DC

If BHVR punishes the exact details, than ragequitters would know exactly what they could get away with, before the penalties are so high that it affects whether or not they'll actually care if they get another penalty.

The game is extremely killer sided. It is not hard to understand people find survivor unplayable/unwinnable. It's always a survivor incentive.

Yet, BHVR just sits around taking orders from killer main streamers like a maid.

I really think most people just get tired of waiting or tired of playing killer, switch to survivor and find it too hard to win. That's what I think of most DCs.

Sorry I'm not accepting this excuse any longer of "Well they didn't address the reasons why people go next."

The game has been out almost a decade at this point — people are well aware of how it is often played (e.g. tunneling and camping) and if they don't want to risk encountering that, then they shouldn't queue.

Do I like going against hard tunnelers? No. Do I think it should be addressed? Probably. But right now it's still and possibility, as it has been for the past decade, and getting tunneled is a risk I CHOOSE to take when I load up the game, and hit the ready up button. If people aren't enjoying Survivor, for whatever reason, then they should STOP PLAYING IT instead of ruining it for those of us who still like it.

Survivors DCing ruins more Survivor matches than tunneling or camping ever could.

Telling survivors to stop playing isn't going to fix anything either. That's a surefire way to kill the game, and that's the last thing we want.

Exactly. Everyone knows the Survivor role has issues that need solved, and so it’s understandable to be frustrated. But if people can’t channel that frustration healthily, then they need to stop playing.

By loading into match after match and instant DCing, they’re just ruining the experience for every other Survivor and giving the Killer an easy win. They’ll complain that they’re only DCing because “Survivor sucks” but half the reason it sucks in the first place is because of teammates giving up all of the time! They’re their own worst enemies and they don’t even realise it.

I used to be quite lenient about DCs/giveups but my patience for it has worn thin and I have very little empathy left for the chronic giving up crowd. Players who ready up knowing they’re probably going to DC and leave their teammates stranded are just as bad as the campers/tunnelers/sluggers they advocate against.

At the very least, I'd think we should at least try giving more autonomy to Survivor and more reasons to stick around before we start blaming them for the state of the game.

This is how I feel too. When the game became a little easier for Killer, camping/tunneling/slugging didn't change. There's no way we can know for sure if giving up would become less frequent if the Survivor role was less awful, but can we at least try and see?

“actually […] make the game enjoyable”

The game already is enjoyable. There’s many of us who are very happy playing the game. If you don’t like it then you’re under no obligation to play it. It’s okay to just acknowledge that you don’t like DbD and play something you do enjoy.

You can call me reactionary or whatever you want, but the truth is that this would not be tolerated in any other PvP game. You either play the matches you signed up for, or don’t play. No ifs and buts about it.

It certainly is tolerated in other PVP games, least the one's that I play.

Now, other asymms? I cant think of any still alive at this point, I dont think TCM had a DC penalty when I was playing.

Didn't think it was controversial to say that theres a lot of people unhappy with the game. Its fine if you like it, but you gotta read the room. Nobody, not Killers or Survivors, are particularly pleased.

This “quit attitude” exists for killers as well

So, I'm talking to specifically this individual here, not generally. I'm aware that this isn't a universal "one size fits all" thing.

Are we even trying to compare a DC of killer and a survivor in game?

I'm not, and if you think that was my point you should read it again. I'm not taking about even dc's specifically, but the reaction to players appearing to be biased and sided.

I'm taking about change and game health. Survivors not enjoying the game are being told, "if you don't like it just quit" and nothing is getting better for them.

The voices saying "punish them if they don't like it" are being heard and punishments are pushed out, even despite the fact that nearly everyone said this is too much when "go next" launched, BHVR only pulled it for like two weeks, then pushed it back out again with minor changes. At least we think with minor changes, since that's how it feels, especially because they didn't put anything in the patch notes about it.

It still falsely flags people, even if not quite as badly. It still determines if the player is "trying" (so, you can play the game wrong, enough to be banned), and it still punishes.

So, for survivors: it's literally "the beatings will continue until morale improves".

Now let's look at the "anti tunnel" and "anti slug" ptb: pulled immediately, because people burned down the forums in a fit. And you'll be hard pressed to find a thread that didn't say something to the effect of "this will kill the game" or "we'll all leave".

Where's that system? Pulled. Indefinitely. No "just tough it out", no "we'll sneak it back in with some tweaks". Nope.

Specifically they literally said "abusable and overly punishing" and pulled it. So where is the "if you don't like it just quit"? That's my question.

Don't play at all, or at least play in a way that doesn't stab your own teammates in the back. That's the only thing people are asking for.

But it's not the only thing people are asking for. Some people are actively torpedoing anything, even discussions, about fixing core issues of the game.

People like me have been patiently and reasonably asking for a fix to actual problems in the game. You literally cannot have a discussion about fixing tunneling in this forum in a constructive way without the thread getting derailed by the loudest and most biased people.

Threads trying to discuss these issues get derailed. The most recent were several hundred posts long and one got off track because someone was intentionally forcing a conversation about "so you think sitting at a gen is hard? Lul", and another about "no seriously, tenacity by itself is abusable and needs nerfing". Come on.

And we aren't getting constructive feedback, either. Zero, and I mean zero attempts to fix literally any of the core reasons people might dc. At least in regards to the anti tunnel changes. People said "no we don't want it at all" and aren't even trying to fix it beyond "just keep the buffs part".

No, it can't be that players don't get to play the game if they're unlucky enough to be the first person downed. We don't want to talk about that, because that might mean changing something. It's gotta be that everyone is petty and needs punished. And if the punishments don't work, then add more punishments.

"The beatings will continue until morale improves".

Because we have this mentality, the point of my post, which is: if you don't like it, then quit.

But only for survivors. And that's #########.

Krasue is understandable but DCing immediately when downed against Myers is so ######### funny.

This is just responding to a whole bunch of stuff I didn’t say so I’m not going to entertain most of it.

Why does this mentality of yours, specifically "if you don't like it just quit" literally only apply to survivors?

It doesn’t. Again, I never said this. There are plenty of Killers who could do with taking the same advice. The DCing issue is mostly a Survivor thing though so that’s what we’re talking about here.

"you can't do this or we'll all leave" and "the game will die when we quit". So where's this cavalier "just quit" attitude then?

This comparison doesn’t work. There’s a huge difference between:

• People who don’t like the fundamentals of a 10-year old game and won’t be happy with it without sweeping changes to the formula. (I.e. people who don’t actually like the game at its core and want it completely redesigned to accommodate them specifically).
• People who like the game, and have played it as it is for years being upset that it’s receiving sweeping and experimental changes to accommodate groups of players who don’t actually like DbD at its core.

the literal meta of "you don't get to play a match".

This is exactly what I’m talking about. Matches of DbD inherently last a different amount of time for each of the Survivors. That’s just how the game works and if that’s offensive to you then it sounds to me like this game just isn’t your thing. Which is fine but people just need to accept that they don’t like fundamental parts of the game and leave it there.

A lot of the things the chronic DCing crowd complain about are simply unfixable without uprooting the foundations of the game. And considering the game’s age and established player base, attempting to do so would be a horrible idea.

And that’s why I don’t put any stock into the “just address their complaints!” argument. There’s NO way, for instance, to ensure that all Survivors spend a relatively equal amount of time in the match and receive equal attention from the Killer. At least not without turning the game into PvE game where the Killer is just there to follow a prescribed path and babysit the Survivors.

I'm of the opinion that BHVR should give those players a push out the door to help them on their way, but BHVR is stuck between not wanting to lose current customers who buy DLC and cosmetics and needing to get brand new customers that the previous group are pushing away.