http://dbd.game/killswitch
What's the problem with SWF
I see a lot of people complaining about swf teams but I never got why.
Would like to hear some opinions on them.
Comments
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They can use every meta perk to the full potential since they can co-ordinate on comms... they’d typically have a strong synergy too.
The devs balance killers around 4-man SWF (not every killer) so as a result the solo experience is horrible.
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You think legion is balanced around 4man swf? Doc? Clown? Ok then.
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Legion and clown say ######### you. If they did balance around 4 man swf we may need old legion lol. Old legion even had trouble against 4 man swf.
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To much communication that removes any and all tactics that a killer can try.
it destroys many killer perks and abilities as when one survivor sees something, all survivors know about it.
They can synergise perks to counter everything a killer can do and causes perks made for solo players to become abused or over tuned.
It is basically cheating, only the devs can't stop it, so they just accept it and block their ears to complaints.
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You missed the part where I said: (not every killer)... since they’re slowly getting reworked/buffed to that level.
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You also missed the part where I said: (not every killer)... since they’re slowly getting reworked/buffed to that level.
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Legion just got nerfed again and he already didnt do crap to 4 man swf what you mean?
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Yeah i did overread that, apologies.
I think what makes solo experience so bad is a combination of factors.
Killers having very bad experiences when going against optimal survivors, nobody likes a ruined game. Thus they tunnel and try to play optimal as well with no regards whether another person has a good game. In addition to that comes the fact that it is straight out easier to rank up as survivor thus ranks are filled with people that do not belong where they are at.
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The frustration playing against good SWFs comes from not knowing that they are SWFs to begin with and the advantage voice can give.
It's a different game if you play against 4 solos, even good ones and a good SWF team.
They can quadruple any information perk, substitute a lot of aura and information perks with their voice and there is nothing you can do about.
Voice can give you access to about 19 perks plus the 4 you are running to maximize your survivability. They can coordinate hook saves, sabo, flashlights and bodyblocks. The can be more efficient with gen repairs etc. That can catch the killer off guard and can be frustrating. Especially if you play a lower tier killer with less option to effectively pressure the survivors. It's a lot more stressful, unfun and you are under more time pressure than usual.
Even as solo survivor if you are with a 2 or 3 man SWF it can be, that they will sandbag you for their success and won't rescue you from the hook, especially if the killer is camping. They will just sacrifice you.
On the other side they tend to be over altruistic towards each other, what can result in stupid plays that will cost you the game.
You never know before hand if you will face a challenging SWF or not and have to come prepared no matter what. And a sweaty killer with strongest add-ons can ruin the fun for the average dbd-player all because of SWFs.
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People dislike SWF groups because they have the ability to coordinate their movements during the game using third-party voice communication apps, like Discord, in a way that solo players can't. This has the potential to give them an advantage over solo players in normal gameplay, and make them harder to face for killers.
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There is no problem about swf directly. It becomes a problem when 4 men are on voice coms doing sweaty call outs + every individual in the team is very skilled.
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Because they don’t 100% know how to move forward with legion keeping his core design which at the same time was problematic... if the devs knew what to do legion would be moved up but it’s just far easier to work on doc for instance for now. If you have a good idea to make legion good without making him annoying to verse by all means post it but take feedback on how it could fail too.
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Yeah I do agree there’s other factors like the Emblem system.
I think I will pitch the case that if solo survivors are doing well all by themselves then they’ve earned the victory fair and can’t really be looked at on the same boat as SWF unless coordination is basically irrelevant to perk use, the killer is informed they’re vs’ing them and the killer’s get a reward too for vs’ing them.
The only solution to SWF otherwise is multiple killers vs a lot more survivors and make it so they only lobby here so there’s coordination on both sides.
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Ill generalise but CWF is borderline cheating while swf takes away a lot of uncertainity in survivor gameplay.
For example a swf knows the general skill and intentions of their members. That alone is a significant advantage compared to solo.
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First of all, they believe that every SWF out there is a highly coordinated, super optimal Bully Squad.
Second they believe that SWF was never planned for this game (like... imagine a Multiplayer Onlinegame where you play in a team without the possibility to play with Friends).
Third, it is really easy to claim that you lost because the others were SWF (certain Streamers do it as well), even if they are Solos, just imagine they were a 4 man SWF to compensate for your lack of Skill.
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My frustration with SWF as a survivor main you get teamed with rank 17s even when you're rank 1
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Even if the swf team isn't highly coordinated, they get simple advantages like "killer is chasing me, do gens", or if you are playing as trapper or hag you might as well forget about setting a trap in the tall grass next to a hooked survivor, they will just tell them where it is. Other easy info is totem counter and hatch location.
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People think players communicating and relaying information to each other makes that game really hard and frustration.
In my opinion, any 4 experienced players, in swf or not, comms or not, is frustrating regardless.
Information doesn't make a swf good. Being good at the game makes you good.
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The primary complaints of SWF are attributed to some outliers in the survivor community's bell curve.
The main complaint is that survivors that communicate with voice chat are blatantly over powered. This claim is based usually on an experiment conducted by Marth88 a few years ago where he and some other killer mains made their own swf group called "The Depip Squad". The squad used no perks and only relied on comms and items found during the trial. Despite the handicap of no perks they won the majority of their games often having three players escape.
While the experiment proved that swf teams have the potential to be unstoppable with proper coordination the community and BHVR rejected these claims knowing that the majority of swf groups don't act remotely like what Marth88 and his group was portraying. Furthermore this experiment backfired on Marth88 and the killer community in that his video footage, that was public, showed survivors how to play in the most optimal way without even needing perks. So then the survivor community took this information in stride, resulting in a more competent survivor cast, for a while at least.
TL:DR
Folks dislike swf groups because they could either be as coordinated as a SWAT team or be exceedingly casual.
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True, communication and relaying info will not make a team good if they aren't good players to begin with, but it does elevate their gameplay. So if 4 bad players join up then they are less bad, 4 good players join and they are now great, 4 great player join up and it's game over.
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