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Legion FF and CD addons changes
![P4MEND6DPKAV[1].jpg](https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/home/leaving?allowTrusted=1&target=https%3A%2F%2Fus.v-cdn.net%2F6030815%2Fuploads%2F212%2FREXQGIVX0VQN.jpg)
Edit: for clarification Peanits has given some clarification so these calculations and the initial post is off due to lack of initial information please look at Peanits post as well as my reply for proper addon/naked and time/distance calculations as well as the proper nerf % to legion
Edit edit: thanks to @knell we have a clear picture to see how the nerf effects Legion see the image above
Overall most of the changes are making sense but in my opinion the addon change goes too far, current live stun time is 3 seconds, with cold dirt and Joeys mix tape, bringing the cool down time from 3 to 1.75 seconds .75 cold dirt and .5 joeys giving a survivor around 7m distance from legion, with 2.7.0 they nerfed his cooldown to 4 seconds and buffed his addons to compensate increasing the time with those 2 addons to 2.35 seconds giving 9.4 meters head start but with 2.7.0.A. it was nerfed even further to 3 seconds with a purple and green addon giving 12 meters head start just for cancelling the power next to the survivor.
It takes currently on the live servers if both survivor and killer are running in a straight line 17.5 seconds to catch up. This was buffed to 15.6 opening up a new viable way to down as legion but this nerfed to 20 seconds with the current 2.7.0A. All this does not including loops which would take longer because killer hit boxes are larger than survivors.
i Feel this may have been too harsh and perhaps there should be tests, perhaps keeping his cooldown 3 seconds to make him less reliant on addons but keeping the nerfed values or even lowering the values more of the cooldown addons.
Because at base currently with the 4 second fatigue time giving 16 meters head start just for canceling your own power giving survivors at minimum 26+ seconds head start makes him heavily rare+ addon dependent.
Comments
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They did the math, they saw that even with the increased Fatigue and the buff to the cool-down add-ons that he was still strong so they nerfed the add-ons and kept the fatigue.
I think they were afraid of any backlash of Legion still being strong as a sign that they failed and didn't want to take any chances of Legion being slightly oppressive in any way so they went full throttle with the nerfs.
Ironically, this in itself has caused backlash to the Devs for doing the one thing they are known to do, screw over Killers in favor of Survivor outcry, they don't mean to do it but they do it anyway because they don't want to lose their fans. They even said they didn't want to pull too many levers at one time but they're like Gretchen on Bob's Burgers who thinks ''pump the breaks'' means go harder.
The Legion nerfs are fine but the FF Vault speed nerf and the cool-down add-ons are too much, those were unnecessary and went too far, without those nerfs Legion could actually be perfect. He wouldn't be oppressive and still be good at anti-loop which is what his vault is all about, anti-loop and they screwed that over completely, it's like nerfing Clown's bottles.
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I know the devs are survivor favored but 80% of the player base is survivors, i am trying to give good constructive criticism in hopes that they might listen like they did partially with the backlash from the pig nerfs, personally i think pig should move at 105 like myers T1 when crouched but that's a topic for another time.
Also the vault speed just looks so silly, and unnecessary seeing as it's only really viable for his first hit.
I'm posting hoping that other like minded people show support and to make our voices herd, because not posting might give the devs the impression that this is acceptable to the community or for people to disagree with the cold hard numbers that have been posted and to hear their side of the story.
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They won't listen. They know exactly what they're doing. Nobody complained about vaulting. They complained about moonwalk & FMT!
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i am cynical but i also know for a fact that if we do not voice our displeasure in a calm collective and constructive way it just makes it easier to ignore the killer perspective seeing as we are a vast minority, 20%.
Having a dev comment here would be very uplifting that, even if they decide not test or implement at least we know that they are aware of our concerns.
Edit: it's like deciding not to vote in an election, and then complaining about the results, if you do not make your voice herd those with power will have no idea those concerns even exist.
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While it initially makes sense to compare it directly to the live version, there's a little more to it than it seems. The fatigue exists to ensure that the Survivor can get some distance after feral frenzy ends. This is crucial, otherwise the Killer could catch up at 5.0m/s (previously ~5.28m/s), cancel frenzy, and then instantly down the Survivor. With that in mind, we can do some quick math. We'll also have to count the speed at which the Legion moves while fatigued.
(This is assuming you're not hitting the survivor and giving them a speed boost, since that would be silly. For simplicity's sake, this also assumes you are exactly where the Survivor is when you hit them, which obviously won't be the case, you won't be inside them.)
With a 1.75 second cooldown, the Survivor will gain:
(1.75 * 4) - (1.75 * 2.7) = 2.275m
With a 3 second cooldown, the Survivor now gains:
(3 * 4) - (3 * 2.7) = 3.9m
The difference:
3.9 - 2.275 = 1.625m
The Survivor is getting 1.625m more distance than they would before. Not a huge amount, but let's not write it off. The important part is how long it takes you to close that gap. (Again, for simplicity's sake, we're going to assume that you need to be directly on the Survivor to hit them. This more or less makes up for the assumption we made before.)
At 4.4m/s, you will close the 2.275m gap in:
2.275 / 0.4 ~= 5.7s
At 4.6m/s, you will close the 3.9m gap in:
3.9 / 0.6 = 6.5s
In total, you're only taking 0.8 seconds longer to catch up to the Survivor than you are in the live build. It's not a very significant amount of time, especially once you factor in the time you'll save being able to run loops at 4.6m/s.
In short, while it is slightly weaker than before, it's not significant when you take the movement speed into consideration.
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I still feel like the stun is too much considering how slow you are in FF, if Legion was as fast as live it would make sense to nerf the stun, and it's not like you're going to run the best add-ons at every match.
To me it's like nerfing clown's bleach add-on.
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@Peanits does the difference of a survivor having near double the time to run where the Legion can not physically attack them to get to a pallet or vault *really* need to be explained to you?
Really dude?
You think this is valid and excusable for double fatigue time even with double max cooldown add-ons?
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Most maps aren't corn fields. Dead Hard only provides a short amount of movement but it's often enough to reach the next looping spot. Right now Legion is lacking in mobility because of his long stun. It's gotten to the point on the ptb that I've taken to to just double stabbing the survivor with a button add on because it's faster than the stun.
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just want to thank you for the reply, and help with the calculations, as i could not find anything about the fatigue speed so thank you for that clarification. Also do you want me to edit a disclaimer at the top that they lack a key part of the equation that this post clarifies?
with those stats i can properly calculate everything
so without addons the 2.7.0A the time to catch up is now 5.2m in 8.7~ seconds
while live is without addons is 3.9m in 9.75 which is pretty harsh again due to distance traveled.
so now let's compare it with optimal addons for CDR
2.7.0 : 3.055m initial distance, 23m to catch up in 5.092~ seconds with dirt and joeys
2.7.0A : 3.9m initial distance, 29.9m to catch back up 6.5 seconds with dirt and joeys
Live: 2.275m initial distance, 24.64 to catch back up 5.6 seconds with dirt and joeys
but as we see it is both a nerf in time currently on PTB as well as distance, distance i would argue is far more important, and to call a 41.7% increase in head start distance with a 15% increase in time it takes not significant is concerning.
Distance means, pallets, windows and more are available.
what i'm trying to convey is that these are some heavy nerfs 42~% increase from live in survivor initial distance gained is quite large this is why i'm suggesting a lower base fatigue time while also keeping a lower addon effect so as to give survivors time to escape if well positioned but if caught out do not have a guaranteed palet/window at their disposal.
edit: math is hard, added distance needed to catch up
Post edited by m1_hero on1 -
With that being the case, we're now talking about a scenario where:
- The Survivor is already injured, you don't need to hit them
- You used Feral Frenzy to catch up to them and then canceled it
The most likely situation for this is if you were using Frenzy to injure them, then caught back up before cancelling it. If this is the case, the would have gotten a speed boost from the first hit which would allow them to easily get to a pallet or window.
The only other situation is where you would for some strange reason use Frenzy to catch up to them when they're already injured and then cancel it. There's not really any sense in doing so if they're already in the open, since they have no pallet to use on you. It makes even less sense if they're already in a loop since they would be able to loop back around to the other side by the time your fatigue is over (in both scenarios).
The scenarios where this predicament is actually going to be detrimental to you are very, very slim (if not non-existent). The amount of time you're going to save by closing the gap 50% faster in loops heavily outweighs the slight amount of time you'll be fatigued.
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You don't need to update it. This is the point of a forum, after all, so we can discuss things. The real key here is that looking at this one change on its own is not the greatest way of looking at it. There's been a whole bunch of other changes to The Legion, more notably the base movement speed. The fatigue time goes hand in hand with the movement speed since that determines at which you would catch up to the Survivor after cancelling Frenzy.
Ultimately it's a pretty nebulously thing since there's a ton of different factors to consider. e.g. Where are they? Where's the closest loop? Is the loop safe? Are you hitting them first, then catching up? What perks are they using? etc.
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You seem to be missing my point. Legion at his very best is a two hit killer. Being unable to down a survivor prior to the survivor reaching the next looping spot is basically the tale tell sign of subpar killers and why Killers who are a threat during the looping phase of the game are considered stronger. All the Legion's mobility means nothing for him in the looping phase as he can't down anyone during it with his power. Using his power for mobility results in a stun worse than a pallet or the NURSE. So he has all the weaknesses built in of the normal two hit killers but also lacks in the highs that are normally possible with other two hit killers such as Trapper's traps, Plague Broken, or Hag traps. It's a jack of all trades killer who fails at any individual role and doesn't stand out. He needs a niche and the current PTB version doesn't have one.
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About the disclaimer i prefer to not mislead people with wrong math or stats so i put it there anyways so to get people the proper information
but the whole thing is comparing with the new move speed, true we are concentrated on the CDR and FF time but we have both taken into account his new move speed and how his new play style is most probably heading, getting that first hit with FF maybe taging others and then eventually ending your power as you need to m1 the injured survivor and so you need to go through this exact scenario.
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Unrelated as hell but it baffles me that we get this kind of addons nerfs for weak/mid tier killer but we still have ######### like insta saw for Billy and omagablink for Nurse...
Sure it's not a huge nerf, but i still find this to be funny when the "Survivor need to have a chance" argument is used.
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To clarify that previous post, there's not really a situation where that would make a difference before or after the update.
If you use it to injure a Survivor and then catch up, they would get a speed boost, the time you'd need to catch up, and then your fatigue time combined to get to the next loop.
If you use it just to catch up to an already injured Survivor, they would get the time it takes you to catch up and your fatigue time combined to catch up.
If you're already in a loop, you're a silly goose and using the power objectively wrong. This wouldn't have worked before or after the update, by design.
In any of those cases, the Survivor would have plenty of time to get to the next loop, even before the update. The Legion's power is not made to catch up with and then regular hit Survivors. You would essentially just have a far more powerful version of the old Frenzy if you could.
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Since the PTB has started what is the % of players who have gone to the dying state because of Deep Wounds?
Post edited by Lemming on1 -
I would be totally shocked if any survivor ever gets downed by deep wounds with how handholding the power is even more now than it was before the PTB.
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I mean. If you aren't supposed to down people with M1 out of frenzy, and you aren't supposed to down people with Deep wounds.
Then what ARE you supposed to down people with?
This is why I think Frenzy should down people who are injured without DW. It doesn't encourage tunneling since it work on everyone BUT the person you initially went after. It gives a logical inherent reward to chain hitting a bunch of people. AND it lets ALL of the nerfs work for his kit in order to make it still fair.
His ability to ignore pallets and windows too strong? They were just nerfed. He can just wait for you to mend? Not if you can just ignore DW in his terror radius, which also makes it easier to tell when he is nearby since the edge of the TR can be hard to hear sometimes. Too hard to juke? No scratchmarks, no blood, a long stun and he is kicked out on a miss. Can't get away from him while he is using Killer Instinct? Now he's slower while using it and has no addons that help make it that better.
All of those things make no sense to implement if you can just ignore his frenzy attacks anyways. But if once you have mended (which you eventually have to do) he can (relatively) easily down you with Frenzy then suddenly it all adds up.
@Peanits any idea if this was one of the "too awesome to share" ideas that the devs had?
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@Peanits if the legion power isn't mean to catch up and possibly down, WHAT IS IT FOR? Deep wounds IS NOT A THREAT! Survivors don't clump together as is so again, what is it's purpose?
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The power's a dud and I'd rather just be a killer who applies status effects with frenzy attacks rather than a killer who applies deep wounds and then looks at the pin addons and sees that they are a waste of time.
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The Legion's power is not made to catch up with and then regular hit Survivors.
Wait, I feel like I've completely missed something. From what I understood from the most recent Dev Stream, this is exactly what The Legion is expected to do.
From the Dev Stream:
Ethan: "So what you should do, is cancel Frenzy. You should not hit them a second time because it only gives them the speed boost and since it doesn't remove time from the Deep Wound timer anymore, it's a really bad move to hit somebody a second time with it. You should use the Frenzy to catch up with them and use whatever you use to cancel Frenzy..."
not_Queen: "I'm going to play the Devil's Advocate here... but then you get a 4 second stun."
Ethan: "You do, but if you hit them you get a 4 second stun AND they get the movement boost."
I may just be having a difficult time following this conversation.
Can you possibly make a spreadsheet of the numbers and calculations you made in the original post (and what they represent), as well as the calculations that Peanits made for us? It's a little too difficult for me to follow, so I would appreciate it.
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I will accept this. Put the gen debuff on it like Billy purple saw piece and we good.
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duplicate
Post edited by m1_hero on0 -
@knell i don't know how to do a spreadsheet on the forums as i am new here but i will give out the calculations and mistakes i have made.
The first mistake was i was lacking information, i was missing the fatigue moves peed so the initial post was if you were stunned and stuck in place and thanks to Peanits was have the fatigue speed of 2.7m/s
Second major post the mistake was that i did not finish the calculation with the time it takes to catch up times the killer move speed to get the full distance needed to catch up if caught with nothing to extend the chase.
this is live server example
(3X4) - (3X2.7)= 3.9m
4.4 - 4= .4m/s
3.9/.4= 9.75 seconds until second hit
9.75x 4.4 = 42.9m needed to travel to get the second hit
TLDR:
(fatigue time X survivor movespeed) - (fatigue time X fatigue speed 2.7m)= distance gained
(Killer move speed - survivor move speed) = gains per second
(distance gained / gains per second) = time to get second hit
(time to get second hit X killer move speed) = distance forced to travel
all done if both are running in a straight line with nothing to interfere
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@knell yup Peanits confirmed the speed in his calculations, while fatigued you can still move but very slow and that is the 2.7m/s
Edit: the reason why i keep calling it fatigue, is because like nurse this effect can't be effected by stuff that lowers stun.
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The context of that statement in the dev stream is that you already hit the Survivor with Feral Frenzy once. He's saying that you wouldn't want to hit them a second time with Feral Frenzy since that would give them a speed boost and also put you into fatigue, you would just want to catch back up and then cancel it.
Stemming from that, what I'm saying is that the power is not made to be cancelled and then allow you to instantly press M1 to do a regular attack and down the Survivor before they have the chance to run away, which is why there's a fatigue when you cancel it. Basically you can use Frenzy to cover the bulk of the distance, but if you're counting on the fatigue being short enough to quickly catch up, cancel it and then get a hit, it's not going to happen.
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Since cold dirt and joey's mix tape gives you a 3 seconds fatigue state. Do u guys consider making their base cooldown to 3 seconds and rework these addons?
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@Peanits i think what knell and i are saying is that it needs to be in a reasonable center, where you hit someone with FF then catch up using FF cancelling it and then m1 downing them, and if you block a window or palet before they get there or catching them out of position that you are rewarded for good play and that your power is not a detriment, and by detriment i mean that you are fatigued so long that no matter what you do they are safe to run to a pallet or window.
That maybe having to run 29.9m to catch them might be too much a nerf especially when it only took 24,6m live at 110%move speed and 23m in 2.7.0.
I think everyone would be happy with roughly having 25m wiggle room to find a palet/window to use.
edit: no one is asking to be able to cancel legions FF and to be able to m1 down a survivor without counterplay
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just did a few calculations, but letting the the stun time with the addons cold dirt and joeys mixtape and having them add up to 2.5 seconds stun time total you can let survivors get 24.916m to find a pallet or window before legion can catch up.
edit: spelling and grammar
Post edited by m1_hero on1 -
And yet the Nurse exists. Great job guys...
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Thanks for the clarification, @Peanits
I do agree with m1_hero, in that if the extra add-ons can reduce the fatigue time to 2.5 seconds (allowing survivors 24.92 m to find a loop or window), it would be in a good place in my opinion.
Moreover, if the longer duration of 0.8 seconds to catch up to the survivor is, as you say, not that significant, then the shorter duration of 0.3 seconds (difference between the live build and if the Fatigue Time is 2.5 seconds) should be even less significant, but can be interpreted as a "buff" to The Legion players, something I feel like they've desperately been in need of. What do you think, is it still unreasonable?
For those who would like a spreadsheet of what m1_hero and Peanits were discussing: (hoping it's correct)
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(Why can't I remove the quote anymore? And is it possible to just quote a single line?)
At first, thanks for your time @Peanits you spend here to answer the questions, although some of them seem a bit offending. I think most of the people reading this are appreciating your work and will to satisfy as most players as possible.
Generally, the longer I think about the changes, the more I believe it could still work out somehow, you just need to adapt to it. Still thinking there are some debuffs that are simply not necessary and don't address anything that has not been addressed yet by other changes (like removing blood pool vision in FF)
But there are three things that really seem annoying to me. The one is the following quote from @Peanits first post here:
"This is assuming you're not hitting the survivor and giving them a speed boost, since that would be silly"
There is no other killer power that punishes you for using it. You can place traps bad, miss with hatchets or get to Evil Within 3 too early by accident. These are simply fails. Hitting a survivor with Frenzy is what you are supposed to do. Getting punished for it in this situation really feels like a design bug. I'd rather like to see something like the new pin addons do. Like said before, even adding slower repair/healing speed until fully healed or something.
A sample situation I have in mind would be the following. As you kindof choose to give the survivor a huge distance, which delays the chase for some good amount or even lets the survivor escape, you can just choose to attach the additional effect instead of try to down him, because you just passed a gen that was being worked on or that was progressed too far. Would give the second hit some purpose, instead of "wow, that was silly dude, you hit him twice"
Speaking of the pins, I kinda like them now. But the 60 seconds broken status seems a bit thin. As written above, you really take some drawback if you decide to hit the survivor twice. Regarding the mangled effect, it makes sense as you could just actively let the survivor escape, knowing he will take some time now to get up again. But the broken status of 60 seconds is at least for 30 seconds irrelevant, because you first need to escape from the killer and then start mending. I'd rather prefer 90 seconds to have a chance to find the survivor again and make use of the effect. Otherwise you wouldn't have to waste the time applying the effect, you could just chase the survivor down. Broken only makes sense if it happens out of your range (like on Deliverance) or if you decide to let the survivor escape on purpose and see the chance to find him again with the effect still being active (like on Plague). Both is not really applying here.
Second one is the change to Franks mixtape. As it was clearly stated, Frenzy should not be a mechanic to down survivors. But with this addon you keep this playstyle alive. This is already a bit strange to me. But one step further, I don't see this to work in any way. As you increased the necessary hits from 4 to 5 compared to the current live Legion, and adding the changes like slower Frenzy speed, slower vaulting speed and no timer regression inside the terror radius and especially only being able to activate Frenzy at full gauge, I would guess it will take like 5 minutes to down a survivor using Franks mixtape.
Also, as the Killer will not see the progress of the bleed out, beneath the fact that it will not be progressing while mending or in the terror radius, I think that it will literally NEVER happen, that you find a survivor by chance that has a bleed out progress of below 25%. How exactly was your plan to use this addon?
And third one is the effect to empty the power gauge on M1 hits. I did not understand this effect on initial release. It actually forces you to always hit survivors with Frenzy. Except you accidentially get in range of an injured survivor it was basically stupid to not frenzy-hit a survivor. Now having a bunch of Frenzy debuffs like longer refill time, no real benefit on injured or deep-wounded survivors and especially only being able to activate at full gauge, I don't get the point of depleting the power gauge on regular hits. @Peanits, can you explain what would be possible abuses or what situations you had in mind to keep this penalty? Or was it just not on the desk?
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There is no plan lol. Plain and simple they didn't want survivors upset and having to outplay legion. They nerf his power to hell destroy FMT so you can't pressure with the power, and make him m1 killer. That's all there is to it. No matter how much logic and reason you put in, they wanted Legion nerfed and that's it lol. We still got Billy, Nurse, & Docktah... So let's be thankful I guess.
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Game hasn't been survivor sided in a long time dude.
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Yes i agree cooldown add-ons shouldn't have be nerfed at least not purple one. why are you survivors or maybe some of killer mains scared, to make Legion a viable and powerful killer while being balanced. Even if legion was OP nurse is the goddess of the fog.
Legion is supposed to be a killer with an increased mobility able to, run though the map put survivors in DW effect then finishing them of with basic attack. I'm ok with the increased fatigue but duration should be a little bit higher, and stun/hit penalty removed.
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let's try and stay on topic guys
@KaoMinerva look i understand the frustration but no point getting mad at the dev that was kind enough to give us more information which he was under no obligation to do so.
@Peanits hey thanks for being so transparent with us and hope that we were able to convince you to perhaps pass on the information and that maybe buffing the survivor distance from 23m to 30m of guaranteed distance before getting hit with a purple and green addon might of been a bit harsh also having to rely on those addons because giving 40m before legion can get a second hit without addons.
Because at least to us killers it feels like you can get the first hit with FF and then we are forced to m1 them but as it currently stands the survivor has such a huge cushion of distance that they are guaranteed a loop no matter what and it feels like sure the power let's us get that first hit but afterwards similar to how Freddy currently is just hurts Legion.
We want to be rewarded especially for good play, by maybe blocking a window or exit rout using FF or catching a survivor out of position and punishing the survivor for making that mistake, but as it stands 30m with addons and 40m without addons is a whole lot of distance the survivor has to find their loop when it's what the killer has to do to down them.
on a side note why can't i post, it is saying my post is waiting for approval?
edit: grammar, also it keeps deleting my post? what is going on?
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@NuclearBurrito Just to play devil's advocate for a bit here, that isn't how players would use his power if they did this. The smarter play in most situations would be to hit players with a regular hit and then use Frenzy to secure the down. Maybe that would be a problem, maybe not. But when trying to figure out if it would be balanced or not, that should be considered.
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You mean hit them once. Wait 13 seconds and THEN down them with Frenzy.
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See? Even the M1 draining Frenzy thing suddenly makes more sense with this sort of change.
Also even without that it would be comparable to other combo hits such as with the Huntress or Plague.
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@Dreamnomad also at that point you're basically just doing a varient on the whole Frenzy -> cancel -> stun thing. Since you still need to chase them with M1 in order to hit them the first time in order to even attempt that.
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@NuclearBurrito true the M1 draining power does perplex when you have to M1 to down people, it kind of feels like a way to stop snowballing of downing someone and then going FF to tag others? but it's such an odd punishment for doing well. But it does make more sense if you were able to down with your power, which in the current PTB you can't
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@Peanits I just wanted to take a second to say that I really appreciate the level of engagement you've shown to the community. This level of transparency is particularly welcome. I'd like to think in your heart of hearts that you know they've dropped the ball on the Legion rework, but it isn't your job to say "hey guys, I agree with all you that Legion rework wasn't handled well." You are literally being paid to defend the company's decisions to the community. I get that.
While I personally feel that they messed up on a number of fundamental levels with the rework and now Legion has half a power, I'll leave all that aside for now and ask questions related to your response.
1.) Do you or your company believe that Legion's cooldowns are a problem on the live servers?
2.) If not then even by your own math this is a nerf even with the base run speed increase. Why is this necessary when Legion already is getting hit with numerous other nerfs?
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duplicate
Post edited by m1_hero on0 -
What I've been seeing with the changes is its great for spreading out first hits while they are grouped but legion quickly loses the advantage of pressure after this. There is still little incentive to heal as now they are forced to m1, which grants survivors a much stronger defense against downs. Legion suffers from;
1. A non lethal follow up ff attack which only grants a speed boost
2. A cooldown designed for survivor distancing whether hitting or missing the attack
3. Wide open for an exhaustion counter as this distance can not be closed/minimized without providing the distance afforded by the cooldown
4. Forced to engage loops in the most favorable method for survivors
5. A larger tr resulting in chases starting at maximum distance unless the survivor chooses to linger
6. The ff can't be used to tag/ward off healthy survivor from a freshly down teammate save as it resets on a successful m1
I do think the changes have made legion play a better alternative to the previous tunnel beast, but feels as though every aspect of the power has been met with counters that I find extremely easy to capitalize on. Atleast when not caught in the open, which every survivor should be avoiding anyway. I wanted some counter play to legion but I'm just seeing a lot of foolish looking killers getting baited into using a survivor friendly power or endure the most drawnout version of chase.
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Just an OT note: why does everybody call Legion a tunneler?
In my opinion, and I think that at least WAS the common understanding, tunneling is hooking the same survivor several times in a row to get him out of the game quickly. Why is chasing down a survivor called tunneling only when talking about Legion?
Sometimes I really have the impression that some people just throw around words to offend someone. Like tryhard was invented when nothing else applies
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yeah ikr.
Also if you take it literally then tryhard is a compliment. I mean trying your best is a positive character trait that you should be proud of.
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