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An idea to punish facecamping
So even tho camping in some cases is smart and even a necessecity due to overly altruistic survivors. It still isn't fun especially in the cases where there is no reason for the killer to camp, no hook rush ect.
So i know they tried stopping the timer for the hook when a killer camps and no survivors are nearby. And this turned out to be a bad idea because it got exploited, but how about if a killer camps for X amount of seconds within an X amount of meters and no survivors are in the area (facecamping). Gen speed gets increased, faster and faster the longer he camps uninterupted. This will make it so facecamping without reason (no survivors around) will be punished and you basically throw the game as killer. If you play like this. Instead of the current version where you facecamp one to death, some waste time trying to unhook before realizing its hopeless, but then the killer have time to even get a second or even a third survivor on the hook and facecamp them too. Also maybe notify the killer when this phase starts to prevent beginners to make this mistake of facecamping.
This needs to only apply to these kind of scenarios so its not misused. And only the scummiest of players get punished.
Thoughts?
Comments
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Stop thinking of punishments for camping, start thinking of rewards for not camping. Punishments do not work, as evidenced by the already existing punishment, as well as literally decades of research into the subject.
PS: Face camping is an exploit that was removed.
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Nope. Camping should never be punished. It is a LEGITIMATE STRATEGY. Rewards for leaving is better.
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Faster gen repair speed? I understand that camping can be frustrating when you are a survivor but gens are already poping too fast.
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I see noone actually read my posts, im not talking about camping, camping is a legit strat and is smart AND good in somecases, but facecamping (Not the exploit, but standing infront just making sure they 100% die with no counter play) Is not something this game needs or should reward. Rewarding killers for not camping is also something i would love, maybe give them an accumulative bloodpoint gain for as long as the survivors is one the hook and you are 32 m away could be a cool boost. But this flat out unfun mechanic has no place and SHOULD be punished. This would have no effect on normal games since facecamping is not something you do in a normal trial. If you get triggered by a survivor sure, facecamp him to death, but then the others should be able to punish you for it and escape.
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Campers can and are punished allready.
Let's motivate people to NOT camp, that's better.
How about giving dubble (from 500 to 1000 BP) for hooking action (Sacriface category) when hooking different Survivor that wasn't on hook previously.
Or you can help Killers by adding new thing into Emblems. Let's say that for EACH DIFFERENT (not the last one, but could be allready hooked in match) Survivor that you hook you secure +1 point into Malicious category.
Simple things like that can motive people to leave hooks.
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Face camping (the ability to prevent an unhook with 100% certainty by blocking the "unhook" prompt) no longer exists. It hasn't existed for quite a long time, in fact.
There's still a chance you can unhook, it's just small.
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They are not punished by the game only smart survivors. (The rank debuff don't count since there is no reason to care about rank atm.) And i would love to see some rewards yes, but knowing these devs they are more likely to implement punishment (the rank debuff) than any rewards. There is so many things they can do to reward the type of gameplay they want, but have failed to so after 3 years.
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This is how you completely miss the point and get caught up in technicality's. Facecamping is what i and many others call it because we dont want to say: The killer is standing still right infront of the survivor making it really difficult to save them without getting grabbed. So instead of a long as explanation for this specific act of camping i call it facecamping. This is starting to get as ridiculous as the gen tapping thread, completely missing my original post...
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Or you could call it what it is: hard camping. Your usage of face camping for things that aren't face camping is why, when face camping came back, it took a long time for it to even get on the devs' radar, and longer still to get fixed.
You may think me pedantic, but your wrong usage of terms has demonstrably negative results.
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Do gens. Three people on gens when a survivor takes the full time to die means you can concievably do almost all the gens in the time it takes for the killer to catch and facecamp the first person they find.
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"Almost" as you say, they simply lack the tools even if they where to never attempt a rescue.
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Yeah!
The match starts and the dude instantly spawns on hook, giving survivors exactly 2 minutes to do all gens...
*eye rolls into space*
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Doing the gens has a 75% win-rate on-paper. Those are the odds of you not being the guy on the hook.
If survivors did this, killers would camp less because most who do it was trying to win and if this decreases their chance to win, they wouldn't do it. Camping is not fun; a killer trying to win and have fun would rather be doing anything else, even if it's yet another over-long frustrating chase. The only reason to do it is to punish a specific survivor which can be classed as a form of rage-quitting, or if it seems obvious survivors will not do gens.
Why is a 75% win-rate still not good enough? If this were another game, any tactic with a 75% win-rate would nerfed.
Seeing as we are discussing this topic with rock-bottom standards, let's do that. Survivors doing gens should be nerfed if someone is on the hook: it has a theoretical 75% win-rate. That's broken!
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^^
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Punishing camping solves nothing. People will do it anyway.
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Oh look, an idea totally not suggested before and utterly rejected!
Oh wait....
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Your counter is swarming.
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The problem here is that you want to "punish". Thats already wrong thinking bro, you want to diacourage the killer instead of punishing him. Thats up to the devs, I thought of this bro instead after the killer hooks someone, their bar go down slower( not gamebreaking slow maybe just 45 more seconds) untill the killer enters a chase, once he enters the chase it goes back to normal
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This never happens
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Got it killer mains. Face camping=good. Looping, adrenaline, survivor items=bad.
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Uh, I hope you're not including facecamping in that
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Yeah, unhooking isnt too hard, but it's making sure that the hooked survivor can get away is the hard part. When a killer facecamps, it doesnt gurantee a free kill since the eploit was removed. However, if the person was unhooked, the killer that was right next to the hook would just go back after the same person
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Respect
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Ehm this is also punishing the killer
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There is currently no punishment, what do you mean? Oh, you mean the emblem "punishment" lol? Yeah, cuz rank matters so much. It's no punishment when it's meaningless. And therefore noone cares, everyone could saw that coming.
Post edited by DaS_only on0 -
But that's not the way to go. If a dog bites you, you don't reward him. You punish him first, and you will reward him in the future IF he does not do that again. If you keep getting bad marks, I don't think your momma is gonna hug you. She will probably chase you around with her shoes as a "weapon". So yeah, camping MUST be punished, but punishment and reward could just be there at the same time. Punishment is the first step though. And about the so called "punishment" already in the game... Well, that's hardly a punishment, or something that doesn't make you laugh loudly.
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Think it over
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You don't reward bad behavior. You figure out a tough enough punishment to discourage it. "Reward bad behavior"? Really? What's wrong with you people?
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No. Punishments for a valid playstyle are silly.
You may not like being camped, but that does not mean the Killer was 'wrong' or 'mean' to do so.
I've browsed a few pages on here since joining; why are people so dead set to punish a valid play style? Like..it's valid. It exists. You being unhappy does not mean devs should change it.
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Here's my idea for punishing a face camper.
You do the gens, and 3 people get out, and the crappy killer doesn't get to rank up. Probably better for them to stay at the rank they are at. Wouldn't even catch a survivor going up the ladder.
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Except killers aren't dogs, and decades of research have shown that, indeed, rewarding desired behavior works better than punishing undesired behavior.
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If they camp just work on gens...
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That's not the point. Face camping is a terrible thing that makes survivors feel powerless, and they can't do anything about it. It's a guaranteed depip and death that you can't control. It's boring for the killer, the hooked survivor, and the gen rushing survivors and it should not be allowed in this game.
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It's a legit tactic that punishes itself.
Just because you don't like it does not mean the devs should suddenly program in 300 inane rules to limit/prevent camping.
Killers can have tons of reasons why they camped, and it's not up to you to decide if those reasons were valid or not, nor can the devs program the game to realize if THIS camping Trapper is doing it to be spiteful while THAT camping Spirit did it because they suspected the Survivor had Dead Hard & Sprint Bust & Decisive Strike.
Bottom line: Camping exists. Camping is legit. Camping should not be punished.
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Camping is zzzz really but what can you do about it?
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Except that games are meant to be fun. If something in the game is causing so much trouble that it gets mentioned here every day, it should not exist.
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That's horrible logic.
Nobody likes losing. the game is less fun when you lose, so should losing be taken out? Should Killer and Survivor hold hands?
The only reason camping is not fun (for YOU) is because you got camped. So you want it removed so you can win next time, which would be less fun for the Killer..See the cycle?
Again; camping is FINE. You only dislike it because you lost and, like many, MANY players recently, you decided 'I lost, therefor I should ask the devs to cater to me and change the game so I can win!'
Instead of 'Maybe I should improve so I don't get camped next time'. Because that would take effort and you don't want to take effort, so you came here to try and get your way.
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No, losing is still fun if you played well, had a decent chance, and got beaten. Of course it should stay. Camping, on the other hand, removes the ability to play the game for all five players, doesn't give anyone but the killer a chance to win, and requires almost no engagement for anyone involved. That's why it shouldn't exist. The majority of players hate it, and not in the same way they hate losing. A loss can usually be avoided, and avoiding a loss is part of the fun. If you get camped by Leatherface, it's hopeless. Just ######### to get to the next game faster.
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Punishment for face camping is that the other three survivors can fix 3 or even 4 gens before the hooked survivor dies.
Yes it sucks for the hooked survivor cause he gets no BPs, but the other three can very easily gen rush the killer.
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You're completely wrong.
When you camp, 3 Survivors can clear 6 generators (2 gens EACH) before the Survivor on the hook dies. So your little factoid about camping preventing 5 people form playing is a flat-out lie.
Camping is fine. Take the loss and move on.
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You get nothing but Lightbringer for repairing generators, guaranteeing a depip if you gen rush and leave, and you will most likely either die or lose Benevolent by going for an unhook. Also, what kind of a$$hole says "Just take the loss and move on?" You think because you stood still for two minutes, you're entitled to a victory? You're a terrible person.
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Indeed, killers who always camp are far worse than dogs. But read that again, Orion. Punishment first, rewards soon after. Never said it had to be only one of those. Don't worry though, I know who I am talking to. A guy who has never been seen agreeing with somebody other than himself.
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People will never listen. The devs have put it in writing and people still refuse to accept that camping isn't something they are trying to fully discourage or prevent. The devs have said on livestreams that they are looking at ways to discourage hard camping or incentivizing leaving the hook in a timely fashion.
It won't be enough for some until a hooked survivor just has a force field erected around them in a 50m radius that only a survivor can pass through. A total killer exclusion zone.
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You can't get camped if you don't get caught.
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Explain how not camping as a killer wouldn't be fun for them? What your saying is the killer not being skillfull and killing all four survivors without using cheap tactics is "boring"?
Just by reading what you said, you're probably already a boring killer to play against that only cares about "winning" the match.
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Why dont we just have the killer be teleported away by the entity if they stay too close by, or slowed in movement speed.
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What I'm saying is that the Devs should not enforce a playstyle based on the biased opinions of people salty at that very playstyle.
You call it 'cheap', I say the Killer might have had his/her reasons to camp. You have no right to say 'You can't do that!' and demand/ask the Devs to enforce your arbitrary rules.
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No. Again; it would be abused to high hell. I'd uninstall if I was trying to stop an unhook and got teleported away, or my movespeed was too slow because everyone hid JUST outside my Terror Radius until the effect kicked in & then got an easy save.
The devs already tried a 'punishment' and all Survivors did was abuse the snot out of it.
Survivors yelling for a punishment just want an easy game, plain and simple. They want to shut down a playstyle they don't like for selfish reasons. A VALID playstyle, regardless of what anyone says.
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just make an algorithm that will start to calculate like this:
After the person u hooked is unhooked a timer will begin, every 10 seconds, it count 1 point, if the killer hook that same person before 1 point, that means he had tunnel/camping and won't get bloodpoints bonus, if he hooked before finishing 6 points, he will get only half points, each hook will have a total of 8 points, in a total of 80 seconds, after that it will stop.
-- at the end of the match, the more points you have, more exp BONUS you get --.
If the killer hooked and went to another survivor, the clock will keep going until 8 points but will stop after the second hook (if it happens before getting to 8p), this systematic will keep going.
I was going to suggest to create a silent heartbeat emited by the survivor, only being able to be listen by the killer, and in that radius the killer won't get points, but that's WRONG, since we all should agree that camping is just a strategy not an exploit, if you want stay camping someone, the survivor should tell his friends and they will gen rush, because karma is a b**ch.
Altho, i really think that tunneling should be fixed, like... if there's still 5 gens left, if you tunnel the survivor, he should get your bloodpoints lefting you with 0 untill that point. But if there's 2 gens left and no sacrifice yet, tunnel is a great way to balance things and must NOT be consider a way of disgrace, the killer should not have bonus for that but in the same way should not be punish for that.
*quick note:
Also, when i'm playing killer, there are times (quiet often) that I don't want to camp or tunnel someone, so i just go forward and, in that point, someone unhook the survivor and that same unhooked guy goes directly to me and I stick my fork in him, since we can never refuse free food, so in that case, the algorithm should be added with a merge of meters, like, altho the clock ticks every 10 seconds, if that same survivor runned or walked for more than 45 meteres from where he was hooked the points will count as a full 8. 45 m in a line, not running in circles and while not in a chase!.
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