http://dbd.game/killswitch
OPERATION HEALTH IS REAL, I REPEAT, OPERATION HEALTH IS REAL
Comments
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Why can we not see our TEAMMATES PERKS??!!! O.— This is obviously what SoloQ could use. DBD Mobile had that… Can't we already see our OWN perks in lobby?… Am I missing a key component here?
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Something something lobby dodging
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Oh dang I didn't even think about that. So griefers can queue up with the intention of slugging all 4 survivors just to get them to quit? Thus wasting everyone's time? Yeah, this has to be implemented very carefully
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All week I’ve been kinda sad because Dead by Daylight is my special interest, and I’ve noticed I’ve lost interest in the game. I haven’t found anything to replace it. Hearing this news makes me excited and realigned. Dead by Daylight is doing just what needs to be done!
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if there are perks that are so terrible no one would want to play with you if they knew your build, that is a bigger issue.
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The thing is, not everyone's going to agree on what those perks are, and some people have extremely strict definitions for what counts as a dodge-worthy perk.
Lobby dodging is a legitimate issue already, anything that makes it worse wouldn't be a great idea.
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For the love of the Entity, can we please have a toolbox item balancing?
Generator speeds are fine, except when survivors stack a bunch of stuff with the Commodious/Event toolbox, because they have 32 charges. If those toolboxes had 16 charges instead, then everything would be perfect.
Hyperfocus also gets too much value out of 32 charge toolboxes, because they scale off of the toolbox’s extra skill chance chances, which means they want the maximum toolbox time.
Map and Key rebalancing is fine and everything, but unless BHVR wants to make useable yellow-rarity and usable green-rarity maps and keys, then I still won’t use them often even if they get major buffs, because they’ll still be “too rare” in the bloodwebs.
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They could put that in the Loading Screen. This might still lead to DCs while loading, but I dont think it would be much. OR at the very least it should be in the game when pressing "Esc", where you see the names and Ping of the players.
This would just be something which bridges the gap between Solo and SWF a bit. People might know that I have Resurgence and dont lead all the healing progress go to waste against Hemorrhage. Or I know that someone else has Deliverance and dont run across the Map just for them unhooking themselves when I am halfway there.
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That's exactly what's going to happen. The over-arching theme of these changes is: "We're not going to fix the unfun thing. You just have to deal with it now."
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I remember when we were told that "removing prestiges from lobbies would stop killers from dodging" yet I frequently see 2-3 killers dodge when i'm playing solo queue.
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100% agree. I was stumped there for a second on how they could make it work, but this sounds great.
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exactly, all the evidence we have so far points this being what’s going to happen.
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I hope against hope that they can slip some modern controller settings in with the ability to use MnK on console.
E: removed a redundant word
Post edited by ControllerFeedback on1 -
While it's adjacent to an anti-slug mechanic, it's more so a surrender option. They do have anti-slugging slated for Part II as well, where we might see a competitive anti-slug mechanic added, but this helps prevent 4-party 4-minute bleedouts. (I do hope it's player initiated and not automatic though)
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Or I could just go afk, use the bathroom, make a coffee, take a break and at the end of the day its gonna be the exact same outcome
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And this is an option for those that are interested in playing the game? I assume it'll be an individual choice given it requires all other players in the dying state. So you can still go and do that while whomever else chooses to surrender. Choice.
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Sure, but you have to agree this is not an "anti-slug" mechanic whatsoever, its just buff to slugging
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I mean that's why I said it's adjacent to an anti-slug mechanic and more so a Surrender option.
(it does at least reduce the overall time spent slugged in certain scenarios)
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🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
im glad too.
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I’m glad brightness options are being added but being honest it shouldn’t have almost taken a decade to add a basic video game feature?
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Anti-slugging? Lol, you mean pro-slugging. Holy 💩, RIP survivor.
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for the surrender option I feel like they should also include when there’s 3 survivor bots and you are the last real person on the team those games aren’t enjoyable at all
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Oh cool, anti-slugging and even more anti-tunneling and anti-camping? It’s going to be so fun to play killer where you have to ask survivor permission to do anything, definitely great game design!
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Dont worry, the killer will ignore the bots, tunnel you out and then surrender themselves
You are not even entitled to die on hook when this happens because of their other future changes, and bots will save you
Its gonna be FUUUUUUUUN
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Actions speak louder than words. For now, I'll postpone my thoughts on this whole "Health Initiative" thing. I want to see these words SUCCESSFULLY put into practice for the foreseeable future before I get happy about anything. They have claimed many times that they'd change certain things or make stuff better only to have it all backfire and go horribly wrong. Prove me wrong BHVR. Time to step up and show us you've been listening, instead of just saying you'll fix stuff and never deliver. Aim for the long-term, never the short.
Post edited by biggybiggybiggens on2 -
"To speed up general Bloodweb activity, we’re adding a button that will allow you to spend Bloodpoints in bulk. "
What exactly does this mean? Is there an option to auto buy the higher tier items?3 -
Hard agree and to be honest, in my initial response I did not think enough. I realized that slugging is still way too strong with what they plan in Phase 1 (since it does not adress the Core Issue), but I was happy that I at least dont have to lie on the ground for 4 minutes if a Killer decides to grief the whole team and I thought that griefing might go down with that.
But it will probably rather increase, since Killers would now get a victory if Survivors surrender.
When it comes to Anti-Hiding, I personally only thought of the extreme cases where two Survivors are hiding without any intention to progress the game. However, it is true that something should be done for this situation which gives the Survivors the chance to come back. And while some Killers will probably say that they already lost at this point - especially as Solo-Survivor you have no control over your teammates and if one or two persons got tunneled out early, this does not mean that the two remaining Survivors were bad and dont deserve to win.
Because, I am honest, when it comes to the 2v1, I dont even try, when I get caught, I suicide on Hook so that the other person has a chance to get the Hatch. When my SWF-Mate and I are the last persons alive, even if we both are not on Death Hook, when one of us gets found it is basically "Yeah, good luck" and Hook Suicide.
And something should be changed here. Survivors should not have to give up when it is 2v1. This is not good game design. And it basically means that the Killer only needs a 2K for a Win, since they will get the 3K automatically.
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They finally are adjusting the AFK crows oh my god holy ######### yes.
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This ain't happen.
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People don't seem to actually understand that BHVR has NO CLUE how to address stuff like slugging, which is why the changes they announced are what's coming. You can't really blame a kettle for being a kettle. Telling it to be a pot is silly though as you should know better.
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YES please.
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Wait that's what I assumed they meant. Wasn't the A/B testing that you could see your teammate's perks? If not then I don't get the point of this either.
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It's awesome that BHVR is taking the direction of caring about the game health!
There are a few things in the update list that I'm worried will have unintended consequences. I hope the team spends a lot of time crowdsourcing possible knock-on effects of any changes. Like PTBs, longer term trial periods for certain updates, and slightly increased frequency of feedback surveys.
As some others have mentioned, it's also important to address why some of these changes are considered to be needed in the first place, and maybe target certain root causes.
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Let's hope they REALLY are doing that and this isn't some stunt that makes it look like they're finally going to take it seriously..
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me watching my entire bot team die to pig traps because they don't know how to interact with the puzzle boxes
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just some sort of interaction with other players other than friends. Like there’s no point in adding people on dbd because you can’t even message majority of them.
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While I am happy that concerns have been heard and changes are being made, I am not sure these were fully thought out.
My initial thoughts -
Surrender option is going to encourage 4 man slugs instead of prevent it. The killers that play like this do not care about anything other than their 4k and will do whatever to get it as fast as possible. This is going to give them the ability to get it faster so they can move onto their next match to do the same thing. The slugging issue is because killers are trying to get around survivor perks that give them things after they are hooked, that is not being addressed at all.Map offerings - There are killers who are very map dependent. If you're going to change this you need to change Scratched Mirror because he is unplayable on an outdoor map. (just an example). Maybe make them hidden but keep the rate that they apply the same. Sac wards are still a thing and are now common.
Spawn changes - if you are going to change this, you need to make sure the survivors are not spawning right next to the killer because there have been so many times recently that survivors have spawned right next to the killer (I am literally watching a stream where the killer spawned right on top of the streamer.) This is also going to give very easy pressure to an S tier killer running Lethal Pursuer.
Lastly, while out of order, Go-Next prevention.
While I do not understand people going next because they went down in 30 seconds, they don't like the killer or don't like the map, there are times where going next is justified. Also, if someone drops on hook because there is only one other person alive and that person is in chase so they want to give the chance for hatch, will that be penalized? If you want survivors to stop giving up, either remove the DC penalty (throwing this out as a suggestion but I hate the idea of more bots) or focus more on balance towards solo queue because those are mostly the survivors that go next.Also if a survivor wants to go next but doesn't want the penalty, they will then just make use of the new AFK system to alert the killer to their position without being obvious about it.
I hope whatever the changes towards MMR are will help with this but that's not for ~6 more months. On top of that, the punishment is very steep and the incentive is not enough; not everyone cares about bloodpoints as we have seen from this iteration of 2v8. My suggestion - remove this completely but actually take action when people report someone in end game since it is one of the options (after verification of course).
Again, these are my initial thoughts. I hope some of these things have been taken into account.
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It would be nice if they put in a filter system to prioritize what you want, but I wouldn't be surprised if they just put in a slider for how much you want to spend or to set a prestige limit and then just get stuff randomly. Something that simple has been wanted for years, but maybe they'll add more because they're allotted more time.
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I know people have been wanting this for a while, but no content? Man…
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Great news and something that's been needed. The devs have already gradually but surely removed most of the big grievances from the game, but there are still a bunch left many of which are being addressed here.
That said, I honestly feel like these changes aren't going far enough considering that BHVR is adjusting their entire release schedule that they've kept to for years and years now. Given that, I would have hoped for more.
Surrender Option
While the option to surrender in hopeless scenarios is welcome to end a match that could otherwise be needlessly (or maliciously) prolonged, I don't think this goes far enough. It will finally stop players from being able to slug survivors to bleedout just to annoy them, but it doesn't address the much more common scenario where 2 survivors are left alive and the killer slugs or otherwise refuses to kill the second-to-last survivor in order to try and guarantee the kill on the last survivor as well. I think the surrender option should also be available in the dying state if only 2 survivors remain in the trial.
Although ideally they would go much further with this and address the bigger issue that is the existence of these "hopeless scenarios" altogether. The 2v1 and 1v1 endgames are a big point of pain in this game's design. Why is it that the last two survivors find themselves in a scenario where escape by actually playing to the game objective is essentially impossible, and the only real hope is hiding? That's undesireable for everyone involved. A lot could be done to make the 2v1 a more compelling and thrilling gameplay proposition, that promotes action and interaction. The 1v1 endgame could also do with a complete overhaul to make it a more exciting culmination to a match, but at the very least removing its egregious pain points seems easy enough: make it so that the hatch closes itself automatically after some time, preventing the killer (or survivor) from camping it; make sure gate spawns are never too too close and move the first red light indicator to 50% of the opening process.
“Go-Next" Prevention
It really remains to be seen just how accurate and helpful this system will be, but for now I'll use this opportunity to suggest also doing something about the much more common "go-next" issue: lobby dodging. Dodging lobbies completely disrupts the matchmaking, and also allows players to "shop" for lobbies they think offer a better chance of success. I think the game should keep track of how often players dodge lobbies and give them a matchmaking cooldown if they do so excessively, in a similar escalating manner as is done with the disconnect cooldowns.
Extreme Hiding & Body Blocking Prevention
While good in and of itself, I think here again the more pertinent issue is the "unwinnable match". Extreme hiding the vast majority of the time occurs when there's only two survivors left in the trial and their only hope of survival is by hiding until one of them is found and killed, such that they may escape by hatch. I think it would be better to address the issue that the idea of objective-oriented gameplay collapses in these scenarios than it is to essentially make these scenarios even more hopeless. They may think this will push survivors to actually try and do gens, but all it will really lead to is people giving up and the game ending without any further gameplay (and if the "go-next prevention" system forces them to go through hoops to get killed without getting penalized for it, that's a recipe for disaster).
The 2v1 endgame could offer a lot of worthwhile gameplay still if it were to be adjusted in sensible ways, there's no reason to essentially force the game to end at this stage and rob everyone of gameplay.
Map Offerings
I don't mind map offerings being nerfed but I also never really minded them existing, this was never a real pain point for me personally, killer or survivor. Although now that it is finally happening I bet it will be a bit of a "be careful what you wish for" situation for a lot of players that cannot any longer send their opponents to Haddonfield or an indoor map as a stealth killer or the like. And I too will miss being able to play Scratched Mirror Myers.
I think making it so that map offerings do stack might be a better way to go about it, with a 25% chance per survivor offering and killer offerings still being 100%. That way if survivors really want to play a certain map, they will have to forgo using any other offering, as well as all spend the specific map offering (which they will absolutely run out of sooner or later this way). And killers could still play all the map-dependent strategies that exist. Maybe with the caveat that if both sides bring map offerings, the chances are mediated (so 1 survivor offering vs. killer offering = 25/75 chance to get the killer's map; 2 survivor offerings vs. killer = 50/50 chance to get either (or 25/25/50 chance if the survivor offerings are for different maps); 3 survivor offerings vs. killer = 75/25 chance to get the survivors' map (or 25/25/25/25 if they are for different maps, or 50/25/25 if two of them are for the same map, and so on…); 4 survivor offerings vs. killer = 20% chance for any of the maps to appear, 80/20 if all survivor offerings are for the same map etc.).
I will also say that there are some maps in the pool that are so problematic that this prospect of playing a much more random variety of maps is a bit concerning. Badham, Garden, Eyrie, Haddonfield, Sanctum, Ruins, and Temple being the most notable. Either introduce map offerings that reduce the likeliness of getting a specific realm, or better yet, address the blatant issues with these maps.
Spawn Rules
Nice.
Bulk Bloodpoint Spending
Nice.
Quest System
Lots of things they could do to make these things more fun rather than repetitive, although I doubt they will change much with regards to what it is you actually have to do in the trials to complete dailies and challenges.
Perk Loadouts & Preview
I'm pretty sure this as opposed to what people are hoping for refers to the little perk loadout graphic on the upper right-hand side of the screen that a bunch of players have been having for many years already. Calling that "a successful round" of A/B testing is as odd as the idea that this is some sort of "feature" that will tangibly improve the quality of the game experience or needed to be tested for years. You can literally just open your loadout screen to see your perks if you really don't already know what they are. What gives? Sure the little info is nice to have I guess, but including this on an ambitious QOL roadmap that they are revamping their entire schedule for is… well, silly.
Now, showing all survivors' perks to each other (in the lobby and the in-trial info overlay) would actually be an immense QOL improvement truly worthy of being mentioned here.
Quickly touching on the things planned for the second round of QOL improvements in the latter half of the year, I'll say that while all of them sound really promising, I think one would do well to rein in their expectations, especially given how… moderate their QOL adjustments for the first round of issues are.
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Do you really think that devs can fix anything in this game? Their band-aid-fix-record is horrendous. As I was reading through the dev note I was just wondering how they will gonna screw this up again. Cause just be the how they worded several aspects it is already clear that some things cant work this way or follow a totally wrong way of handling things.
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As an avid Self-Care and meme build enjoyer, I don't look forward to being lobby dodged because somebody doesn't like my perk choices. We removed prestiges to reduce lobby dodging, why would anyone want to add something that might bring it back again?
Showing each teammate's perks while in game on the ping / offering page would be something I'd like to see, though.
I'd like to know if Survivors will be penalised for "going next" by attempting to self unhook or by missing a skill check to give the other final player a chance at hatch in an obviously lost game. Will I be expected to hang on in these situations, giving the Killer more chance to find the last Survivor? Because I usually let myself go in these situations, since it feels a bit petty or like BM to stay alive in a doomed trial.
Other than that, I don't have anything to add except that I'm really happy to see BHVR responding positively to some long standing issues. Obviously, we don't know what solutions they have in mind yet, but this is at least a good sign that this stuff is on their radar and they're working towards improvements. I think they've realised that there's no point in bringing big deal* franchises like FNAF into the game if the new players they've attracted don't stick around because of long standing player frustrations that have never been properly addressed.
*(So the kids tell me. I know nothing about FNAF)
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I’m really glad more people are seeing this as I did when I first read the announcement. Once you get past the initial excitement that they’re focusing on a ‘health period’ you can see what they’re doing is not actually going to resolve anything.
As you said, the surrender system is not going to disincentivise slugging all survivors at 5 gens or slugging the last two for the 4K, but rather incentivise it because the killer will get to walk away with their 4K quicker than ever before. I’ve raised this every single time a surrender option has been raised on this forum for this reason. Fixes should address the core of the issue and this does not. It promotes it. It will only get worse when this goes live.
Similarly, the anti-hiding is going to do nothing to fix the killer annoyance for survivors hiding out the hatch because it only works when you get idle crows. No one is just standing in one spot for the entire time it takes the hatch to spawn, because idle crows already give killers a sound notification and they know round about where you are. It’s going to carry on exactly the same as it is. Survivors are going to continue to hide because nothing they’re doing here fixes the problems.
As far as slugging for the 4K goes when there’s only two survivors left - It’s a vicious circle. Survivors hide because killers slug you and leave you down, then go off to find the 4th survivor. So you cannot do the objective because it’s too easy for the killer to find you. You can’t go and get your partner off the floor because killers either proxy camp or just knock them down again until they bleed out. The anti-hide and the surrender feature are not going to fix this. They’re just going to exacerbate it.
BHVR need a solution to slugging that promotes return to normal play and also needs to disincentivise survivors not doing the objective. In my opinion, gens need to change proportionately to how many survivors there are in a game so they’re not an insurmountable task.
It’s very telling that the press release of the chapter describes this situation as ‘unwinnable’. There is half the team left in the match at this point, it certainly shouldn’t be unwinnable. That’s the core issue and that’s what needs to change.
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Moving forward, Map Offerings will no longer guarantee the appearance of a given Map, but rather increase its chances by 20%. Note that they will not stack. We’re also looking to make it so Map Offerings, as well as several other types of Offerings, will remain a secret during load-in – that way, your decision to remain in the match will not be swayed by external factors.
I feel like this is the wrong approach to map offerings. A 4-man gets an 80% chance of getting the map they want with this, while the killer only gets a 20% chance. The simpler solution that is fair for both sides is to flip the current effect. Instead of sending you to a specific realm, it removes that realm from the pool.
Basically just map bans.
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Thank you for taking time to make this game healthier and in a better place and trying new things <3 Honestly I give this game so much flak, but seeing an update like this makes me have so much more faith and happier!
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We can make it to where teammates can only see each others perks when pressing the "Esc" key after you're already in game. Then if you want to D/C, it's all on you at that point.
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No. Map offerings will be no longer stackable. So dropping four Eyries won't increase the chance to 80% - it will stay at 20%.
I am personally happy about the chance but I also rather prefer your suggestion.
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The concern is if all 4 survivors bring 4 different map offerings, then what is the overall chance that one of those maps is chosen?
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This sounds good.
I've been burned by BHVR promises, but it does sound mostly good.
The only things that concern me are the "giving up" and hiding.
There are a few ways that giving up is good, like when it's a 2v1 and you're hooked. Likewise, it kind of sounds like the system proposed will nab a lot of new players.
Likewise, with hiding in a 2v1, it used to be that you could try to find a Key. Now the game is unwinnable, no matter what, so they really just need to speed it up.
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20% for each of the four, I assume the rest of the maps have the normal weight.
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