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Who would like these changes to WGLF to make it easier.
i find that using WGLF is sometimes hard to get the tokens because you have to save people to get them and for one you could not save 4 people safely or the killer might not hook 4 people in order for you to get it, and BBQ gives tokens as you hook survivors which is way easier to get than WGLF tokens. Maybe to make it easier, for WGLF we could make it to where whenever you complete a generator, cleanse a (lit) hex totem, and open an exit gate, along with the current ways to which i believe are saving a teammate from a hook and receiving the safe unhook BP bonus and taking a hit for a survivor whether it be near by or on the killers shoulder. i also feel WGLF should have an ability like BBQ does, maybe make it to where whenever you earn a token, You see the killers aura for a few sec, or because there are a few killer seeing aura perks already then we could make it to whenever you earn a token you get a 7% haste for 30-60 seconds which is how much hope gives you when the exit gates are powered. idk post your suggestions in the comments or agree with mine but i feel as a survivor i have to go out of my play style to earn tokens, unlike the killer who just can play normal and get everyone or 3 every game.
Comments
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The point of WGLF is to protect your friends. It's a perk that rewards altruism with bonus bloodpoints. If you want to take advantage of its effects, you have to adopt an altruistic playstyle. If it doesn't fit with your playstyle and you don't want to adapt, then don't use the perk.
Arguably, BBQ also rewards a particular playstyle - it rewards killers who don't tunnel or camp. Both perks are designed to incentivise a style of gameplay which is enjoyable for the other players.
All in all, I agree that it would be nice for survivors to have more ways to maximise bloodpoint gains, however I disagree that that should come in the form of WGLF being made easier because I think it's in a good place now for what it does.
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were gonna live forever should have another 2 tokens or 200% BP
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The problem with the perk is how hard stacks are to get. If you try to go simply by getting unhooks you come across the problem if all 4 survivors decide to run WGLF it is mathematically impossible for all to get 4 stacks via unhooks. That leaves you with no choice but to get protection hits to fill this void. And MoM is a statement to how well designed protection hits are. I think that stacks should still be rewarded via altruistic actions but healing should either become a stack or find another way to get easier stacks.
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WGLF only needs tokens for health states:
- Stays true to the nature of the perk.
- Incentivises healing, one way of slowing down the pace of the game.
- More points easily accessible.
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If that ever becomes a problem in practice, maybe it should be looked at. But I run WGLF all the time, and rarely have trouble getting stacks with it, because in my experience it's simply not a popular enough perk for competition to really be a problem. Feel free to correct me if yours is different, though.
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It's popularity is a problem because of the mathematical situation in which all four survivors will never be able to stack it, and the fact that you're not the only one unhooking people. It's trash compared to BBQ because BBQ gives you stacks so easily, while WGLF forces you to compete against other survivors.
I had to take it off because even going for unhooks, I could never get 4 stacks. I rarely got 2, because usually someone else got to the hook before me, even if I hightailed it to them. The difficulty of getting stacks needs to be made as common as BBQ. I can easily get 4 stacks of BBQ on most games. Getting 4 stacks of WGLF is a challenge to get in 1 game out of 20, unless I'm being a complete dick and bringing Borrowed Time, and farming people off hooks.
I've seen Peanits mention "Killers have BBQ, survivors have WGLF", which is completely silly because no, survivors don't have WGLF. Compared to BBQ, it's useless. I might get 25% of my normal BP, and if I'm LUCKY, 50%. K that's 25000 instead of 20000. Thanks for 5k extra BP. If I'm lucky I might get 10k extra, woo. Now look at all the killers getting 40k BP instead of 20k.
If I were to use the full 32k as an example. I'd normally get 40k with WGLF, and if I'm lucky, 48k. With BBQ I'd get 64k.
Post edited by Atrushan88 on0 -
I rarely struggle with getting my stacks. You can get some easy stacks with protection hits in various scenarios, including 1 for 1 trades, exit gate hits at the end of the game, etc.
At the end of the day, if you REALLY want them, hook bombing gives you 2-3 easy stacks in a matter of seconds.
You can also just take pointless hits when the killer is carrying someone as well if you're really struggling to meet your quota (works really nicely in tandem with an active Decisive Strike).
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One for one trades means you're farming your teammate and they're likely to go down again too. You need SWF for your hook bombing scenario in most cases. Taking pointless hits means you aren't likely to get many points anyways to make it worth taking(and that encourages you to play poorly). Just feels not worth overall.
Sure, I had one person get 2 stacks off me from farming me off the hook with BT, that was easy for him. What did that mean for me? If I had WGLF, no stacks because I was tunneled.
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I love this perk and run it most of the time and it sucks because it doesn't actually DO anything, I can replace it with anything and I would be more of a help to my team. If they combined WGLF with ''We'll Make It'' then it would help you with healing the person you just unhooked and it also encourages the player to stick around and get more points to stack by healing that Survivor you hopefully didn't farm.
Getting stacks for this perk is easier than getting them for MoM but rarely do I ever get 4, my average is 2 and if I get 3 I am ecstatic because wow. They said they were working on Protection Hits and they have plans for WGLF so maybe whatever plans they have for Mettle can transfer over to this perk; depending on what they are of course.
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Gotta do what you gotta do to get those S T A C K S
Also yes, a 25% bonus to all your bloodpoints is worth that hit.
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It might be good if you got stacks for healing survivors with it AND/OR if We'll Make it was combined with it.
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More ways to get Tokens is what WGLF needs. However, those ways should be altruistic actions to keep the Core Design of the Perk. So healing Health States or maybe if you can get the Killer to abandon a chase to follow you.
Because right now it is way weaker than BBQ, because for BBQ you just need to do what you would do anyway. For WGLF, people need to adjust they playstyle by either rushing for Unhooks or taking unneccessary Hits for a Protection Hit.
So overall: More altruistic ways to get WGLF-Stacks.
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The problem with WGLF is not in getting tokens it's that you get nothing in match for doing something that earns you a token. With BBQ the killer hooks someone, gets their token AND gets told where other survivors are. With WGLF you take a hit to protect another survivor and you get your token but now you are injured and at risk yourself of being downed and hooked, effectively weakening your own position. Or you save someone from a hook and one way or another keep the killer from tunneling that person who still needs to be healed so either you and them are spending that time healing or you are running the killer while someone else is healing them or they are SLOWLY healing themselves with self-care or something so gens aren't being worked on but the killer is getting value in that time while running someone down. Suffice it to say that WGLF needs some kind of in match benefit to bring it in line with BBQ.
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I hear a lot of people saying this about Were Gonna Live Forever, but I constantly use it and I get 4 tokens every time. In my experience, it is not hard to get at least 3 unhooks, and BT always garantees they are safe ones. I would advise you to use BT, and try to unhook and tank a hit, so you get 2 tokens directly (3 if you go down near the injured person.)
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If your primary argument for it being good is that you can "easily" get stacks by playing stupidly, it's not really a strong argument. BBQ give stacks for playing intelligently. Why on earth should WGLF stacks be based on stupid gameplay. In its current condition, you're either not getting 4 stacks most of the time, or you're doing something inefficient in order to force those stacks.
It's been suggested time and time again that WGLF should give stacks for healing a teammate for a health state. It's something you don't have to compete with other survivors for since more than 1 person can heal another, and it fits in perfectly with the theme "We're Gonna Live Forever".
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How exactly does it reward not tunneling and camping? You can still tunnel and Camp and get 100% stacks. I thought the only requirement was that you had to hook everybody at least once, because each person gives 25%. So it doesn't necessarily reward optimal playstyle, it's simply rewards the killer for hooking everybody at least once? It encourages killers to go after people away from the hook but it's not a requirement.
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I would rather have an in game effect given to WGLF like a temporary haste buff each time you gain a token. Getting tokens themselves isn't too difficult, it's just a process that requires patience and carefull timing.
I also think getting stacks with BBQ&C should be slightly different too, instead of hooking a survivor for the first time to gain a token, gain a token each time a survivor is unhooked while you're X meters away from the unhooked survivor.
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You answered your own question. If a killer wants to get all 4 stacks of BBQ, it's in their best interests not to camp and tunnel a single person all game. The aura reading effect of being able to see survivors outside a certain range also encourages the killer to go after them instead of waiting around the hook. Yes, you can get all 4 stacks and then tunnel and camp to your heart's content, just like you can get your 4 stacks of WGLF and then let all your teammates die, but both perks are designed to reward a particular playstyle in the early to mid-game at the very least.
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@Fibijean Like I said it encourages that place style, but ultimately you're still rewarded even if you decide to tunnel and camp. So encourages is one thing but you said that it rewards the specific play style. However that play style is not a prerequisite to be rewarded. You could very well tunnel and camp, and still get 100%. For it to truly reward the playstyle you mention, it would have to require you not to hook the same person consecutively or you lose the stack. Then that would encourage the killer to go seek other people out but currently it's not a requirement. It's merely incidental and encouragement. Whereas with WGLF it is absolutely required, you cannot get an unsafe hook or you won't get the stack. So not only does it reward being altruistic and smart but it's absolutely a requirement. That's a big difference than it merely being incidental.
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Unhooking 4 people safely is hard to do. Not everyone likes to take protection hits. So what if you get a token for completing objectives you would normally do in game.
1- unhook/protection hit
2- pop a gen
3- break a totem
4- stun the killer
5- open the gate
6- search a chest
Maximum of 4 tokens but easier to get while doing what you are supposed to.
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I completely agree with you. If they change WGLF into a do anything in the match then, where's the incentive to save someone I have watched people die because someone was to selfish and just hid or did gens.
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I've said it before: WGLF needs to give the person that is getting unhooked the ability to stop the unhook if it is an unsafe unhook. A kick to the face, a 10 second stun, and exposed to the WGLF user that thinks it's okay to unhook in front of the killer without Borrowed Time. This is the change that WGLF needs.
I would rather die on the hook than get farmed.
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