What exactly is gen rush?
4 survivors start the game and hop on 4 generators. The killer finds one and starts chasing that one. The other 3 do gens. Is this gen rushing? If so, why is it rushing? What should the other survivors be doing? Looking for chests? Sabotaging?
I am confused what Gen Rush means - what else should survivors do if not gens?
I'd like to hear from the perspective of killers - what do you expect other survivors to be doing? idling?
Comments
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It's killers who are mad at survivors for doing gens 🤣
Just kidding. It comes from the fact that gens are the only objective for survivors and that means that, especially if the first survivor caught is good at looping, that by the time the killer gets his first hook between 1-3 gens are done. This is why a lot of people are urging the devs to add another objective for survivors that's mandatory (since chests and totems usually go untouched).
As someone who plays both, I definitely agree. It feels like once ruin is broken, the game is lost.
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It really has no meaning, at least to me. The only thing that actually comes close to a real "gen rush" is when survivors literally don't care about doing anything other then gens.
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With a toolbox a single person can do a gen in 53sec-1:10 seconds.
once you get up in rank where people don't run away like idiots when they hear the heartbeat 1-2 people on a gen and they can finish 1-2 before you can even loop the map.
things change with Nurse/Billy/spirit where they have ######### map pressure compared to other killers.
With competent survivors gen rush is an issue, but it's the developers fault not the survivors, they are doing the objective.
oh and it's technically possible to do a gen with 4 people in 10 seconds (1 gen)
it's also technically possible to do a gen in ~16 seconds with 4 people (all gens)
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Isn't there a perk to counter multiple people on 1 gen for killers. *cough* *cough* discordance *cough*. And there's also multiple perks to slow gen progression down alot. I run them and no "gen rush". Killer mains need to stop expecting survivors to just stand around and do nothing while letting the killer kill them. Simple. Patrol the gens.
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It's a term killers use to pin the blame on survivors for getting gens done fast instead of blaming the devs for letting it become that much of q problem
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It's what M1 killers encounter when survivors spread out on gens, play conservatively at loops, and force pallet breaks early. A lot of survivors operate under a misconception that they actually have to loop. The maps aren't tuned for looping. They can be ludicrously inefficient with pallets and never run out if their teammates hammer gens. Some will chime in a and say "but muh gen pressure", but gen pressure isn't a thing when there are 4 healthy survivors. It's fake pressure. You're just going to play whack a mole with gens without hooking anyone. Gen pressure can't start until someone is on a hook.
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Toxic gen rushers are people that bring things to speed up gens BNP, prove rhyself stuff like they i never considered it toxic because they are just doing their job and surviving
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In general without inserting bias as best as I can, the gen rush is this:
The feeling of how quickly gens can be done by survivors who are not being chased by the killer. The killer can only effectively stop one survivor from doing gens at a time by chasing them.
Depending on how long that chase goes on, the remaining 3 survivors can work on generators and complete them at an effective pace.
As gens are completed, the killer feels more pressure to down and hook survivors, in order to prevent them from escaping.
In most cases, if a group of survivors can effectively loop a killer while the others focus on generators and trade off as they're downed and hooked, the killer will be unable to stop them from escaping.
This places the time crunch on the killer while the survivors feel no time crunch.
This time crunch is called the "gen rush" which is also why most survivor players will tell you it doesn't exist.
They don't feel the time crunch. The ones who do, recognize how quickly the match went as they finish the last gen.
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There are things that are available to alleviate this pressure. The most popular of which is Ruin, but most players will note how soon the hex is cleansed within the match.
Then you'll have other players rattling on about map pressure and "letting" the survivors do gens, but they're deliberately ignoring the main points about the concern.
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Match start
3 survivors are on 3 gens
1 is in chase
The killer has ~60 second too down and hook the person
The other 3 survivors power 3 gens
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The killer need a slow down perk or he lost.
And the killer has only 2 good slow down perks.
Ruin and this plague perk.
So the killer player has no freedom in perk builds.
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Genrushing is basically beeing the most optimal survivors on gens. You don't care about ruin, cuz you hit nearly very skillcheck. You don't care beeing injured and you don't heal but keep repairing gens because you are confident enough to loop. Same to your mates, you don't heal them and you do not instantly unhook them. You stay on gens. And totems won't get touched.
Genrushing is having the most tunnel vision on gens but still beeing optimal in overall gameplay.
And no, the killer can't always control and pressure survivors. It's a made up lie by some players who are either biased survivor mains trying to troll or just people who never versed some super optimal genrush squads .
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"Genrushing" is usually the result of a killer tunneling one survivor which is the main reason why tunneling isn't a good strategy. You want to put pressure on all survivors, not just one. So if you are just following one survivor around the map you're going to have three survivors doing gens and getting them done fast.
But this is also why m1 killers are terrible because not only are you easy to loop but it's hard to put pressure on all the survivors. You pretty much have to give up chases quickly or hope you can down survivors really fast in order to be effective. This is why some people say that only nurse and spirit are viable killers since they can end chases quickly and travel quickly around the map putting pressure on all the survivors.
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Gen rush is when the killer fails to apply pressure.
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Lol gen rush exist because weapply no pressure on gens in a sense sometime it's true but, for experimented players you know you're all wrong play clown against gen rusher. YOU.WILL.LOSE
cutting a chase is also a lost because ok you will prevent the survivors to finish a gen but, the survivor you've stopped chasing we go on a generator. So it's like if you were on a solo game you were at the end then decide to restart the game again.
On stupid survivors cutting chase can work but optimal-experimented survivors will simply smash you. Secondary objective is needed for sure for all killers except nurse because she's perfect and that's probably why her add-ons needs to be reworked for sure.
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What Gen Rush means to me, as a killer, is that I've already lost :(
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Gen rushing is a consequence of forgoing healing, cleansing totems and focusing just on completing generators. Gen pressure only exists against un-coordinated solo survivors, the best pressure comes from downing survivors quickly. So you can play a match as a killer and make little to no mistakes and come out on the losing end.
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Also, like most other killers i don't get mad at survivors being efficient, it's just a consequence of game mechanics.
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Gen rush is a term that describes the massive difference in the time it takes for a killer to accomplish their objectives when playing efficiently vs. how long it takes survivors to do the same when playing efficiently. It's not the survivors' fault this is the case any more than it's the killers' fault that the Doctor can shock people; indeed, contrary to popular belief, most killers don't blame survivors for gen rush.
Furthermore, and, again, contrary to popular belief, it's not possible to beat a survivor team playing 100% efficiently, no matter how well you play. It's mathematical.
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There's nothing wrong with "Gen Rushing" If a killer is chasing A, it's expected for B, C and D to do gens.
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Look, up until the yellow, purple and red ranks there really is no reason to complain about gen rush. Map pressure is easy at those ranks, just don't get too focused on one survivor.
At those higher ranks is where it gets harder. Survivors loop better, they avoid better, and they focus on the gens more. This is why a cover all fix will not work. The majority of players are in the green ranks. Many are casual and nowhere near as skilled as higher rank players. Adding another objective to all ranks would make lower rank matches pure squash matches.
The key is to add rank rewards and increase difficulty by rank.
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You know finishing 60% of the game in the first 2 mins is not a very good design choice.
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Adding rank rewards is a good thing, dificully by rank ? ######### NO
I know personal individuals that would give up their entire progress in 2k hrs just to bully killer, when you have those kind of individuals in the game, do you think they're gonna rank up for what ? bloodpoints, or shards ######### NO. they care to bully not to get rewards.
The key is to implement another objective, good players will adapt, bad players will still do gens.
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The players who cite lack of "map pressure" or "gen pressure" are not playing M1 killers, aren't playing against the best survivors, or are simply being disingenuous. Survivors dictate the pace, either by screwing up in chases or choosing to slam gens.
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I think the real gen-rush is when survivors don't give a damn about anything beside gens: when you see all chests still closed, no totem cleansed and people don't heal you know you're facing real gen rushers. It's very rare to find teams playing this way though.
In other cases it's just an excuse used when killers play bad, or a strategy used when they are playing dirty (hard camping or tunneling someone).
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Gen rushing doesnt exist. Its a killer legend to encourage themselfs, that theyre not just really bad at playing this game.
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Generally it refers to doing nothing except gens as fast as possible.
The difference between a genrush, and 'doing the objective' is subtle but real.
When survivors all forgo healing for powering through gens to heal with adrenaline, it's basically ignoring a main game mechanic designed to keep you busy to rush the main objective. Survivors also love to ignore totems, then come onto forums to say noed is op, when the point of it is that it's something you should be trying to do before all gens are completed.
There are people who will call any fast loss a gen rush, but it's different.
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Most commonly, someone will say it when they've got no pressure and end up chasing a survivor for two minutes straight, somehow expecting generators not to go off.
A more reasonable definition is when they bring in four toolboxes and only do generators- no totems, no healing, even delaying rescues- literally spending every second that they're not being chased on a generator. (Not very common.)
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Gen Rush is that exhilarating feeling you get after finishing a gen.
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Genrush can be the result of one bad chase. But i usually call it a mindset. There is only one objective and if you ignore all the immersion and just "play the game", then survivors are most likely to win. The first chase has all the pallets, no spirit fury, no killer momentum. You an usually pump out 2-3 gens without a chance of counterplay. Then its a matter of mindset. If they want to win, they can win right there. They dont have to do totems, play stealthy or rush the hook. They are 3 people having to do 2 gens. Just do the gens and wins.
Its just playing optimally. But if you do, you win. Its just about the RNG of getting 4 genrushers at high ranks.
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That statement is completely false.
Haunted Grounds and Make Your Choice will scare people off of gens due to the exposed effect.
Ruin, Pop, Corrupt, Thrilling, Discordance, Lullaby, Overcharge, Unnerving, and a Sloppy/Nurse's and Thanataphobia combo all provide gen slowing ability. Obviously they're not all the same (and some are better than others) but to say that there's nothing you can do is silly.
I do, however, agree that chases last too long due to some still-present infinites, weird pallet spawns and etc.
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I think you missed, that the killer actually has to kick the gen for two seconds and a hiding survivor can revert this in a blink of an eye. Im not even kicking gens anymore, if i dont got "Pop goes the Weasel" or "Overcharge".
I feel like "gen rush" is, when you got "Prove Yourself" and "Streetwise" plus a good Toolbox. In an SWF you can do two gens easily before the killer even travelled to you.
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That's not what pressure is. Pressure is more along the lines of, 'I have one guy hooked, one guy slugged, and I'm chasing a third so the last guy needs to go for the save or else everyone dies.' i.e. Forcing them to do stuff that isn't a generator.
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the only problem is you can't do that with quite a few killers. and only the top end killers have the capability to do it really. At the higher ranks at least
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That would be objectively false. Downing and hooking survivors is something every killer can do.
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Of course they can, every killer has the POTENTIAL to perform at red ranks in certain conditions. im just saying some killers find map pressure more difficult than others, weather it be map dependant, the killers mobility or chase potential. It often isnt as black and white as down a survivor and hook them when many other factors play a role in the match that effect the killers pressure, some (or quite of few) of which are entirely out of the killers control.
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I just gotta say I love how matter-of-fact your comments often are.
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Gen rush is when all gens are done in 4-5 minutes.
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But how fast can they do it? We can't ignore the fact that most pallets are objectively safe until bloodlust/mindgames come into play for M1 killers. That doesn't even take into account strong structures like the preschool, Strode house, Ironworks window, etc.
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That's another type of pressure in my eyes. Gen pressure is the ability to keep survivors off gens and/or decrease the gen progression as a killer. For sure, enough hook pressure can cause gen pressure too, but only chasing generates no gen pressure. Even hooking a survivor only gets one survivor off a gen.
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In my experience, hook pressure is the only real pressure. Keeping each chase under 30-60s is a must to keep gen progression in check. The whole kicking gens and protecting them only leads to failure as you can only waste time until your next hook. Free hits, injuring, downing people counters genrush.
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Whenever survivors play better than the killer and complete the gens really really fast.
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As a killer main I can accuratelly give you the concept. Gen rushing is the action of not knowing how to properly patrol gens or make survivors three gen themselves when you see gens being done ultra fast, this concept can be surpassed by a common perk called "common sense", which grants the killer the hability to "make them scatter and know your ground to three gen them" o higher levels the perk gives you the hability to also "stop focusing on the loopers who want you to waste time". Hope this helps.
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Yea but there is no comparison between the time taken to down with a killer like wraith or pig vs spirit or nurse. M1 killers down people too slow to generate strong pressure.
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3-genning doesnt work against good survivors. If you chase, one of them gets done. If you dont, the rest are done for free. And then you have nothing to compete against full hookstate survivors who will gladly tap it one at a time but stay out of your reach, since you have to chase at some point for a hook, and they only need 30s to repair one gen. It may work with some Doctorbuilds against casuals.
Not focusing on loopers is also a low-midrank strategy. What do you if you face 4 decent survivors who can loop, abandon every chase until the game is over? At r1 you often face teams, where everyone can loop decently. Those are the games that matter and need to be won and 3 genning is shooting yourself.
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@Peanits is right...can't believe I'm saying that. I main Trapper; I'm colorblind and usually can only spot survivors if they are moving or wearing bright clothes. I can't see scratch Mark's and blood in most maps because that shade of red appears as dark brown ro me. Yet I can achieve map pressure in Purple and lower red ranks. It is really hard for me in the reds, but doable.
In the first 3 minutes of the match I don't chase anyone more than 30 seconds. I wait for them to run near another gen and I peel off for a hit on another survivor. I try to do this with at least 5 gens until I can pick one survivor who makes a mistake or is in either a low pallet area or a pallet I really want gone early (god pallets). By the time the first gen is done, I have often injured 2-3 and have 2-3 good traps set. I try to keep pressure off the 2 furthest gens so they will force a short field and I can riddle it with traps.
Pressure is key and being willing to let go of chases to maintain it is important.
Yes, it fails sometimes, but it mostly works.
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Thanks for all the replies - heres a summary for those that are interested what I think is the best answer based on the responses
Gen Rush is common a killer mindset that survivors are "rushing" to finish generators because they are busy chasing a survivor. I think this is a wrong mindset, since doing generators is the survivors job. They aren't rushing it since they really have nothing else to do.
True "Gen Rush" is when a team runs 4 purpe toolboxes and does nothing but generators, even when they are injured (skip healing). This answer makes the most sense to me. I just started to play killer (and Ive played hundreds of hours as survivor), and I have never seen this. I'd imagine it would have to be 4 SWF who are all much better than a killer and feels confident they can avoid detection and loop successfully even when injured. This is probably only seen at high ranks since at Rank 8 killer (where I am at) and lower, I haven't seen anyone close to being able to pull this off.
My conclusion is that for a majority of us players, gen rushing is not really a problem.
Really appreciate everyone's answers!
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On the reasonable side it's pointing out that gens can fly by incredibly fast and that some sort of secondary objective would be great if implemented correctly. So criticizing the game or specific systems surrounding generators like completion time, strength of gen regression and effectiveness of stalling tools.
On the unreasonable side it's blaming SURVIVORS for doing their objective effectively. Argue about the balance of time management surrounding generators, it is something that could need work for sure, but blaming players for doing their primary objective as quickly as possible is just plain silly.
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It's a game where if there are no weak links on the survivor team it can be over in 5 minutes or less; and there are easily 15-20 pallets on each map that can be looped by an experienced survivor with very little room for counterplay; then add in some infinite window action on top of that and it's pretty rough out there for the m1 killers. Survivors are also given a ton of second chance perks to use if they choose to which can stall out chases for an incredibly long time. Killers have the OP spirit fury / enduring combo to deal with it; or noed which is there after the game has been lost basically.
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It's what happens when one generator is completed before the first hook happens, which is sometimes preceded with a killer DCing. So make sure to 99 that gen and wait for the hook! 🤣
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Seems a tad pointed
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Gen-Rushing is when survivors work on generators instead of going afk.
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