Why are they changing The Spirit?
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it's a bug though - the whole argument on Spirit is that you can't tell when she phases. If you can tell, it's a big problem already solved.
Spine Chill tells you only if she's looking at you, not if she's phasing...
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This is what they mean by overperforming. If you are fine with her getting 3kills on average (basically a 75% kill rate), I don't know what to tell you.
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2k average is not 2k per game.
Given the game being perfectly balanced around a 2k average (right now it's not) you should expect 50% of games to be 0ks and 50% of games to be 4ks.
Ironically a 2k average means 0 2ks.
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IF she is facing a pallet and then suddenly she hasn't moved but Spine Chill is going off, either there is a second Killer or she is phasing.
On most Spirit skins you can tell if she is phasing, however, I admit it is hard to do.
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It isn’t the wrong target if the devs choose that target.
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Actually black pipping with a 2k makes sense assuming we want most games to be a 2k (which is incompatible with wanting the average game to be a 2k funnily enough) because it means you are at the correct rank.
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I still think the Spine Chill aid wouldn't help in your situation, especially if you want to slow vault, but whatever, you are very good if you can ?.
Now, as the some spirit skins tell you if she phases and the bug: then why not make it simply obvious, like when nurse is charging her blink? Why should we rely on bugs :P?
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I wouldn't min, but she needs something else to compensate. Perhaps a longer phase duration at base.
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Why would she need a compensation though? If you already rely on it (even if it’s a bug), why the change? Is she underwhelming now :)?
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Kinda. She reminds me of the PTB footage, where phasing was directional. I don't think it is a bad change, I think it just needs some compensation for it, as it is a rather large nerf, but a healthy one.
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I think we both know that isn't the point he was making.
He is saying that the devs' target can be wrong. That being said, I don't like the way he went about it.
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
His point doesn’t matter when he says it in such an awful way.
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youre clearly not a survivor main. how do you not understand that whatever you do no matter how good you are is just a plain out guess? at this points this is getting old. look at all the evidence shes silly to go against
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Nerfs need compensation or they lead to useless killers (IE: Legion)
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That is not correct.
Here, allow me, the devs can set the wrong target, I think that the kill rate should hover around 60%.
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Who are you talking to, specifically?
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OP
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They seem to be ok with 60%. Trapper hasn’t been nerfed yet.
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Tell that to rank 1 survivors who run her around all day
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Ah, apologies then.
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True. I would argue that Spirit has had a positive bug, where her phasing sound overrides the TR music.
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do you play in pc rank 1 at all......? everyone dcs on sight NO ONE in MONTHS has ran a spirit that hard.
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I didn’t get to play a lot yesterday and haven’t had a chance today so I haven’t experienced it yet but I’ll pay attention to it once I get a chance to play. :)
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my point is that you already know when she’s phasing, right? You stated it multiple times in your posts.
based on this, either she already needs a compensation, or if we make the things official instead of a bug she’d been fine.
I’m trying to follow your posts, I’m not expressing what I really think on this alleged nerf.
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honestly, before you start "balancing killers to get an average of 2 kills" you should really look into your emblem system.
cause in the current state a 2k means a safe depip and therefore equals a loss - a 3k is usually a draw and a win can only really be achieved by a 4k or a game of total domination.
so balancing every killer around 2ks while not allowing for even a draw with said outcome is not gonna work out.
there are good reasons why people only play "top tier" killers in high rank - alias the killers who are not "balanced around 2ks". any killer who would be "balanced" in your terms horribly loses up there.
so if you want to bring variety into high rank gameplay, maybe you shouldnt nerf the killers who are "overperforming" first and instead allow other killers, who should be "balanced" to be able to win. and i dont necessarily mean "buff these killers", thats not necessary for quite a lot of them, though the emblem system, the reason those killers wont win, needs to be readjusted.
my suggestion would be to kinda fuse the victory cube into it, so a 3k equals at least a safepip and a 4k at least 1 pip.
0 - 2ks would then end up as depips / safepips (or in rare cases maybe even pips), depending on the emblem qualities.
of course there would have to be reworks for the emblems themselves too.
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The DC thing is so true lmao
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If a 3-4K should be an automatic pip, a 0-1k should be an automatic depip though, I don’t see why in one case you want to consider the overall match to avoid a depip and in another you don’t.
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Yes, if they allow the bug to stay, she needs a small buff in another area.
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Ok, so just to set the record clear: right now you think Spirit is underpowered, correct?
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What about killers like hag who on Xbox is the killer with the highest 4k probability?
Surely if you nerf a killer due to the better players playing that killer well and coming out with 4ks every game then for the casuals the killers getting these nerfs are suddenly unviable.
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i didnt say a 3k should be a pip tho.
a 3k should not equal a depip, since you killed majority of the survivors, which can never be considered a loss for the killer. a 4k literally means you killed every last survivor in the trial, no one got out with all the chances they have had, so you should win. you did all of your objective, there is no way for you to improve on that, you got 100%. this is a clear win and should be treated as such.
and if you got a 0k i highly doubt the emblems would be able to save you from a depip there. a 1k too will most certainly have you depip, though a 2k, the "perfect balance" as the devs like to call it, has a real chance of not having you depip if you did well.
0k = a very bad game for you. equally bad emblems --> pretty much a guaranteed depip
1k = a bad game for you. emblems might be okay tho --> most of the time a depip, can be a safepip too.
2k = the "perfectly balanced game". if you won or lost will be decided by the emblems. good gameplay allows you to stay, bad gameplay doesnt. in rare cases a win. (2k = you perfectly fit into this rank)
3k = a good game for you. you killed most of the survivors, this can not be called a loss anymore. with good gameplay this will allow you to rank up aswell --> safepip. with good gameplay also a pip.
4k = a merciless game. you killed everyone, there is nothing left you could do. --> a pip. if you played very well, maybe even a 2 pip. this can never be called anything less than a win. (4k = you dominated the survivors. you should definitely be leaving this rank)
however, sometimes there are very rare cases of killers doing very well, but then having mercy on the survivors / BP farming killers. those, who do not kill the survivors because they dont want to (not because they were not able to), should be able to stay at their current rank.
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Exactly. But she needs to look at you in order to phase :) Very helpful perk
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"Small advantage"
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With the bug that tells you when she is phasing, yes, I think she is slightly too weak. Only slightly, it wouldn't need to be an immediate change, she is obviously still stronger than most of the cast, however, give her a little something to compensate.
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I disagree but you could be right been saying she needs a nerf since after she got her first buff. Although if we really want to point fingers point them at the devs for giving us all the idea that all killers will be m1 killers with unique but craptastic powers. Also for their reasoning behind not making all killers strong because if they were all strong there would be a huge power creep they said but if done right i dont think there would be and also wouldn't be such an outcry against specific killers all the time when just one to three of them are having a little edge over survivors. But also keep in mind most people that play aren't ever going to be capable of countering a killer like spirit on their own. Which is fine but when the killer is played a ton it's bound to get called out for a nerf and the devs will follow and do just that.
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Plz no plague buffs ;-; I can counter her power by not cleansing and she can counter my counter by having thanataphobia
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Its been over a year already. That's more than long enough I feel.
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I just hope you guys respectfully understand both sides of the conversation. Spirit has large kill rate because of her skill-cap. It is unfortunate but killers need strong powers with little drawback to have competitive chance to win. The game variables just aren't favorable. I still think that statistics should be 3 kills, 1 escape but that's just me. The average should lose to the killer, not beat the killer, however there are a lot of variables such as difficult of the killer and map.
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Pff please.
If only corrupt was uncounterable...
Good thing It has plenty of counters and downsides.
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It's more easy for them that way.. Why equip ironwill? why equip spine-chill? why turn up the volume/get a good pair of headphones and hear her footsteeps? When they can just come here and cry "nurf this killer" instead of learning how to play the game.
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I'm half way through so I don't know if anything will change, but right now everything seems to be yes, I will use every pallet in the map, but my team mates can work on generators. There are two problems with this statement:
1- you are assuming that you as a survivor will win every read, which will be 100% based on sentiment - you are not reacting to anything a part from Spirit has stopped moving, I suppose she's phasing. Imagine if every loop blocked line of sight with the killer and the killer has no TR or red stain. How many times can you win the loop? And that's assuming that there actually are a lot of loops one next to the other, which is certainly not always the case.
2- at 23:00 of the video tru3 admits that this could only work in a very strong team. In other words, the only counter to any competent Spirit would be to have a strong team. That would be fair in a tournament scenario, not in a casual game, especially for solo survivors.
This being said, I'm one of the players that wishes swf teams to have their own queue, but even if this is not (yet?) the case two wrongs do not make a right.
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It wasn't sudden.. at least on PC. It's been a growing thing since last year when they changed Prayer Beads. I know that's when I started playing her a lot at least and people didn't know how to react to that, then... and most still don't. Survivors were complaining about it since. Her other addons are something else too, and she doesn't take long to master-- at least like it took for Nurse or Hillbilly.
And speaking of Nurse, when she came out, she was considered #########. It took a while before people learned her and the devs didn't even know how good she could be.. and it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't find out until a year later. Spirit is the same way, except, like I said, a lot easier to pick up. It's no surprise BHVR says she's overperforming; none at all. So, as more players try to find a strong killer, the more popular Spirit becomes and from that, the focus.
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If 2K is the target, how about buff the underperforming killers that struggle to make that? Trapper doesn't even exist to me because he's so weak to consider yet I have a bunch of cosmetics for a character that will never see play.
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It should be 2-3k that's bs
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Prayer beads are understandable however, Even about 4 months ago people were saying Spirit was strong but fair, and even balanced. I'm just not sure what it is. Everyone is acting like Spirit has become better, or something changed. If it is because people have FINALLY learned how to use her perfectly, then that counters your point that she is easy because she's been out for... a while. Also, have Survivor's just not been learning how to play against her? Why is that?
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That's what I thought it was balano around. I've never heard them say 1k was the balancing point, always exactly two.
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you should replace "everyone" with "I" in that statement so there is some truth to it.
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Gross. DC punishments can't come soon enough.
Also this: "Spirit/Legion is too much work to deal with and figure out so I'm going to DC. It the Spirit's/Legion's fault that I DC, not mine. I don't have a choice they are forcing me too because they chose Spirit/Legion!"
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Source?
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In my opinion all killer should at least get 0-1k if they are new then 2-3 when they are good with them and only 4k if they can fully understand the killer and play optimally (also fix the damn gen time)
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