully tunneled, but I digress…
I got No Mither the other day on Rancid Abbatoir against a Wesker, and right from minute one, the hardest part was not that I only had 1 health state, but the fact he was CONSTANTLY looking for me, even in low traffic areas. He would take a hit or a pallet off my teammates, but dropped chase immediately each time and went back to patrolling gens, always ensuring that I had to stay hidden because he was gunning for me. Because I knew he was looking for me, I hid as long as I could, but there is only so long you can effectively evade the killer while still trying to meaningfully contribute to the game. I did manage to avoid him off hook each time by being pretty sly with No Mithers effects... but it was just so frustrating to literally not be able to touch a gen cause this man was sniffing for me the entire game.
Of course the fact it was Rancid Abbatoir was my real killer that game… extremely hard to stay hidden on that map… I'd have probably been able to win the game for my team evading him constantly, but if the jig wasn't up right away, my ability to contribute to the game would have been far, far easier, and a lot of the annoyance of No Mither goes away.
Thinking about it as a challenge perk though… One possible change would be to have the survivor permanently exposed as well as permanently broken while injured with the above change. That still has the ring of "Come and have a go if you think you're hard enough" without this immediate target on your back… and would actually benefit the No Mither player vs. M2 killers initially over m1 killers… that'd be fun… I might make a thread on that one day :D
1 -
I agree. As much as I love chaos shuffle, getting No Mither feels terrible since it's a hard-mode perk that you didn't willingly opt in to and it's too punishing to feel fair when left up to random chance. I think the mode would be better without it.
3 -
How would they accomplish this exactly? With the Killswitch? I thought that removes it for all modes or none, with nothing in-between?
0 -
They did that with Hound Master? She killswitched for event mode but she was playable for normal queue. So it's possible yeah.
4 -
It cannot be a coincidence that anytime a fellow Survivor rolls No Mither they either quit on their first hook or they get hard tunnelled out to force a speedy 3 Vs 1.
I wouldn't miss this perk being retired from the mode. There's not a single Killer perk that's even half as bad as No Mither.
1 -
Ok cool
1 -
I haven't played yet during this event but during the last one my teammates would just immediately give up if they got no mither. Either that or the killer would immediately hard tunnel them. A perk that puts you at such a disadvantage does not belong in the mode when killers have no equivalent.
1 -
The point of the gamemode is that you get random perks. Removing perks for being bad not only goes against the spirit of the mode, but also opens a whole new can of worms on what is "bad enough" to get excluded. No mither does have advantages, it makes you more silent and allows you to pick yourself up.
I recently got 2 undetectable perk on doctor, and while they were active I couldn't benefit from my static blast, so should those be excluded too? I also once got Franklins Demise, but the Survivors brought no items, so should that be excluded?
Unless you play doctor or randomly get another terror radius perks, Distressing is a purely negative perk so should that be excluded if those circumstances aren't met? Unless you use one of her two add ons that "normalise" the killer, M1 perks are worthless on Nurse, so should those be excluded? A lot of times Hoarder is worthless or negative for the Killer (especially on Onryo or Xenomorph), so should it be removed from the pool? Technician and Calm Spirit make you harder to dectect, but they also have downsides that make your progress in the game slower and are generally regarded to be bad perks, should those be made unavailable? Object of Obsession tells you where the killer is, but also tells the killer where you are, and due to the immense amount of information it gives it usually encourages the killer to tunnel you out, so should it be removed?
The whole concept "this perk is bad so it should be removed", would not be good for the mode.
0 -
May I ask, why do people say No Mither makes you easier to tunnel? Arguably, if you're being tunnelled, the only relevant parts of No Mither are the reduced grunts of pain and the lack of blood pools dropped, and I don't see those making you easier to tunnel somehow.
To the wider point, I'm on the fence. The possibility of "bad"/undesirable rolls is part of what makes Chaos Shuffle fun, in my opinion, having to adapt on the fly to what you have even if you'd never bring it in a million years otherwise is kinda the whole value proposition of the mode.
That said, No Mither is in a particularly noteworthy position here and could arguably be taken out of the rotation in a way no other perk would need to be, so I don't think it'd be a huge deal if the devs did take it out. I just think it also isn't really necessary.
0 -
I sometimes get perks on my Legion that can make Survivors Oblivious. Obviously, this is not usually something that I want, at least not if I intend to be chaining hits. It's not my preferred way to play Legion (I don't rate their Etched Ruler add-on highly outside of dedicated stealth builds).
The point is that even with perks that mess up your powers as Killer, it's still not as bad as getting No Mither as Survivor. You could load into a match with no perks at all as Killer and still be better off than a Survivor with No Mither.
3 -
- Distressing makes prerunning even more devestating against low mobility killers. Hoarder misplaces Onryos TVs and Xenomorphs Tunnels. Calm Spirit makes you cleanse totems slower. Unnerving Presence allows Survivors that are good at hitting skill checks to complete gens faster.
- Even if No Mither was provable to be the most harmful perk in Chaos Shuffle, the point is that once you say "We ban perks from Chaos Shuffle" it opens the can of worms of where you draw the line. Sure, you think it should be only No Mither, but I think that if do ban perks (which is something I don't think we should), we should also remove the perks listed above.
- The point is that you get randomly assigned perks. Removing perks from the pool goes against the spirit of that.
0 -
Because to many people "tunneling doesn't mean "only going for one Survivor until their dead", but rather "prioritising one Survivors over the others, if you find multiple Survivors and have to decide who you chase". I have seen Survivors die on the 6th+ hook stage in the game and complain they were tunneled.
0 -
If you're against removing perks from the mode, then No Mither needs an urgent rework. It is currently the worst Survivor perk in the game and very few players would willingly take it into a trial outside of trying to complete a tome challenge.
0 -
No mither needs a complete overhaul. A throwing perk like that shouldn't exist in a team based game.
0 -
May I ask, why do people say No Mither makes you easier to tunnel? Arguably, if you're being tunneled, the only relevant parts of No Mither are the reduced grunts of pain and the lack of blood pools dropped, and I don't see those making you easier to tunnel somehow.
You start the match injured and broken and stay that way the whole trial. Yeah you don't bleed and you don't grunt as loud but any killer with eyes will see you limping across the map and go "oh a free hook". Compared to a healthy survivor who needs (depending on the killer) two hits to go down and can heal if they drop chase.
It's similar to the incantation perks where you get a slight match buff at the cost of being a hindrance to your team for the rest of the match, only at least with incantation perks you can just not use it. Ultimately NM wouldn't be as terrible if it has some activation requirements where survivors could just, not activate it if they didn't want to, at least during events.
3 -
What I've never fully understood about that argument is that we're talking about tunnelling here, so, the killer chasing you either immediately after an unhook or soon enough after an unhook that you haven't had time to get anywhere first.
That kinda categorically has to be what tunnelling is, because otherwise it's just… the killer chasing you again at some point, which doesn't really scan to me as a defined action that warrants talking about.
In that scenario, you already haven't had enough time to heal. I could buy the argument that it shuts you out from using something like Resurgence or Second Wind, but very specific niche perks not being accessible doesn't really translate to you actually just being easier to tunnel by default.
0 -
HM was killswitched in an event and not in the main game. It can be arranged
2 -
i wouldn't remove it entirely, but it definitely needs to be paired with something else. it's not that useful by itself and makes you an easy target, so it needs to be paired with something like resilience or an invocation to be actually worth having it.
same with perks like champion of light. at least pair it with residual manifest so we can guarantee a flashlight!
0 -
I had two No Mithers in one of my games today. Two! Combo'd with healing perks was well.
Please BHVR, this perk HAS to be reworked if it's going to keep popping up in Chaos Shuffle games.
0 -
No Mither CAN be okay when paired with other perks. Otherwise this is the worst perk in the game and most likely you will have no perk synergy making sure you are a one hit with zero benefits.
0
