Memento Moris' current strength, and my way of fixing it
Memento Moris... Very strong. Very powerful. Very annoying to play against. It allows you to get someone out of the game fast, and... the Ebony Memento Mori is the ultimate form of toxicity. It is essentially a killer's "Win the game now!" card. Oh, let me show you what is wrong with it. (and the Ivory, can't forget about that one.)
Ebony memento mori:
- It allows you to kill anyone you have hooked before, essentially reducing the chances survivors have before they die, from 3, to 2. This makes the game go by very fast.
- It encourages tunneling due to being able to get people out of your game fast. Having less people in the game slows the game down considerably, because there are now less people to be productive. This means that the killer basically wins, because even with 3 survivors still in the game, 5 generators are NOT getting done, especially because the killer is still able to kill everyone else.
- It ignores Decisive Strike, which is supposed to be an anti-tunneling perk.
- Because of how fast survivors die due to this, any survivor that gets killed early on due to tunneling almost always de-pips, because they are unable to perform the actions required to even safety-pip.
Ivory memento mori:
- It allows you to kill someone you have hooked before, reducing a survivor's chances they have before they die from 3, to 2.
- It encourages tunneling early on due to being able to get someone out of your game fast. Having someone taken out of the game early slows the game down considerably, because there is now 1 less person being productive. This means that the killer basically wins, because even with 3 survivors still in the game, 5 generators are NOT getting done.
- It ignores Decisive Strike, which is supposed to be an anti-tunneling perk.
- Because of how fast the victim dies due to this, they almost always de-pip, because they are unable to perform the actions required to even safety-pip.
Cypress memento Mori:
- It allows you to kill the last survivor in the trial.
- This does not have that big of an effect on gameplay, because it only has use after the game is already over. If the killer finds the survivor, they will hook the survivor and they'll die anyway, because they're the only one in the trial. Killing them instead of hooking them has very little difference, but you're still able to do it. Just for the memes. This is my favorite Mori, because it is like all the other offerings. Has little effect on gameplay.
My idea of fixing them:
Currently, I think the safest way of fixing them is to only allow the killer to kill a survivor if the survivor was unhooked during the Struggle phase. This way, survivors still have 3 chances, instead of being reduced to 2.
I was also thinking of a way to stun the killer and get away during a kill animation using Decisive Strike, but that may be a little too hard to animate and implement.
Comments
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Yeah but rework keys to for a happy place mori and keys needs to be changed at all
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They don't need to be changed AT ALL! Heaven forbid the Killers can end a game in 5 minutes like the Survivors can.
How about you enjoy the game and if every aspect of the game bothers you so much then go play another game?
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@LordBeerus6595 u probably is the guy who put a mori when is a swf xD
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see here's the problem with the statement name another game in this genre that's right dead by daylight, Friday the 13th and last year something i have been playing pretty frequently (love it) but saying go play a different game would work if it wasn't this genre and if survivors are getting you in 5 minutes your ######### at the game.
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There's also Identity V which is literally Dead by Daylight Mobile except the Survivors are unique and every Killer has a unique game mechanic. Also you don't have to be bad to have the Survivors win in that little time. They can all bring in toolboxes and focus the gens hard.
I assume you were aiming that at me. I don't know when I'm playing against a group nor do I care. The only time I bring in a Mori is when I've been playing for a couple of hours and I want to play one more but don't feel like it being a 20 minute game. So the Ebony Mori comes in and we're out in 10 or less.
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Hmm... Don't want to be in a 20 minute game...?
HMMMMM... SURVIVORS CAN END THE GAME IN 5 MINUTES...?
I see contradiction here.
Post edited by Hanselpup on0 -
There's no contradiction. I never said EVERY game is over in 5 minutes. The Survivors can, if they so choose, equip themselves and end finish a game in 5 minutes. The issue is the Killers don't have that luxury unless they bring in an Ebony Mori. The game should be Killer sided and it's not.
That being said most of my games are 15-20 minutes.
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Identity V - Ciphers are nothing and Killers have to camp. Ah Yes.
As for OP. Moris and keys are in that weird balance cycle where one little thing can make them bad, really bad.
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So literally Dead by Daylight Mobile. Game is fun. I wish some of those Killers from Identity were in this game. That would give the Survivors something to really whine about.
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Personnaly i see only one valid change :
=> Nerf : mori can only be use in the last hook stage.
=> Buff : mori can be use any time as the last gen can complete.
Change ? Mori won't be anymore a tunnel tool but it would become a "scare" tool for endgame mainly or a finisher.
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Killer sided? The developers have said they want to balance the game such that 2 survivors will escape on average, and they're fixing the issue with generators being done too fast. You want killer sided? Play on The Gideon Meat Plant. That map is trash.
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Your nerf changed nothing. When I say "only useable when unhooked during struggle", that means on the last hook stage, when they're basically already dead. Your buff? I can't understand what you said. If you're recommending it can only be used during the |End Game Collapse/All Gens Completed|, it would be too similar to No One Escapes Death, and it would be a nerf, not a buff.
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To make it simple :
1) As the last gen get complete, mori didn't require any hook. That mean you can put a great pression in end game. Pair with noed it create a good combo.
2) Out of this case, as you resume, the survivor need to be dead on hook and so it would give more like a ... "finish it".
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The issue I have is with how the game is setup. You have four regular people trapped in some Killers asylum who must repair generators to escape. The odds are not and should not be in their favor. It's not like a game like Evolve where it's a monster going against 4 people in like power armor with guns and their own traps. An average of 2 Survivors escaping is ridiculous but I understand they don't want to discourage people from playing the Survivor side. It should feel like an accomplishment to have one person escape yet alone 2 and I don't think they're at that point just yet.
And The Game map just happens to be my favorite map (besides The Doctor's map) and the only map with multiple levels that I like. It's only trash if you're a Survivor on that map which I can only assume sucks hard.
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The Meat Plant is too small, it's too easy for a killer to apply pressure. Lery's Memorial is too crowded. Too many walls and windows, too many extremely narrow hallways. Very hard to path as Survivor, and annoying as Hillbilly and Huntress.
(I play on the Nintendo Switch, so Huntress is frustrating anyway... but from a PC standpoint, it's worse than Autohaven with extra trees.)
Post edited by Inji on0 -
Wouldn't changing it to only apply after the struggle state just encourage people to facecamp the survivor until they are in the struggle state and then allow them to be unhooked? Thus changing virtually nothing about the current dynamic?
I get that survivors likely hate Mories (I have not run into many of them personally) because they feel cheated but how often do they consider the tools at their disposal for ruining the killers enjoyment of the game?
In a perfect world people wouldn't need to worry about any of these things because everyone would just play to enjoy the game instead of playing to win at all cost and that goes for both sides.
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Killers can end games in 2 minutes just like survivors can end games. Moris are unbalanced, stop being killer sided
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Survivors arent saints, but they have no tool that changes a game as significantly as a mori
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This is the most killer main thing I have ever read here
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Keys and moris need to be changed/tweaked/removed. We just wait for the devs to decide what they see fits best to their game.
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I'd disagree, BNP and generator rushing is functionally the same thing. It removes steps from the game.
I'm sure this will garner a "but they still have to do the generator", thing is killer still has to manage to hook you at least once and if survivors can complete a generator before an average killer can patrol over there. They have removed the kicking, chasing, etc phase of the game.
My second game playing as a killer (ever) I had someone decked out to the nines with meta perks and a BNP completely shut down a game. Pretty much every time I blinked I was getting generator completed notifications. That game was over before it started and they knew what they where doing was patently unfun because they even apologized after the match but "they had a challenge to complete".
And that was one survivor..... the rest of them had functionally nothing on. Now imagine multiplying that by four survivors decked out to gen rush.
From that point on I fully understood why some people consider ruin to be a staple perk. Tho even then Ruin only works for as long as it takes for the survivors to get their first skill check and hunt it down. That is of course assuming that they don't just spawn next to it and remove it from play in the first ten seconds of the game. Or they can always just tap the gens which takes a bit longer but totally bypasses Ruin. Because they aren't interacting with the generator long enough at any given time to trigger a skill check.
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Camping is easy to counter. Irrelevant comment.
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How is doing gens quickly removing steps of doing gens?
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It's not removing the step of doing the generator, it's removing the killers role in counterplay because you're completing the generator before the killer has a chance to do anything about it.
The same way that a mori isn't removing the step of killing the player, it's just removing the survivors role in counterplay for the 2nd actual hooking. Tho at least the killer had to down and hook the afformentioned survivor once before the downed them the second time to mori them which required multiple interactions from both parties.
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Not really, a killer thing just like Brand New part would be something that speed up the hook process, not skipped it
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I think you're missing the point...
And the point is interaction, even a Mori forces you to interact every step of the way. Where being able to genrush mitigates if not removes completely that interaction and counterplay.
I'm sure there is going to be some degree of counter to the end that there is no counterplay to being dead, there also isn't any counterplay to a completed generator.
The difference being a survivor can rush a generator without any interaction with the Killer.
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Wait, what? How does a survivor using a toolbox prevent the killer from patrolling a gen and kicking it? Using pop? Ruin?
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Again you're willfully ignoring the situation, that is players being able to genrush a generator before a killer can realistically get to/patrol said generator.
to which there is literally no counterplay, short of being omnipresent....
Ruin at best is a coinflip, it might work or it might be cleansed in the first 15 seconds of the game. Plus it's kinda wasted if you're not dealing with super sweaty players that are going to genrush you. I guess just always be ready to switch to it and pray if you see that toxic last second swap to toolboxes?
Pop is great but only IF the generator in questions wasn't finished before you where able to get there. But if you're dealing with genrushers it probably was.
But yeah just patrol the completed generators harder, maybe that'll work...
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There is not a single situation in this game where you cant get to a gen before people finish it.
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The only way a Killer can end a game in 2 minutes is if they disconnect 2 minutes into the match. Even with an Ebony Mori you're dependent on the other Survivors to come save each other off the hook and who knows how long that could take.
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Then again, if they kill themselves on hook it doesn't matter. You just got a free kill 2 minutes in.
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