6 Gens instead of 5
For those who don't know, Gen rushing is when the Killer does not have enough pressure to distract all the Survivors so when you are chasing 1 Survivor the other 3 give no shits you're nearby and just do Gens and then by the time you get that guy down 2 or 3 Gens are done.
Gen rushing only exists because the Killers are weak, the Killers are not equipped to put on the necessary pressure they need to slow down Gens. But what if the answer to this problem is simpler than we think it is?
What if, instead of making Gens take longer they just increase 5 Gens to 6?
There are 4 Survivors so they already have to multi task with that 5th Gen but adding in one more will increase the amount of focus THEY need to put in instead of the Killer. Increasing the amount of work the Survivors need to put in will ease off the amount the Killers have to.
Now I firmly believe in the ''2nd Objective'' because Gens are boring, they are SO BORING. But if they want, BHVR can experiment with doing 6 Gens instead of 5 and see how those games go, how fast do those gens go and does it make it too hard for Survivors? One possible way to do it is that from Rank 20-10 you get 5 Gens but from Rank 9-1 you get 6 so that way the lower ranks will generally get better the more they play and the stakes are raised by 1.
Alternately they could turn this into a Secret offering for Killers to add in 1 Gen, then everyone will have to ponder whether it is a Mori or a 6th Gen.
THE PROBLEM
Now there is a problem with this idea, right now the amount of Gens on every map is 7 so to keep the 3 Gen strat they will have to increase this to 8. I don't know if that will make things difficult or not, some gens already appear in some spots and not others so maybe it won't be a problem. I can see this being a problem on The Game and maybe Haddonfield but those maps are getting variations in the future so maybe not. On that note I can't possibly see how they can make The Game map any different since it is literally a complete square made up of smaller squares unless they have permission to turn that square into an Octagon.
Comments
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N, and I cannot stress this enough, O
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Gen rushing doesn't happen because killers are weak. Genrushing happens because players are bad.
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i think its a great idea especially the rank idea with the gen
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And sometimes just plain rng
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I think the second objective would be a good idea, I’ve mentioned it on forums before to have a gate relay to power the gates, but that should only start on blue ranks. Red ranks would have a relay for each gate
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Luck is big part of it.
People shouldn't take it personally when they have bad games. Sometimes you have bad luck.
Problem is people tend to take it personally and think the devs themselves are screwing them over when they have a bad game.
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I actually really like this idea. I think I would really enjoy getting a 4k in literally every trial when I play killer!
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I'd rather not hold M1 for another 80 seconds. No thanks.
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I don't want to either but we have not seen any indication at all from the Devs that they are adding the fabled 2nd Objective so we might as well try to come up with ideas for them and maybe they'll take credit when they find one they like.
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Decrease base generator time and this wouldn't be such a nightmare for survivors to deal with. :)
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Not a bad idea, thank you for actual real constructive criticism that few people in this thread have given :)
I still think the Devs would need to test this internally way before even considering putting this into a PTB as this could be too powerful.
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If a gen repair time is 80 sec, maybe bump it to 60 sec if the offering was burned and have 6 gens required? Make it take longer but not irritate survivors too much with holding M1 for 80 sec 6 times
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What happens when one trick survivors deny its existence though
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I really like the idea as it gives a little and takes a little, it seems to be the popular suggestion.
If they decrease Gens to 60 seconds then toolboxes will have to looked at including the percentages of perks like Resilience and Prove Thyself as they may cancel out the benefit of 6 Gens since they would make Gens go even faster.
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Wait, this just hit me, doesn't that mean the 3-gen strat is now a 2-gen strat?
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You didn't read the whole thing lol I say at the bottom that this means that the 7 Gens we always have will need to be increased to 8.
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Sorry, I typically skim through threads when they are long, so I might miss a few things! D:
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No. Gens are already boring as it is, i dont want to sit and hold R1 for another 80 seconds.
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Actually, the general consensus on this thread is to nerf generator times for the killer to 60 seconds. :)
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Killers already have a UR offering as well as an extra rare and uncommon offering while survivors have none. They don't need 2, and I highly doubt a 6th gen needs to be added. I mean unless you want to give survivors an offering to remove a gen. Otherwise that gives killers 4 offerings that survivors don't have a version of.
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Ngl, i kinda skimmed over what the op said and didnt see that it could be an offering, and that gens would be reduced to 60 seconds.
With that, I actually think it would be cool (as an offering.) Itd spice the game up more in a good way i think.
Though the thing is, some maps might have to have generator spawn spots changed just because of this offering- imagine giving the killer a 4 gen set up, or them purposely only protecting them?
Btw, i think gens should stay at 80 seconds, and that you have to complete 5 (for the base game.) I like the idea of the offering though.
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It's all fine, I skimmed over the thread too XD
I didn't see the idea of an offering too and thought someone suggested the idea within the thread.
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Nah. Most matches we can’t even get all 5 gens done WHAT MAKES YOU THINK WE’LL FINISH 6?! don’t wanna get gen rushed put on ruin or thanatophobia...heck even no ED...killers always wanna whine about something to get survivors nerfed into the ground...you can see all the gens highlighted just walk around and you’ll find em. Don’t camp OR tunnel and you won’t get gen rushed. (P.s. I’m in a game with ghostface and he killed EVERYBODY with all 5 gens left. No hex’s. He used thrilling tremors and I’m all ears. Rank 15.) just sounds like you need practice my guy.
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Give the Survivors an offering to remove a Gen? So give Survivors more of a chance to do the Gens faster?
That's not a good idea, sure giving Survivors 1 more Gen would increase the difficulty but not by much in the high ranks. In the low ranks I did mention just keep the 5 gens.
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Your game is normal for Rank 15 but over in Rank 1 you can down 1 guy, slug them and then hook another and still get 2 gens done WITH Ruin. It gets much more difficult the more Survivors get better, the better you get the easier it is to do everything and harder it becomes for Killers to do anything. You'll see that when you get there.
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Seems like a low rank problem because once you get to high ranks, killers like Ghostface get gen-rushed pretty hard. At high ranks, you have to be on your A-game when playing a mid-tier killer plus some luck. :)
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Like someone said before, gen rushing happens because players are either bad or way too stubborn. If you’re a killer a this one player is making you run across the whole map, why do you even keep running after them? There are another 3 out there.
Now adding an extra gen thru an offering would be cool if that added a downside to it... maybe losing a 3rd of your hooks
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I play with a rank 1 all the time and im rank 7 so...yeah.
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I’m a rank 7 and I play with a rank 1 all the time..we’re on Xbox and the killers are OP.
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So you a 7 and 1 played against a Rank 15 Killer and lost eh.
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Except an offering would not be something you could only use in certain ranks, and killers also have moris. I think a survivor offering to remove a gen wouldn't be worse than the fact that killers have way more offerings than survivors do that impact the game FAR MORE severely than survivors do. We also have to think of all the survivors nerfs that have come and are coming, because they are coming. We can't just nerf them on top of nerfs to stealth and looping and vaulting and literally EVERYTHING survivors do.
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Please can we just get a second objective that doesn't involve holding M1
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Have you played Killer at Rank 1?
You ever totally trashed even though you tried your hardest?
Ever have all your traps as Trapper get disarmed because someone has Object of Obsession and sees you place down every single one?
Ever play Clown and constantly down everyone, I mean down everybody, breaking pallets, you are dominating, then everyone gets out because the match lasted 6 minutes.
You ever play Leatherface, you know that camper wit the chainsaw who can instantly down you? Do you always win?
My goodness, MICHAEL MYERS!!! He can instant down EVERYONE with 1 shot! Do you have a 100% winning ratio against Rank 1 Survivors who broke your Ruin 10 seconds into the match and never let you out of Tier 1 so you only get to Tier 2 when there are 2 Gens left and then LOL everybody ESCAPES 🤣 You couldn't use NOED because they broke all your totems, they had 4 instant heal Med-Kits and they all left through the Hatch because they found a KEY.
Killers have it so easy, Survivors are the absolute hardest faction to play since the struggle of putting a square block into a square hole.
You are right :)
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
Highly doubt they ever inflate match length. The devs have provided stats several times over two years and it's always come out as survival rate below 50%. Meaning 2K's are the most likely outcome with 3Ks happening sometimes and 4Ks happening rarely.
(I figure these have probably changed by now as it's not often I see less than a 2K lately) But that's anecdotal and completely dependant on player skill.
What I think will happen is optional objectives that take a lot of time but increase blood point rewards, sort of like the events.
The issue we see is there are a lot of killers to play, and killer players wanting to be the "Jack of all trades" and spread their time across a bunch of killers instead of focusing on one means when they do poorly because they aren't good with that killer they then make threads about how tough a certain killer is, this is why player skill on the killer side imo has drastically declined. Why be good with one killer when you can whack Noed/Ruin or any combo with those and 3K most games with any killer?
There used to be LITERAL infinites & every loop had double windows & double pallets AND SURVIVORS STILL DIED. The game has only gotten easier, it's just players refuse to be an expert with one thing and want to play everything.
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So apparently survivors are supposed to stop doing gens when killer is around. I didn't know that.
Maybe give survivors a reason to detach themselves from the gens (Like Idk go chase them off the gen) and then you'll add this thing called map pressure.
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There used to be LITERAL infinites & every loop had double windows & double pallets AND SURVIVORS STILL DIED.
Before I comment about this quote, what are you trying to say exactly?
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Exactly! That's the point, Ruin, Thana, Dying Light, totems they are all designed to try and get Survivors off of Gens but totems get found super easy so they don't work as well as they should. Clown can only focus on whoever he is chasing while Legion can chase everyone if they were actually fast. Every Killer is good at what they do but they were never designed to be as strong as Nurse or Spirit they were not designed to be able to put pressure on all the Survivors.
Clown was only ever meant to down 1 person at a loop while Pig can put traps on everyone and slow down Gens. Both of those two Killers are just normal M1 Killers but the differences are huge because one of those two actually has a way to pressure every Survivor while the other cannot as they are designed to.
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What do you mean? There used to be areas the killer couldn't catch you, literally.
There is none of that any more and you still have killers wanting more and more time in the match to prevent survivors getting even one escape.
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That would be 6 x 60 = 360 seconds.
Currently we have 5 x 80 = 400 seconds.
We are talking about making the situation less bad for killers, not making it worse.
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I think better map design is the solution.
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Gen rush exists because survivors are being nerfed and now they can't stealth. In the direction this game is moving in few months we won't be able to loop too, so this is a race against the clock and if we want to survive we only have time to do gens as quickly as possible.
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Pressing M1 for 6 generators is not the most exciting thing to do. I'd rather have 5 generators and second objective to have some dynamic gameplay than having a boring 6 generators game. Gen rushing is IMO quite player dependent. If you get that early game pressure by downing someone fast (Which I know can be very difficult if you have sweaty rank 1 survivors). I remember playing against a huntress who did not have slowdown perks and does not have inherent slowing down abilities. However, she was able to stop genrushing through snowballing the team. You don't need ruin to slow down players as good survivors or good gen jockeys will just push through. However, you may still get a team that will hesitate to do generators when confronted with ruin, so that's where the RNG comes in, your player pool.
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How about we just decrease the gen time to 50 seconds and make a new secondary objectives that are super fun for both sides?...
No?
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Just NO. 5 Gens are already hard enough to repair if the killer knows what he does, despite being one of those OP killers. Just stop complaining about Gens. Its fine as it is.
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The statistics revealed by the devs does not support your argument. The weakest killer in the worst map has a kill rate of around 45-50% in rank 1.
It seems like you tend to remember the frustrating experiences (which is normal) and forget the matches were you got 3-4 kills easily.
What you explained happens when you play against 4 very good survivors. If you are playing a low tier killer, there is little to nothing you can do to win these matches. Adding an extra gen or increasing gen times won't help you win those games. The outcome would still be the same.
This would only make playing survivor more miserable and help carry mediocre killers to ranks where they don't belong. Then they will come here to complain that the game is not balanced.
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Ah, I see, yeah I agree. I feel like the only thing left are map reworks, smoothing out some killers, and in my opinion, second objective. :)
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Try playing a Clown at red ranks with no gen control perk
I think you'll change your mind
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I agree.. Sometimes you down survivors like dominoes but the gens are still done so quick.. Not all killers can go through the map like the nurse. 6 gen would be reasonable.. The thing is playing killer is becoming more of a job rather than a fun game.. It's stressing. Only the killer can be 'bullied' and the whole team laughs at the killer. This shows how much powerful survivors are compared to killers( which is suppose to be the power core of the game).
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I feel stupid for even signing up for this forum nothing but survivors crying how boring gens are and thinking nothing needs to be fixed. Everyone’s answer is “git gud” when I’m 100% sure If that is your answer then you don’t play both sides. Map pressure only works with killers who can either down fast or traverse the map quickly. Trapper,Wraith, Clown, GhostFace, Legion etc all suck with the ladder. I play both sides and I’m a person who likes challenging games, this game is just filled with entitled people and it’s sad. Both sides need adjusting and BHVR should see that.
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Yes, in some situations the match will be a dominant victory for the Killer even with the worst Killer.
I myself stopped playing the way others do a long time ago. My main tactics revolve around torturing Survivors and making things very difficult for them, forcing pressure without needing to be everywhere with maximum focus.
The problems I usually state are problems others or myself have and those are always on matches with a playstyle I myself don't like using. I like the Basement strategy myself, that creates pressure on Survivors and thoughh the Gens still go quick I still usually have a winning or at least long game with 2 kills minimum. When I'm not doing that I really enjoy using combos for slow Gen speed like Thana and Dying Light on Freddy or experimental combos on Pig. These things work for me so I stick with that.
The community is apparently incredibly divided about this game more than I had thought, I am shocked to see how many people actually think this game is fine and balanced and that the Gens going quick is always the Killer's fault when in reality it isn't, it's bad game design and like others have stated, map design. If the maps we got were more procedurally generated than they are now, like even more random that could really help with Gen speed because everyone knows that when a new map comes out the gens always go slower because no one knows where they are.
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