Why does No Mither not have 100% noise reduction?
This is something that has baffled me for a long, long time now. I understand it's a "hardmode" Perk, but it's very clear that the "hardmode" comes from constantly being on a 1-hit down, not from being nearly unable to be stealthy unless you run Iron Will.
I've been mad at this for a long time. You already have to waste a quarter of your Perk slots JUST to make the game harder for yourself; by wasting that Perk slot, you by default have to waste half of your Perk slots on equipping No Mither and Iron Will just so that you can retain your ability to hide from the Killer.
I think No Mither is a fun Perk to run. But that's just it: I like running Perks that make the game feel more fun. And though I do think Iron Will is a fun Perk, if I already have No Mither, Iron Will isn't a fun Perk. It's a forced Perk. Having no choice but to kill my Perk variety just to turn on hardmode isn't fun. What if I want to use that Perk slot for a build? What if I want to combine No Mither, Resilience, This Is Not Happening, and Stake Out to do a gen Mither build, or combine it with Urban Evasion, Quick and Quiet, and Dance With Me to do a stealth Mither build? But no, I have to waste an entire Perk slot on Iron Will just so the idea of hiding from the Killer with No Mither on is even a possibility.
This is exaggerated by the fact that unless you're a high-tier player in a chase, you're going to want to be hiding from the Killer more often because, well, you're constantly on a 1-hit down. But by not giving No Mither a 100% noise reduction, you're strong-armed into using up that extra Perk slot on Iron Will, just so you can be able to do at all what a Perk like No Mither heavily relies on you doing. By making stealth a more valuable mechanic to the player, No Mither should enhance your ability to be stealthy, not damn near erase it.
In short: No Mither should have a 100% noise reduction, because it needs it. The Perk encourages you to play stealthy yet makes stealth nearly impossible without wasting half your Perk slots and killing the variety of fun, useful, or interesting builds you can run.
Comments
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You know. This is why I feel like No Mither = Hard mode is silly.
If you really want to make yourself a 1 hit down then after you get hit throw yourself at the Killer so he can down you for free.
The only reason to run no mither is to get some benefit out of it, since otherwise you could just not run it and get the challenge anyways that you enforce yourself.
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A better question would be: Why does no mither exist in the form it does?
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But no one uses it so it's ok.
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... To make the game more of a challenge for people who are especially good at Survivor?
Like, what other reason could there possibly be?
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No one uses Distortion, so I don’t see what your point is.
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No Mither is actually a good perk, not as a "hard mode" perk (that's dumb as rocks, if you want Hard Mode don't play with Perks) but because it gives some nice benefits -- including being the only counter to Bloodhound.
The main issue is it has too many drawbacks. It's just badly designed. The noise reduction needs to be fixed to 100%, and the Broken Indicator should not be shown so that it's at least a surprise until your first hit or first sighting and the Killer sees your injured.
Perk needs to be reworked, it is sadly in need of some kind of change.
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Everyone saying that No Mither counters X or No Mither counters Y is actually stupid.
”No Mither counters Bloodhound” You know what else counters Bloodhound? Being uninjured.
”No Mither counters Exposed Perks” by making you Exposed all the time? That definitely makes human sense.
“No Mither and Iron Will is stealthy” It’s only just as stealthy as being uninjured—except when you run No Mither, you’re on a 1-hit down.
”No Mither is good for gen builds” WOW, Resilience and This Is Not Happening make gens go SO much faster! I can definitely see myself benefitting from a 9% increase in repair speed and hitting those great skill checks I probably would have hit anyway! That’s definitely worth the trade-off of being on a 1-hit down all game!
Face the facts: The only justifiable reason to equip No Mither is to make the game harder for yourself. All benefits that you could possibly reap from being Broken all game are outweighed by, well, being Broken all game. It’s a challenge Perk, through and through. A badly-designed one.
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I agree with you no mither.
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Here's how I see it; No Mither is a challenge perk, and one people will get angry if it's made not as challenging. The only balancing I see that will make people happy is if No Mither buffs your fellow survivors without buffing yourself; that doesn't eliminate the "hard mode" aspect, while not ruining your teammates' chances of survival
I also fully agree with this (except calling people stupid):
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no mither is a good perk if you like it, and its a bad perk if you dont.
why do people even bother arguing about it, there is a reason david has it, because he doesnt care, and i dont care, exept when people argue about a perk but use the exact same arguments against eachother.
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For someone so against vapid arguing, you seem to be adding quite a lot to the discussion with very insightful comments.
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Agreed, it is stupid
I DONT WANT TO WASTE A PERK SLOT ON IRON WILL GODDAMIT!
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I mean it somewhat counters Legion. Since he just uses Frenzy to make you a 1 hit down anyways, this lets you be stealthy even after he gets the free hit on you.
But I mean, if that's your greatest and really only strength then you're a ######### perk.
The only other benefit is in a sabo build. Since you can break the hooks and when the Killer goes to down you he can't slug you, but since you broke the hooks he can't hook you either. Pain-reliever made a video which includes using this strategy to keep the Killer force to repeatedly down him for 2 minutes before he could hook him.
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I use it in my main build although I don't experience a prob with it due to running OoO with it also. Stealth isn't that great currently but it would be nice to be able to hide with it I admit.
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They should give it a BP increase if that's actually what they're going to go with.
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I have a question, does No mither leave no scratch mark when Downed?
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Because that's what iron will is for.
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There are no scratch marks as long as you are NOT running. But there is blood.
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You didn’t read the post, did you?
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No mither is the same as a Hillbilly's perk to start the game without the chainsaw
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I think it should activate after being hit the first time. then you will not be able to heal and killer will not be able to see that you have no mither. it will just show injury sate. if killer doesn't see, you have at least a chance to heal from dying state.
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Know what would make No Mither OP and actually reasonable? You leave no scratch marks, to compensate for everyone knowing you have No Mither and being a 1 shot all game, but I do reccomend No Mither if you want a challenge.
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No Mither was a counter for the slug meta ages ago, right now its an obsolete perk in dire need of changes.
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No Mither needs to reduce noise by 100%.
It needs to not show broken status to killer.
It needs to not enter game injured. - That way the killer truly won't know who has No Mither.
Retain the inability to be rehealed to uninjured.
Retain the ability to pick yourself up.
Retain the no pools of blood.
Add a BP increase for playing with No Mither. <-- would be nice, but at least make the other changes. Honestly I feel if BBQ has a BP increase even with it being so strong in the first place, then No Mither should likewise have a BP bonus.
That's my recommendation for No Mither.
I agree with much of what was said, No Mither isn't a "hard core" mode, it's an anti slugging perk.
Hard mode is no perks, no items no offerings, and if you really want hard core, just stand still if you get hit once.
In it's current state, especially since you start injured and you show broken to killer, it tells the killer you have No Mither, COMPLETELY negating the primary purpose of the perk, - being to pick yourself up if downed. The current perk stats are rather stupid to be honest.
@Peanits Can we get some feedback on this? And on Left behind?
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No, the purpose of the Perk is absolutely hard mode. The benefits you get from NM do not compensate for being uninjured all game; it is very clear it is a Perk designed to make the game more challenging for those who don’t feel they need the extra hit they get from being uninjured. I’m at least 10,000% certain that the devs intentionally designed the Perk so that the permanent dying state recovery did not consistently come into play so that you don’t get such powerful compensation for knowingly turning on hard mode; if I am correct, the devs have specifically stated that it is in fact a challenge Perk.
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@HURRI_KAIN Agreed. No mither needs some love for sure
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They also need to at least give a blood point bonus for completing a hard mode, maybe in survival category. :)
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Because there are 3-4 perks that only work when you are injured and No Mither gives you injured status from game start. No Mither on its own isn't really that great, but when combined with other injury reliant perks it is great. It also has the added benefit of being able to pick yourself up off the ground as much as you want should someone be doing no hook challenges.
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No Mither with a bunch of injury Perks is not great; it's meh. This Is Not Happening is useless if you already know how to hit Great Skill Checks, Resilience is only useful for vaulting faster thanks to terrible hit connections, Dead Hard is pointless because if you have NM, a decent Killer will see it coming from miles away, and Iron Will... well, the point of the OP was that IW with NM shouldn't be near-mandatory, so yeah.
I've never heard of anyone doing no-hook challenges; it sounds like you're begging to lose that game.
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Look them up, they get done all the time. It is just slugging for the entire game. You lose chunks of bleed out each time you recover. So they just keep downing everyone till they die on the ground.
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Even if a Killer would try that preposterous strategy, No Mither only lets you pick yourself up a total of 7 times before you bleed out anyway unless you had Unbreakable, in which case you'd get picked up 9 times. And even then, simply picking yourself doesn't doesn't bring the entire strategy to a screeching halt, especially if the Killer is running Perks like Deerstalker, TTS, Knock Out, or so on and so forth.
And, of course, when all else fails, one can always refer to the meme I previously posted in this thread regarding No Mither as an anti-slug Perk.
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Except staying uninjured throughout the entire trial is not a reasonable expectation. Sure it happens every now and then when you get lucky or if the killer is not very good, but this is far from the typical situation.
We know that No Mither was designed as a challenge perk from the dev's own words, but like you said it's badly designed. There are just too many drawbacks - the main one (being one hit) is also such a big one that it outweighs anything good that comes out of it.
I would like to have a perk like "Blood is Thicker than Water" or something that prevents you from leaving blood pools, because frankly it's something I've always wanted. The only way I can get it is to play No Mither, which is sad.
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Actually Legion counters No Mither by not going into Frenzy and hitting you normally.
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That sounds way too OP, but if No MIther did exactly that I would take it in a heartbeat to every match.
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It actually isn't, Dead Hard? Why waste two perk slots to get what you have by default (2 hits to down) and make it a not-sure skill check that requires timing and mind games to boot?
Resilience? Resilience is nice but you are giving up 3 hits for a 9% speed improvement.
This is Not Happening? No, just no. Piece of crap perk.
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“Except staying uninjured throughout the entire trial is not a reasonable expectation.”
Healing? Stealth? Sprint Burst? You have tools at your disposal to keep yourself uninjured. Besides, which do you think is stronger: Being immune to Bloodhound on a one-hit down, or not being immune to Bloodhound after being hit, but still nonetheless having a second chance after first getting hit and losing that immunity?
”There are just too many drawbacks - the main one (being one hit) is also such a big one that it outweighs anything good that comes out of it.”
It’s almost like the intended purpose of the Perk is specifically to make the game harder for people who want a more challenging experience and an extra reward is intentionally out of the equation as it is not deserved.
“Actually Legion counters No Mither by not going into Frenzy and hitting you normally.“
That’s hardly a counter when Legion literally has to do that anyway. That’s like saying No Mither counters Myers by making you Exposed all the time.
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Not sure why you're so angry bro!
I agree with you on most points.
It seems like you just want to nitpick anything people say in this thread just to be disagreeable.
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I’m sick of people trying to cherry-pick the benefits you get from running No Mither that are miniscule half the time and a complete placebo the other half, and just generally saying that it’s designed to be anything other than a hardmode Perk.
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