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Can we nerf keys just a little bit?
I'm fine with the hatch hunt and all 4 survivors escaping if all gens are done, But I'm tired of 2-3 man escapes when there is a gen to do. Make it where the hatch close's instantly when there are more than 1 survivors. I've seen this more and more lately people just get a free ez escape and then they become toxic at end game chat, its so easy to get as well you need plunders and you got like a 40% chance to snag a key.
To everyone saying the Moris is need a nerf, I agree completely. It shoud be and always been after a survivor has been hooked twice, but before then so many things need to be balanced for the games health for both sides
Comments
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I would be fine with Keys being removed entirely if Moris get removed too.
Both are just a lame "end the game early" button.
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I just wanna be able to grab people who use keys.
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Just ebony.
Cypress and the green one are ok
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Green should be purple tho
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If keys get removed then Mori's should too.
Only mori i really have an issue with is ebony though. For the green one, maybe change the requirement because its not hard at all to proxy, tunnel and Mori.
Cypress could be in the basekit.
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I like the idea of the Hatch insta-closing when someone uses the key to jump in. At that point normally, either the game is basically over because everyone is about to jump in, or the Killer is able to find the hatch and close it, starting the EGC anyways. If multiple people want to escape, each one needs their own key. Of course, that one achievement where everyone needs to escape via Hatch should be changed, but I see nothing wrong with that.
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Keys are busted. Easy like that. Remove them or change them radically.
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Agreed, the requirement should just be that you have to be hooked twice lol
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killers: damn survivors done 3 gens and 2 escaped by the hatch freaking keys
survivors: damn killer killed everyone by mori without giving a chance to do something freaking ebony
both should shut up, it's equal "balanced"
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Each side having one unbalanced thing does not cause each side to balance out. It means that there are two unbalanced things negatively impacting the game.
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i want two changes for keys:
- a survivor that escapes through the hatch that has been opened with a key can be grabbed by the killer (reintroduction of the hatch grab in certain scenarios)
- a survivor escaping with a purple key will not leave the hatch open, but instead close it behind them (ultra rare things should be gamechangers, not very rare things. currently, the very rare version is just as good as the ultra rare one, so it should be nerfed / fully removed / reworked)
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If keys go all moris need to go too.
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3 survivors can escape when only 1 or 0 gen is left to be done. They would win anyway.
Your problem is that multiple peole can escape with one key. When multiple people are alive and hatch appears that means its very late phase of the match and you were not very good at killing people.
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That does not mean that it is good for the match to prematurely end as a result. It is still more than possible for the Killer to mount a comeback, but the Key can just straight-up deny that. That is not terribly reasonable IMO.
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Well honestly, I think they key that opens a hatch should be ONLY ultra-rare, not rare. Ultra-rare items and add-ons are very rare in bloodweb and they are meant to be filled with over-the-top once-usable power.
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Rarity doesn't factor into this discussion for me. I am talking about both the Dull and Skeleton Keys. The way those two items interact with the Hatch is not balanced IMO.
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It should be brought into discussion. Only ultra-rare and very-rare keys can open the hatch. Thats like talking all med-kits should be nerfed because ranger med-kit exists and its ability is absolutely over-the-top. But the thing is its also very rare rarity.
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Not a good comparison IMO. If the ranger medkit is unbalanced (and I am not saying it is), then the ranger medkit is what should be nerfed while the other med-kits are left untouched, regardless of the rarity of any of the medkits. I am not arguing that all the keys should be nerfed because some of the keys have the ability to prematurely open the hatch. I am arguing that the keys that have the ability to prematurely open the hatch should be nerfed.
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K butcher moris and we'll give you the keys. I think moris should be after two hooks so they're just an animation thing.
Keys should be after gates are powered but hey, that's just me.
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I'm okay with nerfing Moris. I'll put forth the idea I've been pitching: Yellow Bloodpoint add-ons (minus Pudding and Shell) also let you Mori one Survivor who has been hooked two times (NOT a Survivor who is on death hook; they must have been hooked two times specifically in order for them to be able to be Mori'd with the offering), and Green Bloodpoint add-ons (minus Streamers) also let you Mori any Survivor who has been hooked two times.
I'm not sure how I feel about making the key only work on the hatch after the gates are powered. I feel that might be too heavy-handed a nerf.
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You probably know better than me tbh. Your idea sounds like it'd make less of a backlash.
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I personally feel that keys should only allow the holder to escape. If done, then remove ebony mori.
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Well I dont agree with you then. In your logic, the hatch could open only when one survivor is alive. I think thats wasting of an unpredictable and interesting game mechanic of a hatch. I definitely dont want to limit this game to be played in just one single way to assure everything is "balanced and fair" and nobody could complain. BORING.
Anyway, this topic is a TOTAL NON-ISSUE. The situations where multiple people escape through hatch are very rare. Unless you play against swf survivors and they purposely lead the game to hatch escape. Then again dont go to match where you can see one survivor with a map and one with a key in a lobby. Not to mention, no SWF player wants to die so the hatch will most likely spawn after all gens are done and thats really your problem, boo boo.
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Moris need a nerf way more than keys do.
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I never said I necessarily wanted it so the hatch could only open when one Survivor was left. I said above that I liked the idea of having it so the Hatch insta-closes when someone uses the key to open the Hatch and jumps in.
Also, the fact that you are suggesting that Killers lobby dodge is a pretty good indication of this not actually being a "TOTAL NON-ISSUE."
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Franklin Demise exists. Everything has counter.
Post edited by Gcarrara on0 -
Personally, I think keys are fine because it's more of how the hatch spawns. In no circumstance should the hatch spawn when there are generators remaining, period, unless there's only one survivor remaining. :)
If all generators are completed, I don't think killers would mind if survivors escape through the hatch because they did 5/6 of their objective.
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Franklin's Demise is not actually that useful against a Key unless the Survivor using it is hellbent on using add-ons that allow you to channel the Key's energy. When it falls onto the ground, that Survivor or another Survivor can just pick it up later and use it once they know where the Hatch is.
Post edited by Gcarrara on0 -
Franklins doesnt stop Survivors from just picking the key back up. Furthermore the hatch-opening mechanic is not affected by durability.
That means you have to deal damage to the key 7 times to destroy it.
Thats assuming the survivors even let the Killer do that. If the key is left on the ground until the hatch spawns, the Killer cant do anything about it.
Franklins does not counter keys. At all.
Post edited by Gcarrara on3 -
Then you will have to deal with the fact that sometimes you lose and life is unfair. DBD Devs give you a good life lesson.
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Ignoring the discussion in favor of "sometimes you lose; leave it alone" is not constructive at all.
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It is. And I will tell you something. I love unfair mechanics of this game. I love using NOED on killers. I love to patrol 3 gens as a doc. I love bringing skeleton key as survivor. I love getting insta-heals. The matches are fun and unpredictable this way. I explore new ways of playing this game rather than settling down just to make gens and then open the exit doors. Sorry if this makes you angry.
Post edited by Gcarrara on0 -
If you like doing those things, by all means go ahead. They're in the game for you to do, so don't let anyone stop you. If you're not interested in hearing people out because of that, then I'll simply carry on the discussion with other people.
Post edited by Gcarrara on3 -
Neither side should be able to end the game early because of an item or offering. It's so dumb that multiple survivors can escape with one gen left. It's not remotely fair. Same goes for ebony and green moris. It's too easy to lose from the loadout screen in this game.
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There is way too many things these forums want gone. Soon the game will consist of survivors and killers just standing there complaining until one side gives up.
Keys are not that common. I've seen two keys used in the past two months. Ill8admit that the boxes tend to produce keys in swings. I had a week where someone found a key in a chest a dozen times. That said, Ebony Mori is much more common than keys. I have dozens that sit in my inventory for mori daily on Trapper. Keys are not as common in the BW in my experience. I would be interested in the actual stats as everyone's experience may vary.
To sum up, keys are fine. Moris as well.
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This. Its non-issue. Just another thread to cry about survivors. I think this game will always be slightly unfair for killers just because of the asymmetric aspect. Unless they want to make survivors completely useless idiots that wont be fun to play with.
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Well you want to delete everything from this game to the point where we, survivors, cant loop, cant use insta-heals, cant gen-rush, cant open a hatch and let injured survivor from hook escape through it etc. With your vision, the game would become so boring and monotonous for survivors that they would get tired of DBD after 10 matches.
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Keys need to be more visible in the game lobby. I also think that a purple key should open the hatch only for the survivor that uses the key. Pink key should have the hatch stay open for like 20 seconds.
Alternatively, they could remove purple/green keys, remove Map, change Rainbow Map to Map and make it a purple item, then just decrease further the chance of pink items in survivor bloodwebs and chests. This would both nerf keys by making them much harder to get and improve maps which are generally meh items.
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The rate at which OP items show up shouldn't really dictate whether it is problematic on a game-by-game basis. If there was a Beyond-Beyond-Ultra Rare Offering that instantly killed a Survivor when the match started or a Beyond-Beyond-Ultra Rare Offering that prevented the Killer from moving for a solid minute when the game started, neither of those would be balanced because they were super super rare offerings. In an individual game, those offerings would be absolutely insane.
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Good thing keys are not so op then.
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I disagree. Dull/Skeleton Keys (as well as Ivory/Ebony Moris) are OP in my opinion.
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It's not the offering itself, it's how it's used. You don't hear people complaining on masse about Tombstone Myers, do you? : P
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So, I rarely play survivor because I find it dull and entirely dependent upon the killer as to whether the role is fun. If they camp or tunnel then it is a boring M1 match. I prefer to be in the driver seat.
So, I did play a little survivor this weekend and the first match was tombstone Meyers. He apparently stalked the crap out of a couple of survivors before coming upon me. He came around the corner and I make for the window (only escape route in that room of Lerys since he was in the door. As I hit the window, T3 goes off and I'm morid. SOB, ######### did the others do, dance for him? He had zero Los on me till he came around the corner. I've barely been in this match and I'm dead because someone (likely 2or more) were dumb enough to let him stalk them for a long time.
OP? Yes and no. He had to stalk a while to get the ability, but I suffered as a solo survivor due to stupid partners.
Keys are no different than that or the ebony mori match I ended up in 2 games later. The difference between ebony mori and a key is the ebony mori lasts all match and gets used 4 times. The key requires the deatch of 1 to 3 survivors or the gens all done. Much, much weaker.
So, if keys are OP then so is Tombstone Meyers and moris. I don't believe that is the case.
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You win some, you lose some. I have nothing against keys. You should have targeted the one carrying it.
When I play survivor is very exiting to escape using the key.
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Bad teammates is not an argument in favor of something being OP. Against good teammates, properly stalking is actually a challenge to do, and using Tombstone Piece makes that a lot more challenging because it raises the amount of stalk you need to reach EW 3.
Also, your "difference" does not actually highlight what makes Keys weaker than Moris. You're just factually kinda stating what each one does. Moris allow you to shortcut the amount of time it takes to finish a game with no additional effort. Keys allow you to shortcut the amount of time it takes to finish a game with no additional effort. The way they both go about it are completely different because they are completely different items meant for completely different roles.
Keys and Mori offerings are OP in my opinion. Tombstone Piece is not on the same level in my opinion because while it also allows you to shortcut the amount of time it takes to finish the game, it requires significant additional effort to accomplish that and penalizes you if you are unable to reliably capitalize on it (since you only have a limited window to make that happen, and the stalk time needed to reach EW3 is always considerably increased).
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I think from all items and offerings insta heals, moris and keys needs a nerf. Otherwise they're good.
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Keys are one of the stupidest and least rewarding things in the game. Congrads, you got out with alot less BP. Oh you get to tea bag at hatch when Killer-Senpai comes up, good for you. Honestly, If you have a key, you go to the top of the Killer's list. If you think you have skill cause you used a key, you are delusional.
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This makes you an Douche bag.
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Way to over react and add nothing to the conversation.
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Run Franklins.
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