The new legion is garbage
I know lots of people hate legion cause he has "no counter" and i agree with this, he needed one or two nerfs, but man... noe he's only good for deranking, isnt even fun to play him, u get blind for almost 5 seconds, no blood pools, slow vaults (better break the pallets than vaulting them) and the mend has literally no purpose. I think BHVR went too far with this one. In my opinion, i think i would have been enough the nerf against moonwalking. What do u think?
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They did exactly what they wanted to do. Gut Legion to the point no one would play him.
No one plays him? No survivors complain about him and they don't have to care about him anymore.
They all ready made their money off him, why do they give a ****?
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Bro, instead of doing that u better just erase him from the game, as he is a shame for everyone who plays him, he is just a bad joke now, and i really liked him before...
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If they did that they may actually have up consider giving refunds to the people who bought him to enjoy him.
Can't compensate people for removing something they paid for. Better just make them not want to play it at all. That way they still get to keep their profit.
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One man's trash is another man's treasure
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Do u really think it was needed? Everyone said (before the nerf) that legion is a low rate killer, and now everyone hates him cause of some ######### exploiting his bugs. As i said, it would have been enough if they counter the moonwalk, as they did now
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Honestly I was hoping for legion buffs. Unless Legion wanted to spend 10 seconds+ a hit tunnelling one survivor to hit them 5 times, they had to deal with loops without using frenzy, which was really bad.
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Played vs 2 Legions today, 1 time he got a 4K (well, using the best Add-Ons, Iridescent Button and Cold Dirt), second time 2K (without any good Perks and with brown Add-Ons)
Does not sound too bad.
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Yes, I fully believe it was needed and I also believe Legion is a solid mid tier killer now thanks to the changes.
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And way more fun to play for anyone who wants to use their brain
And a healthier design overall
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The problem is people trying to play him the way they did before. Legion was previously a low skill, medium low reward killer. Now they're a medium high skill medium high reward killer. Could do with a bit more perk synergy but honestly they're in a good spot overall and I expect their kill rate to go up over the next few months.
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Lol, do u find it fun getting a stun for almost 5 seconds? Cause i dont, i know there exist addons to prevent the cooldown, but they are not unlimited and when u waste them all, u lose the killer too, which is very boring anyways, but survivor mains might think this is good
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Legion players brought this on themselves by abusing cheesey mechanics. I have no sympathy for you.
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Yeah, been chaining games as Legion and the stun is nasty, you need addons otherwise it's way too much to handle, on top of FF being slow af in both running speed and vaulting speed, wich makes playing Legion really boring now.
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Wait a minute, i didnt say that im main legion, and i never abused about him moonwalking people or stuff like that. Is it right i played him sometimes just for fun when i was getting bored of phasing, as im a main spirit, but i just dont think this is a fair and "balanced" legion, is just fair for the survivors
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Haven't had a problem with the stun so far. After getting a free frenzy hit, you can still reposition yourself in a place where the survivor can't get anywhere too safe, or literally play the game like any other killer except only having to hit them once.
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Legion is stronger after rework, you can get your free first hit with frenzy and then dont bother with it anymore and play like any other m1 killer would. That already above what most m1 killer get.
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He's stronger as an M1 killer, wich used to be the old optimal playstyle, can't deny that he's stronger on that aspect @Kirra , but the only problem we have with that is the power being weak and heavily restricted with an unavoidable 4 second stuns at the end, if anything now i try to get stunned by pallet instead of desactivating it because i don't lose all my vision and it takes less time to recover from a pallet stun than frenzy's stun.
I wouldn't mind the power being weak if it wasn't so heavily restricted to use and if we wouldn't have to eat a 4 second stun everytime we desactivate it.
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The stun is there to prevent you from hitting someone with FF and with a regular attack immediatly afterwards, which is not the intended design.
If you deactivate it yourself, you keep the remaining power. If you get pallet slammed you lose everything. Not worth it.
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It is worth it in a chase, after applying DW there's no point in keeping your power up, a pallet less and a shorter stun is worth it.
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Legion is terrible now. They gutted everything that made him special and the only thing he got in return is normal killer move speed. He's a killer with half a power.
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i have to agree with this thread sadly:( he is bad to play now cause i was almost at rank 12 but got depip to rank 14 like really:(
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and to top that one survivor dc
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are you happy now survivor mains?
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They might be, BHVR changed legion mostly cause of the survivors request :((
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Ofc he is garbage now, but only for those people who abused his mechanics and enforced ez 4Ks.
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that's what happens when u abuse the ######### out of legion's mechanics
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I lost 4 pips when I played as Legion today. He is terrible. The stun when coming out of Frenzy should be 3 seconds instead of 4. I think that is what's really hurting him right now.
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If you played a lot of Legion, well... It was so easy to rank up with them. So you may just be in Ranks where you should not be.
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I play mostly Clown, Pig and Legion. I do fine at my rank with both Pig and Clown (rank 3). Legion is just bad. You get a 4 second stun when you use his power. Its too much.
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his passive disconnection ability didn't get removed yet. sooo. i'll be main-ing legion. :D
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I like the new Legion and enjoy playing that basic sometimes. Just hit and repeat quite easy. He isn't to viable and sure it would be better if he would be as a lot of other killers should be. But he is fun. I did great yesterday actually better then with the old one but thats just because I hated to play efficent with the old Legion. He can mindgame really well now and you can use different builds on him now. Learn to bait paletts to get a short stun even better with enduring.
Give the changes some time to understand them
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played the first game with legion yesterday (i'm rank 12 or so because i don't play the game all that much, just a few games a day), and got paired with rank 5-3 survivors. Used CD addons and "meh" perks, here's the result
Was a pretty decent game, but honestly right now the gameplan is like this (at least for me)
Find survivor, hit survivor with FF, if you hear heartbeats, look for the other survivor, if not, follow the last one you hitted with FF, get yourself in his back, deactivate power, chase and M1.
With this you force them to not be doing objectives (if you hit more than one) during the time they have to mend, wich usually is when you already got the other survivor down. Now deep wounds is just for buying time. Also, people tend to keep healing on him to full, so maybe nurses calling is not a bad idea sometimes.
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Yeah he's garbage.
The main problem is they were hit too hard with nerfs across the board. Sure, you get a "free hit", maybe, but then what? You go chase someone else in frenzy, leaving the other person to freely mend? Then you're just wasting your time. You chase that first person down and M1 them? Then you're just a generic M1 killer, only you have ZERO power in a chase. You know who else has a "free" first hit and then nothing in a chase? Freddy.
How much fun does getting looped to death as an M1 killer with no chase power sound? Well, like heaven to survivors obviously. It's the same crap they did with Freddy, listened to the low skill survivors and nerfed them too hard. Did Legion need nerfs to remove the cheese? Hell yeah. But now they're a low tier, add-on requiring doodoo killer.
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I just played another game and got a 4k. I almost got a double pip. Maybe I just need to play with him and get better.
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:(
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Even a perkless speed limiter Leatherface can 4K against complete inepts, but that doesn't make him a good killer.
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You said yourself that the issue with the old Legion is that they had no counterplay. To play Devil's Advocate, what one or two nerfs alone would have fixed that? The terror radius deep wound change covers moonwalking, but what about someone who only repeatedly uses frenzy to down a survivor? Since there is no counterplay there as well, how do you suggest that should have been fixed? With those two changes in mind, would the Legion be good, or would they be weak?
For what it's worth, I've been watching plenty of people playing the Legion since the update and they've been very successful. The less fun aspects may be gone, but in terms of overall power, the Legion does not appear to have taken much of a hit (if any, they actually seem stronger).
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Ah, yeah, of course. Had 5 games already vs Legion, 3 4Ks, 1 3K, 1 2K. And in every game the Legion Player was exceptionally good and the Survivors (which were at the same Rank) were Potatoes. Sure, sure...
New Legion is not garbage. He is alright. "Problem" is that people need to adapt now, he is not braindead anymore. So some people will struggle with him.
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Yeah so the argument is going to be that now "He's less fun but he's better as a killer"
The counterplay issue of old Legion was fixed when you guys decided to remove the ability to damage DW and fixing the exploits, so i have no idea what you are on about now.
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Any w+m1 killer will do well. Legion isnt fun anymore we are better off playing wraith with 10x better efficiency. That'sthe issue.
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To answer:
Feral Frenzy scales as you strike more target in the same frenzy.
Frenzy will start with its current speeds/duration and deep wounds timer.
Each time you hit a different survivor the deep wounds timer get's reduced by 10%, your frenzy is reset, and given an additional 3 seconds (this is to help you get to the next victim)
After stabbing a second victim stabbing the same victim will no longer end feral frenzy,
After 4 stabs total, your stab now has the ability to put down a bleeding target.
The object is to let him spread dmg around, and get stronger. Which will make him more of a threat in the late game when survivors are closer together. The amount of stabs to transition into putting someone down means the chases should be on the long side for a skilled player game, but still doable. Making him have to stab 2 different people before his perk switches into lethal to people bleeding out, means he is less tunnely, which was the chief complaint.
Hard counters:
Lithe & Sprint burst: Still counters him hard in this build.
Pallets: they exist and are still his bane if you smack him with it.
Generator times
edit: Might consider changing his killer instinct to target only people he has stabbed. Keeping track of his victims, and giving people the chance to stealth him in a way that feels like they did somehting rather then he went after someone else. SO this would be a QOL thing for survivors, more then to increase his lethality. (it feels unrewarding to juke legion)
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40% of the killers i faced who played legion were abusing his powers. it's not a few. maybe try playing survivor??
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You're not as good as you think you are. Plain and simple. The new Legion is just a M1 killer with a big terror radius, they're the worst killer in the game.
And, for the record, killers do adapt. All the time. Since day 1. Survivors simply demand and, more often than not, get nerfs against us every time we do.
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He still gets a Free Hit.
Freddy Doesn't.
Trapper Doesn't.
Spirit Doesn't.
Not even Nurse gets a Free hit.
Git gud and grow up.
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It's funny . His power became very useless he is more Powerful when chasing normally depending on bloodlust .
And I don't think he was that bad before just that some of his add-ons and builds can be abused .
He only needed some little tweaks not a nerf
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You dont realise Frenzy M1ing people multiple times is a counter by itself because of how much time you lose. After moonwalking, it was the least effective way to down someone. What are the other Survivors doing during that time? FMT was an add-on that removed that counter, and that is why that specific add-on was a problem.
As I have said before, Legion were fine the way they were before. Some of their add-ons and moonwalking were LITERALLY THE ONLY PROBLEMS. Those problems were addressed, and thats very much appreciated, but at the unnecessary cost of a decent Killer being trashed because of senseless whining.
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Fix the moonwalking exploit
Make missed attacks drain the power faster and offer a slight slow down to legion
Make FF attacks not deplete the mending timer
Literally nothing else needed to be touched.
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As someone who plays Legion quite a bit, I can say they're in a better spot, of course they could still use some tweaking. My main annoyance with Legion is not being able to use frenzy until it's full while also losing it all when you miss with it. It's not very noob or controller friendly and I much prefered it when you could pop it at 25% charge as it has no killing potential at all.
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I don't think Legion is bad or garbage. I would say Legion rework is one dimensional. There's only one way to really play him now. You grab the green Stolen Sketch Book with either Susie's Mix Tape or Iridescent Button and you stab all 4 people in single frenzy then you proceed to down them with normal M1 115 ms. If the survivors heal, Feral frenzy all of them again, Rince and repeat until everyone dies. If they don't heal and just do generators while successfully using every pallet on the map, too bad for you i guess.
When compared to to other killers, Other killers can have slight change in their play style based on what add-on they use, and they change their purpose of their power. For example, Wraith has Shadow Dance add-on's, Silent belle, Fast uncloak, All seeing orb, Myser has Mirrors,Unlimited Evil within, Tombstone. Pig can change her traps for stalling the game on boxs or Amanda Letter. When you look at Legion's play style variety, what does he have? Oh, that's right, none. The play style of speed+duration from previous patch was possible before rework. Fatique add-on got nerfed. The power takes forever recharge making Tape and Cold studies pointless because duration increased recharge timer. The Legion pins give him wrong status effects and don't really help him at all.
For the record, The plague nerf that reduces her movement speed when holding vomit achieved same result. In PTB, you could play in any style you wanted. When she got on to live servers, She's forced to use Vile effectiveness add-on or Worship Tablet+Black Incense with assumption that, If the survivors don't cleanse, you get map-hack and if they do, you get normal movement speed holding corrupt purge and Vile effectiveness for expose-type killer game-play. That's why your statistics on Plague kill-rate are so poor on plague. So it's not first time that you've weakened a killer and forced one-dimensional play on them.
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