My Item Revisions, Vol. 4: Toolboxes
Hello everyone!
So, I am now on post talking about how I'd improve an item type number 4. (Links for the rest at the end of the post.)
Now, it's time for toolboxes. The main things I want to achieve with these changes is to make them a bit less unbalanced, and make them each specialized for a certain kind of playstyle. Enjoy!
Worn Out Tools:
• 20 Charges
• 25% faster Repair speed
• 50% larger Good Skill Check zones
• Great Skill Checks do not appear.
• 30% slower Skill Checks
• Unlocks the Sabotage action
This one would be tailored to beginners and people who have problems with Skill Checks. I also decreased the repair speed and removed great skill check zones to avoid potential abuse with Hyperfocus.
Toolbox:
• 20 Charges
• 50% faster Repair speed
• Unlocks the Sabotage action
• 50% faster Sabotage speed
This one would become a jack-of-all-trades, but unlike the current one we have (Commodious), it's not just the best in any thing it does.
Commodious Toolbox:
• 28 Charges
• 50% faster Repair speed
• Unlocks the Sabotage action
It should only be focused on repair, not also sabotage. I also trimmed down the numbers just a smidge to even out the field a bit.
Engineer's Toolbox:
• 16 Charges
• 100% faster Repair speed
• Unlocks the Sabotage action
The only real change is that it no longer sabotages faster.
Mechanic's Toolbox (REMOVED)
Alex's Toolbox (Unchanged)
Next up, add-ons. These are, imo, some of the main offenders behind why toolboxes get so ridiculously strong in certain ways. These are the changes:
Instructions (Common):
• Now removes the regression caused by failing a Skill Check while repairing with a Toolbox.
Clean Rag (Common):
• Decreased Repair Speed bonus from 20% to 10%.
Scraps (Common → Uncommon)
• Increases the bonus from Great Skill Checks by 1%.
• Causes the Skill Check pointer to have a chance to go backwards, faster, or slower.
• Causes the Skill Check zones to have a chance to be smaller.
Protective Gloves (REMOVED)
Spring Clamp (Uncommon):
• Now can be permanently applied to a single gen.
• Single use, no Skill Check required.
Socket Swivels (Uncommon → Rare):
• Decreased Repair Speed bonus from 30% to 15%.
Wire Spool (Uncommon → Very Rare)
Brand New Part (Visceral):
• Now, it also reduces the total Charges of the Toolbox by 12.
Thoughts?
Related discussions:
Comments
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I like it, it promotes people to run perk that refills your items more often than just running pure bully builds which can be even in combo with current items.
These changes also would fit well with upcoming changes to anti tunneling and slugging, maybe some further tweaks.
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Glad you like my changes!
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That instructions change is awful. Hitting skillchecks is way better than having none at all, cus you gain more bp and have a chnace fir great skillchecks. You'd likely get made fun of by your teammates for running that.
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I was thinking of it as a beginner-centric add-on, that's why I made it like this.
But, this is a really simple thing to change, so yeah, it would be probably better if it worked for the user only.
Are there other changes you have some thoughs on?
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This would keep toolboxes still way too powerfull. I made my own post about this. It was about toolboxes are consumed on a gen to permanently increas the particular gen speed (by 5, 7 and 10 %) Meaning that Engineers toolbox would result in current Prove thyself at best.
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Ok, that would:
- Not change a single thing, because the resulting time spared with a toolbox is approximately the same as with a permanent +10% repair speed. (90÷1,1= ~82 sec. Engineer's Toolbox conserves 8 seconds exactly at base, so also 82 sec.)
- Make toolboxes unpopular due to the way people would see them, which causes everyone to run medkits instead. If that is the goal, then great job.
So correct me if I'm wrong, but this change suggestion is just changing the font and pretending the text isn't awful anymore.
If you want radical nerfs, this is not it.
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You didn't write it here, but I think they should split the existing toolboxes into two different items, making an entire new Item class called Sabotage Toolboxes, carrying over Sabotage related add ons and reusing Machanic's and Alex's Toolboxes as well as a new uncommon one. These toolboxes would be made on a charge based system, just like Keys, Maps and Fog Vials. Giving you a predetermined amount of charges to sabotage a hook and no punishment through not committing to a sabo by reducing your item's percentage. Grip wrench would make for a good very rare add on, hacksaw giving a basic buff to the toolboxes would be an uncommon. Then there could be a common to add 2 charges to the Toolbox, a rare add on that shows the closest hook to the killer while they're carrying/picking up a survivor, buff and change protective glove's rarity to visceral, adding the ability of making sabotaging quiet, and making hook auras linger for 10 seconds after being destroyed, but charges are reduced by 1 or 2.
Repair speed add on nerfs feel unnecessary, since the faster you repair, the faster your charges are depleting anyway. Most people use their toolboxes on the first gen they see, so theres no point in nerfing the stretegic use of speed add ons to lets say pop a generator as the killer is actively running at your gen.
Normal Toolboxes already have 7 add ons linked to doing gens, so might as well do what they did with Keys, Maps and Fog Vials and make only 5 of them stay, having one for each rarity. I'd say we cut loose wire spool, instructions and clean rag. Keep the existing version of scraps, existing socket swivels, change springclamp to a rare add on, make a new very rare that hides all generator auras for the killer while the toolbox is in use, and keep existing BNP.
I kinda wanna make my own post covering more detailed changes to toolboxes and the two things they are used for. I'll get to it now.
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Separating repair and sabotage could be a good possibility. I don't mind both being a part of the same item, but it could work as a way to make them less strong.
I nerfed the repair speed add-ons, because they are frankly outrageously strong for their rarity. I still think they would be good even in my ideal nerfed form, tho.
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I just like using the item strategically like that to pop before Pain Res or even Pop (the perk.) Doing that would be alot harder without socket swivels
That said, here are my changes.
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That would be one way to do it. As Sabotage and Repair wouldn't be on the same item, it would be easier to deal with.
There are still potential balance wrinkles to worry about in the add-on part, tho.
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IMO Alex's Toolbox should also be changed, it should have a repair speed bonus of like 30/40% or something.
- Even if you're going into a match intending to sabo, wouldn't you rather bring a toolbox with a 50% bonus and maybe a sabotage speed addon? I'm not very well versed on how sabo speed translates into real gameplay, but to my understanding a commodius' inherent sabo speed should still let you take a basic attack in front of a hook, sabotage it, then get away, right? If not I imagine a hacksaw addon would still make up the difference
- It being so intensely specialised pollutes the Chest pool.
Besides that, some notes about a few of your proposed Addon reworks:
- I don't really like the proposed change to Instructions here, because it kinda enables a mild form of griefing. I don't think it would be serious, but I can just imagine the clips of a new player applying Instructions thinking they're helping, only for the Killer to interrupt the gen at 98% progress because John Streamer couldn't get any Great skillchecks. I also think the inherent design of Instructions is wrong- It's cool to have an addon helping players who struggle with skillchecks, but disabling them entirely means they get less opportunities to learn. I would prefer something like "while repairing a generator with a toolbox, failing skillchecks has no penalty" or maybe just removing them as your version of Worn Out Tools already helps with skillchecks.
- The idea of your Scraps rework is great, but IMO it's not thematic for the addon. Maybe it would fit better on Protective Gloves, and to nerf toolbox capacity addons the capacity boosts for Scraps/Wire Spool could be reduced to something like +6/+10 respectively?
- I really like the idea of the Spring Clamp rework, and if it's applying to a single gen permanently, maybe it could also lower the passive sounds of the generator's pistons? That'd be an idea that doesn't exist in the game yet and could create some interesting survivor/killer mindgames.
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Thank you for the feedback!
I am uncertain about buffing the repair speed of the sabo toolbox, as it could get out of hand. But, maybe a nice middle ground of 25% would be possible.
Your Instructions suggestion is really good! You raised a good point about beginners having to learn skill checks, so removing the penalty for a bit would be a good choice for a learning add-on.
I made the Scraps change because I didn't want to do a nerf like this to the charge add-ons. My idea behind it was that you now can't stack them, so the remaining one can stay the same.
I'm glad you like the Spring Clamp idea. And yes, it would be permanent on the gen you put it on. I don't know if it's possible to make the pistons more silent, but I would love it if it was.
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I support your thread! I like it!
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Thank you! I'm glad you like it.
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Bringing toolboxes more in line with each other is a good step because there should be no insane difference between a brown and commodius toolboxes.
However, Sabo toolboxes and their addons should be reverted since they are way too free and strong since their recent buff.
I also wouldn't mind if toolboxes either show your aura to your teammates or you see their aura whenever you hit a skill check on a generator - triggers when you have a toolbox equipped and not only when you work with it. It would help SoloQ a little bit more when it comes to coordination.
However, for the addons, I don't wanna see straight up nerfs or boring adjustments. I wish toolboxes' addons would also enable different fun like killer's addons can do. I have this similar issue with Medkit's addons that they are either boring number things or nothing special. It would be fine if they had a weaker perk version effect or something special that is fun, helpful, but not stupid broken.
- Giving you the ability to gain a weaker version of Chemical Trap (more gen-progress and a bit less hindered duration).
- If you finish a generator with a teammate, for the next 50 seconds you both have an increased repair speed of 5% (thus, stacking could be a problem but I rather wish the devs would go back to a stack-prevention like they tried with haste).
- An addon that always shows you the aura of gens that regress (Rockie Spirit - sure maybe we need to rework or buff the perk then but that wouldn't be bad either).
- After finishing a generator, for the next 30 seconds, you see the aura of your teammates and for 5 seconds the one of the killer.
- Whenever you work on a generator, your teammate see the aura of the generator.
I generally know that some addon changes/reworks would replace or outclass current perks but I just dislike BHVRs philosophy that SoloQ needs perks to have less SoloQ issues. In my opinion, these addon could also have addition effects that help SoloQ in one way or another when it comes to coordination. These are the type of additional effects that wouldn't make SWF stronger but SoloQ better.
So, I'm fine with the toolboxes changes but for the addons, I want a little bit fun, uniqueness, and ways to help SoloQ.
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I think a partial revert would be better.
Cutting Wire and Hacksaw can go back to what they were, but I would knock down Alex' Toolbox sabo speed to 75% instead.
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