DC

Are you running Lethal Pursuer?

I remember during the anniversary event this year, when tunneling was at an all time high, I played Wraith and Vecna games so well I would win in 7 minutes, and constantly trigger DS on ppl despite the fact I hooked someone else between them.

Even with me winning game after game, 8 hooking and not tunneling, all I ever got was complaints about how boring the game was or me being a "tryhard", cause apparently just being skilled and winning is tryharding.

Cause to survivors, losing is boring, so why bother playing.

Survivors are pussies, and most killers suck so hard at this game they couldn't beat the average team without tunneling.

I swear i'm so DBD brained, I literally saw the word TUNNELER not TRUTHER.

@Pulsar, my apologies XD

I'll leave my post in just cause it provides further context. lol

Saying something isn't going to have the effect you think it will isn't defending an action. That's called criticism of an idea.

If you want to obfuscate it that badly then sure. Your advocacy for giving up (which is explicity against the game's rules) to go unpunished totally doesn't enable said behaviour. Right.

You can see into the hearts and minds of your opponents? You can see what is going on? You saw their previous matches? You saw everything their teammates did? You claim, so assuredly, that you know why. I think that's rather arrogant and likely contributes to your view. Of course, the real thing here is that it doesn't matter why. I'm not even sure why you brought it up.

There's no justifiable reason for abandoning your matches except for real-life obligations/emergencies. And there's ZERO way that these people are having an emergency every other match. No ifs and buts. No "but what about their previous matches?". I don't care about that. I wasn't in their previous matches — I did nothing to make their previous matches bad. Therefore ruining MY match because THEY had bad rounds beforehand will not fly with me. Sorry, no sympathy at all. I don't care anymore. You had several bad matches prior? Okay, then stop playing. Simple.

This "well I had several bad matches in a row and bad teammates and so I was frustrated and that's why I DCed 30 seconds into the game." narrative doesn't work because NO ONE is forcing them to continue to play. They can CLOSE the game, securing their own and everyone else's peace of mind. They are CREATING this problem for themselves and then dragging everyone else down with them. It's completely selfish, indefensible behaviour and ought to be punished in the same way any other rulebreaking is.

Have you considered that things can be unfun without being strong? Legion, for example, isn't a strong Killer but they are uniquely unfun to play against. In yesteryear, we had Old Mori's where you'd get tunneled off of hook and finish the match with 2K BP. The issue is that BHVR keeps adding mechanics and Killers that people hate going against.

Again. Sorry, but I don't care. That's how DbD works. There's 40+ Killers now and it is inevitable not everyone is going to like versing all of them. Strong or weak. Fun or not. I don't care. When you boot up the game you KNOW you could be going against anything, including the Killers you don't like. If you can't handle that maturely, then don't queue.

There are plenty of Killers I hate. Xenomorph for one. Can't stand it. And yet, when I see Xeno, I play the match out anyways. Because I signed up to do so. Because it's a team game and I have an obligaiton to my teammates. That's what being a good sport is. This is how I know the giving up is an attitude problem. Because I have plenty of frustrations with this game and I don't do it. My duo has lots of things they don't like about this game and they don't do it either. There are many, many others in the same boat. With longstanding frustrations who play their games out anyways, because it's the PROPER thing to do. Period.

First off, hacking is tolerated lmao. BHVR gave away millions of free accounts to hackers.

No it isn't. The community does not tolerate hackers in the same way it does give ups. Hackers are almost unanimously hated. No one would ever say "Oh well they're just hacking because they're frustrated with the game." Because we all know it's just not about that. It's an attitude issue. Cheaters break the rules because they don't care about the integrity of the game. I'm sure there are plenty of cheaters who go their cheats because they were losing, but that reason doesn't matter. You still have to be a certain type of person to cheat, regardless of how "understandable" your reasoning behind it is. Giving up is the EXACT same.

But for some reason giving up gets a pass. Whenever it gets brought up you'll have a crowd of people going "Oh but it's just because X, Y, or Z." And it shouldn't. The reason doesn't matter when the action is hurting innocent players. Period.

Also the free acounts thing was a blunder. Obviously BHVR don't endorse people cheating at their own game.

Second of all, how would you even go about this? Eventually, you have to start policing intent and punishing bad play.

This is just making a mountain out of molehill. This issue is easily fixable:

• As a community stop endorsing the "go next" mentality.
• Strengthen the DC penalty system.

That's literally all you need to do.

I think what he's trying to say is that survivors constantly disconnecting does not affect any metrics that might cause BHVR to panic and reassess the situation.

A player who queues for matches and then disconnects is still an online player who facilitates matchmaking and could potentially buy DLC.

The reason why killers keep getting their way, such as with the MFT nerfs and the backtracking on tunneling and slugging changes is that killers, as an entire whole, stated they would (and in the case of the MFT era, actually did) stop playing entirely.

I'm not talking "They started up the game and started disconnecting from matches," either.

I'm talking about not even starting up the game in the first place, and in the case of the recent tunneling and slugging changes, a lot of killer players outright uninstalled and walked away from the game entirely.

This means there were a whole lot of killer players at a bare minimum threatening to kneecap BHVR's revenue stream by not buying DLC anymore, and a bunch of them may have actually followed through on that threat.

Compare that to survivors who chronically ragequit, who do not meaningfully impact BHVR's bottom line, and it's really quite trivial to figure out which group BHVR is going to listen to.

I would agree with that then.

Although apparently the DC'ing is getting people to quit. Which is apparently the goal?

I dunno. BHVR does listen to the money, but they always have a stream of new players, so I just don't think we'll see any changes until it's far too late.

I think the point of covering loopholes with punishments is that eventually those players will either quit the game entirely (which means nothing of much value was lost) or they will finally get tired of being slapped around by the punishment system and play the game they started up and queued for.

I realize this is anecdotal, but I noticed match quality massively improved when self-unhook attempts were removed, and then BHVR loosened the parameters of the Go Next Prevention system and everything went downhill again because actually innocent people were reasonably annoyed at catching strays.

If you were playing a game of basketball, and every time you played with your friends, the other team just walked along the court, never running, never trying and never posing any challenge to you, you'd stop playing basketball.

As a killer, having ppl dc every game, makes games pose no challenge, and makes DBD a boring game that killers won't want to play, because whats the point if no one is gonna actually take it seriously?

That system was also punishing completely innocent players, and in fact, still is.

I cannot believe people are advocating for MORE of that, because make no mistake, that's what we will be

A lot of people seem to think they know the exact motivations behind every DC that occurs. In many of my matches, I have no idea why. The only thing BHVR can go off of is the discontent people vocally express. And the fact that they're largely ignoring that discontent shows how significant it likely is (or isn't) to their bottom line. These supossed endless DCs everyone talks about must not be hurting the game as much as people assume.

In my killler matches, people are more likely to try to die on purpose than DC which is really much worse. But there's never going to be a system that can read people's minds, so analyzing these intents without accidentally punishing people simply for being bad is impossible. People will always find a way to leave matches if the game remains consistently frustrating.

The fact that it's vastly more survivors that ragequit is pretty telling. Killers have a chance at a win up until the last second even when they play terrible, but some early scenarios are instant doom for survivors even when they're good players. Why regular comebacks are possible for one side but mostly impossible for the other is the most baffling thing to me me about the game's current structure.

So if people DC because of bad attitudes or mild inconveniences why don't more killers DC? With this belief, you should see more killers with no hooks DC at 3 gens popping, or even just a single lost chase, but it's not that common at all. It's all the same player base, after all, so why is only one side so much more bothered by these mild inconveniences?

I can do nothing to change how you feel, but don't put words in my mouth simply because you disagree with my position.

What I am trying to say is that this has been building over years. It isn't justified, but I have been able to see this coming since at least 2021. People have reached their breaking point with DBD, and yes, they should take a break. It clearly isn't doing them any good sticking around. However, this has been building for a long time. I am sure the recent walk-back of changes and then the release of Krasue has intensified these feelings.

The system we have already bans innocent players. Anti Go-Next grabs people who get tunneled already. Any attempts to make the system stricter or to expand the scope will grab more innocent players. That is what will happen.

I will rephrase. I suspect you know that the community will never come together like that. It is theoretically possible that it would work out the way you hope if they did, but they will not unite on this.

No. If people aren't having fun, they will find a way to give up. Even when DC penalties were at their strictest, there was a ton of DC'ing and giving up.

Every time we have tried to play wack-a-mole with this issue, it simply slides and turns into something else. People will always find a way to get out of a game they find unfun. That is human nature. You have to be prepared to see this path through to the logical conclusion, which is trying to police intent. If not, perhaps we should reconsider?

How are we allowing it? There are penalties. They don't really work.

Why should we continue to dump time and resources into a system that doesn't work?

QoL has a chance to positively impact both the DC rate, and thereby the quality of the average match, AND simultaneously improve the normal player experience. Why shouldn't we focus on that?

This. I don't understand how people aren't getting this. DCs are literally free right now. That's why everyone is just DCing. All they need to do is reinstate proper penalties! That's it. Everyone is acting like it's an impossible task or something when the solution is so simple.

And yet we have people in here claiming they see DC's in a third of their matches, iirc.

People are getting the penalties. They just don't care.

I have no idea if that's true, for the record. The last update I heard was that it was match-based. You have to play a certain number of matches in order to clear the record. I haven't heard any announcements stating this was changed. Do you have any of that information so I can read it?

Still not what I'm saying. I am against further punishment without addressing common pain points.

Because we have never seen a flat-out reduction in "give up" events. We have seen them shift from DC'ing into suicides back into DC'ing. If we continue to double-down and never address anything else, we will start to see calls for further policing.

This point is just moronic, and I don't think you really mean it. Of course it matters what causes it. Of course it matters why people are frustrated. Whether or not you think it's justified is down to personal opinion at the end of the day, but saying it doesn't matter why is just silly.

I suppose we'll see. Considering that pretty much everything I predicted would happen when DC penalties got introduced as happened, I think I'm probably right. Especially if nothing else changes.

BHVR doesn't revert things like that. Neither will you. Even if it doesn't work, we'll be stuck with it because the second you say the phrase, "We're loosening penalties" people will go absolutely feral and DC en masse. Nobody will want that, so they'll keep the system.

I DCed my last session (pours gasoline over my head in anticipation) and it was free. I haven't done it twice in a row per 20 trials so I can't confirm on the frequency at all, but I know at least one is free.

I have no desire to test it, which is why I've been taking people's word for it. I was just curious if it was announced anywhere like the last set of changes.

"We're loosening penalties" people will go absolutely feral and DC en masse

You've contradicted your own points repeatedly so far, as @tes has already pointed out but this one is easily the most egregious. You've said that they can't (in the hypothetical scenario) loosen the DC penalities because everyone will just DC. Which is the exact thing that is literally happening right now because they lowered the DC penalties several patches back. If loosening a penalty would encourage DCing, then why can you not accept that raising it would discourage it? This is straight doublethink.

The DCing is happening because there's no proper penalty. That's it. Not having a proper penalty in place is allowing players with unsportsmanlike attitudes to abandon any matches they want for any reason. This huge wave of DCing started when they dropped the penalties. Penalise them properly again and it will stop. All of this talk of "longstanding frustrations" or whatever else is just an intentional attempt to muddy the waters and make them seem deep, when it's actually incredibly simple. Low/no penalties = DCs. Penalties = No DCs. That's it.

This point is just moronic, and I don't think you really mean it. Of course it matters what causes it. Of course it matters why people are frustrated. Whether or not you think it's justified is down to personal opinion at the end of the day, but saying it doesn't matter why is just silly.

I wholeheartedly stand by what I said. I do not care whatsoever about the cause of it. The feelings of people who consistently abandon their teammates in a PvP game do not matter at all to me. I literally don't think it's worth listening to anything they have to say about the game because they're going out of their way to cause it immense harm. These players don't get to do everything they can to sabotage a role and in the same breath complain about how bad the role is. You can call me moronic for that but it doesn't change my opinion.

From some of your other comments it sounds like you don't actually play the game anymore. And with that context, your point makes more sense because you don't actually have to deal with the behaviour that you're defending. And that is how this comes across to me. There's nothing that could reasonably qualify "I am against further punishment" when it comes to repeated DCing for me. The end of your sentence does not justify the start and only serves to enable bad behaviour IMO.

Of course you're perfectly entitled to that opinion, but I think it's a harmful one. But I'm sure you'd say the same thing about mine so I guess we're at an impasse.