What are your thoughts on current DS?

Still a very decent pick, just not as 'guaranteed' as 5 seconds anymore. Won't help you against Nurse though.

It's definitely a good anti-tunnel perk again. 4 secs definitely feels a lot better for killer, 5 was just excessive, people would t-bag and still make a lot of distance. However i feel like the perk has become a must have again. Also, as killer i hate when survivors stack anti-tunnel to use it offensively.

All these things need to be addressed with the anti-tunneling quality of life update they are doing. Perk reliance for the matter, and it's exploitative nature.

DS is still being weaponized against killers that weren't trying to tunnel. Survivors don't want to "waste" DS, so if the killer isn't trying to tunnel them, then the DS user will aggressively bodyblock, or do other things to hinder the killer from chasing anyone else. It's pretty much the problem that all endurance-based anti-tunneling has, where survivors want to weaponize it against killers that aren't trying to tunnel.

Honestly, if BHVR can manage AI to figure out if survivors are trying to Go Next, then they can get AI to figure out if a survivor is purposely trying to hinder the killer from chasing other people, and that should be considered a conspicuous action.

It's the exact same logic, because you're trying to tell killers they should be happy when survivors bodyblock, because it means less survivors are on generators. That logic says the the number of survivors on generators, is the absolute most important thing in the entire multiverse.

Otherwise, your whole argument falls apart. And we would be able to say things like "NO! Killers should not be happy when they get bodyblocked, because it seriously doesn't matter if it means less people are repairing generators".

I just explained how it's free pressure though. Like yeah it's boring and frustrating when you're not trying to tunnel them but it doesn't change the fact that if you slug them and go for the person they body blocked for, without UB somebody has to get off gens and pick them up aka 'free pressure'. (It's free because the survivor with DS is getting in your face and wants to go down)

Feel however you want about it, that's none of my business.

My argument is that it's a bad idea for survivors to do it because good killers will punish them for it either by just eating the DS and tunnelling them anyway or slugging them. I don't get what's so hard to understand about that.

No, it has nothing to do with whether they agree with me or not. When I say "good killers" I mean people who see the situation and would go "wow this survivor obviously has DS, they can stay slugged" and don't fall for the survivor's obvious bait. Newer/inexperienced killers will fall for it and thus the survivor gets value from their perk as opposed to just being left on the ground.

Also yeah I never said that second part. Survivors who try to weaponise DS know what they are doing. They just expect The Killer to be the clueless one in the scenario.

"He'll eat my DS and we'll both get away" or something like that.

…No? What are you talking about

This is your scenario:

"I am going after a survivor who just unhooked someone however the person who got unhooked is blocking me!"

So then down the person who obviously has DS and keep chasing. Don't fall for the bait/don't let them have perk value. Take the free slug pressure instead.

It's not name calling, it is a fact that newer/less experienced killers will fall for survivor baits compared to those who know what tricks survivors will pull against them. If you think that's "name-calling" then idk what else to say that's just trying to dismiss my point with a petty response.

Again, just to re-iterate - I'm going off of YOUR scenario of not wanting to tunnel off the hook. If you don't care about tunnelling then yeah, tunnel the dude with DS. Why not, they are asking for it. But in YOUR scenario you said you don't want to do that.

Yup, it's important as a survivor to have good positioning, I agree. If I'm running out into the open with nothing nearby and I go down, that's on me. Generally survivors have full control over where they go down. It's all about positioning yourself well whenever your area of operation is. If a killer starts chasing, it's important to bring the killer to a position that's better for you. Avoid deadzones, and be perceptive if stealth is in play. If pallets are low, then ensure you have an exit plan where there at least a window or a loop with them. Pallets are a precious resource, so it is vital that survivors play smart and dont waste them - you'll want as many as you can in the endgame. That's also why experienced survivors may choose to go down instead of using a god pallet so that god pallet is available later in the match when someone is on death hook. It's all about resource management of pallets and even hook states. If survivors are just blowing through resources willy nilly with no thought, that's a problem they should need to deal with, not a perk that just undoes the risk.

So sure, pallets may get reduced, but loops and windows are always available. If you're going down drag the killer to them, then hit them with that DS, and bam, you're extending the chase even longer for your teammates. A single loop can add a lot of time to a chase. Thats the power of DS.

This guy plays entirely perkless and is very good at showing survivors how to effectively play. I definitely recommend checking him out. Getting to one of these loops alone is worth DS' weight in gold.

It's a difficult one as the obvious issue is, it punishes the weaker killers for tunnelling but Nurse and Blight will take eat the stun and immediately down you again if you didn't manage to go down again in a good spot.

It is probably no coincidence some of the worst tunnellers I see are Blights in particular, far more than Nurses

I'm not sure what point you think you're trying to make when you pick garden of joy as the example.

Having trouble finding a pallet? Try Gideon's! Although you can't even choose your map with an offering guaranteed outside of custom lobbies.

Now do the same thing on rotten fields. I won't wait.

It's good imo.

My slow head can't hit the skill check even with a gun aiming at me, so I don't run it.

For those who do, I guess it's great.

As killer, I usually down people bit not pick them up if they came from a hook, and it usually works and I don't get stabbed.

Because we're getting Go Next, the game should already be able to tell the difference between a survivor that is trying to escape a chase, and a survivor that is purposely trying to get hit.

So the game should be able to add intentional bodyblocking to the list of conspicuous actions for enduranced-based anti-tunneling, like DS.

Therefore, when a DS user is intentionally bodyblocking, they lose DS when they take a hit, so it wouldn't matter if they jump in a locker afterwards, because they won't have DS anymore.

Because the survivor had an endurance effect, or because they were healed beforehand. For example, one of the popular DS builds is: OTR/DS/DH/Unbreakable.

Okay?

That's not DS, though, is it?

The problem with DS is that it is essentially a psyop. Bad survivors think that just because they haven't stunned the killer, it means they haven't got any usage out of the perk. This could not be further from the truth. Because DS impact on the game if used is so massive and there is no tell if the survivor has it or not (besides being the obsession which is highly inconsistent considering generally more than one survivor uses it), it influences every decision the killer makes. In that sense, DS is so powerful that you don't really need to use it to get value out of it, so much so that every survivor in every game against a killer who is aware of it uses DS without it being equipped because as killer, you simply have to respect it's existence.

In my opinion, they should alert the killer if the survivor has it or not. It can be a subtle hint, like the survivor holding a glass shard if they are downed with DS active. That way, you would actually have to use the perk to get value from it.

S tier perk