Let's end this play injured phase
Injured survivors should do everything slower. Move, repair, cleanse, heal, ect..
I don't think it's to over the top to suggest that taking a axe in the back should slow a person down until they are mended.
Thoughts? I know you have some...
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I don’t think so, playing injured is a risk vs reward kinda thing. You stay on one shot but don’t need to waste time healing.
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I agree with @GrootDude Its literally a risk vs rewards play-style.
Its honestly situational when to risk not healing to work on the objectives... Usually this is good to do when you're on a generator with someone else who can heal you after or something.
There's even builds centered around not healing so they get speed boosts in action speed. Its honestly just something that you the Survivor can decide is worth healing over or not in a Trial during the right times...
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If it's a problem for you, try running thanatophobia.
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Not really a risk. The reason why anti healing became meta is because survivors have multiple lives. Dead hard, Adrenaline and Decisive are the best examples.
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Yeah, but Dead Hards baitable, Adrenaline is an end-game thing... and Decisive is easy to avoid if you're not tunneling.
If you're injured off the hook, and for whatever scenario involves you finding the Injured person first with DS, you can just hit them and than move on so someone wastes their time getting them.
What I'm referring to is just in-general risk when you won a chase or off the hook, you can get someone to heal you or assist them at a generator and than get healed. If you built a build around the concept of being injured with 99%, you can just self care when the Killer comes to where the generator is.
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They could at least test it. There is code in the game that would reduce a Survivor's max movement speed when injured if it were used.
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bad idea
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Legion exists, so does Plague.
You'd see riots in the forums for days if they did this... if its a significant change than why change it at all?
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Why, once injured there is alot that plays against you,
- Literally a killer can follow your blood trace from the other half of the map and finds you easily.
- You screams due pain
- Once hooked escaping from the killer is just difficult, even more if they decide to tunnel or camp
- Clear bright maps are just too much for bloody survivors
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@GrootDude & @FireHazard I understand your points, and they are good ones, but there is something to be said when one can benifit from playing injured. I personally think it's wack there are perks that encourage it. I get its a risk VS reward, but builds can make it a lot more reward sided while in some cases eliminating the risk.
@Yung_Slug I don't play nurse so correct me if I'm wrong, but does that not only show healing survivors? If they are playing injured and forgoing being healed immediately, then no aura.
@Hozh I don't think blood is as viable of means of tracking as you think with out blood hound, which does help quite a bit.
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The only killers imo that are worth not healing as are: Plague and 1 shot intensive killers. Other than that, I disagree. You should always heal if someone cannot threaten the team with an insta-down. It's risk vs. reward, definitely, but many people don't heal over the slim cast that has one-shots.
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As much as I like anything that makes my job easier, I gotta back up the tree dude on this one. There are already a lot of downsides to running around injured.
And this fine person as well.
Thanatophobia kinda does what you asked for, which is slow down action speed based on wounds. It depends on how many people are wounded, though.
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... you know... for whatever reason I had in my head that thanat worked on 4% increments...
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It probably does, I just grabbed an image off search so I could put up the description without requiring an external link. I guess the picture I got predates the buff, since the wiki says this:
Patch 2.6.0
- Buff: changed the penalty modifiers to a stackable 3/3.5/4 % up to a maximum of 12/14/16 %.
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I disagree, there are survivor builds that are based around being injured, mostly using Resilience.
Killers also have Thanatophobia to punish injured survivors. Thanatophobia was already given a buff to counter this very issue.
And there are tons of downsides to playing injured. There are people here who are acting as if being injured isn't a bad thing. That's ridiculous. There are no builds that eliminate the risk of running injured. That is one less hit when the killer whacks you before you go down. You can lessen it with things like deadhard, but you do not eliminate the risk. Running around the trial broken is risky no matter what you say, and that's not even counting things like the blood trails and moans of pain.
The main reason this play injured playstyle came about is because of nerfs to healing. Killers who wanted those nerfs are to blame. The big healing nerf happened around the time MOM was released. So that just became a magical synergy that clicked in a lot of people's heads.
In addition, penalizing movement speed for injury basically means that every survivor is one-hit and dead. You are not going to be able to win a chase once you are injured, period. Or last more than a few seconds. Your suggestion also makes perks like No Mither even worse than they already are.
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O.o I cleansed one time and got told to fing stop ruining his fun lol I was like
tell bvdr cause they care more then me
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That is the root of this and probably most of the fun sucking, game ruining play styles. Knowing how to extend a chase takes all the most of the risk out of the "risk VS reward" balance.
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If healing was forced upon survivors via multiple debuffs everyone would rage quit against Legion - again (and against any other killer that gets easy first hits combined with an anti-heal build).
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I personally love the idea but because Thana exists they can't do this idea. I love the idea of being slower because you're injured, an injured person is in pain and doesn't want to move around too swiftly because it would hurt more.
Maybe introducing a slower speed while injured would be cool and it would encourage healing even more but then Clown might need to be...well nerfed. Clown can already slow down Survivors and if injured Survivors move slower and then his add-ons would be too powerful. Or maybe it would be just the right buff he needs, won't know until they try it out.
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The killer should become injured when I pallet slam them 3 times. Like previous posts state, its a reward/risk thing so let's leave it.
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You know when people healed a lot?
Before they nerfed healing.
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I forgot they did that, that was a year ago I think? Yeah they made Self-Care take longer, I think it used to be 12 seconds? I barely remember what the change was but yeah I remember it was a lot faster.
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You wouldnt have to deal with decisive if you didnt tunnel the survivor, you made the decision to tunnel and they used a perk slot to counter it thats a fair trade off.
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That's not the point, with ds the survivor is super safe for a whole minute. Plus sometimes you get DSed even if you don't tunnel.
Yes and no. Anti healing was already being played by strong players and streamers When Legion came out, people in the first days of the release stop bringing self care, since it was useelss, when they saw that they could play really well without that perk, even against other killers anti healing became meta. Most of the people needed an healing nerf to become better. The same reason is why we don't see "hit into pallet drop" anymore, since spirit fury was added.
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Theres a difference between "equip x perk to punish y" and "equip x perk to increase y's punishment".
Also thana is really a baaad example, since most people treat it as if it'd only collors the progress bar red. (Survivors have all the time in the world to just heal to prevent any real threat from thana)
Ds was buffed because some people ran enduring, why shouldnt injured be punished just because some run thana. You also forgot its a survivor issue, it'd result in massive nerfs to thana or other actionspeed reductions if injured-penalties would be implemented.
Off topic but the same currently applies to obsession. Being the obsession should not be desireable. But most obsession perks depend on the obsession being alive to work, thus increasing safety for them.
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The healing changes were introduced mid Chapter for Spirit. The Legion and Plague’s addition definitely is what caused this no healing Meta.
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And if survivors heal killers will complain, that they get too many health states. Sry, but this is just about complaining for the purpose of complaining.
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It's a case of damned if you do damned if you don't.
Players always used to heal in games it's just how it was. Players complained about that and how healing was Infinite and wanted it nerfed along with bugfa fo certain pekrs like sloppy. Many of us and even Horvath explained on a stream that people healing wasted time as it took them off gens but that was brushed off as the devs were afraid to nerf healing.
Now it has come full circle and after the players got what they wanted with a nerf to healing peole are complaining some players prefer not to heal. It's a strange situation when you got what you wished for but it didn't work out as many explained.
You cannot punish someone for putting themselves at more risk if they so chose too. If a player can run someone when injured just as long as someone at full health then maybe that's down to them simply knowing the tiles better than who they verse.
The concept of someone simply being better at a game seems to be a thing of the past and its lost within complaints about every little aspect of the game that players blame instead of how they personally played.
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Wat? Who ever complained that survivors heal in 2019? If you're talking about insta heals or old MoM they're not simple health state.
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@twistedmonkey I'd like to say I never complained about healing, as I am aware it took them away from doing gens
"You cannot punish someone for putting themselves at more risk if they so chose too. If a player can run someone when injured just as long as someone at full health then maybe that's down to them simply knowing the tiles better than who they verse."
Even if both killer and survivor knew the tiles perfectly, the advantage usually goes to the runner until they zig where they should have zaged.
I'm complaining about injuring a survivor after an extended chase, to then be lead to a dead part of the map so I must break chase and now they have the potential advantage. Especially if they have not yet been downed and there team mates are still alive to rescue them.
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Bad idea.
1. Thanataphobia does this for you.
2. Survivors are at risk when playing injured
3. Dead Hard is easy to bait and DS is a joke unless you tunnel. Even then, slug to avoid.
4. If you did this, the survivor population would drop significantly.
5. If you implemented this, you need to reverse healing nerfs to balance it out.
6. I like the no heal meta as it makes the survivors easier to pressure and down.
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To be fair that's just smart play by the survivor and baiting you into that zone.
As a killer you need to be one step ahead of the survivors which is harder from the start of a match with standard M1 killers but each pallet destroyed creates a less safe area.
Herding is a common tool used by killers as most loops have a safe and unsafe way to run it as they want to use the tiles to waste time and move to another safe one with a pallet. If you can make them run in such a way that moving to the safer tile meana taking a hit you are forcing them to the more unsafe tiles.
There are safe, unsafe and mindgamable loops and it's about knowing where these are like those survivors and playing one step ahead.
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1. I'd then have to play nurse to make it teachable, then unlock it in the web with my preferred killer. Then I'm running a perk to induce (what I feel) should be a base mechanic.
2. As @DudeDelicious summed up quite well, that "risk" of being downed, which is the only real threat a survivor faces, can be easily reduced.
3. I'd be happy if they just moved slower while injured, and maybe got more of a boost after the initial hit to give them a good chance to lose the killer. Then there would be some actual risk to playing injured. Cause anyone who does now, has come prepared to do so and mitigates majority of the risk.
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Ummm....yeah, you'd have to unlock it, but you don't to play her. My Nurse is level 1 and I have Thanataphobia. We all have to do that, it is call your toolbox. If you don't want to invest in making it better, don't complain about it later.
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The point I'm getting at is perks should be used in favor of a play style you enjoy. Not as a means of countering a metas. There are only 4 slots to fill and way more counters needed. Plus nurse is getting a rework, axe the perk and make a dumbed down version a base mechanic that only affects the injured survivor.
It's just what I want and I'm aware it's not a popular opinion.
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The metas are created by perks. The nerf to healing and healing perks created the no-heal meta. Perks also counter them. It is called tools. If you start hindering injured survivors, nobody will play survivor and we will go back to 1 hour lobby times as killers. Just stop complaining and use the tools that counter the thing you hate.
Personally, I like that they don't heal. It plays directly into my game. It is like running most of the match with NOED. I wish I was not colorblind, I'd love to see the blood pools of all those injured survivors.
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1. A lot of us have to run perks that we feel should be base mechanics.
It's that entitled mindset that we keep petitioning devs to make perks that we feel should be baseline into base mechanics.
What you want is just like how everyone wants Ruin to be baseline, NoEd to be baseline, Bond to be Baseline, Kindred to be Baseline, etc.
All of a sudden the game is just all the perks baseline and there are no more perks. That would be dumb as heck.
2. You can reduce the threat of being downed by playing well. What's the problem? That's how what a game is supposed to be like. If you learn the game and become more skilled, you become better at the game. You are acting as if this is a bad thing. It's not.
Basically you just want to punish survivors for being good at the game. So you can bring them down to your less-skilled level. That's ridiculous.
3. How about each time we drop a pallet on your head, killers now move 1% slower permanently for the rest of the game? That'd make me happy. I think it's fair, too. Cause now, you have to respect palletes instead of just brainlessly not respecting them. I mean, then there would be some actual risk to disrespecting palettes. Cause anyone who does now, has come prepared to do so with perks like Enduring and Spirit Fury and mitigates majority of the risk.
And just in case it went over your head (I'm sure it did) if #3 sounds stupid to you, well that's how stupid you sound to us.
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Easy cheif, nothing goes over my head. I am to fast, I would catch it.
Also I don't think it sounds stupid, unlike the rest of your arguments, which are just strawmen falacies. I don't think any of the mentioned perks need to be base kit, just that injured survivors should be slower. And there is a difference between playing well, and using poorly designed maps with explotive perks to makes chases last fooooor ever.
I bet you think nurse and spirit are OP too don't ya.
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Running around injured against most killers feels like a waste of time to me. You save what, 16 seconds? Most chases are longer than that, and you just halved your potential chase time by giving the killer one less down.
Note I said most killers. This is a different issue when talking about Plague. There you got a choice of the above or turning her into a machine-gun huntress.
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This Isn’t necessary at all.
There are tools which already slow you down if you’re injured that coupled with the fact that being injured is very risky.
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