http://dbd.game/killswitch
Chaos Shuffle just exposes how bad tunneling really is
Chaos Shuffle honestly just highlights how useless most survivor perks are when you’re being aggressively tunneled.
It doesn’t matter what random perks you get, you don’t even have the chance or time to use them if the killer is determined to remove you from the match ASAP. What’s supposed to be a fun, chaotic experience of discovering and experimenting with perks turns into the same bullcrap 5-minute games where you barely get to play.
You queue up after work hoping for something at least fun, and instead your time is wasted: load into a match, then get tunneled out immediately like the killer’s life depends on it. Rinse and repeat.
Modes like Chaos Shuffle are proof that killers don’t need incentives, MMR, or rewards to tunnel, they do it simply because they can. The devs have shown time and time again that this playstyle is promoted, and ultimately ignored. You can nerf or buff perks all you want, but killers will still tunnel even when there’s no reason to “win” or climb MMR.
Sorry to say, but survivor gameplay is miserable, and Stranger Things Part 2 isn't going to cut it.
Comments
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If you can't do anything about it, that's your problem. Learn to play so that maniacs won't waste too much time on you.
I haven't seen any maniacs complain about survivors starting the generator they were recently chased away from-25 -
On the other hand it shows how realy fast all gens can be against killers that dont run gen deffence in form of regression and gen blocking perks or other builds that buy you time and how this effects massively weaker and mid tier killers that get cooked super fast if survivors stick to gens.
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“Learn to play” doesn’t mean anything in this context.
There is no amount of “learning” that lets a survivor outplay a killer who is sitting close to hook, immediately re-commits after the unhook, and hard tunnels with full intent to remove one person from the match. Especially in Chaos Shuffle, where you don’t control your perks and often get zero anti-tunnel tools.
After an unhook, you’re usually injured, in a dead zone, with mostly filler pallets already gone. You’re not making “mistakes”, you’re being forced into an unwinnable situation by design. At that point it’s not about skill expression, it’s about whether the killer chooses to leave you alone or not.
DBD isn’t a game where “learn to play” magically counters tunneling. If the killer wants you gone, you’re gone and Chaos Shuffle makes that more obvious than ever.
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If you say there's no counter to this move, you've never played as the assassin. Experiment before jumping to conclusions.
Play as the killer, I'm sure the matchmaking system will quickly bring you back to reality-22 -
Killers arent guaranteed gen regression and survivors arent guaranteed safety perks in chaos shuffle. If survivors spread on gens, non-mobile killer struggle to keep up. For some killers its straight up impossible to keep up without "unwanted" strategies, when they dont have any gen perks and land on a bigger map.
If the killer drops in and sees a lack of gen defence perks, they will try to slow the game down "naturally". This means tunneling camping and slugging. If they see survivors spreading on gens, they are even more likely to do it.
No side can really be blamed here. Both just try to win. The fundamentals of the game reward these playstyles.
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So, in Chaos Shuffle, what is the actual counter to a killer who decides to tunnel you out immediately after an unhook, injured, useless perks, dead zones, zero protection?
Not “learn to play" or “play killer”… If the killer refuses to drop chase and just wants you gone, what exactly are you supposed to do?
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Then why play Chaos Shuffle at all?
If winning and compensating for bad perk RNG matters that much, normal mode already exists with full builds and gen defense. Chaos Shuffle is supposed to be low-stakes and experimental.
Turning it into tunnel simulator just proves the point that killers don’t really need incentives to play this way, they’ll do it even when "winning" isn’t supposed to matter.
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If anything Chaos Shuffle more exposes how much a number of killers suffer due to reliance on specific addons and perks. Like how absolutely miserable Trapper is in Chaos Shuffle without access to at least one of his red addons if not just Bloody Coils specifically.
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It's unlikely that the killer will want to pursue you a second time if you took up a lot of his time before he hanged you.Otherwise, good teammates will prevent him from killing you quickly, and the killer will be tempted to hang the survivor who exposed himself to save you, if everything was done correctly, by this time power should already be supplied to the gate.
By combining Jill and Claudette's skills, you can regenerate health in less than 10 seconds after being unhooked without the help of a partner.
I'm sure there are many more ways than I mentioned-11 -
None of what you described applies to Chaos Shuffle or solo queue.
You don’t get to “combine Jill and Claudette’s perks” in Chaos Shuffle. That alone makes this advice irrelevant.
And “good teammates will prevent it” isn’t a strategy. You can’t guarantee coordination, body blocks, or smart trades in solo queue, especially in a random-perk mode.
This is exactly the issue with saying “learn to play”, it ignores mode restrictions and the reality of solo queue. When a killer commits to tunneling, there is no skill-based counter you can reliably force.
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I get that some killers like Trapper can feel awful in Chaos Shuffle without specific add-ons. That’s a valid issue.
But using Trapper as a shield to dismiss the survivor experience is illogical. A low-tier killer struggling doesn’t justify an entire role having miserable matches. That’s a Trapper problem, not a survivor one.
The playstyle I’m talking about isn’t limited to weak killers. It’s widely used by high-tier killers too Blight, Nurse, Kaneki... High-tier killers don’t suddenly “play nice” out of generosity, they still tunnel just as hard because they can.
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If anything Chaos Shuffle (and 2v8) more exposes how bad most people are at the killer role. People love to bombard survivors with the idea that most are bad but refuse to do the same for killers despite it also being true. The game is designed for survivors to lose more often resulting in killers thinking they are better than they really are.
I've gone out of my way this Chaos Shuffle to play "low tier" killers because I got four Ghouls in a row playing survivor and have been doing just fine, even Trapper and this includes at least one match I let everyone go (sucker for a lute). Trapper isn't strong but he isn't doing nearly as badly as this community makes it sound like he is.
And “good teammates will prevent it” isn’t a strategy. You can’t guarantee coordination, body blocks, or smart trades in solo queue, especially in a random-perk mode.
And half the time this level of altruism just ends up throwing the game for the survivors as the killer downs the blocker and continues after the tunnel out, its free pressure for the killer that often gives them a snowball win on the spot.
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Randomly choosing a partner can be very unfair, but if you want to completely guarantee your survival, find partners with whom you can play based on mutual understanding. And if you add to this your own good experience, which you need to accumulate, you'll stop fearing being marked and start to be wary of maniacs, who don't need this method.
While, in my opinion, playing with partners who transmit information is a sign of weakness, with good partners it won't be a problem, and a maniac won't be able to kill you using this technique.-8 -
The gate is energized, and the maniac begins guarding your savior, who is only in the first stage of the ritual. Do I need to explain how to save him with the help of two healthy partners?
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Ya, I know how to two man save in endgame. It has nothing to do with what I said or the scenario being discussed but as usual when anything disagrees with something on the killer side they move the goalposts or try to turn it around and make you look like the bad player (this is clearly what you are trying to do here). If the killer plays like trash the whole match to get to that point why should they win?
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Read my text messages above, I already answered what needs to be done against such maniacs.
But if it is not prohibited by the game, then the problem is in your experience-5 -
Actually, yes learning to play better as survivor can help a lot. I realize this is not a very popular opinion around here, but as someone who has a decent amount of experience playing both sides, it’s reality.
I’ve been on both the giving and receiving end of tunneling, and when a survivor knows how to loop and can make each chase last for a decent amount of time, the rest of survivors can get the gens done pretty easily because the killer isn’t putting any pressure on them. Of course this requires the other survivors to actually do gens, which sometimes doesn’t happened but that is not the killer’s fault, is it?When I get tunneled, the thing that feels the worst to me is knowing that I get punished at the end of the game with a lower MMR score and (theoretically) getting matched with worse teammates in my next match. If the skill-measuring system actually made sense, and rewarded you with higher MMR for extended chases, tunneling would feel far less bad than it does now.
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I recently played several matches as Trapper (its my main). I literally just got once Ruin and once Pentimento (but it didnt even activate). And I still had no issue without tunneling at all. I even tied with a 4man SWF with toolboxes. It just prooved my overall view on the game: you do not need to rely on "killer tactics" and you do not need to rely on 4 slowdowns if you understand the overall gameplay and your character. Especially in a game mode like Chaos Shuffle. Still 99% of the killer players are under this false premise that this is mandatory to win, because several extreme biased streamers promote this so blatantly, it becomes a "truth" for them. But its always the same with events: most killers just seem to want to make the game as annoying as possible for others. And as long the devs promote this behaviour by skipping the necessary balance changes, it wont get any better.
Yeah I didnt win at 4 gens, but why should you even be able to do this with any killer? I had fun and challenging games.
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This might come as a surprise, but I like it when the killer pays a lot of attention to me, because I'm playing a horror game. I care about how useful I am to my team, not about getting off the map
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At the same time survivors arent ones to "slow down" on gens etc when they notice the killer having a bad early game/slow hooks. But then again why would anyone want to compromise their fun for others. I get it tunneling and slugging isnt fun to go against but when i see 2-3 gens pop in my first/second chase then i WIL tunnel and slug if needed because why would anyone willingly want to lose. Also lets not forget that flashlights are super broken in chaos shuffle as there isnt a wall at every down or worse a pallet.
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Read my comments above, you randomly brought up endgame saves after I talked about trying to help prevent a tunnel out on a teammate giving the killer free pressure. Your comments to me are complete non-sequiturs, they have nothing to do with what I am saying.
No where do I say you shouldn't do any of this. I am simply pointing out that having decent teammates does not help as much against tunneling as you claim so long as the killer is decent at the role. My only other point is that most people who play the game are bad at it but we primarily see that statement applied solely to the survivor role.
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Considering tunneling at 2 gens after a bad early game isn’t the same as loading into Chaos Shuffle with a pre-plan to tunnel someone out at 5 gens. What I’m describing mostly happens from the first hook, regardless of gens or pressure.
Chaos Shuffle makes it especially obvious because killers can commit to early tunneling with zero downside.
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then again if you get super bad perks (like shattered hope and septic touch as an example) you have to gain pressure in some way. Do note i do not condone tunneling at 5 gens but if the unhooked survivor runs towards me instead of away from me then im not going out of my way to hook em again XD.
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Trapper is like loose 3 gens in short time after you finish your set up with 2-3 traps and get into first chase if survivors go on gens at the start.
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I completely agree with you.
Anyone who comes up with arguments to justify this playstyle, or simply says we need to learn to play better, or that the team should 'just do gens'. Is ignoring how tunneling is in real matches. It doesn't take into account how many gens are left, if we're hooked in a dead zone, or if the Killer commits to tunneling no matter what. And in endgame especially, when the Killer can hook the Survivor far from the gate and in most situations, one survivor has to sacrifice themselves just to give the tunneled survivor a chance to get out. I'll be convinced that I need to learn to play better when someone here can consistently show they deal with a Killer who tunnels at 5 gens, ignores everyone else, and never leaves them alone; and do it across the roster. Not just against a few Killers or a lucky match.9 -
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I play Trapper quite a lot I know. Trapper is a nightmare to play against good survivors if you don't have the right addons though in most situations and I can attest to this, especially if you get a ######### map.
That aside, I feel its worth pointing out how this Chaos Shuffle uses MMR. If you don't play Trapper much you might be getting worse players.-1 -
If you don't play Trapper much you might be getting worse players.
And I was also told the soft cap is really easy to reach. Which is it? Because it can't be both. Besides killer MMR is also supposedly somewhat shared so the exact amount I played Trapper before doesn't actually matter. But also matchmaking sucks and will regularly create mismatches.
Everywhere people talk about this game, the moment anyone claims the killer role isn't as bad as its being made out to be one of these excuses comes out and they regularly contradict each other. Then we watch killer content creators win 50 matches in a row but somehow, someway we should ignore that and focus just on what they say. Even Otz spends a decent chunk of his killer matches complaining and then wins. Its doublethink on doublethink on doublethink. When that stops I will start taking it seriously.
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Not just tunneling, but how badly designed most perks are, 90%, maybe more are very conditional, situational or downright not worth using at all.
Rookie spirit, see any generator thats being regressed, thats all it does, so when no gen regresses. It does nothing and it a gen does regress, what are you going to do while you are already busy healing, rescuing, looping or already doing gens?.
Distortion : if you have a token, aura revealed by the killer is supressed and scratchmarks reduced
Recharge tokens by being chased.
Useless if killer doesnt run aura.
Conditional due to the limit of forcing people to be chased rather than do the objective, resulting in no appeal to the stealth playerbase.
Roadlife has the same issue.
The list just goes on and it gets WORSE.
Killers have such variety, : hexes, vaulting, kicking gens, anti-loop, haste/slowdown, undetectable, oblivious, aura, exposed, tunneling (STBFL), slugging (Third seal, forced hesitation), (sometimes) addon variety. Anti-heal, anti-exhaustion, anti-item/chest.
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Yes, altruism throws the game bc people are bad at it. They often just block immediately. But thats useless for me if im at the pallet. If i cant make the next one, im just watching the wipe animation of the killer.
With that strategy they are just throwing their health states away. But theres no tutorial, so how should they know?
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And we immediately return to the survivors being bad while the killer has zero agency whatsoever. Predictable. If I body block at the right time and the killer hits me and then continues after the tunnel out they still get the tunnel out. Either I give another, possibly throwing the game on the spot, hope another teammate does, or go back to gens and hope the teammate lasts. No matter the choice its all free pressure for the killer as the survivors are off gens, giving free health states, or they get the tunnel out, lose lose lose.
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Could you please stop with this lame us vs. them? I play more survivor than killer.
The topic has just nothing to do with killer skill. Well, if hes really bad, you dont need bodyblocks, but thats rare, bc bloodlust gives even the worst killer a hit after a while. (Resetting bloodlust with a timed bodyblock is also really good)
Its not free pressure. Everything is a time game. The question is how much does the bodyblock extend the chase. 30 sec would be 60 sec (two survivor on gens). It could be worth it, but it also could be better to sit only on gens. A bodyblock against Blight in a deadzone is probably not even worth ten. (bodyblocking his power is hard, but thats far better bc of his cooldown)
So a bodyblock needs good game knowledge and comms make it easier. (I play mostly solo que). The killer just needs to chase the unhooked survivor, ignore all macro gameplay, so his experience as player doesnt really matter. A killer player doesnt even need to learn to chase if a survivor cant loop.
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You personally? Not much, just loop best you can and try to stealth if you are on dead hook.
Usually it's more about your teammates to take a hit for you if needed.
Otherwise just don't heal under the hook and don't unhook early.3 -
So far im not sure what can be done about it. Atleast by the players. Ive been on the recieving end of the turbo tunneling plenty of times. And some of those times ive managed to keep the killer busy for most or all of the generators before dieing, as when u know they are fixated on you alone it means you have free reign to use every pallet on the map.
But then the arguement comes in where sure im decent at looping sometimes even pretty good, but what about if they go for the other teammate maybe they arent that great at looping, or give up when they know the killer doesnt want to play - just win. Then theres really no counter to it except everyone fighting over hatch.
I play allot of killer too and can understand how sometimes you end up against a team that just cranking out gens and whenever you drop someone u cant pick them up, so your tactics have to change by taking the gloves off, but right at 5 gens just incase they are a strong team makes no sense to me. All you really get for winning more is harder matches, which to me makes 3 kills a win, 4th is bonus points, so i always avoid slugging for 4k.
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so your tactics have to change by taking the gloves off, but right at 5 gens just incase they are a strong team makes no sense to me
This is actually the best time to do it. You can very easily dial it back when you're winning and arent under pressure. Once you're losing though you don't have that leeway and any mistakes or strong survivor plays are vastly more punishing when trying to claw back some advantage towards the end of the game. The generator counter is largely irrelevant because multiple gens are being (or should be) worked on and you should assume you're on less gens than it says because of individual gen progress.
Frankly i dont understand going into a PvP game and expecting your opponents to not be trying their hardest from the get go from either side, doesn't make any sense to me.
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Okay so basically here is what I’ve seen. Survivors get smashed within seconds of the match because they’re not very good or because they lack knowledge of the killer they’re up against simply due to the fact that no one hardly plays them. When a survivor proves to be inept the killer sees a weak link and immediately goes to them first every time. They could chase another survivor but when they do they get gen rushed hard after chasing a survivor that clearly knows the routine. If you want to live you better learn the routine. Real problem with solo q which I have no doubt you’ve been playing is that you get teams that are light speed dumb and people get massacred mostly because they lack gen focus and go down in like 3 to 5 seconds. To win typically no less than 2 people should be on gens at all times. The killer can only chase one survivor at a time unless some idiot is following with a flashlight and telling mom to get the camera ready. If you are being tunneled hopefully someone will take a hit after you get the endurance smack down you can get further away. Now I don’t approve of aggressive tunneling that is unnecessary and ruins the player experience. With that being said there are teams out there that have literally forced my hand with some serious plays and aggressive gen focus. But that is on the other side of the problem. Just keep working on your own plays and figure out the map layouts. You can only do so much so don’t beat yourself up and don’t rage out. I wish you luck.
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Mostly comes down to empathy i guess. Some dislike being tunneled so much they refuse to do it to others. While others just know thats what wins and doesn't care about the other player's on the other end. So there will always be a divide lol
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Nothing in my post is us vs them outside of what I honestly see from killers all the time. I personally am not asking for the overall balance to change at all and am much happier with the existing balance than the average person and I also primarily solo queue.
I want tunneling removed because I think it is bad for the gameplay experience and it has everything to do with killer skill. Skilled survivors lose to a tunnel out all the time from killers that are not as skilled as they are. It takes much much more effort and skill from the survivor than it does the killer. It really is free pressure with little effort, that you can beat survivors better than you with it is proof of that.
All you have to do is spend a little bit of time on youtube, here, or the killer subreddit and the doublethink shows up from even the biggest names in the game. It is my single greatest issue with the community. They watch killers win match after match and then those same people claim the game is survivor sided or that survivors need nerfing and then claim they are "just telling it like it is." Its either zero self reflection or being intentionally misleading for their audiences but those people believe them. When the survivors don't win its because they are bad. When the killer doesn't win something else is the problem often contradictory problems. The actual stats contradict this but those get ignored.
The topic has just nothing to do with killer skill.
Yet the rest of your post is about whether or not the survivor is skilled. You are happy to consider survivor skill but ignore the killer skill and agency. Its right there in your post.
Edit: I don't even actually want to see tunneling removed. I just want there to be an actual trade-off to it or something that ensures I don't lose on the spot for having a single bad teammate.
Post edited by FerrousFacade on5 -
"Yet the rest of your post is about whether or not the survivor is skilled. You are happy to consider survivor skill but ignore the killer skill and agency. Its right there in your post."
And thats exactly the us vs. them-thematic. And maybe im not wording this correctly bc english is not my native language, but i will try. You assume that i belong to the killer faction, bc i do only write about survivor skill. You assume that im bashing survivor for their skill level and that i think killer are more skilled. But the reason im not writing about killer skill is that it doesnt matter for this specific topic. For example: If you are saying Blight is op, i dont answer with BNP are op. Thats not a constructive discussion.
In my opinion he tunneling problem has nothing to do with killer player skill bc killer on all skill level do it. Its more the average balance on the low level. A bad killer player will mostly win against bad survivor player. The killer doesnt need to learn how to chase, bc the survivor cant loop.
That also means if a good killer tries to tunnel against survivor of the same skill level, he will struggle. It depends obviously on the killer choice.
And obviously a bad player (boosted through tunneling) has no chance. The amount of Kaneki which dced against me, bc they had no clue what to do in chase, is quite high. But here comes the matchmaking. Those killer could have just chased another survivor in the match and would have won. They just didnt know and im playing a bit aggressive to take chase. But i cant do anything if a bad teammate gets tunneled. If they cant loop, one bodyblock doesnt help much.
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I am not placing you in any faction, I am saying you are falling for the exact same doublethink that pervades the community. The killer's skill absolutely matters in a tunnel out situation. The idea that it doesn't is absolute insanity. If the expectation is that the survivor must be better than the killer in order to win then we have a problem, one caused by the skill level required of the killer to perform a tunnel out and the skill level required of the survivor being tunneled out to not have their entire team lose on the spot. The skill level of both players matters.
That also means if a good killer tries to tunnel against survivor of the same skill level, he will struggle. It depends obviously on the killer choice.
In another thread someone would argue that the point of chase isn't to totally elude the killer, its to buy as much time as possible for your team (directly contradictory to a skilled survivor being able to avoid a tunnel out). If the players are really at the same skill level then the chase will last around 30 seconds (average chase time across all MMR for a single survivor across the whole match was 60 seconds when it was last provided to us, assume three chases and added 10 seconds because that only tracked chase mechanic). That isn't enough time for the survivors to get much done. I have also had ghouls and blights and probably every killer DC against me as well, it was quite obvious that I was much better at the game than they were. We were not at the same skill level.
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Over the years, a majority of the playerbase got conditioned to only think about winning.
There are multiple reasons for this ( MMR, comp dbd influence, bad sportsmanship from the opposing side, entitlement, content creators, …), which I wont go further into, as its not that relevant for the discussion.
Most dbd players want to win. By any means possible. They are just conditioned that way. Why chose chaos shuffle and start tunneling / be really efficient on gens? Cause they want to win with their perks and items. Why do you think most survivors pick med kits in chaos shuffle?
Its sad to see, but its been this way for years now and is probably only gonna get worse.
I dont like this any more than you do but its the way it is.
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I'm rather new.
Could we, for a moment pause to define tunneling in this instance?Because there is difference, between
- deliberately targetting one survivor and hunting them down three times before doing anything else
and things like
- hooking everyone twice if possible (like twice Dwight, twice Meg, twice Claudette, Twice Jake and then Dwight),
- hunting the same survivor after some time has passed or because they are the only one you find
- hunting the same survivor because they are bating
- hunting the same survivor because they have a flashlight and keep preventing the hunt of others
- hunting the same survivor because they keep going back to the gen you picked them from (which would mean, not hunting them is giving up the gen)
- chasing someone for a long time
I think taking a player directly out is not nice, since it limits a players experience and, since looping and evading etc. make a difference, not that experienced players (like me ^^) suffer a lot more from it, because they are taken out much earlier.
But the other things seem to be fair to me.
I can't say that I experienced so much of the first in Chaos shuffle so far.Is that an MMR thing or something somehow?
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The point is to waste time. Making a killer struggle doesnt mean that you will survive. It means that he has a high chance to lose the match (3 out).
And im talking about a good team of survivor. If it was a solo chase you would just need one good survivor.
You say across all mmr its 30 sec, but you dont see the problem? Like i said low mmr swings highly into the killer favor. And if you have some hours in DBD you also know the matchmaking. Why would you thinknthis data is about fair match between good players? Sadly thats maybe 5% of all matches.
Im all in for an anti-tunnel-mechanic. If the killer is forced to chase me and not the weak link, it would be great.
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I would love if they gave this stat and all other stats spread across MMRs and broken down by killer and group size and everything under the sun. I would happily reconsider every opinion I have about the game if they did so.
Here is what we do know. Escape rate is largely constant across all MMRs and all group sizes while total required generator time doesn't actually change. The only outlier is high MMR four mans, a tiny fraction of the playerbase. Given that those teams still have an escape rate below 50% we can surmise that killers are still winning more than they lose against these teams. That means that even when generators are flying these killers can keep up which is only possible if the killer is keeping their chase time short, thus it is safe to assume that average chase time doesn't actually change that much between MMR levels. The only other possibility I see is that chase time actually decreases at high MMR as killer players need to keep up with more generator efficient teams, which means even faster chases.
Put another way, becoming more skilled at survivor increases chase time against killers less skilled than you but killers at your new skill level still keep up. Becoming more skilled at killer decreases chase time against survivors less skilled than you but survivors at your new skill level still keep up. The overall result is roughly similar chase times across MMR with changes only noticeable when there is a skill gap.
Do you think we are actually going to see real improvements in matchmaking? I don't and if we do content creators will complain about their queue times or that all their matches have become more difficult and the changes will be reverted or loosened. I have seen too many killer players with incredibly high kill rates claim that the game is survivor sided to believe that they are OK with only winning half of or slightly more than half of their matches (the result of a fair matchmaking system while maintaining a 60% kill rate). Until matchmaking changes these skill gaps matter. Its not like I can get into a non-custom match without going through matchmaking. The current matchmaking implementation may suck but unless that changes the data it produces is valid for the current state of DbD and what you can expect when you queue up for a match, a game that largely favors the killer side despite all the protest and claims to the contrary.
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every game i play these days is like this. if the 90s came back tomorrow everybody would be an Oddjob main.
it'd be one thing if it meant something, but in a wildly random and chaotic game(extra layer of chaos through Shuffle) i dont get how people take things super seriously. base dbd already can't be taken seriously when so many things are out of your control
everybody has this "only winning and meta is fun" approach, while simultaneously not even bothering to develop the level of game sense needed where that's kind of optimal play would even make a difference. 99% of people don't play at a level where optimal things make a meaningful difference, so people should play and use what makes them passionate to login. that's the spirit that raises a community and keeps the longevity rather than cause severe burn out. People hate me for using goofy stuff like Treacherous Crows, yet I'm the only one still left playing.
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Maybe tunneling is just a symptom of the real disease. Killer has almost no perks that carry any weight along with powers that cant keep up with what survivors are able to get away with and do. Especially when they cant pick their own perks. Survivors get 16 perks In a match, the majority of them are usable if random. Killer gets 4 and meme addons are included in their killers pool as well. Killer also has a lot of perks that dont synergize
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It comes down to skill on both sides. No survivor should be able to run killer for 5 gens but yet that can happen if the killer only sees red and gets tunnel vision. But none of that matters if the survivor lacks map knowledge and knowledge of looping properly. Some survivors are better than others. But this isn’t just a matter of skill but other factors can also weigh in though skill will be a major factor and ultimately determine the result of each chase. There are situations that skill won’t help with. Some pallets are light speed awful and should be avoided a blood lust can be awful though that’s what pallets and body blocking are for. Figuring out how to truly balance this game is worse than rocket science. I play both sides of the field and I see that. You can’t just focus on one thing because of the domino effect. This game will need many slight adjustments to find a sweet spot and that will take ages to accomplish. Until then we should respect both sides.
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Matchmaking will probably stay really bad, but how can we take that as data? Should i just accept that 300 hours claudette who shivers in a corner bc she heard the tr is on the same level as me? Just bc matchmaking puts us in the same match?
A bit more serious: if we are speaking about a scenario with four good players, we should not use official stats. But we can say this scenario isnt relevant for balance discussion bc it almost never happens bc of matchmaking. So we should balance around those stats/kill rates bc thats the realistic approach. I can agree with that.
But i just wanted to point out that your ideas about chase time and match flow in low and high mmr are probably not realistic.
You can win and win and win as killer and you will probably still play against the mentioned Claudette. And it also goes in the other direction. So its not the same match over and over and the killer wins those matches more often. Its killer stomp, survivor stomp etc and it happens more often for the killer side. And yes, its roughly balances out. But should that be the goal? Is that a good gaming experience?
I guess its good for streamers with their winstreaks. But if they (and every veteran player) wins 90% of their matches on high mmr and the killrate is only 60% (well to be fair kill rate is not a reliable stat bc of hatch), who balances it out? Which player group gets destroyed that much in high mmr?
Its frustrating for everyone except the top. And for the top its probably boring. So yh matchmaking will probably not get better, but thats a big problem.
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Whether you're sure or not is your right, but like I said, you need to gain experience! If you're knocked down before even a single generator is started, the problem is yours alone. As for evidence, I'm sure you've seen it many times, but you just love to whine like a little child. I wouldn't mind banning the tunnel because I don't need it, but it's clear the developers won't listen to your complaints because then most of the killers will leave the game. And even though there are more survivors than killers in this game, the developers understand that if they make life easier for survivors, you simply won't have any enemies left
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