Survive With Friends Is NEVER Going Anywhere (MASSIVE Survivor Buffs)

@SenzuDuck said:

@SovererignKing said:
”#########! He found me!” 
“Come grab me off the hook! I’ll Dead Hard/Sprint Burst away to safety or go to a Loop for free cause he can’t hit me right off he hook!”

All this will do is promote Hook Rushing. Hell, if the Killer is far enough away, it’s a freebie for both doing the unhook and the hooked person. Won’t even have to use Borrowed Time anymore and risk the Killer chasing the guy till the timer runs out. Most of all combined with the “status ailments reset on being hooked” so there is no chance to be exhausted so you can’t use your exhaustion perk. 

In fact, it’s even worse than the old BT. Now the unhooked guy is guaranteed to get to take off to a Loop, and Loop the crap out of the Killer for his one health state because he doesn’t have a timer ticking down till he falls.

“Come grab me off the hook! I’ll Dead Hard/Sprint Burst away to safety or go to a Loop for free cause he can’t hit me right off he hook!”

Lmao, you can literally hit a second or two later and you'll get them, if you're that close to hit them anyway you're probably camping which means you're the reason this "buff" is happening.

"All this will do is promote Hook Rushing. Hell, if the Killer is far enough away, it’s a freebie for both doing the unhook and the hooked person. Won’t even have to use Borrowed Time anymore and risk the Killer chasing the guy till the timer runs out. Most of all combined with the “status ailments reset on being hooked” so there is no chance to be exhausted so you can’t use your exhaustion perk."

Again, you've just hooked this person and want to tunnel them, you're still the reason this "buff" is happening.

"In fact, it’s even worse than the old BT. Now the unhooked guy is guaranteed to get to take off to a Loop, and Loop the crap out of the Killer for his one health state because he doesn’t have a timer ticking down till he falls."

Why not, i don't know... go after the one unhooking instead of tunneling? The risk a survivor takes to save someone should allow the saved person some safety. As a killer you can quite easily hit the unhooker, and then hit them again after they've unhooked... It's almost like a trade off or something that you can make if you're camping or running back to the hook on every unhook.

You know these I-frames aren't eternal? They only last until the unhooker gets on his feet and regains control of his character. (Flashlight save killer edition) It's not guaranteed escape/hit. ALSO if they had Dead Hard when you downed them (C'mon it had to happen) just wait a second they will panic and use it

@SovererignKing said:
SenzuDuck said:

@SovererignKing said:

SenzuDuck said:

@SovererignKing said:

SenzuDuck said:

@SovererignKing said: You mean a chance to activate Sprint Burst or Dead Hard with impunity immediately after an unhook. Now with even more I-frames. Because that’s what Survivors need, more I frames.  I'd love to know all about their invincibility frames. If you aren't a camping killer you won't be there when they're unhooked anyway, lol. Sprint Burst has I-frames due to hit box registers being unable to “keep up” with placing the Survivors hit box to be overlapped the Killers active hit box when swinging.  Dead Hard has 3 invincibility frames flat out. As you know. Now the developers want to give invincibility frames right off the hook as well.  “If you aren’t a camper, it won’t effect you” ... Where have I heard that before... oh right. Here we go : 

That was the same excuse Survivors used to justify how broken the old Borrowed Time was. How badly it promoted hook rushing. How it punished Killers who didn’t camp as well. 



Hey, look! A video made before the well deserved borrowed time nerf.  Neeeext!



Hey look! Someone who doesn’t realize the similarities!

This new unhook feature will be abused to hurt those who don’t camp as well. 

Given the new borrowed time the video is irrelevant. now the claudette would have been downed and he would have hooked her. This issue has been addressed.

“Those who do not learn from their mistakes are doomed to repeat them.”

”#########! He found me!” 
“Come grab me off the hook! I’ll Dead Hard/Sprint Burst away to safety or go to a Loop for free cause he can’t hit me right off he hook!”

All this will do is promote Hook Rushing. Hell, if the Killer is far enough away, it’s a freebie for both doing the unhook and the hooked person. Won’t even have to use Borrowed Time anymore and risk the Killer chasing the guy till the timer runs out. Most of all combined with the “status ailments reset on being hooked” so there is no chance to be exhausted so you can’t use your exhaustion perk. 

In fact, it’s even worse than the old BT. Now the unhooked guy is guaranteed to get to take off to a Loop, and Loop the crap out of the Killer for his one health state because he doesn’t have a timer ticking down till he falls.

With the upcoming BL nerf and the other survivor buffs the game will finally reach the point where all survivors escape every match. Survivors get their nice thrill of getting hunted with no real danger and they can create a funny YT video for their friends.

Killers then have to be strong and don´t adapt. It will be hard for a time, but once you get used to 0 kills every match it gets easier. Survivors will tell killers to git gud. But killers need to stay strong and accept the loss. Because if killers adapt like they did in the past, they will only get more nerfs. But if killers stay strong and don´t adapt, they´ll get buffed like survivors did. Because survivors will complain on the forum that they can´t find any matches on high ranks.

@Tsulan said:
With the upcoming BL nerf and the other survivor buffs the game will finally reach the point where all survivors escape every match. Survivors get their nice thrill of getting hunted with no real danger and they can create a funny YT video for their friends.

Killers then have to be strong and don´t adapt. It will be hard for a time, but once you get used to 0 kills every match it gets easier. Survivors will tell killers to git gud. But killers need to stay strong and accept the loss. Because if killers adapt like they did in the past, they will only get more nerfs. But if killers stay strong and don´t adapt, they´ll get buffed like survivors did. Because survivors will complain on the forum that they can´t find any matches on high ranks.

WHAT BUFFS? LOL

@SovererignKing said:
only1biggs said:

@SenzuDuck said:

 @SovererignKing said:

”#########! He found me!” 

“Come grab me off the hook! I’ll Dead Hard/Sprint Burst away to safety or go to a Loop for free cause he can’t hit me right off he hook!”

All this will do is promote Hook Rushing. Hell, if the Killer is far enough away, it’s a freebie for both doing the unhook and the hooked person. Won’t even have to use Borrowed Time anymore and risk the Killer chasing the guy till the timer runs out. Most of all combined with the “status ailments reset on being hooked” so there is no chance to be exhausted so you can’t use your exhaustion perk. 

In fact, it’s even worse than the old BT. Now the unhooked guy is guaranteed to get to take off to a Loop, and Loop the crap out of the Killer for his one health state because he doesn’t have a timer ticking down till he falls.

“Come grab me off the hook! I’ll Dead Hard/Sprint Burst away to safety or go to a Loop for free cause he can’t hit me right off he hook!”

Lmao, you can literally hit a second or two later and you'll get them, if you're that close to hit them anyway you're probably camping which means you're the reason this "buff" is happening.

"All this will do is promote Hook Rushing. Hell, if the Killer is far enough away, it’s a freebie for both doing the unhook and the hooked person. Won’t even have to use Borrowed Time anymore and risk the Killer chasing the guy till the timer runs out. Most of all combined with the “status ailments reset on being hooked” so there is no chance to be exhausted so you can’t use your exhaustion perk."

Again, you've just hooked this person and want to tunnel them,  you're still the reason this "buff" is happening.

"In fact, it’s even worse than the old BT. Now the unhooked guy is guaranteed to get to take off to a Loop, and Loop the crap out of the Killer for his one health state because he doesn’t have a timer ticking down till he falls."

Why not, i don't know... go after the one unhooking instead of tunneling? The risk a survivor takes to save someone should allow the saved person some safety. As a killer you can quite easily hit the unhooker, and then hit them again after they've unhooked... It's almost like a trade off or something that you can make if you're camping or running back to the hook on every unhook.

lol SovererignKing at it again

The changes discussed in the Q&A vid are very welcome to those with a brain. Some changes might not make it given the PTB data, so how about we wait until things go live. Then all the dumb killers here can start moaning for no reason.

You and SenzuDuck obviously have brains, just not a lot of brain cells firing to think critically.

Tell me : How am I camping when I find a [BAD WORD] Survivor on the other side of the damn map and CHASE HIM, and he RUNS TO THE HOOKED GUY, then unhooks him? How is that MY FAULT? WHY is it my fault I’m not stupid and go for the guy who’s closer to death on his second or third hook? WHY is it my fault the idiot team mate hook rushed?

Horvath often ask for our opinion on purposed changes, and I’m going to give it. You don’t like it? Tough #########. 

Well, you could have confidence in your play and just hit the guy who unhooked in your scenario, knowing that you'll get the other guy again. You make a trade, as Duck pointed out, then continue killing. You don't have to be a complete ######### to win as killer, believe it or not. You do you, just don't moan that you aren't allowed to be an ######### as much when good QoL changes are made.

@Tsulan said:

@SenzuDuck said:

@Tsulan said:
With the upcoming BL nerf and the other survivor buffs the game will finally reach the point where all survivors escape every match. Survivors get their nice thrill of getting hunted with no real danger and they can create a funny YT video for their friends.

Killers then have to be strong and don´t adapt. It will be hard for a time, but once you get used to 0 kills every match it gets easier. Survivors will tell killers to git gud. But killers need to stay strong and accept the loss. Because if killers adapt like they did in the past, they will only get more nerfs. But if killers stay strong and don´t adapt, they´ll get buffed like survivors did. Because survivors will complain on the forum that they can´t find any matches on high ranks.

WHAT BUFFS? LOL

Commenting on a Q&A thread and laughting because you haven´t informed yourself.

Buffs like integrated Kindred for every survivor. Longer invincibillity after being unhooked, exhaustion refreshing on the hook so they can use sprint burst right off the hook.
I consider those strong buffs.

"longer invincibility after being unhooked" Dude, do you even listen to anything? They're invisible until their feet touch the ground. it's not like they're running around unhittable. YOU LITERALLY HIT THEM A FEW FRAMES LATER ITS NOT A BUFF ITS A MINOR CHANGE TO AT LEAST GIVE THEM A CHANCE TO ESCAPE HOLY COW.

Do you think they're just letting survivors run around with i frames until the next pallet? jesus.

@SenzuDuck said:

@Tsulan said:

@SenzuDuck said:

@Tsulan said:
With the upcoming BL nerf and the other survivor buffs the game will finally reach the point where all survivors escape every match. Survivors get their nice thrill of getting hunted with no real danger and they can create a funny YT video for their friends.

Killers then have to be strong and don´t adapt. It will be hard for a time, but once you get used to 0 kills every match it gets easier. Survivors will tell killers to git gud. But killers need to stay strong and accept the loss. Because if killers adapt like they did in the past, they will only get more nerfs. But if killers stay strong and don´t adapt, they´ll get buffed like survivors did. Because survivors will complain on the forum that they can´t find any matches on high ranks.

WHAT BUFFS? LOL

Commenting on a Q&A thread and laughting because you haven´t informed yourself.

Buffs like integrated Kindred for every survivor. Longer invincibillity after being unhooked, exhaustion refreshing on the hook so they can use sprint burst right off the hook.
I consider those strong buffs.

"longer invincibility after being unhooked" Dude, do you even listen to anything? They're invisible until their feet touch the ground. it's not like they're running around unhittable. YOU LITERALLY HIT THEM A FEW FRAMES LATER ITS NOT A BUFF ITS A MINOR CHANGE TO AT LEAST GIVE THEM A CHANCE TO ESCAPE HOLY COW.

Do you think they're just letting survivors run around with i frames until the next pallet? jesus.

And what happens once their feet hit the ground? Sprint Burst kicks in. Now the killer can´t connect a hit, the survivor reaches the next pallet and looping starts all over again.
Btw. Invisible is something else.

@SenzuDuck said:

@Tsulan said:
And what happens once their feet hit the ground? Sprint Burst kicks in. Now the killer can´t connect a hit, the survivor reaches the next pallet and looping starts all over again.
Btw. Invisible is something else.

Lol, as if the lunge animation isn't so long that it'll cancel out the sprint burst anyway.
Also, if you're that close when unhooking you're pretty much facecamping anyway.

I used invincibility previously in the post so you know what I meant, I made a typo. Get off your little high horse, correcting spelling for a word I've already used correctly in the previous sentence just makes you look awful.

I´m not the one on a high horse who makes fun of other posts. I just pointed out that it´s a completely different thing. Not just a typo.
But doesn´t feel good to get corrected does it?
Don´t worry, i won´t hurt your feelings anymore. I promise.

Sprint Burst makes the survivor immune to a hit, since the hit registration doesn´t work. That´s the whole point about it. Also face camping doesn´t exist anymore. It was removed back in october 2017.
Would you like to know more?

@SenzuDuck said:

@Tsulan said:

@SenzuDuck said:

@Tsulan said:
And what happens once their feet hit the ground? Sprint Burst kicks in. Now the killer can´t connect a hit, the survivor reaches the next pallet and looping starts all over again.
Btw. Invisible is something else.

Lol, as if the lunge animation isn't so long that it'll cancel out the sprint burst anyway.
Also, if you're that close when unhooking you're pretty much facecamping anyway.

I used invincibility previously in the post so you know what I meant, I made a typo. Get off your little high horse, correcting spelling for a word I've already used correctly in the previous sentence just makes you look awful.

I´m not the one on a high horse who makes fun of other posts. I just pointed out that it´s a completely different thing. Not just a typo.
But doesn´t feel good to get corrected does it?
Don´t worry, i won´t hurt your feelings anymore. I promise.

Sprint Burst makes the survivor immune to a hit, since the hit registration doesn´t work. That´s the whole point about it. Also face camping doesn´t exist anymore. It was removed back in october 2017.
Would you like to know more?

You're so childish and condescending. I don't make fun or troll posts. I give my opinion and other people don't like it because it requires them to adjust to the updates become better killers/Survivors.

Also being corrected on a word I've used correctly in the sentence doesn't bother me, it just shows your immaturity to have an actual conversation.

"Sprint Burst Makes Survivor Immune"

oh my god, you must not play killer at all, I'm sorry for accusing you of being that. I've hit plenty of survivors as their sprint burst activates.

Also, just a little tid bit for you - exhaustion runs down on the hook naturally, no one seems to be complaining about this but suddenly it's super OP because it'll be cleared regardless of how long you're on the hook for? LOL

"Also face camping doesn´t exist anymore. It was removed back in october 2017.
Would you like to know more?"

Face camping is the act of standing infront of the survivor while they're hooked, so you're guaranteed a hit on them or the other person when they're being unhooked. It doesn't matter what angle you get pulled off from, a killer can still stand an inch away from you - AKA FACE CAMPING.

God you need to learn some more about this game before trying to be rude, lol.

Hold ma beer.

@SenzuDuck said:

WHAT BUFFS? LOL

@SenzuDuck said:
"longer invincibility after being unhooked" Dude, do you even listen to anything? They're invisible until their feet touch the ground. it's not like they're running around unhittable. YOU LITERALLY HIT THEM A FEW FRAMES LATER ITS NOT A BUFF ITS A MINOR CHANGE TO AT LEAST GIVE THEM A CHANCE TO ESCAPE HOLY COW.

Do you think they're just letting survivors run around with i frames until the next pallet? jesus.

Lol, as if the lunge animation isn't so long that it'll cancel out the sprint burst anyway.
Also, if you're that close when unhooking you're pretty much facecamping anyway.

I used invincibility previously in the post so you know what I meant, I made a typo. Get off your little high horse, correcting spelling for a word I've already used correctly in the previous sentence just makes you look awful.

https://youtu.be/DzEosOqhDpk?t=16m55s

Here are the devs explaining what face camping is/was and all the other types of camping.
Enjoy!

@Raccoon said:
Tell me more about hitting someone as their Sprint Burst activates, haha.

Anyways, back in the real world, I'm concerned about people getting unhooked after I leave the hook, getting their free SB in the opposite direction, and getting to heal / reset the game state to punish my "fair play."

Exhaustion already depletes on the hook, lol.

Lowbei said:

SenzuDuck said:

@Lowbei said:
Perma kindred will result in killers being forced to camp or immediately lose their hooked player within 10seconds

It doesn't really change much - as a killer you either camp and the survivors do gens anyway.
Or you leave the hook and the survivor gets saved.

The only thing it really helps is survivors knowing each others location which will result in better saving. But seeing as 80% of players are 4-Man SWF Teams (Lol) it doesn't really matter as they know all the info anyways.

A counter would be to make insidious "Hide the aura of the killer when in range of the hook" etc etc.

auto kindred “doesnt really change much”? lol stop trolling

80% are swf? no.

yes insidious should hide the aura



-if SWF are given the permanent kindred as well it's going to give them even more and better coordination then they have now.... why on earth wouldnt this be an issue... if they were giving these "QoL changes" to solo players only there wouldnt be an issue but these changes going swf is only going to give more possibilities of bullying the killer

@Gay Myers (Luzi) said:

@Lowbei said:
@Gay Myers (Luzi)

as long as we are on the topic, the devs have been asked for like 6 months now in every QA about why the report form was taken down before another was put up, and how long it will take to make one. they dodge the question every single time, to the point where its become a joke around here, since apparently its easier to make dlc like maps, killers and survivors, than to make a basic web form.

the lack of a report and the ingame one being a joke (proof with video goes unchecked for months) has lead to an influx of speedhackers in the past few months, but bhvr wouldnt know that since they dont have a system to keep track of it.

i dont honestly expect answers, i just want you to know that this looks bad.

And I cannot give you any information in that regards. I've my limitations. I've to use the same report system as everyone else, but in the long run that's not the topic at hand

.> @Raccoon said:

"because every action should have some sort of consequences"

Like getting hooked refills your exhaustion.

C'mon, folks, let's take a nice relaxing break on the hook.

-Mashes Sprint while getting unhooked-

Camping has a very real consequence - It's a loss vs SWF / anyone that realized you're standing still.

Bloodlust would not be necessary if they:

1) Balanced the maps
2) Fixed the hitboxes to remove Nascar Racing Sim 2000

It depends with camping, because a lot of people will still rush in like beheaded chicken. So it can easily be beneficial for those who camp.

And it is way too punishing that exhaustion wouldn't go down when you're hooked. Now for clarification, I actually did not watch the Q&A (the irony as mod). Is it literally like it resets or that it still has the normal exhaustion effect? The latter is what I'm okay with, if it literally resets, no spank you.

BL is the same reasoning I gave earlier - balance maps and you added the hitbox issue.

I am so sorry but are you real?

If survivors rush in like beheaded chicken, it is their own fault and they deserve to be punished and camping strategy should work there. If they understand that the killer camps, then they should turn it into an opportunity and gen rush him. If the killer understands that the other survivors are gen rushing him, then he should make a move or accept a loss. If one side plays badly, that side should lose, period.

If one side uses a tool to get something, another side should have a tool to counter it. For camping, survivors have gen rushing option. Also they have a perk option called kindred and they can use it. Why do they get an extra option for nothing?

I need to see the next bloodlust effect and other changes to say something but inbuilt kindred is one of the worst ideas I have ever heard in this game.

I looove the idea of Kindred, and I sincerely hope they give people tier 3 for free.

Too often do I see survivors hook rushing or camping a hook expecting the killer to leave and wasting precious time as a result. Heck, it's not uncommon for some people to waste the full two minute hook time waiting around like an idiot instead of doing the objectives in the meantime.

As well, I've actually seen quite a few killers literally camp a hook for two minutes while me and the other survivors are working on the same generator half a map away. Meanwhile I'm wondering what the guy's problem is since no one's even attempting an unhook. Then he repeats for the next guy if the game isn't done yet.

I'm hoping this innate Kindred effect can promote a more efficient playstyle for survivors by giving them the information they need to act smarter. This would, in turn, maybe motivate some killers to get out there and actually try interacting with other players. Now this would definitely increase gen rushing, but I'm optimistic that encouraging survivors to play more optimally might open the doors to introducing new objectives to slow the game down (I mean, they did mention - fingers crossed!) in a meaningful and fun way. This would hopefully alleviate the killer's time-related burdens, especially with the introduction of an innate Kindred.

Not to mention, talk about the incentive to run Open Handed (with a likely cap to seeing the killer's aura via Kindred's effects).

I would hardly call this massive. All the good and okay killers should have no problem dealing with this because it's not a big change. The kindred thing may not happen and even if it does they're just trying to make SWF and playing solo more closely related so they can balance the game easier so im here for it.

@Delfador said:

@Beaburd said:
I looove the idea of Kindred, and I sincerely hope they give people tier 3 for free.

Too often do I see survivors hook rushing or camping a hook expecting the killer to leave and wasting precious time as a result. Heck, it's not uncommon for some people to waste the full two minute hook time waiting around like an idiot instead of doing the objectives in the meantime.

As well, I've actually seen quite a few killers literally camp a hook for two minutes while me and the other survivors are working on the same generator half a map away. Meanwhile I'm wondering what the guy's problem is since no one's even attempting an unhook. Then he repeats for the next guy if the game isn't done yet.

I'm hoping this innate Kindred effect can promote a more efficient playstyle for survivors by giving them the information they need to act smarter. This would, in turn, maybe motivate some killers to get out there and actually try interacting with other players. Now this would definitely increase gen rushing, but I'm optimistic that encouraging survivors to play more optimally might open the doors to introducing new objectives to slow the game down (I mean, they did mention - fingers crossed!) in a meaningful and fun way. This would hopefully alleviate the killer's time-related burdens, especially with the introduction of an innate Kindred.

Not to mention, talk about the incentive to run Open Handed (with a likely cap to seeing the killer's aura via Kindred's effects).

It is a terrible idea and will never work in favor of a killer.

Sometimes, survivors think that somebody will go and unhook the person on the hook. They continue to do the generators and the survivor on the hook gets to second phase. Works for the killer.

Sometimes 2 survivors run to the hook and get a save. The killer was able to waste 3 survivors' time at that moment. If he chases somebody, then the whole game halted. Works for the killer.

When kindred is used, we will be able to see if there is a survivor near a hook. If I see somebody around the hook, why would I waste my time to go there instead of repairing a generator?

Then you can ask why should it be in favor of the killer? Why should not survivors gain favor by getting hooked?

Getting hooked means a failure and we try to award it by giving a buff to survivors. It should not happen naturally. You can keep your kindred as a perk and use it but innate ability is too much. People don't understand but this change is much more problematic than bloodlust imo.

Exactly!

These inconsistencies in player actions due to the uncertainties of the situation often create killer-sided benefits. That's part of the problem in my opinion actually, as it's artificially making killers stronger in games by basing that strength on survivor decisions. This in turn, can make the idea of buffing killers kind of scary due to the snowballing potential from inadequate survivor responses alone.

Why not instead make these actions more consistent for survivors, and reward killers in some other way?

Maybe the addition of new objectives to give the killer more time to act, or perhaps a debuffing for hooking survivors for the first time? Maybe both, or something new entirely?

What I want from this new Kindred is for power to be more consistently measured and controlled by giving survivors the information to act more appropriate to a given situation. Then subsequently balance around that. I want to see killers rewarded not for survivor ignorance and stupidity, but for their own plays, decisions and accomplishments. Maybe even see an increase in the opportunities for such plays by the introduction of new meaningful objectives to off-set the time lost by increased survivor efficiency.

Yes, you're giving survivors additional information for free. But in exchange, I'm hoping for more consistent results in-game, less snowballing for either side, and hopefully better balance decisions when less variables are present. I really do feel this would be a decent step towards that.