3+ years and the largest problem in the game still exists. Generators.
Now before everyone goes and comments "Why do people use the term gen rushing if its just the survivors doing the obective". My answer to that is we deem the term "gen rushing" for teams that play to win and by win we mean escape. Most people play to have fun and for me at least holding m1 on a couple gens then leaving really isn't fun, and for most people they can say the same which is why it probably hasn't been changed. But that does mean that we need a term for people who play to win, which is why people use the term gen rushing.
Now for my main point, 3 years and they haven't even touched the main objective of the game or at least not in a substantial way. They might have changed gens to be a little slower before the huntress was in the game but I can't remember. Anyway, 3 years and its still the same 5 gens that take 80 seconds to complete, with optimal survivor play you are out of the exits in less than 5 min, closer to 3 min. The fact that still exists is pretty sad, but the main issue I have with it is that the main objective isn't even that fun.
Maybe for a player's first 100 hours fixing generators is fun, but beyond that it is perhaps the most boring part of the game and its so core to the game's structure too. Why would you have the most boring task be the one that is required to escape?
Now on gen times they have made perks. 10 perks in total that directly effect generator times 11 if you count noed as a counter to them getting completed so quickly.
I think that directly slowing down gen times wouldn't solve the issue with the task still being the most boring part of the game. I don't know 1 person that would love to be the gen jocky and complete all 5 generators by themselves because they found it to be the most fun part of the game.
As far as how to fix this, there are literally hundreds of suggestions that the devs have gotten in the past of how to make generators a more engaging task. But none of them have ever been implemented. The closest we got were 2 events, the halloween one, and the new year event. Both had tasks that were not generators that you were encouraged to do, this did help with gen time, but not with the actual gens still being really boring, and probably only amplified the boring..ness to them.
However, my theory to why this will never get fixed and I can say with 100% certainty. BHVR will never change the way generators are fixed or how they work for 2 reasons.
- If enough people play the game and don't care, why would they fix it? Its basically just been a reality we have accepted, but gens don't have to be so boring if enough people cared enough to say something about it.
- Changing the way generators work, won't make them more money, and I really think this is the major reason they don't do anything. If it won't make them money, why do it in the first place. A sad reality when they said "this is as much your game as it is our game", but I guess that only applies when it can make them more money.
I could be wrong, but I am fairly confident that is why this problem has lasted this long. And since enough people tolerate gens just being really boring, there is no need to fix it, even if its a really big problem for the game's longevity. And for the basic casual player, it really doesn't matter. But if you think about the streamers that have to play this game to make a living and how boring it can be, it really goes to show why all of them either meme, have viewers play, do viewer builds, or are actually starting to leave. I know of 3 streamers that talk about this a lot, 2 of them did leave, but one had to stay because they make a living off of the game. Its sad really, but something that they have to accept since BHVR won't do anything for them.
I think their only hope is this new archive system, hopefully it adds a new spark to the game, but if it is just a list of goals, I think it will get stale pretty quick.
Comments
-
Though I understand your frustration and the intent behind your thoughts, I don't think the answer is making the gens slower.
For one, it adds to the very monotonous nature of survivors, as you pointed out, holding M1 gets boring so how will holding M1 longer help?
Secondly, survi al rates are already well below 50%. This would only exacerbate those numbers. Whether we like it or not, the goal is to kill and survive. Survivors want to survive and get that survival bp bonus.
Thirdly, I don't want easier 4k matches. As it is, getting a 3k or 4k is 90 percent of my matches. Longer gens is not going to make that harder. Gen rush teams can get in and out quickly, but they are not the norm.
I think the answer is in objectives and map/mode changes. Start introducing maps where gens and gates are not the way to survive. Maybe the survivors ha e to solve a puzzle, reassemble a series of statues, or some other objective in order to get out. The objectives change based on the map. Maybe wraith's map requires you fix a car to escape. Either way, it changes things up based on the map. Have hazards, and ways for the killer to hinder the survivors, such as having the entity destroy part of the statue if the killer hooks 3 different survivors within the first few minutes. This helps deter camping and tunneling in the early part of the match.
There are lots of ways to impr8without just nerfing gen times.
14 -
It's not the gens; it's the medium they exist in. A lot of feedback suggests increasing the base time it takes to repair a generator or adding more objectives, but it misses the point by acting as if time is a factor for survivors.
Time is the currency of the killer; it is the killer that spends time making every decision. Survivors doing gens are just filing away at that time, but gen progress is a means to an end, not an end in itself beyond getting points.
Killers spend time seeking survivors and then spend time trying to catch them, with decisions made during each determining whether more or less time is lost, as long as someone is doing the objectives uninterrupted.
Gen repair time was increased from 70 to 80 in early 2017, but not long after the length of each hook-phase was increased from 45 to 60 seconds, which more than cancels it out. Survivors have continually been given more options for stalling the killer, whilst gens are done just as fast. If gens simply took longer or there were additional objectives, survivors would regain their huge lead sooner or later.
The issue is there is hardly any contest of skill between the killer and survivor. Every killer except the Nurse is dependent on the survivor making mistakes: playing a virtually perfect game is not enough to get a good, let alone perfect result.
2 -
Thats basically exactly what I said. The issue isn't them being too short with the solution being extending them since that would actually hurt the actual problem, which is them being so god dam boring.
And since enough people tolerate it, and making gens more interesting or at least making the main objective more interactive won't make BHVR more money they won't change gen times or the actual gens to make them more fun or more fair.
2 -
I really like the idea of unique map objectives. As a survivor main ive really slowed down in playing (Usually only when friends are on) mainly due to the gen grind.. can't lie it is boring.
Hell even though that blight event nectar collection was kinda derpy at least it gave us something else to do.
1 -
I mean, when a gen gets done within the first 20 seconds of a game every time... it gets frustrating. How am I as a killer supposed to reach that in time? Especially as Trapper, Huntress, or Hag?
Often times I have to play to protect the three nearest me to lock them into a dangerous position. it's 50/50 though, since they still might get it done regardless. Most teams I come into contact though don't even give that option.
1 -
So every single game you have multiple survivors with toolboxes with speed increase add ons and Prove Thyself and they're all working on the same gen? Because that's the only way you'd be able to complete a gen in 20 seconds. And that's if they literally spawned next to the gen and didn't even have to walk.
7 -
3 man spawns on generators are very, very, often when I play survivor and I haven't even used a shroud to guarantee somebody spawning with me, I'd say 3 out of 5 matches consistently
1 -
3 man spawns on gens won't give you a 20 second gen. 4 man won't either. You need 4 with toolboxes , speed addons and Prove Thyself. Not very likely.
That said, I get what was meant by that post. I primarily run Trapper and it often feels like the gens are popping really fast as I try to set a trap or two. Depending on the map, I could be in trouble if I don't get lucky and spawn by 3-4 traps.
Gen timers are still not the answer.
2 -
They can keep gens like this, but nerf Borrowed time, Dstrike, Adrenaline.
Gen rush is a problem, but when gen rush meets the perks above then if becomes unfun.
I dont have a problem with gen rush, i have a problem with gen rush+the perks above.
2 -
4 survivors generator completion base time is 28.57 seconds.
5 -
That's the worst way possible to gen rush, would rather have 3 survs on 3 different gens while the 4th gets chase.
thats 3 gens gone in 80 seconds, if not less with toolbox meta aka 60% within 80 seconds.
but don't worry gen rush isn't a thing 2Head.
3 -
I know. That's the point I'm making.
Someone was claiming gens were done in 20 seconds.
3 -
Ok i start with sth unexpected
What's when the killer is kill-rushing?
When he camps and tunnels the first person he got or better he denies the rescue in a ridiculous awful way. Every time a killer decides to just camp another one dies and he gets slugged. Then idk the third person comes to safe seccesfully, dies, then 2 are down and the killer chases the unhooked person to slug him and so on. Everytime a killer decides to proyi camp/tunnel/slug (on a hook or sth) tactically he just wins and maybe only one survivor is able to survivor through the hatch/endgame, maybe. Sometimes killer just starts camping a hook for any reasons (if theyre legit or not doesnt matter) he founds someone and just kills and slug him and doesnt allow a hook until every one is injured waiting for a mistake...
It's awful and not fun to play. And if you my friend arent able to kill someone these days and play it well enough yea... you get #########. And yea often it's deserved you just cant accept the fact that you played bad "oh i played the pallets perfectly the survivor is just op" yea obviously you dont. Your decisions were bad or the survivor was right in your head.
Watch some good players like tofu, jendenise, zubat or idk to learn sth about how to play correctly.
And yea it's hard to win against a strong team maybe because you had mostly little fools who made awful decisions and wastes tons of time. There are things you cant know like how efficient the survivors played. Did they made gens together or far away from each other. Did they waste lots of time by self healing? How was their positioning on/off chase. Did they react or predict? Did they saw each other through aura reading perks and so they played much more efficient instead of all 3 survivors wanna hook rush one survivor for examble. Did they waste time through senseless urban evading?
If you have 4 survivors, tryharding then yea. If you cant do well you will screwed over ^^
It would help you alot learning from better players and even more from more matches like this because in this way you can learn to play as efficient as possible. Watch some killer perk tier lists on youtube, some of them are pretty good. Whispers for examble is an efficiency perk. You know where people are and not and so you dont waste time searching for nothing. Do you use anti healing or anti gen perks? healing is optional and gens are the objective.
Your presure are disabled survivor and the survivors pressure are gen progresses. Every + second on a gen is + pressure against you. Every - progress and every down/hook/death is pressure from you against the survivors. And so you have to play.
1 -
But isn't that the objective?
Just kidding though... I have to agree that the game would be better of there had different play styles, like anything different from generator, something related to the map, like said above, or idk.. I really support this idea :)
1 -
1. No, doing gens isn't actually much fun.
2. This game promotes an almost pokemon like ownership of your character.
3. Seeing your character get put on a meat hook and his/her soul sacrificed to Satan is a LOT less fun than doing gens and surviving.
4. I don't think killer mains realize that survivor mains have a much harsher failure than killer mains. I am yet to see survivors brutally kill a Trapper or Huntress or such. All killer mains can really complain about is that meg ran away or shined a flashlight at them, etc.
5. If the devs lengthen gens they should add shotguns.
2 -
There's no easy solution to this...
At least I don't think so.
0 -
Use hex ruin to slow the gens down
Just a little bit
1 -
You are absolutely right. There is no easy solution, because changing the game to make the objectives harder/slower would screw over the casual players so much they probably won't want to play, but the issue right now is red rank gens get done so fast its impossible to play any killer besides spirit, billy, and nurse, and there is no casual play for killer at red ranks, which is weird for a game they want to be casual.
Either way you will be making someone mad by changing the base objective, and changing it won't make them more money. That is why its been so many years and nothing.
2 -
A secondary objective would be nice, people have suggested something like a scavenger hunt to find generator parts but that would change the entire mechanics of the game and they'd have to rework a ton of perks. I think it's safe to say Generators will stay ignored for more than 3 years.
1 -
I was exaggerating. But gens shouldn't be done before a killer can even get to them, especially slower killers and ones that need to prepare traps.
0 -
But we should at least be able to get to all the gens before they are able to activate one, right? (WIth trapper I understand, because setting traps takes time, but isn't it weird for Huntress to not be able to do that?)
0 -
Gens are really boring and when a Killer can't apply enough pressure then they go really fast.
The problem is in 2 areas, the Killers aren't strong enough to create enough map wide pressure and secondly the Objective for Survivors is too simple so they can rush through it if no one is paying attention to the.
If Killer had the ability to apply more pressure OR if the Objectives required more than holding a button for over a minute then Gen rushing wouldn't be a problem.
0 -
The problem with this format is it would screw over 80% of the survivor population because they are casual green rank survivors who already face a 40 percent or lower survival rate. Again, not an easy fix.
It's why they need three things here:
1. Different objectives by map as I mentioned above
2. Rewards for achieving purple and red ranks in order to implement number 3
3. Increased difficulty by rank. Either longer gen times, or additional objectives in order to escape. Does not work unless survivors are rewarded for achieving those ranks and making the added difficulty worth it.
3.5 The downside to 2 and 3 is it would be survivor only. If we increase the killer difficulty, then we are back to square 1. No increased difficulty, no reward. It's only fair.
0 -
It never ceases to amaze me just how much people think they're fun is so much more important than the other players.
This thread seems to be about how being a survivor is boring. But only as long as the killer obeys the made up rules about how they are allowed to play.
Might be fun if there was a killer's trinket that one survivor could find that drops if you get hit and if you escape with it then you get a bunch of blood points.
Might also be fun if survivors would shut up about camping and tunneling. Killers kill. Deal with it.
1 -
You can turn it from gen rushing to a scavenger hunt real fast,
*Hex: Ruin*
0 -
Thunderclap as you see it getting destroyed 30 seconds into the game.
0
