Do killers get an unfair amount of points?
It seems whenever I play killer no one usually survives and I have twice as many points as the best survivor. This tends to happen 50% of the time when I play as survivor (in reverse). Why do killers get so many points when survivors are playing hard the whole time as well. I don't believe you get enough points for staying hidden from the killer. It's as if behavior wants everyone running around chasing each other the whole time.. when you would think a survivors whole purpose is to stay hidden as best as possible.
Answers
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It’s killers having unfair bps it’s survivors because survivors have to get them in completely different categories where a killer can get a lot of points in every category in just one chase
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How dare Killers get points! I mean, they have to depend on finding survivors, chasing Survivors, hitting Survivors, hooking Survivors, and hoping to the Entity those Survivors don't DC or just suicide on first hook.
But how dare Killers actually get bloodpoints! This is a Survivor-only game! :P
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The Survivor to Killer bloodpoint ratio is really unbalanced. On top of that, Killers have a really good perk that also gives them double bloodpoints, while Survivors have to sacrifice a perk slot if they want double bloodpoints, because We're Gonna Live Forever does literally nothing. I'm not saying to reduce the amount of bloodpoints that Killers get, but they should give Survivors more bloodpoints. Also, We're Gonna Live Forever should have a secondary effect that affects gameplay.
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No.
Just because survivors have less (arguably - they need not invest in add ons AND they get into new matches much more quickly than killers, who must wait until all have perished or the last survivor chooses to leave) it does NOT mean killers have more.
On the contrary, as a low rank killer, I tend to score LESS than survivors who were higher and better (and, usually, less gracious) than me. When survivors dc, killers score lower too.
Both sides could use some bp buffs. Why for Entity’s sake does Plague earn so little when theoretically she should be raking in bp? Why no bp for recovering, wiggling, using Unbreakable etc.? Why don’t dcs just grant wglf and bbq their bp stack?
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Survivors are 4 players and often kinda compete for points in certain categories. If someone runs the killer for 5 gens it'll be hard for anyone else to get boldness points besides totems which are limited in number, and if you get chased all the time it's gonna be hard for you to get objective and altruism points. The killer is one player and doesn't compete with anyone else like this. So it just sorta makes sense they often end up with more points.
In matches where a lot of spread out action happens and everyone gets the chance to do a bit of everything the points are often a lot more equal, but that's not how every match plays out.
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Killers have a lot more work to do, and they don't leave the match until the game is over so it just makes sense, but I'd say the amount of blood needed to grind everything in this game is atrocious. We should all be earning double or triple what we do all of the time just to make the grind a reasonable thing, and they should triple the cap of 1 million, too.
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You received 24,863
Survivors received 39,460
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Right. . . so the guy having to play against four other players shouldn't be compensated for the amount of work put into that. You do realize there is a perk called Prove Thyself, right? Doubles points earned when working as a team? Helps with that gen rush that's all the rage these days?
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Its not a zero-sum experience. The amount of points one player gets vs another has no effect on the other player.
The game needs more killers, and a lot of the reason people start to play killers is for the beefier point distribution. If you take that away, you'll see longer queue times for survivors.
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Most killers rely on addons, but survivors aren't really reliant on items or addons. So, logically killers should get a bit more blood points than survivors.
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The question you should be asking is: Do survivors get enough bp? If the answer is no then suggesting ways to increase the bp survivors get would be a good thing to do.
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This.
Also there's not a whole lot killers can do to earn BP compared to survivors. Basically just finding survivors, powers, hit, hook, sacrifice, kicking gens, breaking pallets, and chase.
Survivors: Powering Gens, Unhooking, Heal (2 Different States worth), Totems, Stuns (Flash/Pallet), Struggle, Protection Hits, Safe Unhooks, Escaping Grasp, Escaping Trial, Powering Exit Gates, Hatches, Sabotaging Hooks, Basement Time, Being Chased, Disarming Powers (Ghostface/Hag examples), etc
There's a lot more for survivors to do than killers and there's 4 of them. If you lower BPs for killers there's just going to be less incentives to play as killer (and the incentive is rather low at the moment), which will lead to higher que times (as if it wasn't high already).
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Those pictures just prove that survivors can earn a lot of bp in wildly unbalanced lobbies and against inexperienced players playing weaker killers. As you rank up to the point where both sides are forced to complete their objectives more quickly, killers clearly and consistently outpace survivor bp gains.
63% more bloodpoints divided among 4x as many players...Yeah still seems pretty bad
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How about Sairek's example
84,383 to 27,855
The OPs example seems like a quick match where they died quickly without doing much else.
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No it is not unfair. Think about it like an investment.
Survivors CAN choose to enter a match with items, add-ons, and offerings, but often choose not to. Thus anything they do in a match is pure profit.
Now killers. Yeah that killer brought an Iri and Purple add-on, but that's 13k bloodpoints spent to do that. Tack on an Ebony mori for 1-hook mori plays and that's 20k bloodpoints spent with almost nothing gained from the investment. If a killer is LUCKY and 1-hook moris EVERYONE in the match, they'll be lucky to break 25k gross, 5k net profit. Most likely they won't even BREAK 20k and most likely will have lost bloodpoints on the match.
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Are you saying a killer using add-ons and offerings isn't a choice, but it is when survivors do?
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Theres definitely a difference between killer and survivor addons. As a survivor, I typically bring medkits. I can use the same medkit over and over, as long as I escape the trial. When I run out of medkits... I farm more with pharmacy, lol. As a killer on the other hand, each time I use addons I know those are going away no matter how the trial went.
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I do think survivor BP needs to be a buffed a bit more across the board.
I also think too many people regard the survivor experience in a very individual, selfish way, when by design survivors are basically treated as a hive mind and need to think in group terms. Like, if you die, but everyone else escapes, it was still a victory. It doesn't matter what happened to YOU, it matters what the group outcome was. And the group outcome in this scenario was that survivors earned more BP than the killer.
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Exactly.
Killers tend to get more points because their scoring categories all work together. Survivors on the other hand are competing for points in two out of the four categories. Add in the ridiculously low amount of points some things give you and naturally survivors get much less.
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The survivor point gains are just funny imo.
-throws down every pallet on the map- MASSIVE POINT GAIN!!!
-insures the unhook you just did was actually SAFE-... heres 500
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There's multiple reasons.
In general Killers have to do much more per game but this aside Killers loose their Add ons every game no matter what.
As a Survivor you keep whatever you escape with and earn more points to buy more items and add ons. As a Survivor you never really run short on items and add ons unless your dying consistently. Then you have chests as well, Realistically survivors never have to go a game without Items and can start stashing them very easily.
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They really don't make sense. Repair 3 full gens by yourself. Here's 3,700 points.
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Had a game last night with an afk nurse. My teammates all found the nurse, started a chase by running in front of her and vaulted a thrown down pallet to get points.
In all seriousness though, I wish more points were given for SAFE unhooks. I dont think you should get ANY points if the guy is downed 0.5 seconds after his feet hit the ground. Get the full amount as a safe rescue, and it may encourage people to be smarter, or even take a hit if need be.
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Survivors have the ability to get on par with a killer. Problem is your competing with 3 other people. Solos tend to get more BP in my exp then of playing as a SWF.
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I always try for a safe unhook. Unfortunately at end game you have to be less picky. You either let them die, or try to take the hit. My altruism emblem got wrecked in a match early because of that. It's to the point that I'm going to have to level up Bill for Borrowed Time.
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I play sneaky, so typically... Im in and out before the killer knows where we went. If I screw up though and unhook someone while a Myers was ACTUALLY closeby but I didnt notice him... Im not just gonna split and let him chase my injured teammate. I'll tank a hit and give the guy a chance.
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"I don't believe you get enough points for staying hidden from the killer. It's as if behavior wants everyone running around chasing each other the whole time.. when you would think a survivors whole purpose is to stay hidden as best as possible."
Things like BP and points towards pipping are rewarded in such a way as to encourage fun gameplay for both sides. The game's not going to reward survivors points for just staying hidden from the killer all match, because that's not how the game is supposed to be played. The game wants survivors interacting with the killer.
If the killer never sees a survivor all match, then that match wasn't fun for the killer. The game's not going to reward/encourage that.
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If the killer couldnt find anymore, that's the killer's fault. The game shouldnt be hitting anyone's points or emblems because they didnt get found.
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Well, for most killers, if they don't find anyone all match, they get zero points. All their points are earned through interacting with the survivors. The survivors can still walk away from a match like that with 15k. So... the survivors still have the better deal.
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And thats completely acceptable. If you failed to find and down your targets, you SHOULDNT get pity points. Git good at tracking, bring whispers if ya need. The game shouldnt be holding the survivor's points hostage because they didnt throw themselves at the killer.
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Like I said, the game doesn't want to encourage survivors to just hide all match. If a survivor hides around the map, touching no gens, they shouldn't just accrue points for staying out the the killer's TR, because they're not really playing or participating in the game at that point.
The game doesn't encourage stealth. It gives killers a bunch of tracking and aura perks. The survivor's objective is to do gens to escape, and killers see gen auras. Killers see the exit gate auras. Everything in the game tries to make sure survivors and killers interact.
Survivors can still even get Boldness points without the killer. The only thing that absolutely requires the killer is Altruism.
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I never said give survivors points for doing nothing. If I did gens, got unhooks and heals, opened the exit gates under the killers nose, ect... I should get a decent amount of points. I shouldnt have to be the Neon colored Nea that "got tunneled all game for some reason".
As far as aura perks goes, the game also gave survivors tools to COUNTER those perks.
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Considering killer's have to face 4 opponents, seems like a fair trade to me. Especially considering how much harder they work at the higher ranks.
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Look at their perks, they're using all general and personal perks for the killer they're playing, which denotes they are probably inexperienced. One of your pictures has you playing 4 teachables from different characters showing that you have experience as a survivor.
Inexperienced killers can't apply as much pressure giving you more time to find scoring opportunities and making it more likely that you'll be able to max out certain scoring events.
Rank doesn't directly affect BPS, but a difference in skill level certainly can.
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I'm not saying the game does the balance well, I'm just saying that's what it's trying to do and that's why points are awarded the way they are.
The game's design is flawed. It's a horror game: as a survivor, the fear would come from being helpless and hiding from the killer. That's fine when the killer is an NPC. When the killer is an actual player, then hide-and-seek doesn't work, because if the killer is just wandering around on a map strugging to find anyone, then they're not going to have a fun time, and if players aren't having a fun time, they're not going to play. Fewer players = less money = no game.
BHVR doesn't know how to encourage survivors to interact with killers organically within the game itself, so they just have the scoring system reward survivors for doing it. The survivor can play how they want and earn fewer points, or they can play how the game wants and earn more points. It's a choice. Just like killers can choose to bring a mori and have fun slaughtering survivors but earn fewer points, or they can keep survivors alive longer and earn more points. The longer survivors are alive, the more fun the survivors have, so the more points a killer can potentially make. Again, it's a choice, and it's there for both sides.
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Glowing Nea with clicky clicky flashlights runs in a circle afew times
Game- TAKE ALL THE POINTS!!!!
Me...fixing a generator while feeling the breath on my face of the killer who still hasnt noticed me
Game- you can have 3 boldness...
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As they should. They completely failed as a killer. That's like saying the survivor caught and found in 30 secs. And died on first hook deserves points for dying.
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If they're the obsession, they get points for dying... Dumbest thing ever.
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So basically what should happen is that you deserve the points that u worked for. And as a survivor some categories dont reward the amount it should like doing a full gen by ur self should be worth something.
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In first place who cares.?
Why r upset about a survivor getting 1k points....? Out of 32k???
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The point isnt the actual point value, but rather the fact that someone actually gets points for dying. Im always gonna find that dumb. Was the obsession like 3 times in a row the other night, cuz my buddy kept bringing DS, and it just turned into a running joke. "But hey...I got that obsession bonus"
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The Killer does have to play against 4 other players, but 1 Survivor =/= a Killer. 4 Survivors = a Killer. You're making it sound like all odds are stacked against the Killer in an unfair 4v1, when the game is quite honestly pretty even. Because of this, I think Killers and Survivors should get roughly the same amount of bloodpoints.
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It's 1v4 and it's far more stressful to play a killer than it is to play survivor, unless you're in the pleb ranks (which ironically the people who often complain about this stuff, and how killer is easy, tend to be located). Killers are also in the match the entire time. You have a lot more to deal with as a killer and therefore you are rewarded more. You have to play different killers, different powers, and so on. Depending on how you as a survivor play and the killer, you can walk out with 20k BP in your games as well, even if you die.
If you want to suggest a fix for this "problem" I suggest buffing the amount of BP both the survivor and the killer gain per match. This doesn't seem like a bad thing considering how many perks flood the game.
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This is unfair because survivors have a lot of incentive to risky behavior if they want BPs. It may be a mechanic assumed for the dynamics of the game, but it is rather unfair.
A game where the survivors are never chased by the killer, where they do not have to heal, where they have no one to unhook... it is objectively a good game, but that will offer very few points.
I think some changes are planned for the next update, but I do not think that's enough.
It is quite possible to imagine a category rewarding the game of hide and seek without abuse. When the survivor is near the killer while the killer is not chasing another survivor. It could also be interesting to increase the gain per second with proximity. Few if the survivor stays 30 meters away from him, a lot if the killer walks in front of the locker where the survivor is hidden...
And of course, rethink We're Gonna Live Forever. It gives no real advantage, it encourages to go unhook while survivors are already running after all these BPs, and encourages to take hits instead of another, which is interesting but not the easiest thing to do.
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I mean at the end of the day a lot of those choices are survivor choices. Healing is meant to be something you do in the game, as a way to slow the game down, and it also gives you points. But due to the state of the game it's also beneficial to simply not heal yourself. That alone says there's a problem, when the game goes fast enough and you're so unthreatened you don't need to heal, or the killer can't hook enough people, or whatever it may be.
It really wouldn't be difficult for them to increase the points of destroying a totem by a lot more, for healing yourself, or just increasing the gains you obtain from doing objectives that are normally ignored for the sake of speeding up gen progress. I personally think that they should adjust the things that make healing yourself so tedious, to the point it may also be avoided and hinder the killer themselves - like running Sloppy Butcher. But eh, my suggestions are endless for how to improve the basics.
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Killers get a ton more points, feels a little unfair but frankly I don't really care, I stopped caring about Blood Points a long time ago.
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What kind of ridiculous reasoning is this?
If a Survivor enters the match with a purple item and addons and offering he spends some 18k bringing the junk into the match.
Then he gets killed in the first minute and makes 2k blood points. He is net loss 16k.
This fact doesn't change just because he is a Survivor.
Get your killer-sided logic out of here.
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Actually no.
Survivors cannot earn as much as killers. Killers can get into the 30k base BP mark if they do really well. And this while uncommon is certainly not unheard of. And I've seen man killers do this.
Survivors cannot get 30k base BP even if they play God's Perfect Game. Theoretically a survivor can hit 32k but I have never seen one in game and I see 4x as many survivors as killers per game. There simply isn't enough opportunity to do so. Even in farming games with full killer complicitness I never see a Survivor get over 30k BP.
And that's before all the bonuses. Survivors don't get as many BP bonuses as Killers do. And doens't take into consideration that Killers generally will get much more BP in a normal game than survivors will.
The two images you posted are ideal best-case scenarios where the killer didn't do too well while the best survivor (not even all survivors) did really well. This is not a common occurrence and in fact is incredibly rare.
And that's fine. The killer does a lot more in a game on his own than an individual survivor will. It's water under the bridge for me.
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I think what makes killers usually get points easier is how the game-flow unfolds in a game of DBD:
All of the actions the killer does to gain BP are the same for them succeed in their objective (sacrifice survivors), and they kind of seamlessly link and flow into one another.
Find Survivor>Chase>Use Power>Hit>Hook>Repeat
The killer needs to do no more than what they have to do to win the game to max out (or nearly) all of their BP categories.
On the other hand, survivors are usually pushed into doing one or two of the main categories they need to max out their BP. Some of them are reactionary and depend on how well the killer does (altruism) and are not directly their objective to survive.
For example:
If you are chased all game, you will max out on boldness but get nothing on altruism and objective points.
If you do gens all game, you will max out objective but get nothing on boldness and altruism.
If you save/heal people all game, you will max out on altruism but get nothing on boldness and objective.
Sometimes you can do a bit of each, but unless you're farming you will virtually never max out on all categories. Which is something the killer can do in a regular game but hooking everyone 3 times and using their power effectively.
So it is not that killers get an unfair amount of points, it is that survivors get an unfair amount of points.
Just give the guy who is being chased some lightbringer points if a gen pops while they are in chase. Or some altruism points if someone safely unhooks someone else while you're fixing up the gens. Survivors are supposed to be one team after all, so they should gain points as a team instead of only as individuals.
PS: I know this already exists with stuff like "Distraction" and "Assist" BP events, but we need a lot more of those, with a lot higher BP gain.
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