http://dbd.game/killswitch
Should great Skillchecks have an impact?
Hello everyone,
as you may know I got some time on the Survivor side of DbD and since the last weekend I tested "fast track" quiet a lot when the following topic popped up in my head.
With nearly 5000 hours on DbD hitting great Skillcheks is kinda a musclememory for me and 9 out of 10 skill checks are great.
Don´t get me wrong pushing a gen faster than it should have been cause 5 Skillchecks in a row showed up is always satisfying and I understand that you have normaly the risk to go for the great skillcheck but could fail it and lose gen progress.
But to be fair, isn´t this kinda unfair for newer Survivors? Why should I as experienced Survivor get faster gens than someone who hasn´t sold his time to DbD?
Important: Don´t understand me wrong, I don´t want Skillchecks nerfed but I thought if it would be more fair for all if the Skillchecks would always give 0.5% progress if they appear and a great Skillcheck should only give more BPs, so that the outcome won´t be tilted to the veteran Survivors.
Comments
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I think skill checks are more of a test to see if you're still awake for 90 seconds of effectively a loading screen.
Personally, I like the idea of having a skill ceiling that is higher than the skill floor. I think this game sometimes suffers from game design issues where people expect to pick up the game and have instant success with no friction or learning curve. We see it on both sides with new maps and new killers (playing as or going against) where some players seem to expect to instantly master it and never struggle or have any difficulty.
I think that's both a mentality problem and poor game design when they cater to it. Some people seem to expect that slamming their face on the keyboard should win them games, and it seems to be lucrative for them to allow that occasionally, for better or for worse.
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I dont think that new players will ever think it is unfair that someone else hits more Great Skill Checks and gets a Gen done slightly faster (it is only 1% per Great Skill Check, after all). And honestly, it should be the case that there is more skill at doing Skill Checks which can be achieved. Obviously, repairing Gens overall is not the most skillful interaction, since everyone can press M1. But the Skill Checks are basically the only way of Skill Expression you can have while repairing a Gen and as Survivor, you have to do that A LOT. Dumbing that down would not be good IMO.
Because why even bother going for Great Skill Checks if you dont have any real incentive anymore? Sure, more BPs is nice, but since you can cap out on the Objectives Category, this incentive might be meaningless. Personally, I was already a bit unhappy with them nerfing the Skill Check Progression on Gens from 2% to 1%, even if they increased the BPs. Obviously it was a very easy and logical way to make Gens take longer, but for me it was removing a lot of reward for actually being good at Skill Checks. This should not be reduced further.
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Fat fingered, sorry
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Just like the pre-rework Ruin, there’s always been a sense that BhVR has viewed getting a “Great” on skill checks as an extremely difficult feat since way back. Otherwise, there’s no way to explain this Fast Track situation. Right?
P.S. Along with Fast Track, I’m really feeling just how strong Déjà Vu is again in this update. Was it a lie when they said they were just temporarily applying a speed buff until the 3-gen system was complete? Déjà Vu is still being used all the time in gen rush builds.
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Yeah I get both of your points that it would dumb down the Skill ceiling and it is not that heavy of an impact but as you know I always try to take the randomness out of DbD so that it would be easier to balance.
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Experience is something, but the difficulty of skillchecks also depends on the FPS.
I have 3k hours on ps4 (30 FPS) and now 1k on PC (120 FPS). It was a bit weird to get the different timing done, but after one week i had a far better success rate than ever on PS4. And i had 3k hours experience on playstation.
But 1% is completely fine.
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Lmao, you're always making me laugh. I love the starting line, thank you for making my day. Same for @Aven_Fallen got me chuckling.
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Skill checks are a really awkward pain point for Survivor gameplay. Perks and powers centred on skill checks are imbalanced towards the extreme ends of the experience spectrum: new Survivors struggle immensely against things like Doctor and Huntress' Lullaby because hitting skill checks with any kind of complication is a challenge, while experienced Survivors can minmax certain perks and things like the skill check medkit addons to get great value, and aren't really bothered by difficult skill checks from Killer perks (Undone is useless for this reason), and with the new Fast Track I've never seen generators go more quickly. At the same time, skill checks are inconsistent– they're not guaranteed to happen at all– and perks like Autodidact are terrible as a result. Ideally skill checks and the things that affect them would get fully reworked into a system that's more engaging and balanced but we know that's not going to happen.
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Back in the day it was 3% of gen progress after hitting great skillcheck and it was predecesor of hyperfocus, people that can hit them almost every time like the high experienced survivors did gens way faster thats why they chnaged it like 5 great skillchecks is 15% of gen progress if the one gives you 3% for hitting it thats more than BNP and like 13,5 seconds of gen time (thats just regression from pop or pain res).
Giving it back to top survivors would meant they would do gens way faster which isnt needed and killers regression perks would need buffs to compansate for it which would backfire on less experienced survivors that more miss or just dont hit the greats reliably so I dont think its great idea to change it.
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Do you think new survivors are mad you've memorized tile layouts or pathing too? You should be better at things. That's the whole point of time investment.
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But to be fair, isn´t this kinda unfair for newer Survivors? Why should I as experienced Survivor get faster gens than someone who hasn´t sold his time to DbD?This is true of any game with depth, as players get more experience they'll learn new ways to plays and improve their mechanical skills to overall be better at the game.
DbD, being an asym, is unusual in that the survivor and killer have differing skill floor/ceilings on how players progress. That's definitely a concern, but there''s lots of a elements to it.
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I quiet understand your point.
But a Survivor which plays longer gets most likely a Killer which played longer (in an optimal world with functioning MMR) So the Skill ceiling grows on both sides.
But a Killer never gets Bonus regression on Gens when he kicks it right?
And I say it again, I don´t want great Skillchecks to be useless just more filling the gap between pro and new Survivors.
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I don't know if the great reward is enough to warrant changes, and the equivalent would be giving killers a skill check with a chance for a great when they kick a gen. But then what would missing it mean? No regression on kick? I also don't know why "bridging the gap" always seems to be about making survivor worse. It's already the role expected to lose more than it wins and this doesn't help the average players at all.
Greats are harder for console/controller players too. So there's a gap there as well. Hours don't make you perfect at skill checks.
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Did you read my first post?
"Important: Don´t understand me wrong, I don´t want Skillchecks nerfed but I thought if it would be more fair for all if the Skillchecks would always give 0.5% progress if they appear and a great Skillcheck should only give more BPs, so that the outcome won´t be tilted to the veteran Survivors."
This would bridge the Skillchecks for all Survivors. New, Veteran, PC or Consol.
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I mean tbh the whole game is weighted against new survivors lol. Personally I think the OP has a good point. Just getting bp bonus for great checks seems reward enough, that and the sound you get on great skill check triggers the endorphins for me, plus it can give better progress only if used with perks like fogwise and hyperfocus, allowing players to benefit from being good at skill checks at the cost of a perk slot.
Do I think base skill checks should boost progress? Ehhh... probably not, all that really does is ramp gen speeds across the board. And I don't think the game needs that.
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Regular skill checks are just to make sure you're awake and paying attention. They don't really need a reward buff. And this gives no incentive for new players to get better at skill checks. I don't know who would risk messing up gen progress just for BP. I sure wouldn't.
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Back in the day it was 2% for generators. Im not 100% sure if it was more in the first year, but i checked the changelog.
I dont know why you answered me, bc i dont want it changed.
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Why would someone get better at something with no benefit? Why go for great skill checks if it doesn't do anything more than a basic skill check?
Why do people that practice free throws in basketball benefit over people who never played before? It is quite the odd question to have. Should we give new players two points if they miss just because they are new?
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I think it was originaly 3% for gens on hitting great one and 5% on hitting great one for healing (which is it now), they change many times because of how much impact it had basicaly people that could hit them very often (which were the better palyers) had stronger version of hyperfocus back than when gens took less time to repeair.
For people seeking validation for their work I get it but there are games where hitting skillchecks while doing some objective doesnt give you any perogress its just lets your bar progress continue, if I remember good skillchecks give you 50 bp oints and 0,5% of gen progress (0,45 seconds from 90 seconds) and great give you 1% of gen progress (0,9 seconds from 90 seconds) with 300 bp which isnt such none reward and argument "but you can stuck your points in that category another by other way" yeah you an by doing lot of gens but some people dont sit on gens all game but are preasured by killer and their gen time can be super low like in progress not even whole gen or just one so more points for them is a lot more important than for someone who just sits on gens and gets full points in that one category faster.
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Greats dont need to be "must hit them" for very long time like back than the reward was huge in progress (basicaly some easier version of hyperfocus that doesnt needed perks) and perk like og ruin kinda forced you to hit them (until someone found out you can tap gens and bypass the ruin effect).
It doesnt matter if you hit great or good skillcheck but what matters is to dont miss skillcheck thats that key thing.
Now days reward for great is kinda locked by perks like hyperfocus, the things that werent back than exist now in this mess like you could increase the reward in gen progress for them but than it could stack super high with hyperfocus build (that is strong now) and be super busted where one guy with toolbox can do gen in 60 seconds or even less and if 3-4 do it than its gg for the killer because you cant stop 3 people from the start you msut ge downs and eventualy hooks to get preasure and perks going (you can slug whole team but that is a thing not all killers can do).
Things that increase gen speed are problematic thats why devs are very strick around them, you can say "but not all survivors would run them" yeah not all but in time they could and than what you would need to nerf it and you are just two steps back and lost time in somewhere you had lot of info from previous cases in things that made increased gen sped problematic and at the end of a year you wasted few moths from that year in which you could do some bugfix patches and made game better or rework something, waste of resources.
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