http://dbd.game/killswitch
Is this ok ? If i dared to hook anyone at any point i would have lost this match .
is this really how we want the game to be played ?
i don't blame the survivors who using fast track in a stack as i do the same myself .i have Personally have only lost to nurse, blight and killers who only slug when using 4man fast track . Anyone else that plays the game normally just looses . Fast track - ressurgence and self preservation trully punish any killers who plays nice and spreads their hooks . I don't get how even with a team of content creators who help them with feedback we are still releasing/ reworking perks like this . Can we make hooking viable since it has been part of the gameplay for ten years now . Really make hooking good again balance team pls.
Comments
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You didn't know what perks they'd have. You just decided to be this way. Don't blame the game for your choices.
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Well when you see 4 toolboxes you can have a pretty good guess on what perk they will have. The game indirectly forces people to make choices. When something becomes to prevelant in the meta that the devs made then yes at some point the balancing can be to blame for how people play.
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I want to see how all the people who say they can win easily without camping, tunneling or slugging do against this team.
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is this really how we want the game to be played?I find this ironic as you are playing ghoul with the centipede ad on.
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Except that people are doing this regardless of what they see, and blaming Fast Track. I just had a Billy do this to me yesterday and said just that in chat. Meanwhile, I was the only one with a gen perk, and it was just Deja Vu. I'm pretty tired of every single little thing being used as an excuse for crappy behavior. This perk is not "prevalent in the meta." I barely ever see it.
And you can't convince me someone who slaps Infectious Fright onto the games most hated high mobility killer is only doing it when they see four toolboxes. I would never do this regardless of what i think might happen. And even so, if just the lobby tilts you this hard, dodge.
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I'm not arguing your point in full but this does go both ways. The survivors went in with those builds, deciding before they knew how the killer would play. It could have been a baby trapper for all they knew - this does go both ways. Granted yeah I'm not thrilled to see a Ghoul in this scenario, it's important to remember that this is not one-sided behavior. Both sides did things that are at fault here.
Perhaps we should be looking at the outcomes, rather than attempting to dismiss the example by distributing blame?3 -
trying to win using an available, legitimate, strategy is not 'crappy behaviour'
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Slugging really isn't "crappy" never understood the disdain towards it. You legit stay in the game longer if you were to be slugged than if you were hooked and left to hang there for the maximum 69.9 seconds. People have tools to use against slugging but rarely ever choose to use it like Conviction.
As for it might happen. Yes that is a very valid response to playing to win. Say this to ANY other pvp game and you would be agreed with 24/7. And as for fast track I see at least one or two but that might just be me and playing in a higher mmr bracket on average due to the average skill of a survivor I face.1 -
Sure, but they didn't know that for sure going in. They just assumed. Do you think they would have said "oppsie sorry thought you had that one perk" if they hadn't? It's also only one match. How many more did they do this in and then cherry pick this one instance? I've also yet to get a full team doing this. It's not common. And they're also complaining about SP and Resurgence for some reason, because survivors aren't allowed to have perks, I guess.
Then why are they trying to justify it it with "but perks". Full team slugging is hated and shouldn't exist.
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Then go get slugged over and over and tell me how fun it is to be in a match where you're licking the ground at 5 gens. It's pretty common right now so you shouldn't have any trouble finding one of these super fun matches. And it's even more fun, by your standards, when you get to bleedout for 4 minutes. I've had two of these just in the last couple days.
Ah yes, the legenadry high MMR that everyone is in yet everyone also agrees matchmaking is garbage. Yeah I see one or two too because it's had buzz. These are matches I usually win because this perk is nothing. Second chance/chase extenders are still the meta perks i lose to.
Perks shouldn't be the only way to counter someone else's decisions. I don't need gen perks to do a gen, I don't need healing perks to heal, I don't need chase perks to win a chase, but I do need anti-slugging perks to stand back up. There's a reason there was an effort to make this counterable at basekit. Because it's garbage and it makes matches awful. Anti-slug perks are also garbage. Conviction requires coordination, and the killer can just run you down until you drop. Unbreakable is one time use. Exponential is snuffable. "Just bring perks" yet the perks are crap.
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if slugging 'shouldn't exist' then you have a problem with the game not the player.
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Nah, I have a problem with the players who choose to do certain things they know are hated becuase of a win-at-all-costs mentatlity, and who also stopped the anti-slug from going through by mass social media screeching. The game can change. It has, many times, and it needs to again.
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no survivor strategy has ever been held to this standard
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How about both?
If there's an exploit in the game, clearly that's a problem with the game. But it's also a problem with those who abuse the exploit at everyone else's detriment.
Map offerings. Pretty much any survivor perk, too.
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BHVR said after their failed update last year that they aren't going to address tunnelling and slugging within the game any further, which is acknowledgement that those strats are here to stay and be used freely. If the playerbase wants the freedom to play as they choose, then that needs to go for everyone. If survivors want to gen rush then they should be free to, just as the killer is free to slug in response. This game has always been a matter of give and take. You ask if this is how we want the game to be played, and the answer (based on the massive response to the anti-update last year) is a resounding yes. This is the game players want. Viable strategies and the freedom to use them at will.
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BHVR said after their failed update last year that they aren't going to address tunnelling and slugging within the game any further
Do you have a source for this, by any chance? I don't recall this.
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So tell me the killer runs you down until you drop. That's 30 seconds for your entire team to reset or work on gens and you can just run to a stronger part of the map for your team for a pickup. Do you SERIOUSLY not see how valuable that is? It even saves slug situations where slugging is only really viable on said high mobility killers. If you're getting slugged by john clown or plague then sorry your team or you are just bad at the game. The reason why you need anti slug perks rather than base kit because it SHOULD be team play that beats a killer and not pure 1v1.
As for getting slugged for 4 minutes. I personally have no issue as when it's that it's usually my teammates that are not doing the correct things or are bad not the killer being particularly good. Tell me would it be fair to add anti slug stuff for a majority of the time is the survivors failing to do the correct play? This is like ANY other game where something is somewhat common so other in response bring stuff to counter it the only difference is DBD is a lot more pre-emptive than other games as you can't see the other teams builds as killer and can't adjust your own mid match.
I'm sorry but if you don't like DBD being a pvp game where there is people actually playing to win there is a bunch of PVE games on the market.0 -
nobody is seriously saying survs should refrain from fast track or DS, nor did they say it when dead hard was overpowered, the conversation in these cases is always centered around issues with the game and not blaming players for trying to win it
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You're literally looking at one of the survivor strategies being held to this standards in the OP. But here's a list of other survivor strats that get complained about daily:
Being on comms
Exhaustion perks
Endurance perks
Prerunning
Flashlights/Saboing
Stealth
Holding W
Using meta perks
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i will send you ten dollars if you can link me a single post on this forum saying that prerunning is cheating
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Kinda hard to say a team is bad when it's soloq. There's no control or coordination. There is no team. Too many killer wins are determined by just one bad team member. It's easy to see when you've landed a solo lobby. They're basically free ego boosts for killers.
I've had matches where people have gotten up with Conviction while I chased and hooked someone else and all I had to do was note the direction they went in to find them. Again, it's crap without coordination because it's quite possible no one will pick you up at all. The only solos that play like a proper team are usually high-skill, high-hour. A solo team playing against a high mobility killer running Infectious Fright and intending to slug everyone is basically guaranteed to lose.
Live service games get adjusted. If something is bad, it needs fixing. It's funny how if it's a killer benefit it's "it's a legit strat go play something else" but if it's survivor benefit it's "nerf it."
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Who said anything about cheating??
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I didn't screenshot it unfortunately, but they said they won't be addressing tunnelling or slugging any further, and their hope is that the upcoming matchmaking rework is all that is necessary to alleviate players frustrations
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Well yeah because survivor right now is really strong. Just because the player base isn't that good doesn't deny the state of it. We're unironically getting to the point where the base kit perks and maps are coming back to make even bad players get chances near to winning against someone physically better than them but since they chose a slightly weak killer they get to that point.
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Well yeah because survivor right now is really strong. Just because the player base isn't that good doesn't deny the state of it.
'My guesstimations trump all statistics!'
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So do you have anything to refute what I said or are you going to stick with the sarcasm.
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My guy, there is literally nothing to refute. You posted nothing but a personal opinion that goes against all statistics and then proclaimed it undeniable fact.
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Statistics aren't a one all conclusion to the state of a character. They are nothing more than a reason to look at said character. Tell me do these stats in Broad MMR really say "Dredge, Sadako and Pinhead are these top tier killers?" Vecna 1 and MAYBE Freddy if you really stretched it but, in most cases, its the HARDCORE mains that are doing that well along with a majority of people not understanding the counterplay or are just bad. When you get survivors that know how to play against said killers you see quickly how they just fall. At least with high mmr you could make a reasonable argument for all of those having that high of kill rates as those are undeniably strong killers.
Idk about you but I like to go into why a killer is strong and not look at "muh statistics" only.
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Which CC is responsible for this mantra of "survivor is really strong right now" that I keep hearing, because it seems like a way to just avoid responsibility? You can blame the game when survivors win instead of blaming yourself.
You're also saying "survivor is really strong" in a post where the dreaded and all powerful 4man, supposedly the strongest thing in the game, got full-team slugged. So what does weak look like?
Also, I have higher stats on Henry, Dredge, Freddy, and Vecna than the official numbers you posted and I'm mid, at best. And it's only those four because I've never played the others. But you're right, the statistics don't paint a clear picture because matches with DCs are cut. The numbers for thise killers are likely 5 to 10 points higher in reality. That aligns more with my own stats.
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Annnnnnd maybe they decide to tunnel out the "weakest" link so they snowball? Maaaaaaaybe they get super altruistic survivors? Maybe the survivors keep throwing? Maybe each and every killer is better at a base level than a single survivor? Theres a ton of reasons.
You say survivor is really strong but theres so many easy ways to simply kick them down as long as your decent with anyone. Generally killers fail due to misplays or mismatches.2 -
Mate, your whole build is designed around just 4 man slug the full team. You run Coulrophobia and Infectious to slow down and interrupt people from picking up their teammates, just to also slug them.
Dont act as if you reacted to anything here. You play every game like that, but its obviously the Survivors Fault. How long did it take for you to take this screenshot and how many SoloQ-Teams with off-meta builds did you face before?
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Leaving people on the ground for 4 minutes !? Heck no that is super boring to do as a habit. I just swapped to this build when i saw the 4x toolboxes . I know this game too well to know what they were up too. Funny because i play tons of survivor too but i never victimize myself like this 😂 i guess because i'm an og survivor who played even back in 2016
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Typical survivor squad running meta : You didn't know bro! Yeah they ran meta but what if it could have been 4 survivor baby dwights only running alert! If you don't 12 hook you're toxic. BHVR should bring back anti camp, anti tunnel, and imo anti tunnel-injuries(If you hit the same survivor twice in a row you're kind of tunneling if you think about it)
Killer running meta/even non meta lightborne or backpack: Bro you were so toxic, how could you play trapper with bag and go into basement : / game over bro.
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Yeah 4 toolboxes are either two things, saboo squad that wants to do this for 100% which is rare to get and very unlikely or team that has something for gens doesnt mean its total genrush squad but they have them for gens to be more efficient.
That team had all for gens in terms of toolboxes and perks for beating hard siruations like two unbreakables, one baiter with ds and shoulder or dh nothing friendly for spreading hooks or even slugging (forget we are gonny live togeather this perk counters slugging too or it can) so they were ready to crack so his intuation for reading their intentions was right.
He had ghoul but not so meta hard build as they had, I would say his addons were more meta than his perks if he didnt had those addons than its more likely he would had two kills max because ghoul after the revualt bug made into feature isnt that great in chase and now he is supper buggy (personal experience, I had so many strange bugs) so no shame in playing hard here.
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Two had unbreakable and one had two perks for giving himself and the one he picks from ground endurance effect so no shame it was equal battle plus genrushing toolboxes and few other meta perks against ruin+thrill and ghouls best addons.
Equal battle kinda but more better gear had survivors here and i bet they were all playing togeather maybe on coms because such chance for all of them running this is super rare so 4man stacked swf vs ghoul.
If you think they are soloq than I guess you didnt get good sence in reading people because chances are super low for 4 randoms in soloq running this especialy with tollboxes like these its 4 man.
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Statistics aren't a one all conclusion to the state of a character. They are nothing more than a reason to look at said character. Tell me do these stats in Broad MMR really say "Dredge, Sadako and Pinhead are these top tier killers?" Vecna 1 and MAYBE Freddy if you really stretched it but, in most cases, its the HARDCORE mains that are doing that well
Ah, I see, so you're saying most killers have worse players dragging down their killrates!
So the game is actually skewed further in the killers' favour than what the stats show, they're just dragged down by bad killer players!
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I don’t mind being slugged at all. I’d rather be slugged than be hooked - at least I’m not getting progressed as fast towards being eliminated from the game. In my experience, killers who prefer to slug instead of hook usually lose.
If you’re staying down for minutes or your whole team is getting slugged, that is because 1) survivors aren’t picking each other up, and 2) survivors are getting downed very quickly in their chases. Neither of those things is a problem with the way the killer is playing.
Oh and let’s not forget that survivors are allowed to abandon match for free if everyone is slugged. Are there any situations where killers get to abandon match for free when they are losing?0 -
Yes there is. If gen is not done in after 10 minutes has passed and that does not mean that killer is winning that one. In the matches where I have seen killer using that option to abandon were in a state of stalemate but the killer was not winning. Usually them slugging and not really hooking hard defending the gens quite usually not committing to any chase and survivors having to try to get others up from the ground, healed and get progress in a gen.
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Here, if you where still interested.2 -
Looking at that screenshot, would hooking really have made that much of a difference?
There are a lot of hook-related perks here, sure, but I don't think anyone would argue a single proc of Dead Hard is going to swing the game, and Shoulder the Burden + Decisive Strike can be reliably avoided with a 100% success rate even while hooking so they aren't going to be what's contentious here either.
I know what we're meant to be looking at here is mostly Fast Track, but even then… these survivors all have stacked toolboxes, and what Fast Track adds pales in comparison to what you get from that item. In this scenario, hooking would've given them slightly more progression, to be sure, but it also would've given you objective progression and slowdown on top of it— more importantly than that, not hooking does nothing to stop their biggest offender.
I probably sound like a broken record at this point, but I really feel there's an ongoing problem where people aren't acknowledging that genrushing begins and ends with toolboxes, they are the problematic source of gen speed and every problematic build requires them to function.
Slugging may have won you the game here, but I'd argue that's just a reflection of how excessive slugging is good at catching players off guard. Hooking here wouldn't have lost you the game, toolboxes here would've lost you the game.1 -
It's funny, because you'll all be complaining when the devs have no other choice but to introduce anti-slugging mechanics into base kit.
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It goes both ways. Bad survivors ALSO inflate kill rates and there are way more bad survivors than there are good ones if we REALLY want to use statistics as an example if only ~18% of the community is high mmr from BHVRs own words then it would make sense why killers have higher kill rates when those survivors aren't that good. Of course, there's a lot more nuance than that but that's what I see when people say "but the statistics" it just makes them look REALLY ignorant.
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So why is it the default "which CC said this" because this has been the norm for a while now with a lot of the slowdown getting consistently nerfed until recently along with BHVRs refusal to really impact the survivor gameplay loop. Please play and record your game against competent survivors that actually try to win and come back when you play as your average B tier.
As for the 2nd paragraph. Trying to use that is questionable. Its a screenshot of the end game screen. There was no video on how it was played out. It could have been a slaughter. It could have been down to the wire at 1 gen left against Ghoul so trying to use that as a "gotcha" doesn't really work. But if you want to go that way play this match as almost anyone under ghoul except Singularity and Twins and then what. You get stomped if you try to do anything.1 -
Right, it goes both ways, but we'll conveniently ignore that and claim it's a one-sided issue if it means we can dismiss stats that show the game favours the killer.
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If say the only point where the game favours the killer is in the fact the killer is one person and the survivors are four which logically means the survivor side has the higher chance for human error.
But that's not really something you can balance around
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