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Thoughts on yesterday's Dev stream?
I remember when I first played this game. The fun was running away, hiding and having that intense nervousness as the heartbeat grew louder and the killer could be right around the corner about to find you. I still LOVE that.
I don't find the action/chases fun, nor being able to read auras. Killers get swamped and bullied by survivors, and it's chaos. No tension.
This isn't an angry post, it's their game and they can do what they want to it (and it seems from Horvath that a lot of people do enjoy the action/running style gameplay). I'm just so disappointed that the scary, tense, tactical game I used to love is slowly turning into an all out aura reading, running around, guns blazing action fest.
Comments
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I understand their viewpoint and it's true that they are starting to take a better look at the game. It would be great if Queen could get Rank 1 on killer every season, as well as being a survivor on rank 1, it would really help with balancing the game on many aspects.
Queen was Rank 10 on last season, that would never help with balancing of the game, only Rank 1 matters
same with the Devs, they really need to start playing and get to rank 1 on every season, that's the only way they can ever fix this game
Judging from all previous matches against players, the dev's beside Queen are all poor players near Rank 15s which is Sad
Post edited by Someissues on3 -
Play as a P3 Claudette with Urban evasion, iron will and the new calm spirit. There is your stealth5
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I can see it both ways, I love stealth and when I play if I don't even see the Killer I consider it a good round. (As if IRL, not seeing the Killer would be the perfect round). But the game is moving towards making us get ever closer to danger to get points. I would love it if a super stealthy round gained as much points as those guys that can run circles and juke like crazy.
But if that was the case, then it would be conceivable that you could have entire rounds where all four are super stealthy and the Killer finds no one, making it the most boring of rounds. Which would lead to Killers asking for a buff or a nerf because its boring to look around a map for 10-20 mins and then watch the survivors at the exit gates.
Its a tough job balancing this game for sure.
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Stealth is already possible with Spine Chill, it's still one of my favourite perks, people just don't take it since they rush gens nowadays
even if killers can see aura, u don't have to work on a gen nonstop, just hide for a few sec knowing he will come for u, it's that easy
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Stealth went out the window a long time ago.
Flashlights are increasingly being used to torment and annoy the killer rather save people. Killers are introduced, e.g. Doc, that make stealth nearly useless. Perks that nullify stealth are introduced.
They want the survs out in the open and running the killer in circles.
I am not that good at juking the killer out in the open such as coldwind farm. Others can dance around the killer and lose him right after getting hit. I have had survs literally disappear right after i hit them. No they are not crouching either in front of me or behind me. They do a turn and lose me in 1 second flat. Kudos to them. I cant do that to save my life.
Point is that stealth is nearly useless and i am starting to think that being stealthy and taking too much time doing stuff and getting to stuff that needs to be done is getting me killed. At the same time when i am doing gens and see others juking the killer i dont mind since i rock at doing gens - almost never miss a skill check no matter what is thrown at me. I am a gen god.
The in-ability to lose the killer and nearly always dying as solo que made me play killer where i got more points and it was far less stressful. Yes, i find surv too stressful. I am in the minority, i know. But playing killer does not stress me out too much. Running in circles gets to me sometimes.
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Unfortunately the game is not about stealth. You just need to look at the most used perks, they are not stealthy at all, and the killer perks counter stealth gameplay. Some maps are not even dark enough to hide properly. And of course you have a lot of other elements that lead to that "non stealth" gameplay.
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@Broccoli_Jaeger said:
Play as a P3 Claudette with Urban evasion, iron will and the new calm spirit. There is your stealthThere will be no more stealth with all the new perks for killers to see auras, survivors will be shown to killers from the start till the last 1 is killed, every time.
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I heard from a friend of mine that the devs told off and scolded survivor mains.
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It was heartening to hear they were sticking to their guns on a lot of changes, and offering tips to counter some of the more popular killer perks.
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I'll just say what I said in the last thread about it:
@Easylife said:
I loved how Stefan had the BALLS to stand up and justify all the PTB changes to all the whiners in chat and reinforce why they are needed and why they are going through next patch.
It would of been a lot easier to give in to survivor pressure (like they did with Freddy) and revert or put off the changes.The fact that he did that and then went on to explain the reasoning why BBQ won't see any future changes anytime soon really reinforced my faith in him and his team that this game can and will see good well thought out and much NEEDED balance changes in patches to come such as the ability to close the hatch and DS not causing you to drop survivors anymore.
Who knows, one day Hex totems might get some love at this rate, very impressed!
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First off, I do enjoy playing stealthy. Only perk I use for stealth is urban evasion and I manage to outstealth bbq and other perks often enough. Not always.
As for the future of the game, I see the reasons why they're moving more towards action. Stealth prolongs the game at no real risk and thus doesn't truly offer the appropriate award. While Sure, you're not hiding in a closet, but hiding the whole time and never engaging isn't really playing the game unless it's a true Hide and Seek game, which I don't think dbd is.
That said, stealth is atm and in the future, a skillful approach that won't work all the time but can work some of the times and that's a good thing. I think the Devs are making the right decisions moving to quicker gameplay.0 -
I was more mad about Queen saying that they support camping as a killer mechanic, they need to fix that because camping is unfun for both killers and survivors. Survivors can't save their team mates and get bloodpoints and altruism and they can't get healing points, and killers just sit there by the hook not chasing and watching the gen counter go down. It can literally shut the game down and stop any action besides endgame shenanigans because survivors and killers need to pip somehow.
I'm not lying, I've been matched up with camping Leatherfaces my past 5 games and it's non interactive to say the least.I just sit there do gens, open gates, break totems and try to bait a chase by the exit and leave.
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@akbays35 said:
I was more mad about Queen saying that they support camping as a killer mechanic, they need to fix that because camping is unfun for both killers and survivors. Survivors can't save their team mates and get bloodpoints and altruism and they can't get healing points, and killers just sit there by the hook not chasing and watching the gen counter go down. It can literally shut the game down and stop any action besides endgame shenanigans because survivors and killers need to pip somehow.I'm not lying, I've been matched up with camping Leatherfaces my past 5 games and it's non interactive to say the least.I just sit there do gens, open gates, break totems and try to bait a chase by the exit and leave.
Ive created a thread about looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
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I still don’t see the issue with campingakbays35 said:I was more mad about Queen saying that they support camping as a killer mechanic, they need to fix that because camping is unfun for both killers and survivors. Survivors can't save their team mates and get bloodpoints and altruism and they can't get healing points, and killers just sit there by the hook not chasing and watching the gen counter go down. It can literally shut the game down and stop any action besides endgame shenanigans because survivors and killers need to pip somehow.
I'm not lying, I've been matched up with camping Leatherfaces my past 5 games and it's non interactive to say the least.I just sit there do gens, open gates, break totems and try to bait a chase by the exit and leave.
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@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.0 -
@akbays35 said:
@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.Bloodlust was the worst thing they created. It was supposed to help against the horrible map design, but fact is that you sometimes lose your chase even though you directly look at the survivor, RIP bloodlust. Then even with bloodlust 3 there are spots where you cant get the survivor (2 jungle gyms next to each other for example. You need to break those pallets.
Maps need a general rework, but devs are too lazy and try to hide the issues by adding other "features"
Devs tried to introduce punishment for camping, but it got abused by survivors, either you give incentive to leave the hook or we will stay at the current situation. However when you suggest incentives liek that (truetalen fresh hook idea e.g.), survivors go into ragemode^^ (BBQ OP etc)
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Camping isn’t broken. It’s a strategy. Also they already tried the reduced hook progress thingakbays35 said:@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.0 -
@ThePloopz said:
akbays35 said:@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.
Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.
Camping isn’t broken. It’s a strategy. Also they already tried the reduced hook progress thing
Camping is a strategy like looping
Both strategies shouldnt be in the game if we are honest0 -
@Manta said:
I love this game so freaking much, but when Horvath and Queen confirmed that stealth is not the direction they want the game to go, my heart totally sank.I remember when I first played this game. The fun was running away, hiding and having that intense nervousness as the heartbeat grew louder and the killer could be right around the corner about to find you. I still LOVE that.
I don't find the action/chases fun, nor being able to read auras. Killers get swamped and bullied by survivors, and it's chaos. No tension.This isn't an angry post, it's their game and they can do what they want to it (and it seems from Horvath that a lot of people do enjoy the action/running style gameplay). I'm just so disappointed that the scary, tense, tactical game I used to love is slowly turning into an all out aura reading, running around, guns blazing action fest.
I agree that stealth shouldn't be the focus. It would be boring for a Killer to play a match where he doesn't find anyone. I play a ton of solo survivor and most of my matches end with me never being found. While fun to have close encounters it can also be boring. What I believe we need is a way to make chases more about jukes/mind-games rather than loops/DS. Its fun for the killer to find someone to chase and catch and its fun as survivor to lose a killer during a chase. If they can find a healthy balance I believe that's the way to go. Kate's "Dance with me" perk is a nice step in that direction but I often find it activates on a window or pallet that at that time makes it meaningless. It would be cool if it was on a activation button instead. That being said we still have a long way to go with were perks are to make anything balanced on that scale.
Summary- Total stealth makes boring Killer games, aura reading makes boring survivor games, mindgames/jukes make for fun plays on both sides.
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I think camping definitely has it’s place in the game like in those situations where the survivors powered the gates and you put someone on the hook. I’m sure you’ve personally experienced games where that’ll happen and instead of you just getting that one kill you end up with 2 or 3 because the survivors just had to save that person. Then there’s the over altruistic survivors where camping is really effective against themMaster said:@ThePloopz said:
akbays35 said:@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.
Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.
Camping isn’t broken. It’s a strategy. Also they already tried the reduced hook progress thing
Camping is a strategy like looping
Both strategies shouldnt be in the game if we are honest0 -
As a killer main I'd much rathe be chasing then looking.
It would be better if survivors had an easier time losing killers though.
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Uhmm pretty sure they want a well rounded game for all ranks, not just rank 1. Also they said that stealth is still is viable. You just have to put my thought into it. Besides if everyone keeps playing the same style over an over. The game would become stale.1
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@akbays35 said:
@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.These might just be some of the worst suggestions I have ever seen on this forum.
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@akbays35 said:
@Master said:
looping not to long ago.
I asked for advice what to do against loopers after I have been looped for 5 gens and the advice was "play nurse" or "chase another one"
IF this is what the game comes down, yeah camping will become more and more common, the more survivors get better at looping.Either that or nurse, but Im not sure whether that is so much fun either
2 things can fix looping, faster bloodlust on turning actions, bloodlust triggering after stomping a pallet.
2 things can fix camping too, reduced hook progress when the killer is near the hook, killers get bloodlust after hooking a survivor.Just make the killer hitbox smaller. You’re clearly over zealous and COMPLETELY IGNORED this would kill the already NEAR NOTHING CHANCE of escaping a chase by actually shaking the killer.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
It was heartening to hear they were sticking to their guns on a lot of changes, and offering tips to counter some of the more popular killer perks.Yes, I definitly remember them saying sole survivor counters BBQ, when both versions HAVE ZERO EFFECT! top notch counters am I right? Really a good message to players who don’t know the devs were completely wrong.
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They said that stealth still has a place in the game and I still do it alongside a very good friend of mine.
Even against Doctors, which people complain that stealth is impossible against him. To that, I say git gud.
Anyways, I love the fact that they're defending their choices instead of catering into Survivors as they've been doing for 2 years. Feels real good.
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@Doom_Punk said:
They said that stealth still has a place in the game and I still do it alongside a very good friend of mine.Even against Doctors, which people complain that stealth is impossible against him. To that, I say git gud.
Anyways, I love the fact that they're defending their choices instead of catering into Survivors as they've been doing for 2 years. Feels real good.
The calm spirit re-work will help with Doc Stealth
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@whyareyoutunnelingme said:
@Doom_Punk said:
They said that stealth still has a place in the game and I still do it alongside a very good friend of mine.Even against Doctors, which people complain that stealth is impossible against him. To that, I say git gud.
Anyways, I love the fact that they're defending their choices instead of catering into Survivors as they've been doing for 2 years. Feels real good.
The calm spirit re-work will help with Doc Stealth
Yeah, hopefully some people break away from meta and try new things, I loved the rework of Calm in the PTB.
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