Opinions on the current version of the ghoul?

My main issue with him is that he has an auto-aim hit scan ranged attack that takes a health state and a half. The enraged vault and the timings and speed around his power are also too strong for how little is required to pull them off. I like comparing him to Wesker. They are both 4.6m/s killers who have high mobility powers and where their timings are different highlights why Ghoul isn'-t very fun to play against for me while Wesker generally is. All of these timings are sourced from their respective wiki pages.

Wesker takes 1.5s to charge his power, whereas Ghoul only takes 0.35s. I think this is fine considering Ghoul can't immediately injure you with it, though less than a third of the time is pretty extreme. Wesker and Ghoul both move at 3.68m/s while holding it up and travel at 14m/s after activation, though Wesker slows down to 2.76m/s in between his first and second bound whereas it doesn't seem Ghoul slows down at all. Wesker takes 1.5s after cancelling his power, whereas Ghoul is only 1s. The slower charge time already means he will take less time to cancel so it kind of double dips here. Wesker takes 1.5s to vault something, which I believe Ghoul does as well except while enraged which lowers it to like 0.9s if I applied the modifier correctly. After vaulting, Wesker enters a 1.5s cooldown. Ghoul's is only 1.25s for some reason. Overall, enraged Ghoul spends a little over 2 seconds to get over a pallet before he can swing where Wesker takes 3. So that's almost a whole 4 meters of distance which will equal a hit at most pallets, for an ability that is easier to aim and pull off which seems backwards to me.

Ghoul's cooldowns are also shorter outside of pallets. When they cancel their power after the first use or are out of tokens, Wesker has a 3 second cooldown while Ghoul's is only 2. The only piece they have in common here is after they get a hit they both have a 3 second cooldown, but that also seems pretty unfair to me considering the effort that goes into actually landing that hit. Additionally, Wesker's cooldown is increased to 5 seconds when he has to throw the survivor whereas Ghoul has no similar conditional downside. It doesn't really seem like bodyblocking midloop is particularly difficult, because every single Ghoul I have played against has been able to do it pretty consistently, and then when they do there really there's far less time to react than when another killer would do something similar. Like sure I guess it's harder than the grab attack and the enraged vault hits but like… that's a pretty low bar.

Personally, I don't think there is anything they could do to Ghoul's current power that would make it "acceptable" to me. I think it's an egregious design flaw to have it work the way that it does, which is made worse by the fact he requires a lot less from the killer player to be as effective than similar killers. None of his changes addressed the issues I had with him on PTB or release. I'm sure his kill rate has reduced slightly with the tweaks, but the experience of playing against him hasn't changed at all. All of the most frustrating aspects are still there the same as they were when he was launched.

I don't really have an opinion of playing as him anymore, since I only did so a few games on the PTB. His power seemed like a design mistake to me then, so I didn't buy him.

The Ghoul is, in my view, still overtuned… not necessarily because of raw numbers, but because of how much pressure he generates with so little effort. His map mobility, chained aggression, and the ease with which he secures downs make him one of the most punishing killers to play against, especially when piloted competently.

Yes, he's fun to play → for the killer. But as several people have already pointed out, good killer design shouldn’t peak at 11/10 fun for one side while the other sits somewhere between a 1 and 2. That’s exactly where The Ghoul lands right now. The frustration from the survivor side is palpable, and that’s a clear sign something is off.

Compare him to Wesker… a killer who is strong, fair, and actually fun to face. Wesker rewards both skill and timing on both ends. Survivors feel like they have agency, and good plays on both sides feel earned. That’s healthy asymmetry. The Ghoul currently fails to deliver that experience.

He might not need deletion, but the current iteration does require deeper structural tuning… not just cooldown tweaks. Without that, we're stuck in a meta where one side is encouraged to leave, alt-tab, or write forum posts while waiting to get hooked.

Very much agree with the 3 meters minimum distance to leap like you saw in my discussion. It would make him so much less frustrating to play on indoor maps and less clunky in general.

The vault speed could maybe get slightly reduced, but not too much because he gets punished very hard for breaking pallets.

My frustration when playing against him is how unavoidable his hitscan injury attack is. If they tweaked that he would be more enjoyable to play against. Maybe also reduce the mending time when affected by his mark to make playing against him more enjoyable.

I can agree with that, I do think the character could easily be kept in tact whilst making them fun to play against. It just needs time and care put into the changes, something I hope BHVR can do down the line.

Or rather, your opinions and love of the character make me believe there is a way to make you happy while those who play against him happy.

Respect, that‘s a good Clip. It‘s very hard to do especially on a lot of maps with a lot of clutter.

I don‘t exactly get what you mean with the increase from 1.5 meters to 1.8 meters, but increasing the cancel time would kill this character.

Still insufferable.

Hit scan attacks were a very bad idea, auto aim (the sticky cursor combined with the slightly increased hit detection for survivors) also feels unfair (doubly so if he injures you through a solid object), a free injury is always going to be extremely frustrating to play against and enraged vaults are still practically old scamper.

In short, a completely unfun experience to play against, but who cares about that when the killer is fun to use, right?

Let's please not act like BHVR doesn't care about the survivors fun, they simply released a killer that missed the mark. And honestly I still believe he can be fun for quite a few survivor players with just a couple of more tweaks.

he doesn't have the kidnap tech anymore also can we just leave kaneki alone?

Ghoul seems okay, but the main thing I really hate about ghoul is their auto aim thing gives them free hits on survivors who are hiding, when vs just about any other killer, they don't see you and would walk by.

This will be controversial to some, but I think he's slightly annoying to face and yet I'm okay with it?

It's hard to explain and I'm not sure why I feel that way to begin with.

Yeah. I can agree with that. Theoretically, I am fine with an extremely high mobility power that that's great for positioning but not much else. So the main pain points to me are when his power is doing a lot more on top of that, and arguably the strongest parts of his ability are the free initial injure and the free hits after enraged vault modifier and canceling. If they got rid of the initial injure and the enraged vault modifier and playing against him was ONLY around body blocking and avoiding the body blocks like OP showed it that would probably feel a lot more engaging.

But that's a big if, because I can't see them peeling away that much of his power without immense blowback. And I'd understand, too. It'd be Ash all over again. I think they just made a huge mistake designing and releasing him this way, and it's enough that I've avoided playing much survivor since his release.

If they mess around with that aim scan assist any more he'll very likely become unplayable with a controller.

Feel free to plug in a controller to confirm that yourself

The enraged vault is actually not that bad anymore. At least against me survivors are often able to make it around the loop again before I can hit them after I vault. But I can see why people would want it nerfed just slightly more. Right now the vault time is 1.5 seconds, 1.7 or 1.8 seconds would probably be the sweet spot.

I fear there is nothing they can do about the hitscan though. I don't think kaneki would work without it.

Just hold on a bit longer, once Springtrap is released Kaneki will probably be played much less. I just hope Springtrap is very fun to go against.

I play on controller and the only killer I found genuinely impossible to use was old trickster with his recoil.

I am not opposed to making qol updates for controller players, but the solution can't be introducing aim assisted attacks. That just feels cheap to go against.

How are you supposed to hit something without it? That would really suck.