Decisive Strike and instagrabs
Can we make it so that any action that would instantly put a survivor on the killer's shoulder won't trigger DS? Just got unhooked? Run into a locker. Killer camping when gates are open? Just dive right in there and get nice and greasy with it. Keep DS as an anti tunneling perk, but get rid of these free escapes from instagrabs.
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Don’t tunnel then lol
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Can't really avoid it if they just run right into you after being unhooked. It's more problematic during endgame. If I hook someone near the gate and camp because I can't do anything else, they can just dive the hook with BT, forcing me to grab them, boom DS, both escape.
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Then do a basic attack leave them on ground and wait for a bit
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60 seconds. DS has nothing to do with tunnelling.
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Don't tunnel. There is a second guy chase them. And if your going to pull the "DS can still be active" Then there is no point in the survivor going into a locker because the timer will soon be up.
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60 seconds. DS has nothing to do with tunnelling.
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The don't tunnel argument is so stupid. 60 SECONDS.
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It’s 60 seconds after you get unhooked so if you go after them after the unhook that’s tunneling
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yes 60 seconds. Let's ignore the fact that in those 60 seconds a multitude of things can happen you go after the unhooker down them. Most killers run BBQ for blood points so finding another target separate from the DS user is pretty simple. You might even be right next to someone who is not a DS user. Then if you do you can simply hit them if they try to interact with you.
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Saw a clip recently with 3 survivors pretty much trading out on a hook right in front of the exit gates. Eventually, they ALL had an active DS. Gate was open, so slugging wasn't really an option. The killer tried slugging one guy and picking him right before he got out... But got DSed.
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DS shouldn't be able to activate in the exit gates. At that point you're not tunnelling, you're denying an escape. Otherwise DS can easily become broken since 60 seconds is a lot of time, especially with a gate already open. You can basically be unhooked anywhere on the map and still make it to the gate with seconds to spare on most maps.
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I feel if you are struggling to get the kill when the exit gates are open you probably don't deserve the kill.
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What’s wrong with that?
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They can hook dive with zero consequences. If they healed you have to grab them, or they unhook the person, most likely with BT. You grab them, their DS activates, they both escape. They can just trade places on hook until everyone has DS. Again, it's not really problematic during early/midgame, but once the gates are open it gets really problematic.
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While a lot can happen in a minute, that's still pretty close to be chased after an unhook. There are other targets, and even gens that need kicking. DS already has conditions to activate and counters. Don't pull them from a locker if you're afraid of a stun, although it's better to eat it early than save it for the end game where they can safely unhook their camped teammates. It's supposed to stop someone from being re-hooked within a minute, which I feel is a fair perk and also takes up a slot.
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All of the "don't tunnel" arguments are bullshit and are most likely coming from Survivors who need the free escapes or just want to be toxic. 60 seconds is a LONG time in DbD. You can do whatever you want and not get punished for it. If you or the unhooker makes a bad play (like jumping to a locker when the Killer is too close, running in front of you, or unhooking when the Killer is nearby and can down both you very quickly), then you don't deserve to get away for free. You deserve to get hooked again.
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DS doesn't need a nerf. It's already very situational and most killers just slug the person after immediately downing them anyway so it's hardly that effective. It only works on desperate killers that are tunnelling.
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It’s not problematic. They saved their ds for endgame, now they escape, nothing wrong with it.
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A bit broken really, since 60 seconds is enough to traverse the entire map with seconds to spare. DS shouldn't be able to trigger in the exit gates.
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Ds is fine, devs are not going to rework it again, get over it.
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DS is a 1 minute killer immunity perk not an anti-tunnel. It is not fine.
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It is not broken.
There is always a risk when saving DS - it might be possible that the Survivor is not able to use it later, because he might not get saved or will get slugged at this point. Saving DS for later CAN be good, but there is no guarantee that it will pay off.
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Every single argument about the new DS being OP boils down to killers wanting the perk to do literally nothing if they have half a brain cell.
Current DS has counterplay. If they run into you, slug them. If they jump in a locker, ignore them. 60 seconds isn't really that long of a time.
If you do a lot of things before coming back and downing them again, then their DS will be close to being gone so just leave them for another ~15 seconds then get them.
People just can't seem to get it in their damn heads that the perk is supposed to put you in a power position for 60 seconds after being unhooked. If you don't want the survivor to use that against you, then don't ######### with that survivor for 60 seconds, period.
Sometimes the perk is going to put survivors in a guaranteed escape position near an exit gate. If you've let yourself reach this point of desperation, you probably don't deserve the kill. You could have downed the person unhooking.
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Whats the new changes?
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In 60 seconds someone can crawl to the exit if they are close enough. It's a free escape no matter what.
How about the killer AND the survivor get a skill check at the same time? If the killer AND survivor hits it, it cancels out. It adds some skill and chance to the mechanic. If the killer misses, he knows it was his fault and oh well. Maybe next time.
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While Skill Checks are called Skill Checks, they have nothing to do with Skill.
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You can avoid it, by going after the other person unless you are willing to wait 60 seconds at a locker.
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How do you avoid it in egc?
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if downed by the exit gate you are screwed, but if they aren't just wait a bit and once they get close to escaping pick them up. There is a chance it went out/They become sacrificed.
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So I'm just screwed since they run to the exit gate anyway
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Well you could run unnerving presence if you dont want to get hit by DS
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It's really only good on doctor if your only using it for ds its a waste of a slot
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Oh no, you can no longer SeCurE a KilL in the endgame, must be really sad.
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You should at least be able to get one kill in egc honestly it shouldn't work in egc
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Why? You should earn your kills, not just stand in front of someone on hook with no counterplay to it.
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There is nothing to do during egc anyway and people run with borrowed for a free save and the unhooked person body blocks and has ds its dumb
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It’s not. You didn’t get a kill during game, why do you deserve it during endgame for free?
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I caught someone at the end of the game why do you deserve a free escape which it does
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it's only potentially a free escape for the person being unhooked. If you played better you would down the person unhooking them instead of the person who got unhooked.
If you're concerned about a multiple active DS problem. Leave people slugged a bit before you hook them to drain a load of time off of the active currently active DS(s)
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Honestly DS is very weak unless you are tunnelling or desperate.
Recovery should translate into % of wiggle progress and Ash's (Flip-Flop) perk should just be a better version of that. Would end the slugging counter against the tunnel counter.
The dev's could then improve Iron Grasp. The game needs more hard counters to change up the meta.
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I'm talking about endgame ds which is a guaranteed escape especially if the unhooker has borrowed
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But that’s the problem right? The killer is the power position not the survivors. DS is single handedly controlling the meta of this game.
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Decisive at least needs there to be a condition if someone is hooked before you, DS deactivates. It's meant to be anti tunnel, but it's far more than that.
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So you dont know that this is easy outplayed with another cheap way of playing killer? Think again.
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Oh look, someone who has a "new" argument.
It's new design was designed with one purpose. Anti Tunneling. If you hook someone, you aren't tunneling.
Slugging just makes it unfun for killers and survivors. You shouldn't encourage slugging because a perk exists.
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It makes me sad to see that people are getting hit by Decisive Strike so often that they complain about it. I get hit by it once per day, and only because I lost track of which survivors I hooked and which ones I didn't. If you tunnel so much that Decisive Strike is a problem for you, then YOU are the very reason this perk exists in the first place.
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Believe it or not, it is intended that perks affect how you play and create different and interesting situations. DS isn't controlling the meta of the game. If any perk is controlling the game's meta its adrenaline and ruin.
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If they are downed before someone else is hooked then DS activates.
If they are grabbed this doesn't apply so no doing a gen in the Killers face.
Someone else being hooked first always prevents the perk from activating, and will otherwise stay available forever if no one is hooked (unless it gets triggered obviously).
Problem solved, that would make it anti-tunnel.
If the Killer goes for the unhooked Survivor then they could chase them forever and slug them forever and DS would stay active.
If the Killer goes for the unhooker then he doesn't even need to worry about DS's existence
If the Killer loses both Survivors and later runs into the Unhooked then they still need to run in order to avoid being grabbed, but can still save a health state if they do.
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Without having a stopwatch timing when the survivor was unhooked, would you really have thought to slug in this situation?
Flashlight Laurie gets unhooked at 1:35 and, after hooking two other survivors, I get DS'd by Flashlight Laurie at 2:34.
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