SWF needs to be nerfed
It’s not fair when a lv5 killer play with four red rank survivor. And it’s so frustrating that these four survivor share information all the time making the game so hard for killer.
I would like like to reject all games later, and I believe the rank should be adjusted when survivor is playing with friends, according to how many people are with each other. This kind of adjustment in matching is basically everywhere in other PVP games, like Dota LOL CSGO. I didn’t see such in the game at all
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I feel you, the matchmaking recently has been quite tough on killers :( hopefully it will improve
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Survive with Friends is never going away. That's the truth. Its a necessary evil.
This game desperately need some sort of lobby indicator of who's part of a SWF (and who's with who) and then add incentive for killers and solo survivors for playing with SWFs.
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Quietly waits for Paladin_Goo to show up
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Please vote me up to make this post seen by DYD team
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Something as simple as bonus BP for killers who vs SWF or making their gens take 25% longer for each SWF would be a good fix IMHO
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@johnmwarner A game should NEVER punish players for wanting to play together. Incentive for wanting to play with/against SWFs are the way to go.
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I felt the collaboration among them, cause they were doing soooooo well as a team. Also, four MoM make u frustrated further so I have to carry a green mori to make the game a little more fair.
My suggestion is simple, ur lvl in this match is higher than actual by X, where X is ur team size. This solution is simple, but effective
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no.
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@claudemonet Fortunately they change MoM. But I think swf is not that big a deal. Just don't expect a 4k and you will be fine. I like the idea of rewarding killers with extra bp though.
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The others big problem is SWF groups that’s level down to the killer. So rank 13 killer against a 14, 12, 4 and 3 survivors if he tries to catch then he’s getting looped forever
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Good point, the penalty may be wrong but he bonus BP would be good solution. Or getting your addon back maybe?
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If you play good, keep nice pressure on map and mindgame ppl in your favor - SWF can't do more than any good solo survivors. Just build more skill and see such games as good training for perception of game flow and optimizing your chases and map rotation.
TL/DR: Stop whining and rise skill.
P.S. Skilled red ranks solo survivors dont need to be SWF to make 4 escaped against literally any red ranked Killer, apart from Nurse.
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It’s not about how skillful, it’s about information gathering. SWF can be much more responsive to ur action as a whole.
i am not talking the chasing strategy here. The core of this game is information gathering, and for killer it’s not fair that every action u take would be broadcasted to all survivors
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And for ur argument, killer is the god if it is playing good. There is some limitations even on nurse and billy, and u can’t control every aspects of the game, most of the time u need to make tradeoff. SWF make the trade off completely no gain for killer
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So what? Like if it is something new to acknowledge, SWF was in game for ages and that is obvious that SWF will share info.
What kind of information can they share?
Totem placement? Dont run Ruin and learn how to apply pressure without it, replace with other perks like PGTW, Thanatophobia, Sloppy, Discordance.
Your location? But even as solo survivor you can pretty much predict Killer location in 90% of time.
Certain perks you run? But that knowledge do not help them. Like if they know that you run Sloppy after first injure - will it help them? No.
Run more informational perks - Surveillance, Discordance, Whispers. Check hook site more throughly since SWF tend to be over altruistic. Capitalize on that.
If they try to gen rush during chases - informational perks should help you to acknowledge it and act accordingly.
I've played against a lot of SWFs, certain amount of them had 1-2 streamers in SWF and I was always taking my time after game, no matter of win or loss, to check their channel and watch game from their PoV, and learn what kind of communication do they provide to each other.
Believe me - there is NOTHING special in there to be able to RUIN your game as Killer. Several times SWF can't even explain WHERE exactly totem or where they are slugged with Knock Out. "I'm on the side of main building which look at the jungle gym with pallet and here is a big rock" And two other guys looking for him on opposite side, cause there is rock and jungle gym too.
Ofc, if you're camper and they say - he's camping, do gens, and you lose game with 1 kill at most, it is very "viable" information, but maybe start to apply pressure and stop camp?
TL/DR: Information that SWF can provide is literally couple of things: location of something and if Killer is camping. All other info do not affect Killer.
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To be fair, if you’re a level five killer you will struggle anyway more than likely.
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They wont do nothing to swf many ppl want something to disable swf and that will make even worse the game no matter what the only solution its simple put 2 thing in this game
1.-make kindred as basekit
2.-make 2nd objective for survivor to fix gen rush and make the game fun for both sides
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Buff solo survivor and buff every killer thereafter. There is no way to remove swf unfortunately.
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You won't have anyone to kill. I'm not playing a multiplayer game that penalizes me for playing with friends. Enjoy the long lobby times.
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I like how ppl downvoting my posts without argumentation even. Can you name me information which SWF tell to each other that is so crucial that it is even gamebreaking for Killer?
P.S. Yet another downvote even on this post :D Well, you can't ask too much from kids when analytical thinking involved :D
Post edited by Frozenscum on2 -
I don't agree with nerfing SWF. We need to buff certain killers to be able to stand a chance against them.
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You won't be missed. DBD has 20k daily players.
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*analytical
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You can't extrapolate? Not surprised. You can't even get your PC to hold a proper host connection.
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Honestly it would be a lot healthier for the game if we could be in control of our experience. Having a ranked and casual queue with the ranked being a solo experience for all players and the casual being SWF friendly that would give people who do play solo a nice bonus% of BP whether survivor or killer so there's incentive to hop in casual.
If there's good enough bonuses people won't care about playing with SWF so the whole player base can benefit from casual play.
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That was very, very needed answer to my question. Pointing to my typo, anything else to add?
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Right because a SWF would make you guys play? You guys DC on the first THOUGHT a survivor team being SWF. Just admit you want GG EZ 4K's.
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The smartest, most in depth description of SWF I've seen. As a surv main, it's nice to show 2 IQ killer mains that SWF is not OP. I'm literally on comms with my friends and I'm like "I found a totem but he's on me, it's in the killer shack!" Then my friends go and cleanse it and it's Haunted Grounds xD Playing SWF doesn't give an advantage, it just makes the game more fun and less repetitive. If it's removed from the game, or some sort of penalty comes from playing it, this game will die faster than I do on the hook.
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SWF isn't going anywhere. In fact squads of 4 aren't even that common according to dev data. I would like to see an icon in lobby that says who is in swf and who isn't though. I think that alone could make a world of difference. If you don't want to deal with SWF you should be able to dodge.
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Hiho. This is my first post.
I'm pretty new to this game. I managed to reach rank 10 as a killer and rank 8 as a surv... I didn't play even 150 hours yet.
So I really like playing killer. Mostly myers because I love his style. So up to the point I'm reaching rank 11, I've seen that facing swf is pure cancer. Especially with chase based killers. I know I have a bad start with Mikey. If I don't manage to pull someone from a Gen or sth, the game starts for me when 2 gens are done...
When I'm facing a good swf this is getting so much harder... I literally get bullied (I thought this is a horror game, should people not be scared when they face me)
Anyway. I'm facing loop for loop for loop. While others can do gens. When I go away I really see that the others are warned. I play with m&a and a rabbit, but that's nothing worth when the other players simply tell them where I am...
It's actually pretty rare, that I stomp an swf, as long as they are not dump...
It feels like it's the combination of all this things. Really many loops and a lot of provided information feels a little unfair. Especially when I'm comparing this with games against non swf.
The last game I won against an swf was me slugging down 4 people and depipping (how is that possible).
The final thing. After the game when I see ranks... Just had an swf against 2 rank4 in my lobby.... This is just ridiculous...
Sorry for the wall of text. Have nice games guys!
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Solo survivors waste a lot of time crossing the map for rescues when someone else is already doing the rescue. They can also let people hit struggle or die because they are relying on others to do a rescue.
SWFs can play optimally by announcing whether they are attempting the rescue or not.
@Tru3Lemon - Yes Kinded as base would help reduce the gap between SWF and solos. I'd love to see that happen
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You are incredibly biased and it is obvious in this post. Let's start from the top since you want "argumentation."
Totem Placement: Actually, yes. Totem placements can be huge. And not just Ruin. Lullaby, Devour Hope, Noed etc. Regardless if YOU think these perks are good or not, if a Killer chooses to use them then he is doing so because he/she likes them or uses that play style. But because of SWF, the first person to run past it either cleanses it, or tells their teammates where it is. In solo, you have no way of telling anyone where a totem is, and depending on what it is will usually last awhile. At least enough to make a difference. But because you have information in SWF you would not have, it is unfair.
Location: 90% of the time? You might have a general idea of where the killer is, but that is only part of it. What is the killer doing? Is he chasing someone? Is he kicking a gen? Is he patrolling a gen? Is it a Hag or Trapper setting traps? Is it a Michael Stalking you? Is it a Huntress winding up a hatching aiming it your way? All this information is given to you by whoever can see the Killer directly. "He is heading your way." "He is in the basement, keep working on your gen." "I am looping him, go pick Feng up." If you do not see the insane advantages in just this point then you need to reevaluate your view.
Perks: Again, you are not thinking objectively. What if you have a key and he has Franklin's? Sloppy Butcher and Hex: 3rd Seal are annoying perks and i'd rather avoid getting hit if I can, so if I know they have it then again it's nice information that SWF provides. Overcharge is another one that makes a huge difference if you know it is coming. And going back to point number one, Ruin and Lullaby get identified the first 5 seconds someone is on a gen and now everyone knows that normal they would not.
I am at work and do not feel like typing an essay, but the advantages are endless. And it is not even about SWF. I love SWF. I play with my best friend and girlfriend all the time and we have a blast. But as someone who tries and thinks objectively, you can't sit there and deny the benefits SWF has over Solo survs. And that was the way this game was designed, was for Solo play.
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To be honest I think solo players should be buffed to be on par with SWF, then killers can be buffed vs a stable stream line. SWF isn't so much the issue but a symptom of trying to balance one side vs two very drastically different type of player... the SWF vs the Solo. If we could create a baseline of mechanical ability for all survivors, we could then more easily place killers where they need to be. A place where they neither totally wreck solo groups or get totally wrecked by SWF.
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I have said this before but I believe the issue is that solo queue is so goddamn awful that SWF seems that much more superior in comparison. Solo queue in DbD might be the worst thing that I have ever experienced in any video game ever. Unsafe unhooks, no Borrowed Time, people running around like chickens with their heads cut off if they even SMELL Ruin or Lullaby.
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Just give the killers the option to filter out SWF teams. Problem solved. It might also help curb the "three survivor" lobby problem. Who knows?
Though as I read through the thread, I see survivor mains asking what kind of information is being shared that would make SWF overpowered. The answer is having a constant survailance of the killer.
Where is the killer going?
How is he patroling?
Is the killer Trapper or Hag? Well, they'll have knowledge of all but maybe one or two of your set traps.
Early warning signs of perks given away by the killer's behavior and being able to coordinate their gen rush around all of this info. BBQ, Rancor, and Iron Maiden come off the top of my head. And some perks like Knock Out become completely useless.
Alot of SWF teams are trash at the game and often the only info they will share is, "The killer is on me. Do gens." But there is so much that even a two man team can do to a killer to make their life hell. Especially if it's a Leatherface on a larger map that guy doesn't stand a chance in hell against survivors with triple digit IQ's. (But let's all cry when we see nothing but Nurse, right?)
It's easy to say that SWF doesn't have any sort of advantage when over half the survivors playing the game are almost literal #########. Watching streamers mow through these teams in record time as they attempt to bully the killer by acting stupid isn't an accurate representation of what a 4 SWF team can really do.
Post edited by Powa_Gaysah on0 -
Yes, I'm incredibly biased on that matter, and I'm Killer main with 800 hours as Killer and maaaybe around 50-70 hours as Survivor, and mostly Solo one.
Check this my post in other thread, where I made my points pretty clear. https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/534835#Comment_534835
You made so much strange examples about information.
Totems: any Survivor who is not potato and has a bit of experience knows all totem placements on maps. If it is Ruin - it will be destroyed fast or after first wave of gens done (which is depends on rank, purple and red will work through and destroy after), other ones will be destroyed once any of Survs will run by and check spawn points. If you dont run totem protection build with ToTH and proper Killer - you can say goodbye to totems.
Who will ever tell you that Huntress winding up hatchet towards someone in the middle of nowhere? Really?
You can read link above about information Solo survivor has without any comms.
If you loop Killer while he has slug nearby and he does not break chase after 20 seconds to go for pick up - you dont need SWF to help slug, Killer is either potato with tunnel vision or has no intention to pick slug up. As Solo if I see downed guy close to me and no pick up right after - I go to check if I can get slug, cause Killer is chasing someone else 100%.
I can guess Killer's perks in 100% of matches as Solo, I'm always assume from start of match that Killer has BBQ and it is pretty easy to confirm/disprove assumption in first half of match.
I saw ######### loads of SWF running around like beheaded chickens doing random crap, so it is about individual skills. Once you have 4 good players against you - they dont need comms even, cause they know what and how to do.
You know if it is Ruin or Lullaby in first 20 seconds anyway, if you are doing gens as any normal survivor should do at start of match, you dont need SWF for that.
I dont need SWF to warn me about Overcharge, even such potato as I am can hit it 90% of time even against Doctor in Madness T2. Also, I can probably be mistaken, but I'm almost sure, that gen kicked with Overcharge has different sparks animation, it has those little lightnings in the middle of chassic which are not there if gen is kicked as usual. So you can even see if it is Overcharge, and you dont need SWF for that.
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First of all, there has to be matchmaking, that actually works, and not letting red ranks with one yellow go against a yellow ranked Killer. This is what I face lately besides swf.
Normally the average rank gets matched, but for swf this should be higher. This is to prevent the seal clubbing.
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This is pretty accurate. The best part of Dead by Daylight (at least in my opinion and I'm sure at least a few others) is being able to group up with 1-3 other friends and have fun messing around in matches. Playing with friends makes the whole experience more enjoyable and less repetitive like you said.
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