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It has been over 3 years already and we still only have 5 boons

AhoyWolf
AhoyWolf Member Posts: 4,645

What was the point of adding them if you're not gonna expand on the idea or do anything with them for such a long time? You add a general Perk that allows Killers to break boons which was pretty neat, but not add any general boon Perk to Survivors so the Killer Perk could be used at all? So that perk only works on a mechanic locked behind "luck" through the Shrine of Secrets or a DLC…

Then boons get nerfed (rightfully for some), but then the brand new cool general Killer Perk becomes an unusable dead perk in 99% of matches, because nobody just uses those damn boons, and why would they?

I just don't get it, BHVR has so many options to improve upon the Survivor gameplay by expanding on ideas they already have in the game, like boons, breakable walls, teamwork perks, etc…

Anyone can answer this?

Comments

  • Linkdouken
    Linkdouken Member Posts: 681

    I like boons just for something a bit different to do and they can be viable but yes,there needs to be more boons and invocations (but make them better)

  • Langweilig
    Langweilig Member Posts: 3,139
    edited May 30

    The problem is behavior doesn‘t want to reintroduce controversial stuff and boons are exactly that, same with invocations, so they rather abandon them, which is sad.

    Shattered hope should have never existed as perk and instead been made basekit, which would have allowed to keep circle of healing and buff the other boon perks.

    That are my ideas for boons:

    Post edited by Langweilig on
  • LockerLurk
    LockerLurk Member Posts: 1,683

    Boons are best described as a niche perk type best used for SWFs, and since BHVR does not want to make SWFs more powerful but wants to keep them balanced (a 4-man SWF according to their data has a higher likelihood of escape and sometimes even approaches a 50% escape rate if they're one of the rare very coordinated and very good SWFs), Boons gotta be left behind. They're a failed concept unfortunately. Niche.

    Hexes are quite similar too - not many Killers can defend a totem well, perks like Hex: Ruin are way better used on Killers with high mobility. Unless you're running something like Pentimento and Plaything together, Hexes are also often not great unless built around. Perhaps they were good when Hag was released, but not anymore.

  • I_Cant_Loop
    I_Cant_Loop Member Posts: 2,276

    This is the correct answer. Boons are terrible and there are far better perks to choose from. It’s an interesting concept and I’m glad that BHVR tried it out. I think boons could be worthwhile to run with some buffs, but of course there’s always a delicate balance between making them worthwhile but not OP (as was the case with original CoH).

  • Langweilig
    Langweilig Member Posts: 3,139
    edited May 30

    Invocations are easy to fix. Make the crow one give you oblivous instead of broken and weaving makes you lose a hook state instead of broken. Then decrease their time a bit and make it possible to do them at the same time at the cost of taking a little bit longer.

    Boons are also relatively easy to fix, but you have my discussion linked there if you want to discuss my ideas and I don‘t think my ideas would make boons worse or too op. Just strong and worth running.

  • LockerLurk
    LockerLurk Member Posts: 1,683

    As it turns out, a limited but super powerful effect still is not fun to play against, because it's super powerful, so you can't make them TOO strong or they become really unbalanced. As I pointed out Hex perks have this same exact problem and that's why nobody hardly ever runs them.

  • Science_Guy
    Science_Guy Member Posts: 2,073

    I don't really agree that Boons are a complete failure. I occasionally still run COH/Shadowstep boon builds, and when my solo queue teammates are actually smart enough to play into it, the payoff is really nice. Shadowstep in particular is quite underrated, and it sort of salvages some utility when I get teammates that refuse to heal. OTOH, the other ones are quite useless. I would love to see a lot more experimentation with the mechanic.

  • Reinami
    Reinami Member Posts: 6,611

    They are either way too strong or useless. no in betwee.

  • coco_shotz
    coco_shotz Member Posts: 305

    Boons can be a useful tactic, but I think they need to try something a bit less situational. i feel like maybe having them work in a similar manner to hex's would be beneficial. Like you place a boon that helps give faster healing (circle of healing) another one that gives silent foot steps to all survivors (shadow step) and so on.

    They can also work map wide this way so you don't have to run to a select location for use out of the perk, but the effects can be lessened to a general buff instead of a heavy buff in a targeted area.

  • GeneralV
    GeneralV Member Posts: 12,666
  • jesterkind
    jesterkind Member Posts: 9,563

    I'm surprised nobody else has pointed this out, but five isn't actually that little for newer perk types?

    There are only seven Scourge Hook perks, and that's including the two existing perks that were changed into Scourge Hooks. If we're only counting new releases, there are exactly as many Scourge Hook perks as there are Boon perks.

    As to boons themselves, I think people are too quick to dismiss them currently. We have five boons, and three of them are outright good + worth running if you want their effects, that's a pretty damn good hit rate. Sure, Dark Theory and Illumination could use a little boost - and I have some ideas for how to do that myself, though that's a little outside the scope of this post - but the other three are just flat out good perks.

    I don't think BHVR really are neglecting them. We haven't gotten a new one in a little while, but that's true of other perk types as well; prior to Houndmaster, the last killer to have a Scourge Hook perk was Sadako, and that's a pretty big gap.

    Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see more boons and some buffs for the two undertuned boons as well - especially a new generic boon - but I don't really think the mechanic's being neglected, really. I'd sooner finger Teamwork perks as the neglected archetype, lmfao.

  • 100PercentBPMain
    100PercentBPMain Member Posts: 2,794
    edited May 30

    bhvr won't give us new indoor levels to abuse boons. I invite people to say boons are trash on indoor levels.

    I was really praying that Freddy fazbears was gonna be primarily indoor

  • 100PercentBPMain
    100PercentBPMain Member Posts: 2,794
    edited May 30

    I'd love to see how you play against an always active Shadowstep and CoH. its annoying enough youll feel the need to keep breaking it.

    Healthy survivors breaking LoS under Shadowstep saves as much health states as CoH recovers. if the level has floors like midwich or RPD, even better.

  • Aven_Fallen
    Aven_Fallen Member Posts: 17,644

    Regarding Floors - I said in my post that the only change Boons needed (at least CoH before they completely gutted it) was that it only works on one Floor. So I agree on that.

    However, if Survivors are using Boons, they are already helping the Killer. Circle of Healing as the strongest Boon is not really worth it the time spend to boon a Totem. I gladly take teams who waste their time doing that, ideally over and over again.

    Shadowstep is not really an issue. You can still hear Survivors and most of the time you will have at least some form of line of sight. At least I never had an issue with Shadowstep.

  • SoGo
    SoGo Member Posts: 4,258

    Boons need some love (as do all of the special perk types), that's for sure.

    Here is how I'd change them:

    General changes:

    • Reduce the noises that the boons make to make them not as loud.
    • Increase the general radius of the boons to 32 meters
    • Reduce the time needed to bless a dull totem to 7 seconds.
    • Now, totems automatically break after being snuffed.

    Individual Perk changes:

    Boon: Circle of Healing
    • Injured survivors now can see the auras of survivors inside the Boon.

    Boon: Shadow Step
    • Add an effect of muffling footsteps of survivors into it.

    Boon: Illumination
    • Make it so that it also shows the auras of totems, pallets and windows.
    • Replace the cleansing/blessing speed bonus with a 4/5/6 second lingering effect.
    • Make it so this perk ignores the Blindness status effect while inside the boon's radius.

    Boon: Dark Theory (Full Rework)

    Your obsessive study of the paranormal has given you unprecedented knowledge of other realms and planes of existence.

    Press and hold the Ability button near a Dull or Hex Totem to bless it and create a Boon Totem. Soft chimes ring out in a 32 meter range.

    When in the Boon's radius:
    • You can see the auras of all regressing generators in light blue.

    While the Boon is active:
    • Generators regress 10/15/20% slower.
    • When a generator starts regressing, the blessed Totem is blocked from being snuffed for 15 seconds.

  • terumisan
    terumisan Member Posts: 2,208

    killers actually can't break boons they only break the totem which is still a problem since boons can be placed infinitely but hexes can't

  • hermitkermit
    hermitkermit Member Posts: 991

    Boons are great in theory but as others have stated, they’re really tricky to balance, and the time/effort it takes to find a totem and set the boon often don’t end up worth it. I feel like the only way to get a chance at decent value is to dedicate the entire build to Boons. And as someone that’s tried many times to play around with them, they’re often found really quickly. Exponential is great but in order for it to work you have to be in the radius— and if you’re in the radius that means you can hear it which means the killer hears it too. The recovery time just wasn’t enough to pick up before the was snuffed.

    But yeah, I would love for boons to be better but they’re tricky.

  • AhoyWolf
    AhoyWolf Member Posts: 4,645

    Hexes are generally stronger and are map wide tho, that's why they're one time use, boons should be weaker hexes that can be relit with some time investment, but as of right now, they are just way too generic / limited, pretty much not worth running since you have Perks that do pretty much the same thing and better in some cases without the need to invest time into boons.

  • Host_yu
    Host_yu Member Posts: 31

    To be fair almost all the boons in the game are trash and not worth it. It takes 14 seconds to even set up a boon (28 if its a hex) just for it to get snuffed in 1 second lol. That's 14 seconds you could've put towards a gen, not including the time it took to search for dull. Lets go through them shall we

    Boon Circle of Healing: Got nerfed to ######### and honestly isn't worth running, I'm not about to run across the map to heal somebody in a boon

    Boon Illumination: HAHAHAHAHA

    Boon Shadow Step: Decent perk but not worth running a boon over especially if I'm only using it to hide my aura or scratch marks

    Boon Dark Theory: Decent Perk and honestly the extra haste makes a difference

    Boon Exponential: Its infinite UB and arguably the best boon perk currently you'll very rarely get value from it at least in my experience

    I believe that's it. My honest opinion/suggestion for boons is to increase the radius of them and give some of them some buffs. COH could be self care for everyone again but give it a long time to self care maybe equal to selfcare and keep the bonus of it being faster to have someone else heal you.

    Illumination could be buffed to make it also show chest and totems

    Shadow step is fine, Dark Theory is fine, Exponential is fine

    These perks just need an increase in range some of them (I don't feel like renaming them again) but a lot of them can stay at 24 while some can be increase to 24-42 meters

  • AhoyWolf
    AhoyWolf Member Posts: 4,645

    I think having boons at 28 metres would be fine as a base line, the issue with boons having different AOE ranges would be the question of how would they stack? I mean, they could all just work with different ranges on one totem right? But that would kinda give false positives and would be quite confusing: "I was in the boon radius why didn't X Perk active?!" or "Is X Perk 28 metres or 32 metres or something else???", it would just be confusing tbh.

  • Host_yu
    Host_yu Member Posts: 31

    I don't think it'd be confusing it can activate the same as it does now. Bottom right showing you what boon you have active

  • JawsIsTheNextKiller
    JawsIsTheNextKiller Member Posts: 3,436

    If Circle of Healing just gave everybody the ability to heal at self-care speeds with no additional benefits, I think it would be enough to make boons worthwhile.

    Going from completely overpowered to useless seems like a wasted opportunity.

  • Langweilig
    Langweilig Member Posts: 3,139

    Agree. That‘s the main thing I want. Give us self care on circle of healing back. Just make it very slow.