BHVR treats solo players like garbage
I just checked out Apex legends and saw this:
They added ammo icons in the HUD for everyone, so as solo player you know exactly what type of ammo your mates need and you can help them out to find them. And this wasn't even something requested much from the community but everyone is very happy and thankful for that. And this is just one little example, they have many stuff like that for solo players.
Now, BHVR doesn't give a crap about solos in DBD. We requested so many QoL changes but nothing gets done. Why is a free game providing so much better support for these details and why not DbD?
BHVR doesn't care, that's the reason. Simple. Otherwise we would have gotten the HUD improved like chase indication, gen indication, total totem counter etc years ago. But we haven't. We are constantly asking for that stuff but nothing happens, it's still like 2016.
Heck, they didn't even try out the kindred basekit idea in a PTB even tho many many experienced players agreed that this would fix multiple problems at once.
Comments
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At first I thought this post was going to have more then just asking for HUD changes, like actual solo player experiences. Whether you get grouped with SWF or just 3 other solo's, I find especially in red ranks players are much more careless then around purple or green ranks. What I mean by that is they will usually prioritize doing a totem, opening a chest, before pulling you off the hook. And i'm talking like against non-camping killers, they legit just play like this because. It's frustrating.
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Also an interesting comment from a reddit user:
"Apex is setting the bar too damn high for other games (regarding non-verbal comms). After playing Apex I think every game needs the different pings we have here (enemy, loot, looking at, etc)."
And he is truly right. Playing apex solo Q I don't feel in a huge disadvantage against pre mates on voice chat, it feels very fair balanced. And then coming back to DbD it's like playing a completely different game when you switch between SWF and solo Q. This is THE main reason why DbD will never be balanced enough so everyone can enjoy playing no matter what role he takes.
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Do you mean potatoes as team mates? If yes: that another issue we solo players have. The ranking system allows potatoes to rank up to easy which makes it very frustating to play with randoms against very skilled killers.
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I'm not entirely sure it's just potatoes, but I know what you mean. But i've even seen some of the better survivors behave this way and it's frustrating. I don't think for a second before i'm already running to hook to help someone out, it's just mind boggling.
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In light of recent events, I would say Nurse mains have been treated the worst.
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I think increased things like chat, pinging and hud changes are not necessary in this game. You aren't supposed to feel like a team in there, you are supposed to feel despair and alone and confused etc..as for potato team mates there is nothing you can do there im afraid - you get them in Apex as with other games no matter how many pings or hud changes, if ppl are ######### they are #########
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As much as I want this to be a horror game, it's not a horror game. There's a bit of tension for a few matches when you first start playing, but after that it's pretty much just a PvP game. The killers aren't creepy. The maps are all bright as daylight. And SWF have voice coms to turn it into a party game. As long as there's such a huge gap between SWF and solo, there's no way to really balance the game. The devs will keep balancing killers to not be too strong against solo, and killer players will be miserable because they get stomped by SWF. The only way to bridge that gap is to give solo survivors more information.
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Surely once you start feeding someone information that tbh if they have any common sense you should know anyway, then isn't that going against the main tone of the game? It's not an Esport - its about surviving and making best use of the tools you have at your disposal.
As a solo survivor what information do you want ? what information do you think would benefit you that you cannot already get in the game? @TragicSolitude
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Dunno exactly. A start would be base kit Kindred that shows survivor auras only when someone's on the hook. Players dying on their first hook is something I see constantly in my matches.
Adding a totem counter to Small Game would be helpful. Not even asking for that to be base kit, which for SWF it basically is.
Giving some sort of BP bonus to Borrowed Time would be nice. It's a strong perk when survivors bother to run it, but usually I'm the only one who ever does, so then I'm the one who dies because they unhook me in the killer's face. Something like a BP bonus might encourage selfish solo survivors to run it.
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Ok so lets try and see
- Base kit kindred - Would this just be ONLY for solo survivors or Duos? Trios? but not for SWF? Or would it be for every survivor always to know where all of their team mates are at all times?
- Totem counter I could get on board with - I digress that the game is designed to disorientate you so giving you paint by number counters may be slightly against the ethos.
- BP to Borrowed time bonus - cant really see how this would improve the solo player game - I do question some peoples eagerness to unhook someone or not bother at all. I think personally a better idea could be to raise the chances of a kobi off the hook if you are a solo survivor (not by much though)
Personally i'm not seeing much here that you cant already do in the game and it almost feels like people want to have some kind of arcade mode for solo survivors where there is minimal difficulty, there are perks and enough triggers within the game for you to make educated guesses on what is happening - I do this myself when im in a SWF and when i'm out. I think the game already makes good on what people are asking for - personally I just see it as people are looking for ways not to have to use perks so they can tier ######### instead of using stuff to survive like the game expects.
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They were strongly considering making Kindred base kit. But then, they brilliantly came to the conclusion that "perks should never be base kit." And instead, proceeded to do absolutely nothing at all.
So yes, if you want your fellow solo survivors to have something even remotely close to what SWF has, you must use an entire perk slot.
So much wrong with this game, where simple fixes could go a long way. What do we get instead? A Fornite-style battle pass.
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Alright, I can explain why.
In the event that the ruin totem is right there, or there is a possibility of a noed, it's actually the better idea to cleanse the totem before the save, as long as the person on hook can survive that long. Because once someone is unhooked, the killer will come, same with opening a chest. Doing it before makes sure they can finish before the killer comes.
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Your logic is absurd. This game is not scary. It is a competitive asymmetrical game with a horror coating.
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@Psychopathy if I have the time and the totem is like in front of a hooked survivor - I will always do the totem first before alerting the killer to the unhooked survivor - it just makes sense doesn't it ! so I agree
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and I agree with them - lets make sprint burst base kit, self care, hell lets do it so all the survivors can see all the totems, all the generators, all the team mates, the killer and chests every single game as base kit. Cos that'll improve the game ofc - I think people asking for basekit stuff to be added to the survivors should learn to be good at the game with no perks at all then add them on - they are there to give you "some" assistance in your fight against evil ! If I had my way thre would be no perks at all
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You are completely disregarding that certain perks are far better than others. More importantly, you are disregarding that certain perks become unnecessary in SWF because that information is readily available on comms. Far more information is available to SWF, that is not up for debate. Maybe you should think that through before telling people to "learn to be good at the game."
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Firstly do not take my post in a combative tone - this is a polite discussion im having so calm down. I'm not disregarding the tier levels of perks, in fact I alluded to that in my post. I don't disagree that playing with friends is a benefit - I do question the level of skill still needed even in a SWF group as some of my friends are absolutely trash, no matter how much information you give them.
I think the game gives you all the information you need for you to be a successful survivor without having to use crutch perks, there is a level of skill involved and as you improve you get better the game and rely less on having to see everything single thing lit up on the map like its the 4th of July. To play without these things are Learnt as is technique and that is not up for debate either.
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Beautifully put @DudeDelicious
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But how do devs balance killers against that? That's the problem, at least as I see it. When there's such a huge gap between solo and SWF, and you yourself say that SWF is much easier, then a killer can't be well balanced against both.
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I wish I could see everybodies (besides the killers) perks before the match so I know if their perks help me in any way or not. I also hope next chapter they come up with solo que perks for survivors and SWF counter perks for killer
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I don't think the killer needs to be balanced against SWF at all - in fact I fail to see why you would balance the killer against SWF and not just against 4 standard survivors?
Thing is I don't think there is a huge gap between solo and swf, I think communication with SWF is useful as it improves timing, but other than that my potato team mate SWF party group are no better than the T3 Blendette who knows ######### she is doing. I think people look to SWF too readily and not at their own skill levels - personally. @TragicSolitude - I also think this is a good mannered debate about a hot topic within the game and needs some decent debate and back and forth.
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I agree. I hate it when people say it’s not horror. Like this game was scary when I first played it but over time I just got desensitized that it was no longer scary. You get use to it. Same goes with horror movies. They can be scary when you see it but watching it again you are no longer scared, but that doesn’t mean it’s no longer a horror movie. You just know what to expect.
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I play solo all the time and I don't have any problems; sometimes I escape and sometimes I die, but even if I die I pip or black pip most of time: plus my death isn't in vain many times because it buys my team time to power up the exit gates or open them and escape and I'm okay with that because we were playing as a team, if at least one manages to escape it feels like a win to me.
I don't know how you play, but I tend to always change my last perk slot to run things like bond and kindred and I always run we'll make it. I'm planning on running detective's hunch now that it has been buffed
If you are struggling playing solo I advice you to run perks like bond, kindred and better together on your last perk slot and always run we'll make it, that's an amazing perk.
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I love @Xerge - this is how you play solo and SWF survivor people !
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Debates are good.
SWF can bring so much to the table that even the best killer will have trouble dealing with them. They have built in Kindred, Empathy, Bond, a totem counter. They know when a teammate is in a chase and it's safe to work on gens, make a save, or open an exit gate. Then, they each get four perks on top of that. If you have four survivors who are great solo playing SWF, they're going to destroy a likewise-ranked killer,
From a similar viewpoint, if you have a bunch of boosted survivors who normally play SWF now playing solo, likewise-ranked killers will destroy them, making the killer seem OP.
Every survivor, whether on voice coms or not, should have about the same chance. An even playing field on which everything else can be balanced. Otherwise, solo survivors and killers are going to continue to be frustrated by the game's "balance," where solo survivors feel weak against killers and killers feel weak against SWF.
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also directed at the original poster @justarandy - I don't think BHVR treat its players like trash, I think DBD players treat DBD players like trash :D
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I invite you to play with my swf team @TragicSolitude - you wont feel jack all benefit from that xD
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@TeambossFloze lol that good, huh? I haven't played SWF that much, usually when I'm playing games on PS4 it's not to be social, but the few times I have I was surprised by how much better I performed. I didn't necessarily escape but I survived much longer, was able to do more during the match. It was almost like a completely different game.
It's just crazy that there are perks that are made completely unnecessary by using voice coms, but SWF don't have to sacrifice any perk slots. If the game took into account that people communicating are basically going in with Kindred, Empathy, and Bond, that would leave them with only one perk slot.
It's just, to me, it seems like voice coms shouldn't do work for some players for which other players are required to use perks. The perks exist because players aren't supposed to have that information without using the perks/sacrificing perk slots for them. In other words, players shouldn't be able to use voice coms in the game while the game basically treats it like voice coms don't exist.
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Yeah BHVR have done nothing to close the gap between solos and SWF and it’s honestly so disappointing. I can’t even have fun playing survivor anymore unless I’m playing SWF, because I feel like I’m at such a disadvantage. I end up just playing killer to relax.
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- Solo and SWF are mechanically the same in-trial
- Any buff to Solo will also affect SWF to varying degrees. (100% or higher effiency)
- Survivors dont want the Solo-Swf gap closed, it's the Solo-CWF differences.
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I wans't referring to any of those situations, just normal hook status, letting people die for no reason.
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They said they were looking into "closing the gap between solos and swf" but we still have no update on this and it feels like they aren't doing anything about this at all.
Even if they just made kindred basekit it would be a really good change. Why did they even decide not to do this anyway? They should have at least tested it on the ptb.
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Strongly disagree, mostly your teammates treat you like garbage when you play solo.
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They also said they were looking into adding stuff like Rank Rewards but it has been 3+ years now.. I wouldn't hold my breath at this point. There's a lot of noise but little to not action.
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Which is really sad. Dbd has so much potential, imagine another leadership would be working for DbD, a leadership which is a hardcore gamer by themselves and cares about the community.. Just imagine where dbd could be.. It's sad, it really is.
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No point in dwelling in the past. All we can do now is looking forward to all the new upcoming skins and other macrotransactions coming in the future.
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Just a rocket League / overwatch style chat would be enough.
With custom messages.
I found hatch, gen almost complete, door at 99, I have a flashlight, omg key, Killer is looking for me, Basement!, Go for the unhook, heal?, Let'sa go, darn it, Stoopid killer, Stoopid teammates. And the post chat lobby selections of GG, tunneler, camper, nice connection, disgraceful McDonald's WiFi.
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I'm seeing some comments to the effect of 'its supposed to be a horror game' 'survivors should have feelings of despair' - basically just sounds like some people saying it should suck to play survivor and that survivors are just there for a killer to kill.
You will hear stuff like that from killers when survivors are disadvantaged ('adapt' and 'get good' are also things they will toss in). When killers feel disadvantaged those same people will cry about fair balance between sides and nerfing whatever perks, items, mechanics that survivors have to defend themselves.
In the end some killers just don't want to risk losing their easier games versus solos and the devs apparently agree, because there have not been any significant QoL advancements for solos for years. The feeling is trying to balance between SWF and killers, and letting solos make their own way - ironic as that sounds.
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Yes I noticed the same, those hardcore killer mains who think balancing swf and solo for a smaller gap is a bad idea just want to keep the ez wins against solos and they completely ignore the fact that reducing the gap would allow much stronger buffs for killers.
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DbD is not a horror game after 10 hours game experience, sorry to blub your bubble.
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@justarandy You may not feel that it is a horror game after your 10 hours of game experience, however it is a horror game, it is officially an Asymmetrical survival horror game. Wether it is scary or not is debated but to say it isn't a horror game is just a flat out lie,
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The point being, on a this thread discussing a subjective thing such as 'horror' is not a good justification point for explaining the solo disadvantage. They are still both games and both sides want a fair shake at winning.
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We won't get anything because it's against the vision of immersed Claudette crouching for the whole game. This is how you're supposed to play this game and it will be probably the only way to play when they will "balance" maps
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I just have one question for the people who keep bringing up the "This is an Asymetrical game"...
Do ALL Asymetrical games follow the same rules? Because I consider Friday the 13th an Asymetrical game as well, and in that game you always know where Jason is, you also have weapons to fight back...both of which according to some in these forums lose the whole "horror-asymetrical" aspect, which I disagree with.
Playing solo survivor is a nightmare as it is, not because it's fun or because it's a "horror" experience... and the very least they could do if they aren't going to add things like chase indicators is buff perks like Kindred. Add optional voice chat for the lobby sessions, I wanna know what my team is bringing without having to type it all. Those two alone would help tremendously.
This isn't just a horror game, it's also a survival game.
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Sooo, when luigis mansion gets "officially" called a horror game it's a horror game?
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Your idea isn't bad, but I figured out something better a whole ago, take a look into this: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/85354/bhvr-why-do-you-hate-solo-survivors-so-much/
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Short answer - yes
Will it be called a horror game? no it wont be. Is DBD called an asymmetrical horror game? yes.
Don't really see your point tbh
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@darktrix The point being, on a this thread discussing a subjective thing such as 'horror' is not a good justification point for explaining the solo disadvantage. They are still both games and both sides want a fair shake at winning.
I think the horror aspect actual is something that gives good justification why they don't just crutch everyone with perks so they can feel less sorry for themselves. The horror aspect is to create a feeling of despair, disruption and confusion on behalf of the survivor and the killers role is the opposite.
I disagree that everyone knows where Jason is in Friday 13th - You do when he is close but other than that you don't (same as DBD)
I do like the idea of having a few short commands like "follow me" or "help"
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@DudeDelicious 100% correct !
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We really need this
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