My take on the Q&A 3.
Hello, first, make sure to watch this, if you haven't.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zw-ReSg0Ol4
- Secondary objectives are a good idea. No project for it after 2 years of it being asked, however, is rather disappointing and doesn't make us think anything is gonna happen before at least 6 months, which isn't very promising to say the least.
- "Kindred" as passive for all survivors is just a buff to all survivors, including SWF. It's not closing the gap that much. Especially since Aura is WAY superior info than voicecom in general "I'm going for the save" is way different than being able to see who's the closest, who should go for the save and such. Not to mention the lack of mindgames and faster reaction of the team, and better coordination, which will make the survivor's team way more efficient, while it could have given room for snowballing before.
- WGLF not giving stacks & BP for unsafe unhook sounds pretty allright. May just force a BT pick but at least it'll give the hooked a chance in that scenario.
- Invincibility frame while being unhooked could do. But as not_queen stated : I'm not sure if you should unhook in the killer's face in the first place. Not sure why you would reward that.
- Faster unhook cancelling, I'm not sure why it should even be a thing. It sure is a room for more "mindgames" for survivors, and sure would help against camping to some extent, but it would also help with Bullying to some extent. Not sure why a HOOK mindgame should be survivor oriented. It's also a pretty huge nerf on Doc's grabbing, and most grabbing in general obviously.
- Dead Hard buff : a more responsive DH would be cool for survs. Tho, predicting it/being predicted while using it shouldn't be buffed, because that's the cost of it being on an activation button rather than automatic.
- Pallet stun speed increase : Could prove to be an issue, as it will transform a lot of mindgames into simple reflexes. While the survivor had to PREDICT to some extent (similarly to what the killer has to do, basically predict the survivor won't drop the pallet), now it may just allow reflexes to be enough. Not to mention a lot of experienced survivors are already hovering at the far end of the pallet, walking back and forward to make it a feint, that could be punished before that possible change, and may just not be, after it. Not to mention the looping aspect of the buff.
- Bloodlust nerf : As I stated above, that you probably read, as long as windows are so strong and lacking so much mindgames in several spots in the game, I doubt it would be changed. I can understand that BL3 is an issue as you can easily "cheese" a hit at some pallets using it, which is definitely wrong, but it also prevent extensive use of the same exact windows in succession. Basically punishes brainless play and force survivors to use SAFE pallets in order to pay for their extensive use of strong windows (that usually require no mindgames as they give full vision over the killer, and are usually surrounded by a lot of safe pallets anyway, aka Coal Tower entry pallet). Removing BL3 entirely sounds like a better option, overall, than nerfing BL2 speed, if you truly want to nerf something. You could easily imagine a simple time reduction (like 12-13s instead of 15) to get bloodlust, and only make it to have 2 levels, with the current values.
- The "Trap disarming" feature sounds very useless, as more traps are placed in tight corridors, and the disarming survivor will block the passage anyway. If the trap is not in a corridor, you can easily get past it considering the super small trap hitbox anyway. I'm not sure what's the thinking behind that, but I don't see any scenario when it could become handy to have that "feature". I'm not even sure survivors deserve it considering Trapper is far from being a huge threat, even post-buff, compared to the state you may want to bring him.
- The Statut reset/exhaustion recovery upon unhooking sounds both unnecessary and counterproductive. Unless you want Sprint burst to become even stronger. Not to mention it would make, in the case of you cancelling the "Mangled" status, to make a lot of add-ons to become obsolete. For example, the Billy Very rare Begrimed Saw and such, which would solely become Slugging tools. It's basically a nerf of its possibilities and strength that should at least be adressed/advised.
What's your opinion folks ?
Comments
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@Runiver said:
Hello, first, make sure to watch this, if you haven't.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zw-ReSg0Ol4- Secondary objectives are a good idea. No project for it after 2 years of it being asked, however, is rather disappointing and doesn't make us think anything is gonna happen before at least 6 months, which isn't very promising to say the least.
- "Kindred" as passive for all survivors is just a buff to all survivors, including SWF. It's not closing the gap that much. Especially since Aura is WAY superior info than voicecom in general "I'm going for the save" is way different than being able to see who's the closest, who should go for the save and such. Not to mention the lack of mindgames and faster reaction of the team, and better coordination, which will make the survivor's team way more efficient, while it could have given room for snowballing before.
- WGLF not giving stacks & BP for unsafe unhook sounds pretty allright. May just force a BT pick but at least it'll give the hooked a chance in that scenario.
- Invincibility frame while being unhooked could do. But as not_queen stated : I'm not sure if you should unhook in the killer's face in the first place. Not sure why you would reward that.
- Faster unhook cancelling, I'm not sure why it should even be a thing. It sure is a room for more "mindgames" for survivors, and sure would help against camping to some extent, but it would also help with Bullying to some extent. Not sure why a HOOK mindgame should be survivor oriented. It's also a pretty huge nerf on Doc's grabbing, and most grabbing in general obviously.
- Dead Hard buff : a more responsive DH would be cool for survs. Tho, predicting it/being predicted while using it shouldn't be buffed, because that's the cost of it being on an activation button rather than automatic.
- Pallet stun speed increase : Could prove to be an issue, as it will transform a lot of mindgames into simple reflexes. While the survivor had to PREDICT to some extent (similarly to what the killer has to do, basically predict the survivor won't drop the pallet), now it may just allow reflexes to be enough. Not to mention a lot of experienced survivors are already hovering at the far end of the pallet, walking back and forward to make it a feint, that could be punished before that possible change, and may just not be, after it. Not to mention the looping aspect of the buff.
- Bloodlust nerf : As I stated above, that you probably read, as long as windows are so strong and lacking so much mindgames in several spots in the game, I doubt it would be changed. I can understand that BL3 is an issue as you can easily "cheese" a hit at some pallets using it, which is definitely wrong, but it also prevent extensive use of the same exact windows in succession. Basically punishes brainless play and force survivors to use SAFE pallets in order to pay for their extensive use of strong windows (that usually require no mindgames as they give full vision over the killer, and are usually surrounded by a lot of safe pallets anyway, aka Coal Tower entry pallet). Removing BL3 entirely sounds like a better option, overall, than nerfing BL2 speed, if you truly want to nerf something. You could easily imagine a simple time reduction (like 12-13s instead of 15) to get bloodlust, and only make it to have 2 levels, with the current values.
- The "Trap disarming" feature sounds very useless, as more traps are placed in tight corridors, and the disarming survivor will block the passage anyway. If the trap is not in a corridor, you can easily get past it considering the super small trap hitbox anyway. I'm not sure what's the thinking behind that, but I don't see any scenario when it could become handy to have that "feature". I'm not even sure survivors deserve it considering Trapper is far from being a huge threat, even post-buff, compared to the state you may want to bring him.
- The Statut reset/exhaustion recovery upon unhooking sounds both unnecessary and counterproductive. Unless you want Sprint burst to become even stronger. Not to mention it would make, in the case of you cancelling the "Mangled" status, to make a lot of add-ons to become obsolete. For example, the Billy Very rare Begrimed Saw and such, which would solely become Slugging tools. It's basically a nerf of its possibilities and strength that should at least be adressed/advised.
What's your opinion folks ?
I feel that the status reset on hook isn't a good thing. Say the pig uses her add-on's to give the trapped survivor blindness and exhaustion. They now will be rendered useless and you just wasted two add-on slots for nothing.
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@Sally55 I doubt it would apply to the Pig, as the effects are applied as long as the survivor wears the helmet. Tho it sure would turn a LOT of add-ons into pure slugging add-ons, which isn't quite interesting.
Not to mention the effect on The Third Seal, an already Hilarious perk, that would become even more pointless.7 -
@Runiver said:
@Sally55 I doubt it would apply to the Pig, as the effects are applied as long as the survivor wears the helmet. Tho it sure would turn a LOT of add-ons into pure slugging add-ons, which isn't quite interesting.
Not to mention the effect on The Third Seal, an already Hilarious perk, that would become even more pointless.I agree. Third seal will basically become a waste of a perk slot. My concern is that this will bug out the RBT and cause status afflictions to be cleared even if the helmet is still on.
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@Sally55 said:
@Runiver said:
@Sally55 I doubt it would apply to the Pig, as the effects are applied as long as the survivor wears the helmet. Tho it sure would turn a LOT of add-ons into pure slugging add-ons, which isn't quite interesting.
Not to mention the effect on The Third Seal, an already Hilarious perk, that would become even more pointless.I agree. Third seal will basically become a waste of a perk slot. My concern is that this will bug out the RBT and cause status afflictions to be cleared even if the helmet is still on.
Well, as long as the QA team does its job prop... thinks about Tinkerer 2 nevermind.
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My Take on this Q & A. With the bloodlust nerf and pallet change that may come with the old positioning and the stun happening sooner.. I think it is absolute bullshit. As a survivor main & killer main, this is my take on the survivor side.
I feel like the current pallet system is a much improved and should be how it is. Honestly, after the pallet changes, I played more stealthy and resorted to jungle gyms and window loops over pallets. I used them as a last resort. When I did pull off a decent pallet stun after the changes, i liked it! It wasn't 100% mindless anymore. If these bloodlust changes come through, it'll be window city for most matches. i promise that.
As a Killer main, i feel like this is a big slap to the face and the devs are slowly caving in to recent review bombs. Maybe Deathgarden, who i heard is ran by a different dev team will STAND THEIR GROUND, THEY WON'T BACK DOWN! XD
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@ShrimpTwiggs
I agree with the fact SWF & Solo gap should be lowered since it's the only (sad) solution. But I doubt it's the right way either.
For the disarm, I guess it could be decent for the vaulting indeed. Not sure how often you would encounter that scenario tho.
I agree with the fact it should only affect Exhaustion, tho I still think that, in that case, Sprint Burst should be adressed and its impact lowered, as it would nearly become a MUST-HAVE compared to other perks in term of strength and effectiveness (even tho Dead Hard could do some nice tricks). The conditions for the other exhaustion perks just cannot compare to the "no condition" for SB.So far I mostly like the WGLF change for less toxicity/farming/sandbagging. I still suspect that sandbaggers and farmers will just bring out BT and play the same tho. But at least.. it's something ?
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The status effect thing should only apply to Exhaustion and Hindered. Every other status should remain, especially Mangled because then what's the point of using Sloppy Butcher or certain add-ons if it only applies for one chase. I also think they should re-ka-gigger Mangled and Hemmorhage statuses. Hemmorhage should basically do what Mangled does now, and Mangled should reduce repair time. Then add-ons like begrimed chains/hatchets would inflict Mangled and slow gens, and Sloppy Butcher can go back to just doing Hemmorhage but basically be unchanged in terms of it's effects. It just seems odd that we have this specific debuff for begrimed items that's not a status effect. It'd make more sense as a status effect, and then we could get perks or more add-ons that inflict it.
Regarding the Kindred stuff I think that's a bad move. Instead, you should just see other survivors only within say 16m of the hook. Then when you have those situations where everyone is circling the hook for the save other people can see someone in a better position and bait the killer to a chase, or just go and do gens or something more important. I think that would be more reasonable and would definitely help solo survs without being way too powerful for SWF. If you want full range and killer aura then you should have to run Kindred.
The rest of the stuff seems like good changes. I know killer mains will REEEEEE all over the place, as if they are the only ones in need of gameplay fixes, but truth is there is some BS stuff that happens to survs too, namely the new vacuum-less pallets favor killers way too hard. It's too easy to just swing through a pallet and almost always get the hit even if they dropped it at the right time.
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The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.
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@thesuicidefox said:
The status effect thing should only apply to Exhaustion and Hindered. Every other status should remain, especially Mangled because then what's the point of using Sloppy Butcher or certain add-ons if it only applies for one chase. I also think they should re-ka-gigger Mangled and Hemmorhage statuses. Hemmorhage should basically do what Mangled does now, and Mangled should reduce repair time. Then add-ons like begrimed chains/hatchets would inflict Mangled and slow gens, and Sloppy Butcher can go back to just doing Hemmorhage but basically be unchanged in terms of it's effects. It just seems odd that we have this specific debuff for begrimed items that's not a status effect. It'd make more sense as a status effect, and then we could get perks or more add-ons that inflict it.Regarding the Kindred stuff I think that's a bad move. Instead, you should just see other survivors only within say 16m of the hook. Then when you have those situations where everyone is circling the hook for the save other people can see someone in a better position and bait the killer to a chase, or just go and do gens or something more important. I think that would be more reasonable and would definitely help solo survs without being way too powerful for SWF. If you want full range and killer aura then you should have to run Kindred.
The rest of the stuff seems like good changes. I know killer mains will REEEEEE all over the place, as if they are the only ones in need of gameplay fixes, but truth is there is some BS stuff that happens to survs too, namely the new vacuum-less pallets favor killers way too hard. It's too easy to just swing through a pallet and almost always get the hit even if they dropped it at the right time.
Basically this.
Kindred would screw over killers if it was built into the base part of the game. Having so it would reveal survivors in a certain radius is a great idea.
The Blood Lust nerf is like the exhaustion nerf. Pointless. Only bad killers will be affected the most by it. Blood Lust was always a band-aid to fix the real problems (which was the maps).
Everything else is either to prevent farming or quality of life changes.
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@TheXenoborg said:
They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.
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@TheXenoborg said:
@Tsulan said:
@TheXenoborg said:
They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.
That shouldn't be hard to code, but then the devs don't know how to code, so I doubt it.
Fair point.
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What i get out of this is - the changes will promote more unbalanced game play. More bullying/blocking from survivors with the changes to unhooking them. More infinite looping, and with the blood lust changes far more of what i always called my "just fast enough rule"
Survivors will now find it much easier to make it to every pallet in the game, running from one to the other, making it just in the nick of time, every single time, and killers getting screwed over in the chase once again. Espeically the weaker killers with poor map control.
Nice one devs..
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Well boys if these changes come true, it's time to buy Deathgarden since they are not ######### pussys who lick survivors's butts and make killer useless! Cuz survivors really need buffs in dbd yes, they are not op, they cannot loop u for 15 mins in almoust every map, whilst killers are very op right devs -.-" just idiotic changes that they described in this q&a. BL nerf, pallet buff, survivors have kindred by default? killers no longer have hex perks, noed is deafult also ruin is deafult killer "perk", why not do that either? morons!
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I'd like for some more Hex totems other than NOED to be hidden, which would incureage survivors to hunt for them.
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Can't believe people are legit complaining about unhook cancelling and not being able to hit a survivor who can't move. You will ADAPT and GET GOOD.0
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Every single strategic move in this game is ######### bullying to some people.0
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The part that bothered me overall was 'trying to make solo play as balanced as swf'. I'm not totally against that if they balanced the maps and made them less survivor-friendly. But i heard nothing mentioned as to 'making killers more equipped to handle swf'. So i suppose this was yet another '**** YOU, KILLER. GO PLAY CIV 5'.
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My opinion on this Q&A is : PLAY ONLY NURSE OR SURVIVOR.
I can't really think of something else why bother play the other 11 killers when you can ignore this nonsense throw at you by the devs.3 -
@TheXenoborg said:
@MaxiferPriest said:
Well boys if these changes come true, it's time to buy Deathgarden since they are not [BAD WORD] pussys who lick survivors's butts and make killer useless! Cuz survivors really need buffs in dbd yes, they are not op, they cannot loop u for 15 mins in almoust every map, whilst killers are very op right devs -.-" just idiotic changes that they described in this q&a. BL nerf, pallet buff, survivors have kindred by default? killers no longer have hex perks, noed is deafult also ruin is deafult killer "perk", why not do that either? morons!"BHVR messed up balance in Dead By Daylight so I will go and buy Deathgarden which will speculatively not have balance issues because it is made by BHVR who know how to balance a game." What?!?
DG is BALANCED! it is made by a different BHVR dev team and you CANNOT win without team work in DG. it's the balance that dbd should have but never will cuz devs are morrons and are just buffing survivors more and more and more and more and more
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I would disagree about the kindred being better than voice comms thing. Kindred has a very limited range. I can tell my buddies, "He's camping" when the killer is just outside the radius with insidious, meanwhile kindred would not show that. Figuring out who's closer has never been an issue. I can very easily say, "I'm half way across the map, is anyone close to them?" and figure it out in a second. You'd still have to spend the same time looking around to figure out who's closer anyway, and you'll then have to figure out who's who so you can coordinate it (where applicable).
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@Peanits said:
I would disagree about the kindred being better than voice comms thing. Kindred has a very limited range. I can tell my buddies, "He's camping" when the killer is just outside the radius with insidious, meanwhile kindred would not show that. Figuring out who's closer has never been an issue. I can very easily say, "I'm half way across the map, is anyone close to them?" and figure it out in a second. You'd still have to spend the same time looking around to figure out who's closer anyway, and you'll then have to figure out who's who so you can coordinate it (where applicable).It still make coordination a whole lot easier, especially for things such as bodyblocking, instantly know who has to save, where to come from and such. A whole lot of info that voice com doesn't give.
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"We know SWF is unbalaned. We're gonna fix it. We're gonna balance SWF by making solo play just as effective. See? We need 4 ppl happy to play and one miserable bastard to host em. We ******* hate killers " - DBD dev team 2018
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@Runiver All I can say is I agree with everything you said. Have a good day
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Good Insights, OP.
I can see why the devs want to nerf BL - because of the technical issues created by such a big speed discrepancy between survivors and killer. But this nerf seems to undo the reasons for having it in the game as a "safety valve" to cut short endless chases in the first place.
Personally, I think that the BL nerfs could work if the speeds were reduced, but the times to achieve each BL level were significantly reduced - maybe about half: 9 seconds to BL1, 18 to BL2, and 27 for BL 3. You'd end up with the same BL2 we see now happening three seconds earlier - but no overpowered current BL3 potential.
Seems like a reasonable tradeoff to me.
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Kindred is much more powerful than most people think. The reason why it is not being seen as a powerful perk is because not all of the survivors use it in a match.
Survivors can say that the killer side also has got powerful aura reading perks recently but the killers need to sacrifice a perk slot for that. For bitter murmur which perk slot should I give up? BBQ? Whispers? NOED? Bamboozle? Enduring? Brutal strength? Ruin? I am not saying that kindred should be removed, what I am saying is that if you don't like getting camped then use it and sacrifice a perk slot for that, give up your sprint burst, selfcare, adrenaline, borrowed time, bond, urban evasion or iron will.
Survivors get something really cheap while killers need to make sacrifices constantly.
I am okay with pallet changes tbh. I think that the game should be more responsive both for the killers and the survivors.
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@deadwolfwalking said:
"We know SWF is unbalaned. We're gonna fix it. We're gonna balance SWF by making solo play just as effective. See? We need 4 ppl happy to play and one miserable bastard to host em. We ******* hate killers " - DBD dev team 2018It´s always about the survivors fun. If survivors complain that something is unfun, devs nerf it (Freddy)
If a killer says that it´s not fun to play killer, devs tell him to play survivor or civ.3 -
@Tsulan said:
@deadwolfwalking said:
"We know SWF is unbalaned. We're gonna fix it. We're gonna balance SWF by making solo play just as effective. See? We need 4 ppl happy to play and one miserable bastard to host em. We ******* hate killers " - DBD dev team 2018It´s always about the survivors fun. If survivors complain that something is unfun, devs nerf it (Freddy)
If a killer says that it´s not fun to play killer, devs tell him to play survivor or civ.Then they get spanked by survivors as they try to get a single hook with hag. It is just sad. Maybe they are the ones who need to play civ.
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@Tsulan said:
The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?
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@Warmbeano said:
@Tsulan said:
The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?
Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.
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@Tsulan said:
@Warmbeano said:
@Tsulan said:
The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?
Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.
It takes more time to bloodlust someone around a really safe pallet then to go around different loops you might aswell break it and move to the next one you will waste less time
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@Warmbeano said:
@Tsulan said:
@Warmbeano said:
@Tsulan said:
The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?
Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.
It takes more time to bloodlust someone around a really safe pallet then to go around different loops you might aswell break it and move to the next one you will waste less time
Then you break this pallet, then the next one, the one after that and after 30+ pallets you finally realize that you are alone on the map.
Yes, it´s unaviodable to break some pallets. But on some spots it might be better to get BL instead of breaking every pallet.
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@TheXenoborg said:
@Tsulan said:
@Warmbeano said:
@Tsulan said:
@Warmbeano said:
@Tsulan said:
The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?
Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.
It takes more time to bloodlust someone around a really safe pallet then to go around different loops you might aswell break it and move to the next one you will waste less time
Then you break this pallet, then the next one, the one after that and after 30+ pallets you finally realize that you are alone on the map.
Yes, it´s unaviodable to break some pallets. But on some spots it might be better to get BL instead of breaking every pallet.
Why are survivors still giving redundant advice from 2016 like, "just break the pallet", "just use BS", "just chase someone else". It doesn't work and it never will. Honestly.
At this point i honestly don´t know if they don´t know better, or if they simply troll.
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@brokedownpalace said:
Can't believe people are legit complaining about unhook cancelling and not being able to hit a survivor who can't move. You will ADAPT and GET GOOD.LOL right? It's like "Oh no the survivor can actually dodge my hit that was completely free before, how will I ever get a kill now?" Maybe don't camp hooks? Maybe don't tunnel a single person all game? Maybe focus on emblems and not on kills?
I've had a few games over the past few days where I only managed to get 1 measly kill but still managed to pip because I had iri chaser and stuff like that. It's also really REALLY hard to depip as killer compared to survivor. I can have a truly crappy killer game and still safety quite easily. Survivor though, you can have a really good game and still not pip because of some BS usually related to Benevolence. Case and point, I had a game against a Clown yesterday where I play decently and escaped, but literally 2 seconds before I ran out the gate he hooked someone and I lost -10 Benevolence, which made me lose a single emblem point and I just missed out on a pip. It was quite BS IMO, since she was dead anyway (second hook basement IIRC), but because I didn't leave fast enough I only got a safety. If I ran out 2 seconds sooner I woulda pipped. That sort thing has never happened to me as killer, you almost have to purposely try to depip.
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I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.
My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?
Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.
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Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.Mister_Holdout said:I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.
My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?
Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.
If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.2 -
@ChesterTheMolester said:
Mister_Holdout said:I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.
My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?
Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.
Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.
If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.
Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.1 -
@Runiver said:
@ChesterTheMolester said:
Mister_Holdout said:I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.
My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?
Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.
Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.
If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.
Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.My prediction:
- more nurse player
- gens get done as fast in solo as they do in swf
- killers will struggle to rank up because of how short the games are
- long survivor ques for october (seems to be a tradition)
3 -
I appreciate how well you worded your opinions. Nice read.
I don't care enough for the proposed changes, as a solo queuer I can't complain because it definitely helps with our balance but sadly SWF balance should be more focused than us solo queues.
Since it'll be in the PTB, once I experience the changes perhaps I'll form a real opinion.
Edit: I don't like the proposed BL changes though. I thought BL is well needed in the state it's in for Killers.
3 -
Tsulan said:
@TheXenoborg said:
They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.
They better be working hard on the killer Ai, otherwise survivors won't have anyone to bull soonTsulan said:@TheXenoborg said:
They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.
2 -
@Master said:
Tsulan said:@TheXenoborg said:
They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.
The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.
Tsulan said:@TheXenoborg said:
They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.
The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.
They better be working hard on the killer Ai, otherwise survivors won't have anyone to bull soon
This october will be hot. Just grab some popcorn and enjoy the show.
3 -
Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
7 -
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.se05239 said:Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.5 -
@se05239 said:
Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".Devs went full Freddy even tho they said they will never go full Freddy again.
Exhaustion nerf had barely any effect in r1 as gens still get done in 5 mins.
2 -
@SovererignKing said:
se05239 said:Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.
But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.
3 -
@Hillbilly420 said:
@Tsulan said:
@SovererignKing said:
se05239 said:Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.
But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.
Survivor mains and fake Survivor mains (you know, "those" guys who claim they play Survivor/Killer equally but always say "Well, I think Freddy was OP and needed the nerfs." Or "Blood Lodge doesn't have that many pallets. Killers need to git gud." One of those guys) are some stupidest people I have ever come across in any community. The mental gymnastics these guys go through to somehow convince themselves that running around a piece of level geometry is difficult is astonishing.
Running in circles clearly requires a lot of skill. I wonder what would happen if survivors and killers had suddenly the same hitbox. Probably review armageddon.
1 -
@Tsulan said:
@Runiver said:
@ChesterTheMolester said:
Mister_Holdout said:I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.
My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?
Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.
Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.
If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.
Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.My prediction:
- more nurse player
- gens get done as fast in solo as they do in swf
- killers will struggle to rank up because of how short the games are
- long survivor ques for october (seems to be a tradition)
Possibly. Might be the case if all the changes they put on the PTB go live even if people on the forums do not agree with it, similarly to the exhaustion change. I doubt the majority was for that change, and wanted more of a sprint burst change instead.
I doubt it will be that hard to rank up, but as usual, it won't be due to the killer's skill, but rather to the survivor's stupidity and ability to make a shitload of mistakes.
@Tsulan said:
@Hillbilly420 said:
@Tsulan said:
@SovererignKing said:
se05239 said:Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.
But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.
Survivor mains and fake Survivor mains (you know, "those" guys who claim they play Survivor/Killer equally but always say "Well, I think Freddy was OP and needed the nerfs." Or "Blood Lodge doesn't have that many pallets. Killers need to git gud." One of those guys) are some stupidest people I have ever come across in any community. The mental gymnastics these guys go through to somehow convince themselves that running around a piece of level geometry is difficult is astonishing.
Running in circles clearly requires a lot of skill. I wonder what would happen if survivors and killers had suddenly the same hitbox. Probably review armageddon.
I'd love to see this, honestly. Would be so much smoother to run loops.
3 -
Smaller hit boxes for Killers : Looping goes away, Killers can’t body block the basement to hold the game hostage and basement saves aren’t so stupidly hard to do (Even as a Killer, I think the basement is too much atm), Nerf Killer aura reading perks (We don’t need them if Looping is gone, if we can’t find Survivors that’s our fault, not the Survivors fault if they are good at hiding.)Hillbilly420 said:@Runiver said:
@Tsulan said:
@Runiver said:
@ChesterTheMolester said:
Mister_Holdout said:I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.
My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?
Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.
Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.
If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.
Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.My prediction:
- more nurse player
- gens get done as fast in solo as they do in swf
- killers will struggle to rank up because of how short the games are
- long survivor ques for october (seems to be a tradition)
Possibly. Might be the case if all the changes they put on the PTB go live even if people on the forums do not agree with it, similarly to the exhaustion change. I doubt the majority was for that change, and wanted more of a sprint burst change instead.
I doubt it will be that hard to rank up, but as usual, it won't be due to the killer's skill, but rather to the survivor's stupidity and ability to make a shitload of mistakes.
@Tsulan said:
@Hillbilly420 said:
@Tsulan said:
@SovererignKing said:
se05239 said:Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.
But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.
Survivor mains and fake Survivor mains (you know, "those" guys who claim they play Survivor/Killer equally but always say "Well, I think Freddy was OP and needed the nerfs." Or "Blood Lodge doesn't have that many pallets. Killers need to git gud." One of those guys) are some stupidest people I have ever come across in any community. The mental gymnastics these guys go through to somehow convince themselves that running around a piece of level geometry is difficult is astonishing.
Running in circles clearly requires a lot of skill. I wonder what would happen if survivors and killers had suddenly the same hitbox. Probably review armageddon.
I'd love to see this, honestly. Would be so much smoother to run loops.
And no more fat shaming.
A thinner hitbox would benefit both sides. No more fat shame spots and it's harder to body block Survivors. it's win/win.
Lastly : Give Killers a REAL incentive to leave the hook. I stick with Tru3Ta1ent’s idea of a debuff for every fresh hook. -10% to repair speed. I want to like the idea of secondary objectives for Survivors to slow the game down, but this doesn’t help the issue of Killers camping folks out. Tru3Ta1ent’s debuff idea kills two birds with one stone. Slows the game down AND reduces the likelihood of camping and tunneling.3 -
@SovererignKing said:
Hillbilly420 said:@Runiver said:
@Tsulan said: @Runiver said: @ChesterTheMolester said: Mister_Holdout said: I think your analysis is spot on Runiver. My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have? Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time. Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed. If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf. Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3. Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it. My prediction:* more nurse player
* gens get done as fast in solo as they do in swf
* killers will struggle to rank up because of how short the games are
* long survivor ques for october (seems to be a tradition)Possibly. Might be the case if all the changes they put on the PTB go live even if people on the forums do not agree with it, similarly to the exhaustion change. I doubt the majority was for that change, and wanted more of a sprint burst change instead.
I doubt it will be that hard to rank up, but as usual, it won't be due to the killer's skill, but rather to the survivor's stupidity and ability to make a shitload of mistakes.
@Tsulan said:
@Hillbilly420 said:
@Tsulan said:
@SovererignKing said:
se05239 said:
Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.
But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.
Survivor mains and fake Survivor mains (you know, "those" guys who claim they play Survivor/Killer equally but always say "Well, I think Freddy was OP and needed the nerfs." Or "Blood Lodge doesn't have that many pallets. Killers need to git gud." One of those guys) are some stupidest people I have ever come across in any community. The mental gymnastics these guys go through to somehow convince themselves that running around a piece of level geometry is difficult is astonishing.
Running in circles clearly requires a lot of skill. I wonder what would happen if survivors and killers had suddenly the same hitbox. Probably review armageddon.
I'd love to see this, honestly. Would be so much smoother to run loops.
And no more fat shaming.
A thinner hitbox would benefit both sides. No more fat shame spots and it's harder to body block Survivors. it's win/win.
Smaller hit boxes for Killers : Looping goes away, Killers can’t body block the basement to hold the game hostage and basement saves aren’t so stupidly hard to do (Even as a Killer, I think the basement is too much atm), Nerf Killer aura reading perks (We don’t need them if Looping is gone, if we can’t find Survivors that’s our fault, not the Survivors fault if they are good at hiding.)
Lastly : Give Killers a REAL incentive to leave the hook. I stick with Tru3Ta1ent’s idea of a debuff for every fresh hook. -10% to repair speed. I want to like the idea of secondary objectives for Survivors to slow the game down, but this doesn’t help the issue of Killers camping folks out. Tru3Ta1ent’s debuff idea kills two birds with one stone. Slows the game down AND reduces the likelihood of camping and tunneling.
I like the idea of smaller hit boxes for killers. Body blocking shouldn´t be a thing. Neither for survivors.
BBQ was already nerfed tho.
If you want killers to stop camping, make DH a normal perk or even better: make it part of the basekit. Since Kindred is on the table, that would be a equally powerful thing for killers.2 -
@SovererignKing said:
se05239 said:Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".
It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers.
The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers.
Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect.
When I look at the latest plans it seems more like 1 step forward with killers and then 2 steps foward with survivor.
0
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