So, about SWF. [SUGGESTION]

JAWS_BDSM
JAWS_BDSM Member Posts: 328
edited July 2019 in General Discussions

Currently game is mainly balanced around solo players and decreasing their gap between SWF. So i suggest to completely remove solo queueing and allow survivors to form full SWF group before starting searching for killer`s lobby.

How do I see this change: Survivors can search for incomplete SWF group or create their own. They can choose whether it is public or private, so they can invite their friends if they want to. If they don`t have friends, they can create public lobby to start waiting for another survivors. When 3 other survivors join, they can finally start searching killers' lobby. They have access to voice chat, so 3rd party programmes will no longer be someone's privilege. You can search for SWF groups within a region of your choice. You can mute players if they are too annoying.

You may ask me know: "Hey, JawsBDSM, your suggestion is completely against lore, logic and killers themselves" But wait to roast me, let me explain how it can be implemented in the game.

Firstly, lore is flexible. It allows survivors dress like clowns and killers to be clowns. Even though it was told, that The Entity made survivors voiceless, so they have to use emotes to communicate, Ash Williams is able to speak somehow. So why others cannot?

Secondly, my suggestion can sound too radical and uncompromising, but it will only make the game better and even more balanced. Here are the reasons:

  1. It will allows devs to concentrate on balancing only SWF, without having to waste resources on solo players.
  2. It will partly (not completely, because human factor) eliminate the problem of survivors "not playing in team", because now they can better communicate with each other and coordinate their moves.
  3. It will become a good basis for future changes, that I`m now going to explain.

So, let me show you are few changes, to make new SWFs more balanced. Because now survivors can cooperate even better I think that a few things must be changed.

  1. Distribution of roles. Earlier, survivors could take same perks and this could be a bit frustrating experience to killers. I suggest that every perk in the game cannot be taken by more than one survivors. So there cannot be any copies of any perk. That is why survivors will be forced to distribute roles among themselves and plan their tactics more carefully. One will have to distract killer, others will focus on healing, repairing, rescuing or sabotaging. Same works for items and offerings.
  2. Hexes. As now survivors can cooperate to find totems more effectively, all hex totems lit after 60 seconds from the beginning of the trial OR when they first come into effect. (for example Huntress`s lullaby will lit only after 1 hook and Devour hope will lit only after 2 tokens are gained). This will not affect NOED, it remains the same.
  3. Generators. For same reasons, generators take 40 seconds longer to repair. This penalty decreases by 10 seconds for each generator done, so last gen will take 40 seconds less. To compensate this change, survivors will have secondary objective to help them do gens quicker. All across the map, there are 5 hidden stashes with special item "lubricated part". It works same as Brand new part: skillcheck game. Installing this part in 2 seconds will add 20% to repairing progress. So they are more effective at the beginning of the game. Killers do not see auras of stashes, although they can find them and trap, if their power allows them to do that.
  4. Object of obsession. I put this perk in separate paragraph, because of it being extremely OP when used in parties with communication. Because of this, its bonuses are changed: A supernatural bond links you to the killer. If you are looking in the killer`s direction, your link will reveal your aura to the killer. This effect works only outside 24 meter range from the killer. As the killer's obsession you go through 3/4/5 different phases on the hook. Only last one includes struggling. Each phase lasts 40 seconds. You can attempt to escape in first 2/3/4 phases. Otherwise each phase lasts 30 seconds. Increases your chances of becoming killer's obsession. This perk can still be useful now, as it gives you WAY more chances to fail and be hooked (you can be hooked up to 5 times, and you die only on 6th hook).
  5. Some killers` powers. I will not be touching nurse, spirit or hillbilly, though, because I don't think I can change them without making them crippled legion's relatives. However, some killers need to be changes.
  • The Trapper. He now carries all his traps with him, and "bag" type of addons increase the amount of traps he can carry by 2/3/4. Survivors who try to disarm the trap will face tremendously difficult skillcheck. If they fail it, they will be injured or put into the dying state, if they were injured before. The trap will be disarmed.
  • The Wraith. Is now fully invisible while in spirit world even when walking. His sounds like footsteps or grunting are completely silenced.
  • The Shape. Stalking multiple survivors will build EW faster (I don`t know if it worked like that before, so I'll ad this just in case). One survivor is always chosen as obsession. He can kill this survivor with EW tier 3, IF all other survivors are dead (can be altered with hair bow, lock of hair, fragrant tuft of hair addons: 2/1/0 dead survivors required).
  • The Doctor. Madness Tier 3 blocks survivor's ability to use voice chat (we`ll hope everyone is too lazy to use 3rd party programmes now and plays fair. When Tier 3 madness survivor tries to use voice chat, other hear sound interference, instead of this player's voice). Survivors hit by shock therapy are affected by its debuff (which blocks their interaction with pallets and windows) 0.3 seconds longer for each madness tier (tier 1: 2.7 seconds, tier 2: 3 seconds, tier 3: 3.3 seconds). Moldy electrode is base kit.
  • The Cannibal. Gains secondary ability. Use secondary power button to completely suppress your terror radius and red stain. Lasts for 20 seconds and has a cooldown of 40 seconds. (You still can be heard, but you will be able to ambush survivors with your ability. in texas chainsaw massacre bubba ambushed his victims despite him being fat and noisy, so why not xD). Chainsaw slowdown now applies only when you use it while in your ability. You regain your terror radius after you: get stunned/use your power/main attack.
  • The Pig. RBTs don`t require generator to be done to be activated. Survivors will face 2 moderately difficult skillchecks while searching for the key. Each failed skillcheck decreases time left before RBT explodes by 10 seconds (can be increased by 5/10 seconds using workshop grease or interlocking razor addons). Survivors will face 2 skillchecks in every box. They will not face the same skillcheck twice (so if survivor failed one skillcheck, he will not have to go through it once again).After all gens are done and EGC has begun, RTB pause EGC timer until removed. Rules set No. 2 is changed: Not all games have the same rules. If survivor has removed his RBT on the first try, decrease death timer by 60 seconds on next RBT put on him. Crate of gears is changed: Considerably increases time it takes survivor to search a Jigsaw bos. Moderately decrease time it takes to put the RBT on survivor. Survivor will face only 1 skillcheck while searching a Jigsaw box. Amanda's secret is changed: Decreases the amount of RBT carried by 4. Your ambush attacks deal double damage. Amanda's letter is changed: Successful ambush attack allows to put RBT on survivor without putting him in dying stage (so you land an ambush attack and RBT is already on survivor). Put RBT is already active.
  • The Clown. Stays the same. I can`t imagine anything that would make him stronger in the face of 4 survivors who are able to communicate and coordinate themselves. Let's just say redhead's pinky finger is his basekit. (I'm opened to your suggestions).
  • The Plague: After survivor is broken with her power, the second, 60 seconds timer start. It doesn't go while in chase. If survivor fails to cleanse before it goes off, he will be put into dying stage and his aura will be highlighted for The Plague for 5 seconds.
  • The Legion. Nyo-HO-HO. I wrote another post about my view on the Legion. Basically: Kill with Friends. https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/72611/kill-with-friends-the-legion.
  • The Ghostface. While in Night Shroud can use secondary power button(default R) to teleport into any locker on the map. Use Stalk button to carefully peak from locker and stalk survivors. You can instantly leave locker pressing interactions button (default space) to instantly leave locker. You will make quiet sound while doing this. Take 3 seconds to complete. If you teleport into the locker, where survivor has hid, you will immediately grab him and leave locker. Has no cooldown. Crouch ability is binded to CTRL as default and can be changed in settings.

Well, I don`t think I have covered every aspect that should be changed to suit that change, so add your thought and suggestions. I know you can disagree with my view on game's balance and I understand it. As for Killers' changes, I tryied to make them feel better when facing coordinated groups of survivors. Some of this changes are extremely OP or not enough to help that certain killer to adapt to new circumstances. Feel free to critizise my suggestion, but please give any arguments. I hoped you enjoyed reading my post.

P.S. I will complement this post if I remember anything important.

P.P.S If it matter, I`m the Killer main. I rarely play survivors, but I have achieved Rank 1 for both sides at least once.

Comments

  • JAWS_BDSM
    JAWS_BDSM Member Posts: 328

    @Peanits what do you think? Would it change game for good or it will ruin it?

  • JAWS_BDSM
    JAWS_BDSM Member Posts: 328

    Raising

  • go1gotha
    go1gotha Member Posts: 108

    It is difficult to implement, too much work for them. + The solution in general and in details cannot be called ideal in order to start spending resources and forces on it. I don’t want to discuss this in more detail, so I just leave my short opinion.

  • Chickenchaser
    Chickenchaser Member Posts: 391

    You get an A for effort.

    None of that is going to happen. It's way too much change, and work.

    Getting rid of solo. Buffing killers for SWF. It's not practical.

    However some of your killer buff ideas should be seriously considered by the devs.

    Like pigs jigsaw traps starting immediately without a gen needing to be done, and the skill check ideas are gold. Pig should have that for sure.

    And Trapper having more traps with failed skill checks on the traps resulting in injury.

    But you made the other killers way too OP even for even the best SWF groups.

    This community will not except not being able to have the same perks judging from my short time spent reading stupid complaints over the most mundane of subjects. Like how OP NOED is, or how Freddy is OP, or calling for a nurse rework.

  • MrsPiggyIsSoSneaky
    MrsPiggyIsSoSneaky Member Posts: 571

    You do realize the reason why ash can talk is because when he or they are at the camp, which to the survivors, is their safehaven, because they're not in a trial, and the Killer is just lurking in the distance, watching them, watching whoever is going to be in their trial, once they go into a trial by The Entity, then they can't speak.


    Or we can go for a more simpler explanation and it's just for decorative reasons, and it doesn't necessarily affect the lore

  • twistedmonkey
    twistedmonkey Member Posts: 4,307
    edited July 2019

    Putting in voice chat imo would ruin it.

    Solo is the majority of the userbase and is also a choice as some like myself like the aspect of not knowing.

    As I have also stated in other posts not everyone speaks the same language in regions. I sometimes feel those that wish for this are either playing SWF or like in English speaking countries.

    Being from the UK my region was EU which makes up over 30 countries who are not native English speakers. I now reside in the US in NC and am matched with people from South America adding voice chat when the players don't speak the same language is completely pointless and the reason regions are larger is so finding games is quicker.

    There is also nothing to stop SWF muting anyone not in there party and just keep using the 3rd party software.

    Then there is the toxicity of this community where every action is subject to scrutuny and people get upset for anything someone does or how they play. This scenario has been complained about in many other games with voice chat and it has ruined many people's experience.

    The really good SWF players are not just good because of comms. They are good because they are actually a team who work and coordinate well together. This is why a group of really good solo players can still do better than a mediocre SWF group.

    Voice chat is not the answer as DBD is not a team game. As a solo player it is in reality everyman for themselves and the actions you do in game is for your own benefit and escape chances. While some like myself will try a save and dont mind giving my life up it's more of a personal challenge to get the save off where as SWF do it to to try and get a friend out.

    The rest well they seem more like fantasy land. The survivor not being able to use perks they earned is a really bad idea as again solo players with randoms will never agree who gersxwgat and why should they? Grinding for hours on end just to say you can't use the perks you gained?

    Your change to totems would actually be a nerf to them as any and all dull ones would be cleansed more often. Most hex perks are also easy to spot when killers get the first use from them.

    Adding gen time will make the game so monotonous and why people are asking for another objective instead. You want something so survivors have to move around the map increasing the game time more naturally instead of turning it more boring.

    Traps already make survivors injured and I don't agree with dying state as a skill check is nothing to players with over 20-50h it only hurts new players who killers don't really need buffs against. His kit needs improved but I'd say it should be more about the traps being present and he can pick them up from a distance for starters.

    Wraith I don't think should be completely invisible it makes it just like prayer beads atm and it comes down to luck of where he comes from.

    Myers he used to be able to stalk multiple survivors but they changed it as it was deemed too strong. Someone else came up with the idea of being able to stalk more on each survivor per hook maybe hooked survivors together can be multi stalked. I liked that idea as doing well gained him more power.

    The DOC'S change makes SWF stronger as they use out of game chat. Bad idea.

    The Pig's Rbt's are not designed to kill a lot it should be very rare so making them more likely to do so isn't a good idea imo. Her base kit needs buffed to help her ambush and chase potential. To make her RBT's too strong means if a second objective happens they would need to be nerfed.

    The plague idea removes choices forcing you to intentionally put anothers in danger at times. You can punish someone so harshly for a bad power design. The power is in the hands of survivirs which is the issue. She instead should be able to activate it every so often when survivors are infected the more infected at once the longer it lasts.

    Ghostface being able to teleport accross the map with no Cool down is too strong. I like the idea but a cool down would be needed. Him being able to stalk and Insta down after seeing someone with BBQ or any aura perk does seems quite OP so that may need to be looked at also.

    Post edited by twistedmonkey on
  • Carpemortum
    Carpemortum Member Posts: 4,506

    Holy ######### you're from NC too? Howre you enjoying this 100° swamp humidity lately. 😆😂

  • twistedmonkey
    twistedmonkey Member Posts: 4,307

    I am originally from Scotland so its a huge shock to the system 🤓. Just as well everywhere has AC or I would turn into a human puddle lol. Loving the beach life but a but paranoid of sharks still!

  • Carpemortum
    Carpemortum Member Posts: 4,506

    Haha I understand that. AC is magic. And yeah I can imagine the weather change difference Haha. It goes a week of 100 then like 65 and rain. When winter starts/ends is the worst. 4 weeks of snow/90° back and forth Haha.

  • JAWS_BDSM
    JAWS_BDSM Member Posts: 328

    If I am not mistaken, DBD lore states that Entity literally took away survivors` ability to talk.

    Killers, however, can talk, but they prefer to remain silent.

    Ash is something I still cannot understand. Either he is just to cool to follow godlike being`s orders or "devs forgot" or entity "forgot" (allowed them to speak).

    First things first, thank you for your detailed feedback and criticism, I appreciate it.

    1) As for communication problem, I totally agree with you. Honestly, I didn`t think over how exactly it should and will work. I supposed, ability to choose region to increase chances of finding people who speak your native language or at least language you can understand would be enough. It seems not. Language barrier in some regions is a nuisance. I have no idea how to fix this problem. Maybe text chat or more emotes can help it, but I'm not sure. Also, splitting players among different regions, so they can find teammates they can understand will work for games with significantly bigger online than in DBD, which has a peak of 40-50 thousand players (correct me if i'm wrong). DBD in its current phase cannot handle such changes, which is sad.

    2)Nothing can stop certain SWF's use voice chat, especially when it means they cannot give each other information in some cases (tier3 madness, one of members is dead, etc). People are like this and nothing can change this. I hoped that people would be just too lazy to use third party programmes when they meet each other for the first time.. No way track if someone uses 3rdparty, so yeah, it's pointless. I'm dreaming of perfect world.

    3)Toxicity. Can't deny this, it's how most people in dbd are. If they were given tools to spit acid in game, they would spit acid. Report and mute system can possibly change it, but we'll all end up muting each other and playing same solo game.

    4) As for me, I tend to think, that survivors should not play like they are all by themselves. They were meant to play in team and coordinate to overcome the killer, who is a solo player. 4 players against 1. Together they can overcome the killer and give at least half of their team chance to see another day. I'm trying to give that tool of communication to all players, so they can be a better team. Too bad we're not living in perfect world and this whole concept is ruined by toxic bastards, who would use voice for trashtalking, spamming and e.t.c. Soloing is great, but it is not great to balance (currently) the game for soloing, even though majority is soloing. Something is needed to be done with SWF and I present that scenario.

    5)Atmosphere would be ruined and that's sad. Although, I already think it was ruined years ago with fancy bright skins (good clothes for those who should be hiding from a murderer) and survivors' attitude to the killers (am I using the right word? not native speaker, sorry). I'm not even talking about graphic changes (i liked the graphic in 2016, really. it was much more spookier than today).

    6)Survivors should not be able to use same perks, because this makes killers' experience horrible. 4 adrenaline, 4 decisive strike, 4 no mither, oh wait, this makes survivors' experience horrible, buff this perk please. Something is needed to be done with that. The "lighter" version is that for every same perk taken in the group, this perk will become weaker (for example, if there's 1 SB in the group, it would give less exhaustion duration, than if there were 4 SB.).

    7)Killers. I've overdone with this here, yes. These changes were meant to increase killers' strength due to every survivor having communication. I'm not going to talk about every of them, because I totally agree with your thoughts. However, I would like to mention the Pig, because she needs love and buffs. As "Saw" fan I find it boring that survivors die because of RBT so rarely, so I tryied to compensate her recent nerf with that change. Skillchecks could be a little bit too much, but I still think that traps should be active without requiring gen to be done and while EGC is active, it is paused while RBT are on survivors. This is my opinion on the Pig and how she should be in the game. Amanda doesn't follow the rules, she cheats in the game and puts impossible rules. This change is also meant to work with my "everyone is swf" scenario, as if RBTs were active after a gen was done, there would be a strong possibility that the Pig would be extremely weak, because there are more chances survivors will not finish gens to extend the timer.

    P.S. Buff pig, reeee

  • Laakeri
    Laakeri Member Posts: 835

    I like your ideas, but lets face it devs will never do anything drastic to balance cheat with friends with rest of the game.

    Only reasonable thing I can imagine them ever implementing is simple indicator for killers that they are facing cheat with friends so they can prepare accordingly.