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Does anyone agree that the game is biased towards Killers ?
I originally started playing the game due to its licenced killers 2 years ago, not so much because I migrated from the online playing community on PS4.
I say that to say I play exclusively as a killer particularly licenced killer and I can't help but notice the biased in the games design and overall community in regards to catering to the survivor playing experience as opposed to killer.
Why is there a double standard in unsportsman like behavior among killers and not survivors ?How is is tunneling not ok but Looping and gen rushing is perfectly acceptable and expected every session ? I have survivors trolling me at they end of my session because of the type of perks I have. So apparently there's an unofficial rule that says NOED is cheating but its perfectly acceptable to gen rush and loop through multiple sessions. And the higher in rank you go the more its a crutch that survivors use to go up in ranks
I can't help but notice there's a weird entitlement that's been created in the community among the Survivors.
Apparently if I don't play to the standards of the survivors that basically allows them to a Better chance at surviving then I'll be trolled at he end of he session the majority of the time. If i am not far enough away from a survivor by the time someone one gets them down I'll be trolled at the end if the session
And why is it so ridiculously difficult to rank up as a killer? I play as killer and my roommate plays as survivor. I've been playing the game longer then him and the means in which he ranks up compared to my killer rank is ridiculous and he's not even a gamer.
Why is the game design and even communal altitudes biased towers killers as opposed to survivors .
Comments
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SWF is one thing, but...
The EGC is extremely biased towards the killers unless you get some decent Exit Gate spawns where the survivor has a fair chance.
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We could just stay around here and give each other a pity pat on the back or you can just ignore what the survivor is doing and play as you want? Equip NOED, tunnel, whatever.
Either grow a pair or mute the chat button.
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Does the EGC do what it's supposed to though ? No. It just makes sure that the session comes to an end so that survivors can't drag it on. The goal is to leave and he problem is survivors weren't leaving.
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I'm also on PS4.
When playing killer, I've been yelled at by survivors for not playing the way they think I should play.
When playing survivor, I've been yelled at by survivors for not playing the way they think I should play. (Even back when I was new at the game and still learning, and I tried to point that out and apologize, the invective didn't abate. Admitting I wasn't good just got me, "Yeah, you got that right." -_- Way to encourage new players to stick with the game, guys.)
I do not know what it is about playing survivor that brings this out in some people.
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I may be experiencing a different perspective, since I play both killer and survivor on XBOX, but from what I can tell, there is an inherent idea among people who only play survivor that believes that certain killer perks is unfair. There are people on the killer side that believe certain perks are unfair that survivors use.
I play both sides, and I can tell from your post, since you've outright stated you only play killer, you dont understand certain aspects of gameplay, for the survivor. You should try playing as survivor with your room mate-- it might help give you a broader perspective on the issues you're having.
For example, when I only played survivor, I thought BBQ&Chili was horrendously OP. To the point where I thought it would be a game changer for me, and bought it in the shrine at the first opportunity I got. Once I started using it, I realized how underwhelming it was. The only perks I still have problems with, after playing both teams for some length of time (highest rank I've reached for Survivor/Killer is 2/8 respectively, so there is still some bias there), are Spirit Fury, and Franklin's Demise. Survivors have abundant counters to hex perks, crutch perks, and one-hit kills, as well as campers. Inversely, Killers also have those hexes, crutch perks, and one hit abilities to counteract gen rushing, extended loops, and pallet abuse.
But to be honest with you, as much as I hate getting looped for a gen or two, I find it hard to blame the people getting chased-- the game's objective has you looking for a generator, then holding a button for 80 seconds, with occasional checks to make sure you havent flatlined with a death grip on your mouse button.
Therefore, my advice to you, is to try to play both sides of the game. If you find that you dont enjoy survivor, at least you have that newfound perspective. But worst case scenario? Ignore the people who complain about something stupid. Its their fault for losing, after all.
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No it isnt that i don't understand aspects of gameplay for survivor, i just have an issue with being forced to adjust how i play to suit a sect of people who like myself choose to only use one end of he spectrum. I mean i never see anybody even talk about gen rushing anymore like is just a thing we accept.
In terms of sportsmanship we can't have a culture that's wholey against "tunneling" and then say its ok to loop around a pallet, the thing designed to keep the killer at bay. That's not evading the killer a as the game intended. We asked have to deal with the weird hit boxes and jerky frame rate for killers on console.
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How is playing as a survivor easy when he responsibility between the survivors and killer isn't even equal. A survivors job is essentially to"survive". Everything in between is just the icing on the cake and points. As a killer I have to chase and sacrifice 4 people hooking them 3 times each and striking twice per hook bare minimum, . And even that alone isn't enough in terms of rank.
All the survivor had to do is evade but apparently that's so easy for some its created a culture of trolling the killer and caused the need to force survivors to leave a session with the end game collapse.
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Because survivors are the whales and bring in more money you can't upset survivors or they'll lose a lot of potential revenue sad because killer do buy things too but it's 4 to 1 so they aren't as concerned
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No, it's rly not. Good Survivor team can destroy most killers without problem.
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It's nothing personal against you, and it doesn't mean that you can't have opinions, but it's practically impossible for you to have the kind of understanding necessary to form a balanced perspective if you exclusively play one role. As much as you may try to minimise your own bias, there are some things that cannot be completely understood without experiencing them for yourself.
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I don't think the game is biased towards any side honestly.
Not to say I think everything's perfect and balanced, but I do not think they ever make things or changes trying specifically to cater to one side mainly.
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No, it IS that you don't understand 50% of the game. You are biased by default.
You are not "forced" to do anything. Some survivors trash talking you is not forcing you. Close the chat if you can't handle it without feeling forced.
Genrush is talked about CONSTANTLY, ad nauseam. If you don't see that then either you're not here or on reddit enough or you are wearing some serious blinders.
The "culture" is not "wholly" against tunneling. Certain people are. Ignore them and play however you want, within the dev's limited rules. They have repeatedly said camping and tunneling are not punishable.
Neither is looping. It doesn't matter how the game was originally "intended" to be played, games change. Looping is an adaptation.
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How I feel about the balance of DBD:
Everyone is bad = Killer dominates
Everyone is decent = Game feels somewhat balanced
Everyone is good = Survivors dominate
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Dbd is a tug of war. The survivors are at their most strongest at the beginning and the killer has to get momentum to win. If a killer can't get a pull on that momentum and keep the damage going, the survivors recover and can win.
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Do you want the survivors to just stand still? Looping is their only means of defense. Obviously they're going to use it. As far as gen rushing, what else do you want them to do? Their objective is to repair gens. People don't like killers that tunnel because, contrary to popular belief, the killer is the power role. If a killer wants a survivor dead there's nothing they can do about it. As for survivors trolling you, what can I say? So people are just garbage people. But trolling behavior goes both ways. Noed always feels cheap when you get hit with it. But it's the survivors fault when they do get hit with it.
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The game is absolutely Stacked in the survivors favour, a optimal team of survivors will beat a optimal killer every time.
Survivors greatest weakness is altruism and memeing, if they dedicate themselves to winning they always will.
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This is with gaming in general though. While I still believe the majority of gamers are normal people, there are also these weirdos that believe you need a certain skill level to earn the right to play a game.
The fact that there are people with a certain gaming skill level that get all cocky and offensive towards others with a lesser skill level is just baffling to me. It's as if they believe gaming skill is in any way an important skill to have as a human and people who don't have that skill are lesser beings. It's honestly pathetic, sad and even scary, because you realise how many people there are without an actual life outside of video games.
I've just started playing Paladins again and I'm not the greatest at the game, and the insults I've already got thrown at me and others are crazy. Often amusing, but still.
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If you see devs adding in crappy perks to slow the game down instead of just reworking gens to be bias toward killer then okay man.
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I know exactly what you mean. Often, when I choose to escape during the EGC when a survivor is on the hook, I get nothing but insults thrown my way because I chose to cut my losses instead of playing into the killer's hands and giving them a free kill.
Even if I'm injured, can't heal and don't have Borrowed Time, yet I had 3 or more unhooks and did several heals over the course of the game, it's not enough unless I make a downright suicidal play in an often-futile attempt to save my teammate.
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Honestly i recommend playing both survivor and killer because it helps you be a better killer and a better survivor and tbh survivors who only play survivor tend to think they know everything about killer same with killers who only play killer i try to play both but lean towards killer and if you are having trouble ranking up it might be the way your playing your killers some killers require certain ways to play to be good honestly i rank up to fast when i play ghostface but when i play nurse because im terrible at her i rank up at a snails pace
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Which it should be, if the Killer has stopped the gens from being done AND found the hatch, the Survivor SHOULD feel like it's almost impossible to escape.
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Here's the thing, some maps it IS impossible to escape because the Exit Gates spawn on the same map wall.
I want the EGC to be difficult, but I don't want my odds reduced to 0% because of RNG. Let's be honest here, at the point, why have an EGC? Minus well have the Entity sacrifice me on the spot once the killer closes the hatch if I have no odds of escaping. 😕
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this is why I use keys incase of crappy gate spawns
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I agree with you.
But as per many things that benefit killer, they are less discussed than the things that benefit survivors. Everyone wants to talk about how DS is so powerful during EGC, but no one is talking about how basement camping is just as powerful...aka biased.
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I don't like to use keys unless I want a chill game because my previous games were frustrating.
Through, I can't be completely unbiased if I don't say Exit Gates can mess up both sides in the EGC.
Exit Gates: Survivor Favored
The Exit Gates should never spawn across the map from each other — just look at how much time it takes to the killer, especially Spirit, to do one rotation.
Exit Gates: Killer Favored
Through the Exit Gates didn't spawn on the same wall, you minus well say they are in this scenario because I can just do this and prevent the survivor from escaping.
Some maps aren't even RNG I noticed, their Exit Gate spawn position is static and never changes. Therefore, luck won't save you on some maps, you're either dead or you get an easy escape. 😕🤔
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Honestly,Id rather find fast lobbies
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if you think the game balance is biased towards killers, they are nerfing spirit even though she does not need it and this is what DBD used to be
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the EGC SHOULD BE killer favored
you had the chance to do 5 gens, FAILED
you had the chance to find the hatch, FAILED
you had a chance to open the exit gates, FAILED
3 strikes you are out buckaroo
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Good survivors will almost always beat the killer, even if the killer is also extremely good. EGC was DESIGNED to be killer sided. Genrush is easy as #########, killer is much harder and skillful than current survivor run to safe pallet then next etc.
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The Bias is SWF>Killer>Solo survivor.
The devs could do a lot more about SWF but some killers complain that if solos had stuff like built in kindred etc then they couldn’t have easier matches against solos despite the devs would buff killers more. So yeah sucks there’s a bias.
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If only in game communication wasn't limited to flashlight clicking and t bagging. I think some more options to communicate in game would give solo surviving more incentive to play over swf.
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Personally i think the game is biased towards the survivor.
Im red ranks both killer and survivor.
heres my thoughts
First of all its 4v1, 2nd of all DS, borrowed time, adrenaline etc.
Secondly most survivors are just not at a great skill level or dont understand the game. you each take turns looping a killer for 80 seconds while a gen gets done. its really not a long time, The problem is most survivors waste their time healing, running around the map/hiding or looking for hex ruin. you could literally have the game done in 5 minutes if you had 3 people on a generator for the whole game.
Where as for a killer, its 4v1.... you have to know where they all are. pray you get a good map, because its a 50/50 in biased towards survivors, then hope that your survivors arent actually interestested in getting the escape doors open which more often than not is the case. so i know even though i dont run hex ruin the survivors arent going to be on gens till about 2 minutes into the game.
then you have to know where all the survivors are at all times, to stop gen rushes you have to try and slug, on top of that you must have someone on a hook at all stages in the game in order to keep map pressure.
at the end of the day its 4v1 and survivors cry at everyturn about everything. they cry about no ed, they cry about ruin, they cry about slugging. again ill refer to borrowed time DS adrenaline.
Everything in terms of perks is pretty even, everything is counterable. How ever in terms of game play its self its considerably biased towards the survivor. you can loop, if your not doing gens you know theres 3 other people who should be. if youre not getting those doors open in 5-6 minutes, is because you either looped poorly or as a team werent gen focused enough.
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It should be killer favored, don't get me wrong, but I think you're missing the part where I said the survivor should never have a 0% chance to escape.
Like I said, if I'm going to have a 0% chance to escape because of the Exit Gate spawns — why have an EGC? Minus well have the Entity sacrifice me once the killer closes the hatch. 🤷♂️🤔
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you dont have a 0% chance, there is many tricks you can do. like waiting by the doors when the hatch is closed
powering up to the first E (right before 1 light powers up) to overall reduce the time it would take to open the door, or power up till 1 light on one door then do the power up strat I just said. use a key is also a option. the survivor is NEVER at a 0% chance to escape. you got so many strategies you don't realize or ignore that it is funny. plus sometimes on some maps the exit gates are on the opposite sides of the map, the demo gorgans map, the game, lery, etc
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I imagine it is biased a little towards killers, out of necessity. It's a 4 v 1 game I imagine the balance goal is like 50/50 but to aim to have it just a hair in the killer favor over survivors; if only because of things like SWF and the fact it's a 4 v 1 game.
Overall I think they are doing an okay job of balancing, most of the balance problems come from the core of the game itself, matchmaker, ranking, progression, and so on... everything else they are doing pretty good and sorting out tbh.
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In the case of RNG screwing you over the game doesn't actually know what your odds are before hand, so it still needs to go through the formalities so you have a chance to try anyways so that it doesn't auto-kill you when you easily could have escaped.
If you still haven't gotten out in 2 minutes you probably aren't going to at all.
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I already acknowledged that the Exit Gates can be survivor favored here:
If you watch the videos I provided, I do everything you mentioned about surviving the EGC. Especially this one here, but I got lucky with Exit Gate spawns on Lèry:
Also, you said keys can be used to increase your chances of survival, but really, here's the bigger picture — does that really solve the problem with Exit Gates spawns? In my opinion, using a key is a red flag because you, as a survivor, acknowledged you don't have a fair chance (I.E. Exit Gates being somewhat spread apart for the survivor) to escape through the Exit Gates and must use a key to escape.
Therefore, keys do not solve the problem with Exit Gates spawns — it just ignores the problem. 😕🤷♂️
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It was on their hands when they allowed swf in a game designed around Solo players.
Everything that is wrong with SWF is on the devs.
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Here's some simple things the game should know NOT to do because it's obvious that this drops your odds to 0%.
- Spawn both Exit Gates on the same wall.
- Exit Gates can have LoS on each other.
- Spawn Exit Gates within 48 meters from each other.
Simple things like this should be obvious because if this happens, you minus well give up — you have a 0% chance to escape. Typically, when I see both Exit Gates spawn together like that, I get the killer's attention and point at a hook: Call this one a loss and move on.
I'd like to see an A.I that controls Exit Gate spawns and hatch spawns. Then modifies their locations until they get close to a 25% escape rate for the survivor. That would be nice! 😁🤗
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only in low ranks.
in high ranks it shifts more to the survivors favor.
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Not true. Your winrate approaches but never reaches 0% (until there is mathematically not enough time to open a gate of course)
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How do you have a chance of survival when the killer has both Exit Gates in LoS and is serious about their 4K?
In most situations, best case scenario, you will get 10%-20% of the Exit Gate before you're forced off into a chase. Killers that are serious about their 4K won't lose you, so you're either going to lose the chase or run out of time.
There are a lot of other variables to consider, but if the killer is good, if you're unlucky with Exit Gates (which is usually the case) — that's it.
I'm not even going into certain killer powers that makes Exit Gates a death trap. 😕
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This post contains a lot of conditionals unaccounted for by the spawn mechanics.
Just because the Killer can ensure a win doesn't mean he actually will. That's why your winrate only approaches 0 without quite reaching it.
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How can a killer not secure a kill when the survivor is leaving scratch marks everywhere?
If the survivor was previously injured or got injured during a chase, how will the killer not secure a kill against a survivor who's leaving blood Trials and is making a lot of noise?
Let's assume the survivor does indeed lose the killer after some miracle... The Exit Gates are still in LoS from each other, the killer can just go right back to their vantage point and rinse/repeat.
Now, if you're talking about nice killers, sure — I always give the Exit Gates if they aren't fair to the survivor because it's who I am as a person/player. However, I'm talking about killers who have no mercy, and will do everything it takes to make sure that survivor is sacrificed.
By the way, I'm not saying this is the killer's fault because they weren't the ones who spawned the Exit Gates the way they did. To wrap everything up, I'm saying the Exit Gate spawns need some work to be fair to both sides. 🤗😁
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When it is optimal play then no, very survivor sided. But if you are a survivor with bad team mates, then it's a more stressful experience. But rank 1 you will struggle far more than survivors as a killer.
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You original question was about why the game still goes through with the EGC instead of just immediately Killing you.
The game doesn't know if the Killer is a nice Killer or a moron or whatever. And even if the gate spawns are unfair the Killer could have started far enough away from the gates in the first place that you might open it in spite of the Gate spawns.
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I literally had game where I could watch both gate by just turning around. And the spot from which I watched was exactly where the hatch spawned. That's basicly an Instawin with zero chance.
@Topic:
I disagree, the game isn't biased against killers or even survivors. It's just a not good good-game. Sometimes devs nail it and sometimes they don't. And to be honest that in a genre which basicly nobody has mastered yet (asymmetrical gameplay). But DbD is quite close to some degree. That's something we sometimes forget about it.
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You've got it backwards
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that is just bad luck, also like it is bad luck that some infinite loops are made when certain windows are open, bad luck for killers.
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Man, start thinking prior posting. This post is so cringe!
First of all, the game has no bias, devs really do want to both killers and survivors keep playing, having fun and spending their money on the game.
Second, yes tunelling people out of the hook is toxic. Downing a survivor who got hooked recently (less than 60 seconds) and did something stupid isn't toxic but DS will punish you either way and this is a problem still not solved.
Third, looping and doing gens isn't toxic because doing gens is the first objective of the game and not being hooked is the second. If you think looping is toxic, it's probably because you've been outplayed. I know how it feels, it happens to me a lot. Keep practicing.
Fourth, NOED isn't cheating but it's a perk that rewards bad players. If you feel you need it, use it, but understand people complaining.
Last but not least, it's difficult because there is no easy mode, you are going against people better than you, nobody should be on red ranks if can't outplay the other side on lower levels. It's easier to rank up as survivors because if it was harder, red rank killers would be all alone playing against nobody.
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