RIP Ruin
Comments
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@Peanits Imo the new Ruin should either not be a Hex perk anymore (0.3125% taken from the Wiki * 2 = 0.625% Gen progress per second for a perk that could get cleansed after 20 seconds is pretty low), or the Survivors should not get any kind of indication that the perk is active, other than the Generator slowly becoming queiter and the things moving slower. Regarding the "lack of information for Survivors" with the latter suggestion, I will gladly point to Devour Hope which works perfectly fine and also doesn't give an indication of it's existence until it's "too late" (other than the burning totem ofc).
I am generally all for changing Ruin (playing both sides equally) as it is a boring Perk that requires no interaction from the Killer to do its job, but not until something has been done about the Gen speed or balancing maps / weaker Killers.
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As with just about any other perk, the idea is that you get a notification when you're affected by it. It helps newer people learn the game (they can figure out why that happened), but experienced players wouldn't need it. You would know once the generator sparks. It's purely a QOL thing for new players.
Whether or not it it should be a hex perk, though, that is something that's best left to PTB testing. I do think it's pretty strong in the right hands, so I'd be hesitant to remove the hex condition.
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I just wish someone from bhvr would tell us why they are doing this so I can quit bitching. The way it is now there are 2 reasons why a survivor is not in red ranks. First reason is they have some type of disability. They may be blind, or born without arms for example. The 2nd reason is some people don't have the time to put in between resets to make it to red rank.
The new reset has fixed the issue with not having time....every new m1 killer released and every change to killers is working on the 2nd reason I guess.
But please, just tell us what we are not seeing. Why is it better for the game to have every survivor in the top ranks?
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I get that, maybe it would be a compromise to give the indication after re-touching the Generator they previously left? This way the Killer gets some use out of it and the Survivor gets the information that a Hex-Totem caused the Gen to regress.
Yeah I will definitely test it on PTB. If given enough feedback from actual testing, changes can still be made before launch I guess.
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What is your response to the argument that it doesn't matter that the new Ruin is better late game when it is not reliable for a Hex totem to remain standing for that long?
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I don't understand why a passive ability is so bad. You said that the new ruin requires effort, but that is essentially saying killers were not trying to begin with. And even if one is hooked and one goes for the unhook, that is still 2 survivors doing gens. Nothing changes in that sense.
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Oh I just noticed a problem with the indication after re-touching it, because Survivors can just tap the Gen twice and they'd know of the Totem perk, so it would need something like a timer that has to be passed before it can show you the info.
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What do u guys mean it's op and weak they told us why did they do that lots of new players can't hit great skill check and that was only the main problem And now it's something what has a purpose so everyone can play the game at sfw will still do gen fast ASF and with random team it is going to be hard but still manageable to escape
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HOW WOULD IT SLOW DOWN GENS IF THEY CAN GET COMPLETED IN UNDER 40 SECONDS?
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Except that isn't how the game actually goes for a majority of the killers.
Killers like trapper and now screwed because, what is setup time for traps. ######### if I know.
But lets say that this magically works, you then are only losing TWO gens if you are lucky.
Because setting up traps on the best of times is anywhere between 40-60 seconds.
So you are forgoing A majority of at minimum 2 gen if the survivors are potatoes.
Which then means pray to god you have a good 3 gen and they aren't on coms.
Moving past that, hey, congrats, you manage to find one, you then spend if rng is on your side and the god awful maps haven't screwed you, anywhere from another 30-60 seconds under the very large and broad assumption that the survivors are potatoes.
So by this point you'd have lost a gen minimum, and survivors would be working on them un impreaded because you had the audacity to try and use your power.
So, what happens next, well you hopefully hook someone. Congrats, well done, the gen that that survivor was maybe working on now has to take DOUBLE the time they were working on it to regress in any meaningful way.
So, you have successfully in trying to use your power screwed yourself in to trying for a 3gen which on, off the top of my head 8 of the total maps stupidly unlikely.
The problem is that this hex does nothing to stop the early game rush. Which is where killers like Trapper need it.
Not that you give two shits about killers though.
And before you say that I should try it on ptb, this was at rank 1 with nearly 3k hours my general play experience.
So how did that change my gameplay?
Well, I no longer had the time to show ANY kindness or mercy. I had to play as remorselessly and heartlessly throwing any concept of survivor fun out the window and 90% of the games I've played so far got to the point where doors were being opened because hmmm, oddly enough when unimpeded with toolboxes, Survivors blow through gens like they don't exist.
But again, the general dev response to any killer or survivor criticism on this topic is
"######### you got mine."
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Thanatophobia is actually very good at very early game slowdown if everyone brings no mither
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You win ;D
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Here's what people don't seem to understand, we don't need another generic slowdown perk, we need one that helps early game right from the start. The only killers that benefit from using new ruin are killers that were already easy enough to apply pressure with, you lumped killers like Legion and Clown together with Billy and Freddy meanwhile the latter don't even need ruin. How do you expect a killer without a mobility tool to gen patrol on a 12km^2 map while having nothing to slow progress down before they get to the gen, the easy answer is you don't and knew this going into the PTB that the core issue of Old ruin and why it's used has absolutely nothing to do with New ruin, they're completely different perks that accomplish a different goal. What use do you expect Clown, Legion, or Bubba to every possibly get from this perk.
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We don't need a perk to slow down the early game. What we need is a good fix that is called secondary objective that cant be rushed that much, also adding time to the trial.
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Do you honestly think they're going to do that, after everything you've seen in the recent. Because I don't, I've lost faith in them to do the right thing, and if they are going to add a second objective then nerf ruin when you get to that point, not sooner for absolutely nothing aside from rank 15 survivor convenience
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Im not saying that they will. They are devs and ignore the peoples feedback most of the time, or if they listen, they go too ambitious and do things unnecessary like messing with the nurse's base kit... when people just asked for them to change the add-ons.
The solution is the secondary objective, even tho that they don't listen to people playing in red ranks (but what does rank mean nowadays?). I'm a add-on less legion main so i know very well that they don't listen to people or make bad decisions with that. Instead of simply listening to people that play this game for a living.
I think i'm uninstalling until the dark ages pass away. IMO, we're at dark ages 2.
Even if they don't listen to what the people with the right mindset say, the solution is NOT a early game slowdown perk, its a change in the core gameplay. I didn't see you talk about a secondary objective, just wanted to mention that.
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You realize all of u just getting constantly ignored ?
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Yup, since may... waaaaaaaay back in the legion's patch.
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Maybe devs need to listen to the overall community rather than just going off of assumption because of the opinion of two or three-hundred people.
New Ruin shouldn't even be a perk; it should be base kit.
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Show us your red rank killer gameplay
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Have you heard of Corrupt Intervention? It is very good for early game, so yes killers do still have early game perks. And it's more consistent as well for it cannot be destroyed in 8 seconds of the match.
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He can't is is a rank 7.
And honestly, that seems like he is stacking the game in his favor because just from watching the streams either he has paid actors or I don't ######### know but my rank 14 killer friend has more game sense than him.
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Yeah, corrupt intervention is the next band-aid that will get picked 80% of games that aren't below rank 10.
I honestly thought they nerfed ruin because they were going to follow it up with a nerf or fix to early gens, maybe something like EGC for early game, but no, it's like they came back from their holidays, sat down, looked at some perk stats and said, "nah, 80% is too much, must be broken".
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At this point, I don't know if the devs don't want to see the emerging problems with the new ruin or if they actually don't see them.
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Cool story care to explain how any of the ones that you mentioned help any 110/115 killer to get to the gen before it is done? Makes me wonder if you actually know how/why ruin was used at all.
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Key word "if"
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Doesn't play red rank killer but so adamant with this ruin nerf. I don't use ruin but I see why it is needed. Either make it base for every killer or change the gen speed or even better remove the generator emblem because it seems to me survivors intentionally rush gens to screw killer over on bp
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Just when you thought getting to red ranks couldn’t get any easier they give us survivors this hot garbage. Lol poor killers.. you thought you were getting bullied before. Better be running killers who can traverse the map quickly and put pressure on gens aka billy/nurse/spirit/Freddy/oni etc. This rework just makes stealth killers and lower tier killers extinct. So now survivors no longer have to worry about many stealth killers and or most killers who cannot get across the map quickly. So RIP trapper/wraith/Michael/ghostface/leatherface/pig/clown/legion/plague/doc/huntress
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Every game I've played ruin goes down before my second hook. And the generator regression is not noticable from the first chase. It's been pretty close to useless.
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Tell me how that goes for you consistently in red ranks an see if ruin stays up to even do anything
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It isn't even remotely close to better early game.
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Ruin is good now!
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Also you cant even use pop while ruin is up.....
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Git gud and apply more pressure. Killer mains wipe your tears off and play the game. It's a game. U r not real killer.
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Oni is awful in the early game since he only gets his power when he harasses an injured survivor for a minute or hits 2 separate survivors and absorbs some blood orbs and even then oni can still be looped in his power
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Dead hard requires no effort
Adrenaline requires no effort
Sprint burst requires no effort
OoO requires no effort
AMN requires no effort
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I like the new ruin Peanits :D and I'm a killer main, I really don't understand some players that say you guys only cater to survivors it's really sad that they think this:(
But I think you did a great job with this keep up the great work:D can't wait to see what's in the future :)
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Yea I don't understand them at all I think there overreacting :( I for one like this change and I'm a killer main.
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PGTW is good, yes, but Thano's effect is almost negligible until you already have enough hurt or hooked to the point that you're already dominating, and Dying light is alright until you have to kill the obsession, and if they find out that you're avoiding hitting them, they'll take advantage of that by playing more fast and loose, and if you just get rid of them then the perk is moot.
What are you guys doing about generator times? Is there ANY plan for them? Even a second objective? People have been begging for changes like these and you guys react by removing the one perk killers had to slow gen times effectively from the get go other than Corrupt. The survivor bias is showing.
You're not looking at why killers have to use ruin, you're looking at how frustrating it is for survivors to have to deal with it. That's why it was a hex perk. It can be removed from play. Its a huge gamble if it would be effective at all or be cleansed immediately. Survivors who can't hit skill checks will either learn to hit them, or learn totem spots and how to evade the killer. Instead of making them adapt, you're making it easier on them with no good fix for killers. Please. I like this game, and I play both sides but I can't keep playing if you guys are neglecting one side of play.
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Post edited by tortrader on0 -
It would only be used for the effect that generators regress without having to be kicked, only if the survivor stops working on it.
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Buy me the DLC with that perk, then we can talk. It's outrageous that to have any chance for winning I have you buy DLC that contains this one perk or wait month for it to appear in Shrine of Secrets.
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The fact that old Ruin required no effort is quickly debunked as Ruin is a Hex perk and, you know, you should protect that totem... and that means often maybe abandoning a chase or switch your priorities around. But just stating it required no effort..... I don't know what to say
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Pop doesn't work with new ruin no synergy there
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Just apply pressure is a massive lie. Imagine being able to walk across the map in less than half a gen.
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That.....that isnt worth a perk, cause if someone runs you kick the gen it takes like 3 seconds
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I guess maybe since you don't have to disengage? But I do agree, it's a really bad perk since Brutal strength would basically give the same effect with more use and also it's not a hex.
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Let’s be honest, other game slowdown perks like thana dyinglight are super weak compared to toolboxes. They have high requirements for low values. While even a brown toolbox grants a 15% repair speed buff.
The new Ruin is good for high mobility killers and that is true. How about clown?
And overall it is a hex perk. I play both sides. I’m a rank 1 survivor and a rank 1 killer at the same time. Except for the reworked badham, all other maps follow easy totem spawn rules and they can be easily found.
And about the gamble to make for survivors you talked about, the decision making of whether to spend time looking for Ruin or not. It’s not a decision making when the totem just spawn right next to gens or in the center of the map.
I do agree that new Ruin can be useful. But that’s only when it is not a hex perk. And pls stop telling me Ruin surveillance combo is too strong if it’s not hex. I can track people by my map knowledge and it is not the problem of I don’t know where people are. The problem is even if I know, I can’t stop them across the map or they just have too many defenses around them. The new Kindred is a base survivor perk and it is a hard counter to new Ruin even if it is not a hex perk. And I have to waster two perk slot for just tracking.
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