Random map selection needs to go.
Killers are far too map-dependant for the game to have map selection be random.
Some Killers can even basically have their powers crippled by map RNG (Eg: Billy on Treatment Theatre or the upcoming Hawkins Lab, or stealth Killers on wide-open maps with no way for them to sneak around)
First, remove the map offerings.
Next, in the pre-game lobby have a set of 3-4 random maps be shown to the Killer, and they can pick which one of those maps they want.
This would fix 3 major issues with the current map selection system:
1) Killers getting screwed by rng (like in the examples listed above)
2) Killers getting to choose exactly what map they want via offerings (So Nurses will no longer be able to just pop The Game offerings every match)
3) Survivors screwing over the Killer by picking map offerings for maps that are extremely unbalanced in the Survivor's favour. (Eg Survivors taking Haddonfield offerings while running Balanced Landing)
Comments
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I think 2 good things to combat this is the following:
1. Add an "anti map" offering. For example, you burn "anti Lerry's" offering and the chance of getting it is reduced
2. A map offering Form the kilker should be at least 2 times stronger than a map offering from the survivor since survivors can burn a map 4 times and will guarantee to get it no matter what.
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I mean if you allow killers only to choose maps they wouldn't do it since it's unfair to survivors but if you do a voting system all survivors would do is pick farm maps or haddonfield which is awful
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This isn't going to happen. There are certain maps killers would always pick or always avoid.
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Yeah, I gotta agree killers with no mobility tools are absolutely screwed on giant corn maps, you're almost guaranteed to lose if the survivors don't throw for example if you're Legion on a giant corn map like the one with just corn or the one with the barn. The matchmaker expects you to have Billy like mobility and if you don't you're nearly guaranteed a loss sometimes, and if you don't feel like playing a guaranteed loss and dc at the start you get banned eventually. It's just not fair, you can combat almost anything that survivors bring or do with skill and great use of your power but if you get a bad map vs good players it's gg. I understand there are bad maps for survivors too like the game, I'm not saying it doesn't need to be addressed and killer preferences are the only important ones but it's 1v4. I made this go too long but I'm tired and you get the idea, play a 115 killer on a standard map vs omega corn and you'll feel the difference hard.
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1) They wouldnt be able to just pick any map they want. Just from a random selection of 3-4. Theres nearly 30 maps in the game, there is tonnes of room for varience.
2) If there are specific maps that Killers always avoid, the devs should take a look at those maps and rework them because if nobody plays those maps theres obviously something wrong with those maps.
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And that's what the devs are doing. This game is largely about randomness. Allowing the killer to pick the map, even if from a pool, is unfair. Completely taking any say away from a huge chunk of the game's population is not the way to go.
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Exactly why its not a voting system.
Its the choice of 3-4 random maps.
Survivors shouldnt get a say in map picking anyways. Killer's are the Entity's chosen and the maps are the Entity's realm. It makes zero sense for Survivors to be able to pick maps, both in terms of gameplay balance and in concept.
Besides if you want to talk about "unfair" how about the fact thats its a total of 16 perk slots vs 4 perk slots, or that Survivors have a total of 4 offering slots, while Killer gets 1. But thats not really related to this discussion anyways.
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Randomness is a large part of DBD, but its to the detriment of the game, not benefit.
DBD needs less RNG overall.
Generators, loop setups, and tile locations are enough variance.
There doesnt need to be the type of RNG where "whoops you got a bad map, now your choice of Killer is severely crippled"
Thats bad RNG and should be removed, which is exactly what having the map selection pool would do.
Saying Killer being able to choose the map is "unfair" is completley ridiculous.
Getting screwed over before the match even starts because of RNG or because a Survivor took an offering, now thats actually unfair.
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I just wish map offerings were removed entirely
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I think it's good as it is.
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I don't think there should be a voting system. I think that in the lobby where everyone readies-up, it should show which map everyone is about to enter. Much like other games like Paladins and Overwatch do. That way, survivors can adjust loadouts as needed, and the Killer player can pick a decent killer for the map as needed.
And then just get rid of map offerings since they would be useless at that point.
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So the killer decides which map we'll go in everytime?
Oh yeah, let's go to Shelter Woods everytime. I don't think so.
Killers can also pick a map offering or are you not taking that into account?
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No point in arguing with someone who sees zero middle ground.
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Also, I'm not sure if you don't play survivor or what, but plenty of times the RNG screws over survivors as well. Not everything is about the killer.
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For a fix maybe add a ban/avoid system, like matchmaking preferences siege had for it's players. Not an outright ban but it's more like "avoid this map more". If a map gets "avoided" into oblivion by everyone then guess what, It means the majority of a Playerbase hates it and it needs some touching up. Outright bans would be too much and nothing as is right now is just not enjoyable especially at high ranks where a certain map can make or break you.
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Honestly... I rather they just rework the maps.
Then, no one would need to pick a map, because you can do well in all of them
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A random selection of 3-4 maps out of 30+ isnt going to make the game stale. Its still plenty of varience.
Also I have already stated the issue with offerings.
I'm a Survivor main.
So you didnt read the post at all.
Its from a random pool of 3-4 maps, chosen from the 30+ maps in the game.
They cant just pick whatever they want.
And again, I already explained the issue with offerings.
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Theres always going to be maps that a Killer is going to be better or worse on.
Like Hillbilly is always going to be crippled by maps like Hawkins and Lerys because they are tight, close quarters maps where he cannot use his power effectively.
Thats not an issue with the map itself, its an issue with the RNG.
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How are you ever get better with a certain killer on a certain map if you just opt out and never try? Hard pass for me. Let's all try to get better and learn from EVERY game.
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It doesnt work that way. Again, the big example is Billy on indoors maps.
No matter how good you are with Billy, he is objectively crippled by those maps.
You cant just make all those walls magically disappear.
Some maps and some Killers will just never work well together no matter how well you play.
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Huntress on Lery's, The Game, and Lampkin Lane would like to say hi.
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Hell, no.
Not more reasons to Lobbydodge - want to play as Billy, get: Haddonfield, Lerys, The Game, the new Map.
Also not really cool that Killers would basically always be able to pick their best Maps. Thats not how this Game should work. Like, there is Rotten Fields in the Rotation? I will pick Billy. Lerys? Lets go for Hag.
I mean, let the Survivors do the same. But hell no, this is a Killer-sided Forum, we only cater to Killer players.
Just let it be random Maps. I also dont want to play on fking Rotten Fields or Lerys, but have to. Same with Map Offerings, they are fine. It is not the case that a Coldwind or Haddonfield Offering is burned every game from Survivors, I see them very, very rarely used.
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Everyone will be have a different disadvantages with different maps. Do your best and learn and adapt. You did not come into this world with the innate gift to always have line of sight and no walls in DBD. That would be silly. Learn and grow from the tough matches. You have a one shot down and awesome mobility ffs.
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That is ridiculous then.
If a certain map is unpopular, that should be a big red flag that the map is bad and should be reworked.
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"Not more reasons to Lobbydodge - want to play as Billy, get: Haddonfield, Lerys, The Game, the new Map."
That would be astronomically unlikely that all 3/4 maps would be bad for the specified Killer.
"Also not really cool that Killers would basically always be able to pick their best Maps. Thats not how this Game should work. Like, there is Rotten Fields in the Rotation? I will pick Billy. Lerys? Lets go for Hag."
Map selection would be AFTER the Killer player's choice of Killer is locked-in. So you cant just see The Game and say "haha time to play Nurse".
The Killer player choose their Killer/build, everybody readys up, and then after its locked in the the player is given the choice of the maps.
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Again, if specifc maps are globally unpopular, that means theres obviously some major issue with them and they should be reworked.
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People have given you good objections. Just sounds like you want an easy mode at this point...
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1) No, they really havent.
2) I have given counter arguements to their objections.
3) "Doesnt want Killers to be crippled by bad RNG" does not equal EZMODO. There should not be a mechanic that just cripples the Killer before the match even begins, and having maps be random is exactly that.
Again, I am primarily a Survivor main.
I used to play both equally, but I quit playing Killer because why continue to play the weaker side. However BHVR has been making a lot of good changes lately, and removing map RNG would be a big benefit for the game and would get me back into playing Killer.
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Maps like Lerys, The Game, and Hawkins are more specialized maps. They work very well for some Killers, but not so well for others.
They have their own niche, and thats fine.
The maps that should be reworked are the ones that are universally unpopular. Maps no player ever wants to pick regardless of Killer or build choice.
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It's good as is. I wouldn't want to never see a map again because it's never voted.
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The map should just always be the realm of the killer unless an offering is being used
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I know I'm still only a fairly new player but I really enjoy the random maps. I don't want a choice or to even know before I load in.
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That would take away the Suspense of not knowing what Killer you're going against. It's even worse for Killers who rely on a surprise factor, such as Myers, GF or Wraith.
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Killers shouldn’t hold the power to pick whatever map they want. I really don’t wanna bore myself playing on Lery’s 50 times over and over again because killers seem to love that map.
I agree that some killers are too map dependent like Huntress. She has like five good maps.
It still gives an advantage for killers because they can choose Blood Lodge as Huntress or Lery’s with Myers every single time.
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This would be insane for some Killers, in a good and bad way. LIke Billy would probably be happy to get to Coldwind-Maps all the time. Nurse would also not be bad on her Map or Realm, but its kinda meh to remove the Possibility to have a Map vs Nurse, which is not good for her.
And Huntress would suffer a lot, she has the worst Map Control and will end up on really huge Maps.
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There are also heavily killer favored maps like "The Game". They just need to rework some maps.
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I’d rather not have killers permanently stuck on their maps. It would get boring and repetitive especially if you main that killer.
Some killers just have terrible maps. Pig would always be stuck on The Game and Myers on Haddonfield. The random chance of what map you get is fine how it is.
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The Game? Killer sided? That’s funny. There is like 15 safe pallets that are not able to be mindgamed. That map is TERRIBLE for killer. If you have Spirit Fury/Enduring combo it is okay but the map is so boring. All you do is kick pallets all game then the round is over.
“Woo! Yay! We love The Game map!”
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Let me see all the Survivors.
Let me see their names.
Let me see their profiles.
Let me pick the maps.
Have you ever heard of a choosing beggar?
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I think that there sould be a 3-4 maps pool that survivors go on a vote to ban, if there is 2-2 votes, one of the two is picked "randomly" to be banned. Then, the killer chooses one of the other options.
This has some rules like "2 maps of the same region (exp: rotten fields and thompson house) can't be in the same pool, just 1 of them appears.
This can go really well along with the map reworks, it's also a way for the devs to see which maps are more unbalanced/unfun to play.
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This is a terrible idea, reason why I love this game so much is the random map selection, if Killers could choose the map they wanted then we would see more of one map and barely one of another. Reasons why I stopped playing other games where everyone could vote a map they want, it will just be another thing that would become Meta and break the game even more. The Enity is the one that chooses the realm and map it wants and since most killers are just pawns to the entity, it would make no sense lore wise that they would be able to choose.
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I certainly wouldn't want the killer to be able to just pick. You bet your ass if I'm playing Myers and I see Lery's and The Game pop up, especially the game I'm putting on scratched mirror. And am going to have a field day coming out of no where to slap survivors in da face.
There are maps that I hate as survivor, and maps I love. As survivor I'd always want to go to the Crotus Penn Asylum with the big circular building in the middle. It's balanced landing, loop heaven to me. I'd always want to avoid The Game or Lery's. Or that what is it Macmillian Estate? With the giant tree in the middle of it that seems to have no pallets around?
Let it be random, also survivors rarely put on map offerings, and even less put on multiple of the same offerings to attempt to go to a certain map. Killers also get more bloodpoints on average than survivors, so as long as you are using those blood points on the killer, they will have more chances at getting map offerings to begin with.
As for picking the killers dedicated map. It doesn't work on certain killers like Leatherface, and Ghostface. Also certain killers got butt maps. Not a fan of playing Haddonfield with Myers at all.
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Then only hillbillies would pick cornfield maps
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And you forgot that "The Game" is the map with like the best totem spawns in DbD. Additionally it's the smallest map in the game. Safe Pallets? Go with Brutal Strength or a viable killer and you 4k nearly every time on that map.
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Actually Springwood has taken the crown of “best totem placement”. Lery’s is also good. Also why does it matter about totem placement when good survivors are gonna not care about Ruin and mow through the gens and spread out? Totem placement doesn’t mean jack when the map is total garbage.
A “viable killer”. Who? Nurse? Spirit? Those are the only two killers that can deal with those pallets and even Spirit HAS to break a majority of them. They are “safe pallets” for a reason. There is literally four extremely safe pallets in one area. The room above the bathroom and the hallway beside the bathroom. The map is not killer friendly when you bore yourself by breaking 18 pallets all round.
Yeah...I guess I’ll bring in Brutal Strength for the off chance I get The Game map. Not a very smart idea.
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Did you really just try the 4:1 argument because they're proving your points to be invalid? That's a....pretty bad defense to go for...
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No.
Then you'll just have people mastering the one map type and only playing that over and over. Take the quote from Bear Grylls; "Improvise. Adapt. Overcome."
If you don't like playing Treatment Theatre with Billy, then learn to play better on it and improve as a killer thinking outside the box. I've seen plenty who have done this. It won't come straight away and might not be easy but if you practice enough, you'll be grand.
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The devs want the game balanced, not for one side to be op.
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welp, guess Haddonfield would pretty much die with that change.
i dont see anyone actually picking this map xD
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Springwood is much bigger than the game. Totem spots are kinda ok. Lery's got equally good totem spots, but is way bigger too and got a huge vault problem.
You are right about the safe pallets, but when the gen in the room of the game is completed, one becomes unsafe. I see like ~50% of the pallets on "The Game" are mindgameable for all killers. On most maps it's around 30%. Additionally, the map is the smallest Map in the Game. Even when "Mother's Dwelling" would've got 90% mindgameable pallets, it's still a ######### map, because it's huge. With killers without mobility aka all unviable killers, the map is pretty nice
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