9.2.0 | Sinister Grace Patch Notes
Comments
-
I have to agree with the sentiment that nerfing OTR in this patch doesn't make sense if it's not in conjunction with anti-tunnel basekit changes. It's definitely a problematic perk, but it's a necessary evil as long as tunnelling remains in the game the way it currently is.
I'm also a little surprised Tenacity's sidegrade and Deerstalker's rework are going through without basekit anti-slugging, but I don't think those two are necessarily problems.
6 -
Hey there! Apologies for asking, but would you be able to point me towards this bug report? I can make sure it's on the team's radar for you.
-5 -
Would you be able to elaborate on what has made them feel worse this update? I'd be more than happy to pass along that feedback.
-4 -
In addition, I wanted to confirm that I've seen the comments in here about Off The Record. I appreciate y'all being open about your thoughts on it. Rest assured, I've pulled together this feedback and am sharing it with the team.
2 -
In other words, Killer complaints get addressed (again) while Survivor complaints get ignored (again).
17 -
Leverage should not be nerfed as long as Resurgence exists as it is.
Healing is as easy as ever and anti-heal perks are weaker than ever. Leverage was one of the last perks stopping survivors from being healed basically the moment they got unhooked and now it is nerfed for seemingly no reason.
Leverage was a perfectly fine perk. Extra duration does basically nothing for it but the reduced slowdown on healing is a hefty nerf. Better off running gen regression for slowdown.
-2 -
Can you explain the reasoning behind the Deerstalker rework? It's basically a blanket counter to all survivor aura perks but without any prerequisites like, say, Distortion has.
14 -
In other words, we shouldn’t have a double standard, where we tell killers that tunneling is bad, but tell survivors it’s ok for recently unhooked survivors to weaponize anti-tunnel perks.
-24 -
Appreciate that, man. Always a big plus 1 from me whenever m1 killers become less frustrating/annoying to play.
-7 -
Well ######### I was giving the developers grace with postponing the anti-slug/tunnelling update but it's becoming more clear to me that they're just ######### terrible and have absolutely no clue about their game's health.
They've said in the past that they favor killer, so it shouldn't be a surprise anymore but #########. They're either clueless, stupid, or don't give a #########. I'm going for all 3, honestly.
This is what happens when they allow streamers to dictate the way their game goes.
6 -
You guys love just putting survivors down recently
The perkd are still bad
Fog vials still nerfed
Took 4 months to fix kaneki's kidnap exploit but we also can gut fog-vials 2 weeks into release
And now we gutting otr and tenacity for giggles.
Dont complain about killer queues if they are 20+ mins.
13 -
Didnt realise that the anti-changes tried to adress it by removing collision,
Also, are we really pretending that killers dont "weaponize" perks too?, dms and painres, plaything and/or penti, thril when it originally got buffed to the extremes.
Oh, you want aggresive weaponization?, well they exist too. Haunted ground hex build, skill-check build as doc, thombstone myers with pwyf (stacks never being removed since you melee em),
You can also aggresively slug with hag-third seal and most players crumble.
You can do that with 2 players remaining basekit since you wont allow hatch and they cant do #########.
Having kaneki with an abusable exploit for 4 months wasnt enough i guess.
13 -
Thanks Ryan. You think you could also pass on to the team about Tenacity as that's a perk we also feel got nerfed?
-2 -
We really too scared to give survivors anything to play him,
Be careful or johnny might have fun playing survivor, cant have that, loll
6 -
Stop lying, you never listen to survivor feedback. All you guys seem to do is determine the best way to make survivor more miserable. "Oh thank you for the feedback, I'm gonna pass this on to the devs", for them to what? double-down on ######### over the survivor?
9 -
Maybe I missed a change, but should I be able to see hook states on killer? Or is this a bug? Just played a match and I was about halfway through before I realized it was even there.
0 -
I love the Hope nerf too! Since my endgame tunneling build with Remember Me is even stronger now!
Also we really NEED more aura reading perks that fit well on nurse!!! she is so weak after all..
6 -
the same reason onyro's VHS tape is iridescent.
0 -
Yes, finally I can get the kills that are rightfully mine in end game despite playing terrible all match!
Poor nurse, indeed. The dear thing does need some help.
9 -
The self pickup isn't working in game. Was this a mistake in the patch notes?
0 -
You may be reading it wrong. What it means is when your recovery bar is full while you have a perk that allows a self pickup equipped you press the button to recover out of the dying state now like in 2v8. There's no self pickup basekit.
2 -
To be fair, the patch notes don't specify that you need one of those perks to pick yourself up.
1 -
I hope I am and it's not anything misleading
0 -
That doesn't justify buffing tunneling even more, especially in the same patch that was originally supposed to nerf it.
As jesterkind said, as long as tunneling exists in the game the way it is, OTR is…while I wouldn't call it a "necessary evil," it is definitely necessary.
21 -
I played a bunch of surv today and never got the option to pick myself up after having been left on the ground for long enough. It worked like before where I'd reach 95% progress and then someone else would have to come and get me.
0 -
Here it is:
0 -
dude without tunneling or slugging which killers have to do sometimes because of how strong swf is, nerfing it means that so many killers including Twins are going to be unviable and you are just gonna see Nurses and Blights everywhere
-23 -
This is killer rulebook stuff. Nowhere does it say you can't use endurance to help a team mate. Everyone pretty much unanimously believes the survivor experience would be much better if everyone played as a team, so let them play as a team.
15 -
"Everyone played as a team" means no lone wolf survivors that are excessively hiding, and trying to get an escape as the last survivor alive. "Everyone played as a team" means none of the survivors ragequitting.
"Everyone played as a team" doesn't mean that absolutely everything in the multiverse, that involves teamwork, is good for the game.
-13 -
Kind of a wasted opportunity to rework draculas iri addons and cube of zoe. Who knows when he will get another update.
1 -
Is there any word on Tenacity? It has always been a mainstay of my build and I see a lot of "We're sending feedback regarding OTR" but nothing whatsoever for Tenacity which now feels almost entirely useless? I permarun No Mither (and thank you thank you thank you for finally allowing me to remove Iron Will) but it hurts to see Tenacity done so wrongly when the crawl+recover mechanics didn't get implemented but it still got the nerf for that :/
1 -
"Everyone played as a team" doesn't mean that absolutely everything in the multiverse, that involves teamwork, is good for the game.
You're going to melt a lot of brains with that level of nuance.
(I fully agree, by the way.)
-12 -
Ryan, I do want to know how this happened, and I wager more people do. It's not like they forgot to untangle the perk changes from the held-back anti-tunnel/slug changes, since the regression nerfs were reverted.
How is it that it's specifically the survivor side's perks that carried this mistake, and not the killer side's?
11 -
I’m sure that Blurry Photo was the most-used addon for The Unknown. Instead of making it part of the base kit, the developers just nerfed it. Why? Was it problematic or overpowered? No, it was just necessary for comfortable gameplay with him. I understand why they did it—they wanted more variety—but they could’ve achieved that by just adding it to the base kit.
0 -
I really hope the Off The Record (OTR) change stays in the game. This version of OTR is way heathier than the previous version because survivors kept weaponizing the endurance effect against killers that were trying to chase someone else.
It feels bad when BHVR tells killers that it's bad to tunnel, but then tells survivors that it's ok for recently unhooked survivors to purposely run towards a killer so the survivor doesn't "waste" their endurance effect.
-14 -
OTR in this way can stay in the game only if anti tunel changes will come to live also. Without those changes OTT should be reverted as its 1 out of 2 anti tunnel perks that survivor has.
We cant agree to nerfing anti tunnel perks while not giving anything in exchange.
10 -
Anti-tunnel means it should be a DEFENSIVE perk. There’s nothing defensive about a perk that encourages a survivor to run towards the killer.
The endurance effect wasn’t even that good against tunneling anyway. If I’m tunneling someone off the hook, and I don’t hear grunts of pain, then I’m immediately hitting them to get rid of the endurance effect. That means the endurance effect was always better as a weapon than it was at anti-tunnel.
As in, previous OTR punishes killers if they don’t tunnel survivors off the hook, which is a bad perk design for an anti-tunnel.-16 -
so you just forgot that OTR changes was introduce only coz Anti-Tunnel changes was also introduced.
Just tell us that you are killer main who struggle to get kills when you are not tunneling and we are will see why you are crying about old OTR
6 -
I literally just said the endurance effect wasn’t even that good against actual tunneling, because if I tunnel the survivor off the hook, I would immediately hit them if I didn’t hear grunts of pain.
-3 -
Normally, when a meta perk is problematic i would tend to agree… but not in this case.
Game is in a ######### state rn for Solo survivors, its prolly in one of the biggest lows its been in a hot minute with a killer thats as good as PH at tunneling and is nearly uncounterable at loops, and they got rid of one of the only options to deal with tunneling, leaving just one good perk now for it.
I actually despise nerfing perks most of the time, and more of the philosophy of buffing other perks to increase variety and choice, but yeaaaaaaa
Everyone is gonna run DS now, might honestly overtake Windows for most used perk for a short while
OTR def can be abused as you said, but thats also a strategic thing to use the endurance to take a hit, espically if another survivor is injured in chase, even if the killer gets back onto them and downs them, they made their choice and thats fine (Survivor mindset is another thing entirely, if they ######### about it, they made their choice on the matter by taking that hit).
Do i think they could find a way to make OTR healthier? yes
Do i think that gutting it is the correct call without the anti-tunnel changes? ######### no
7 -
“They made their choice and that’s fine” isn’t a valid reason to allow survivors to weaponize endurance.
Because if the killer throws the OTR survivor back on a hook, it’s still considered tunneling. And it means the “anti-tunneling” perk actually encouraged the killer to tunnel.
-13 -
It is though, Survivors are actively making the choice to use that endurance to take a protection hit for their teammate, or play bait.
That is the survivor ACTIVELY (keyword) knowing that they can be tunneled by the killer by playing in an altruistic manner, and as i said if they complain, they made their choice to go down again after getting hooked.
as the killer, if the survivor does that, cool, i get another hook, and the survivor can only blame themselves for allowing themselves to be downed so quickly again by playing in that manner.
The core function of the perk is still the anti-tunnel aspect, yes that endurance can be used… but so can the basekit BT endurance aswell, so can WGLF Endurance. It GIVES the survivor agency to make those desicions, and reap the consequences of it.
4 -
It doesn’t matter if the survivor made the choice to be tunneled. It’s still encouraging tunneling, which is the exact opposite of what the perk is supposed to be doing.
The perk isn’t supposed to be “anti-tunneling unless the survivor decides it should be pro-tunneling”
-10 -
But the point of the taking the hit isnt to encourage tunneling, its to take a prot hit, but take that risk of getting tunneled or going down increases significantly by doing so. Its called Agency, the survivor is actively making a choice that can directly affect the outcome of the game and for themselves by using whats at their disposal to affect the game in a positive manner for their team, while not negatively affecting the killer a significant amount (Killer likely still gets a down or a hook)
To me, that sounds like good game design when it does something like that, cause there is drawbacks to taking that endurance hit (encourages killer to after you), but it also wastes time and delays a hit on another player allowing them to reset if need be.
I do think i would be fine with this OTR change IF the anti-tunnel changes were implemented… they are not currently, and nerfing the perk does nothing but remove one of the few Anti-Tunnel tools and a significant amount of Agency for the survivors.
It also encourages less build diversity too, cause guess what perk everyone is gonna use to descentivize tunneling… the only Anti-Tunnel perk in the game
6 -
This leads back into the same cycle of Tunneling and that argument, im gonna leave it here as is.
Its not a good change, it hurts build diversity, hurts survivor agency, and gives the killer only one anti-tunnel tool they need to deal with… which encourages slugging
If they were gonna nerf OTR, they should have buffed other perks to atleast help deal with Anti-Tunnel… but they didnt, and the newest killer is arguably one of the best at tunneling in her current state, prolly even outright being better over PH in terms of tunnel potential.
Bhvr really didnt think about the drawbacks to nerfing this perk without these changes, and i think its gonna show throughout the week.
7 -
I don’t care if it’s called agency. That isn’t a magical word that makes things acceptable.
-10 -
It doesnt take away anything from the killer, they can still benefit from it if the survivor ######### up and they knew the risk in doing so.
regardless, still stands that they didnt do anything to adress the loss of anti-tunnel perk, and the only one in the game promotes slugging (which solo survivors love), so Unbreakble and DS prolly gonna be in alot of peoples builds this week, along with Windows and an Exhaustion perk, nerfing perk diversity
just… cool work bhvr, really cool.
5 -
Survivors didn’t lose an anti-tunnel perk. They just lost the ability to weaponize the perk.
And “perk diversity” also isn’t a valid reason. Otherwise, we could argue a lot of killer perk nerfs should be reverted, because they hurt perk diversity.
-11 -
"Fixed an issue where The Hillbilly could completely turn around when breaking a door while using the LoPro Chains add-on"
😭 not my LoPro flicks!
In all seriousness though, was the turn completely removed even after pallet break? Previously after breaking through the pallet, you could still curve to hit a survivor around the corner. Now I seem to only be able to go in a straight line after the break.
0 -
Survivors definitely lost an anti-tunnel perk. Dunno what you are on about, but you should easily be able to play around bodyblocking. All you need to do now is to count to 10, or even better, have a stopwatch next to you, so that you can time it exactly.
DMS got rightfully nerfed, because pretty much EVERY game was Pain Res + DMS. -20% progress + 50 seconds of blockage (and whatever regression you got from 50 seconds), which could easily increase a gen's timer by 75 seconds.How much time do you really need, especially when playing a killer with too much mobility?
Also, this one is for @ThatRyanB: Is the Krasue supposed to be able to attack a survivor mid transform from body to head form, or is this a bug? If it is a bug, it needs to be patched fast, because it has zero counterplay.
The sliding also needs to be drastically toned down. I mean, there is a reason why hug-tech was removed from killers like Blight and Wesker, because it is too strong.6
