Nurse is not top tier anymore
As a nurse main i tested the new nurse for about twenty games on red ranks now. I have to say that her addons (except the URs) are decent.
But the change to her basekit is even worse than i thought. Without two cooldown addons you are B-Tier now. And even with the two cooldown addons she's not as good as old base nurse due to a nerf to them from PTB to live for some reason.
Wait, that was not all. Her blinks are still bugged. Half of the time you want to blink or blink a second time and the game says just no. You go in fatigue or whiff into nothing. And dedicated servers. They still mess with he grabs and blinks. You are unable to react to survivors properly anymore, because you are ported back a bit after every blink.
My conclusion is: She is not fun to play anymore. Before the basekit nerf, she was very difficult, but rewarding, if you invest the time to learn her. Now she is extremely difficult, but not rewarding and bugged af on top of it. Revert her basekit change or fix the several bugs at least.
Comments
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All what the community wanted was addon nerf/rework. But they thought touching her basekit "slightly" was needed aswell.
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Base kit didnt needed nerf.
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Yea the majority of the ppl dont understand the basekit nerfs, it doesnt make any sense but yeah... think the nice balance designer from the legion "update" had his hands onto that and the nice designers from freddy rework had holidays or something.
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Remember: If a Killer is not buried 6 feet under the bottom tier; they are OP.
This is the mantra Survivor mains say every day before logging into the forums to yell for undeserved nerfs.
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I think she is still a good killer but annoying and boring to play after the base changes.
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Nurse is still in the top 5, but she ain't the best in the game anymore, that's Spirit now, though how they are going too "look" at her addons like they "looked" at Nurse she's screwed.
My new top 5 list is
1: Spirit
2: Freddy
3: Nurse
4: Billy
5: Huntress
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The problem I've had with the discussion is that it's being dominated by the people who don't understand how severe adding a cooldown to basekit is.
Non-Nurse players, and if we're being honest, the devs, don't have a good feel for just how hamstrung Nurse is against high level survivors when you give her a blink cooldown. This isn't an opinion thing. It's a math thing when it comes to distances.
Plus, adding a cooldown to blinks changes blinks from a game of 60% precision/40% prediction to 70% prediction/30% precision around many tiles. It's not 3.5 seconds. It's changing the basic theory behind how a killer is played. But we can't just ask the people who actually know how Nurse works at a high level.
On top of that, it made no sense to shotgun the nerfs and changes all at once. Rework the add ons and see how that feels. Monitor the performance. Then maybe adjust the kit if it still needs tweaking. This whole process has just been a cavalcade of stupid led by those who don't seem to know what they're tinkering with. I say that because the changes have done the opposite of what the devs stated they didn't want to do i.e. "mess with muscle memory", for one.
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Freddy can definitely get a down within first 15 seconds of the game, has massive slug potential, has 0 cooldown on his powers map traversal...
The Freddy thing never made sense. Billy is just better. And Billy can deny loops. If survs face Freddy like they do Clown, by dropping pallets early you can stall Chase's forever. Billy can saw them, and even curve to deny some loops.
He also can mindgame with his chainsaw hardcore, by only lightly charging it at a pallet. Getting sick of the "Billy has no mindgames and no slowdown" arguments.
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Did anyone had those bugs i mentioned too?
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With dedicated server, i almost missed every blink attack, even i blink on top of them
Sometimes if survivor is in front of me, a quick blink doesn't close the distance, causing me to missed, fatigue, and waste a lot of time
I also don't have any fun playing new nurse because of cooldown. It's literally staring your power bar the whole game
Post edited by OmegaXII on6 -
Some people and even streamers still say that she is by far the best killer in the game and that she needs further nerfs, so I don't even think that people will entirely stop complaining about her even after these changes.
But I still think that she is top tier. I mean, about what killers you could say that are better than her nerfed version ? Spirit probably, but she's getting changes soon too. Billy is very questionable even with his best add-ons ( which also are gonna get changes soon ). Hag could be, but very few people play her at her full potential, plus Object of Obsession is still a very big deal for her ( but you will probably barely see people using that perk now with Undetectable status effect being in play ). Freddy ... I just don't see him being that good.
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I faced a Nurse today who had the yellow Blink Recharge Add-On as the only Add-On, and he was quite clear that Nurse is still S-Tier.
When testing Nurse myself (I am not good with her), I feel that the Servers are a bigger Issue.
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Most survivors play killer as well. The survivor vs killer whining is a bit rediculous. Those who are one side or the other are way too biased to even try to discuss issues of balance with.
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She is still by far the best killer in the game as long as you hit your blinks.
Post edited by Mandy on15 -
I find the biggest issue to be the servers as well. Gave her a spin earlier and it was super clunky due to the servers. It's why I've hardly played since their release.
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Oh and I forgot, some people and streamers will still keep calling her " by far the best killer in the game", so I still expect complains towards her and people asking for further nerfs.
Post edited by Marcus on1 -
I didn't say she needed more nerfs. She's still the strongest, but no longer "what the ######### is happening" strong, just "damn she strong,"
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Billy is better if you hit every of your chainsaws. But the question is if billy can hit every chainsaw.
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How is Billy better? Nurse by far is still best. She’s just not STUPIDLY above the rest anymore. She can’t be looped. She denies all survivor defenses. If the Nurse player can hit their blinks then chases still end in a matter of seconds.
Let’s not even get into the Billy vs Spirit debate because Spirit is just behind Nurse in the tier list.
Billy is like #4 to me behind Nurse, Spirit, and Hag
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Billy cant land on top of (good) Survivors. Billy cant run through walls. Billy cannot ignore Pallets or Windows.
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Which map did you play on? I just played her with that addon only, I wonder if that was me.
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Ah, it was in the morning, on Coal Tower. :)
Not right now. ^^
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I specifically said you were calling for more nerfs ? No, I just said there will still be people who will ask for more nerfs.
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Nurse can be genrushed now and she won't even know what happened. When you can't use your power for half the match then its bad business.
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Hag is strong but trust me she does not have the tools to handle SWF. Only Spirit, Nurse, and Billy did. Now only Billy and Spirit do.
I think a lot of players that say she is still top tier, fun, or SWF crushing strong have never played her or learned her and gone against a good team. Even before the changes a good team was never an easy fight, and you had to be on your best game to win. Now even if you're running meta everything you can still get rushed like any other killer.
All of this. And on top of it, by adding a cooldown there is objectively less time in the match you're using your power, and it gets bigger the longer a match goes on which WILL happen now that Nurse is much weaker.
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I’ve played Nurse and gotten a 4K, but I’m absolutely terrible with her. I play on console so it’s not easy to play her :/
I’ve seen many (even average) Nurse players who destroy a team. What do you mean she doesn’t have the tools to fight a good SWF team? They HAVE no tools against a Nurse. Pallets and loops are useless because she can just blink through them. Any halfway decent Nurse player can hit most of their blinks and end chases quickly.
Billy can get looped to an oblivion. He’s not great with an SWF team. An instadown means nothing when you can’t even use your chainsaw. He is one of the better killers but not at the very top.
Spirit is basically Nurse, but with a longer cooldown. It’s very easy to destroy a team with Spirit.
Hag isn’t great with OoO and flashlight users but I RARELY run into OoO and I won’t play Hag against flashlights so I never really have any issues with Hag.
It honestly doesn’t matter if they are an SWF group or not. Most players do not play sweaty, they’re just having fun with their friends. Most of the time you get laid back SWF group. Not tournament squads where you HAVE to play sweaty.
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Any killer can 4k if survivors are not at an adequate skill level to overcome the killer, regardless of what killer they're using.
All you need to do is look at tournaments for this game. Look at which killers are picked any why. The top 3 because they're actually viable, the rest are not. I understand the devs want casual killers but they seem to be lacking on the competitive killers and bringing down one of the best without even slightly making the rest of the garbage tier cast better is a slap in the face to every high-elo killer.
When it gets so bad that there is only Spirit and Billy in red ranks (obviously other killers are played, but they go in knowing they are at a distinct disadvantage) and eventually just one single killer the game will show it's balance problems like never before.
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I agree with you. I can 4K as most killers in red ranks. Not that the survivors aren’t good, they just aren’t playing like a tournament style team.
You also should not be killing all survivors every single time either. Survivor skill should matter. Not every survivor is gonna to let you down them in under 30 seconds. With Nurse and Spirit...survivor skill goes out the window. It’s down to “How good is the Nurse?” Or “Does the Spirit have ears?”
This game isn’t exactly meant to be super competitive which is why most survivors aren’t going to play extremely sweaty or rush generators super quickly. I rarely run into those teams. The game shouldn’t be balanced around tournament style SWF teams that you encounter maybe 1 out of every 20 games. People always remember the bad rounds they had and forget the last 8 rounds where they got a 4K.
I don’t believe Nurse needed a base-kit nerf. Nor do I believe Spirit should receive any hardcore nerfs. I want strong killers in the game, but I don’t see them making anymore killers as strong as those two :/
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You can't slaughter and end a game in 2 minutes anymore. You poor poor souls. Broken since release, you've had this long, and everytime survivors cried out for something to be done you spoke of how balanced she was, now that they've adjusted the problems facing her, here you are crying again. Go figure.
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Nurse is still the best. Don't know how so many people can blame "those crying survivor mains" for a nerf to what has been the strongest killer in the game since her release. If nurse is unplayable with a 3-second cool down between double-blinks, it's not the killer that has the problem.
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Nope. You’re still thinking about it the wrong way. Nurse does not ignore game mechanics, she just uses them differently than other killers. If you are trying to run her around a cow loop or car junk, you are playing incorrectly. You’re supposed to make her guess where you are by breaking LOS and running back or forward depending on the read.
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I mean you aren't taking into account that she also uses blinks to traverse the map since she's slower than survivors when not blinking so if you happen to blink near a gen you have to get fatigued then wait for the second blink then go after the survivor I ain't a nurse player but that doesn't sound fun at all
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I'm playing nurse on console, she's fine if you land your blinks (hard on console but doable if you're ready to suffer). It's probably dedicated servers.
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Yeah...and how often does that work against an experienced Nurse? I can lead a Nurse on a pretty long chase but predicting where she is going to go but sometimes she predicts my fake and I’m down. All it takes is one mistake on your end and Nurse will down you.
Breaking LOS and being unpredictable is all you can do. It’s not foolproof though, as it shouldn’t be
A Nurse player who is very good will down you in a matter of seconds.
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I personally would replace Billy with Freddy, but yeah very accurate list I can agree with that!
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Who said that? I'm curious which streamer has this little game knowledge.
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Lmao it's like saying "is everyone eon cracking? Wraith is still by far the best killer in the game as long as you hit and down survivors."
Yeah no ######### sherlock, I thought you can win as Nurse without hitting your blinks lol.
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You clearly know the business, how many hours you have on Nurse?
I have around 1k hrs just on Nurse (23k blink attacks) and it was really not easy to verse some sweaty swf groups. You really had to sit down concentrating and sweat aswell just to barely get your 2k. These teams are rare, but they exist and they dominate 99% of every match they go in.
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Nurse needed a change. Being able to ignore all obstacles is already a huge advantage in her favor and with only a short fatigue to slow her down, she could dominate and give survivors no chance of escape. Snowballing was a huge issue with a good Nurse. It gave survivors little chance to do any actions. It's true she's not the same, but she is still very viable. I can vouch for the fact she is still a great killer, but no longer the greatest.
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Why should your options all be fool proof? Why shouldn’t you have to guess? This line of thinking is an indictment of our community. Looping killers and leaving them with very few options should NOT be the norm. Survivors should not get to dictate how much time they can waste; there should be mindgames and counterplay on both sides.
I am an experienced Nurse main and can tell you that there is a noticeable difference between people who know how to play against Nurse and those who don’t.
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The nurse still function the way she has done before. The only different is the cool down which isn't a big deal because once you are out of fatigue you get to blink.
If you are good at nurse then you would hardly see a different because if u can land a hit in each blink u will stay have chases lasting less than 25 seconds. Let's say y do miss, u will still have chase lasting less than a minute. Unless you are just extremely bad at using her.
The bugs doesn't represent the devs purposely doing that. It is just a bug.
Futhermore, Nurse is still at the top tier because she has the ability to ignore all defences a surivior has. Not only that, but the only on playing against her is juking which if you r so good at using her would get used to it.
So tell me how exactly is she a b tier or worst than spirit when she can ignore all defences a surivior has while spirit can't? Just because there is a cool down doesn't mean she is bad . It just means she is more annoying to use, but it doesn't change how strong she is.
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I never said it was 100% foolproof. I said it WASN’T foolproof nor should it be.
”This line of thinking is an indictment to our community”.
We all have varying opinions my dude. No need to chastise others for how they think. I don’t know where you got idea that I believe survivors should dictate how long they can run a killer around because I never said that. You're twisting words into your favor
It should be survivor skill vs killer skill. However with Nurse and Spirit, survivor skill means little to none. It is “How good is the Nurse” or “Can the Spirit hear me”. Your skill as a survivor doesn’t mean much unless you’re running certain perks. You can’t mindgame those two killers.
People who can play against a Nurse will eventually go down either way. Pretty soon as a matter of fact. A good Nurse can just dominate and end chases super quickly.
I can play against a Nurse but a lot of the times she predicts right and I get downed. It’s all apart of her gameplay. If she predicts right then you are dead. Especially against a good Nurse.
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“If she predicts right” means you should get hit. If you predicted right, she misses. It doesn’t get any more fair than that.
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It's not like all Nurses are Nostradamus, they are not gonna predict you every single time unless you are very predictable. Maps with lots of LOS breakers like Lery's, Hawkins or Family Residence can be a pain in the ass even for very experienced Nurses. Same with big maps, they got even worse for her now that she has a cooldown on her blinks. Her map pressure got hurt more than her chase potential by these changes.
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That's exactly what i said. The better the survivors get the more of your blinks are prediction. If you land exactly where you want, but the survivor did something you didn't predict, gg, you can go in fatigue AND cooldown.
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Sorry but no she's still top tier. I 4k every game with her addonless, I'm on PS4 btw it's she that strong on consoles she's definitely better on PC. I find her more stronger than before with add-ons.
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Rank? Rank matters extremely when it comes to the viability of killers.
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Red ranks Here a video.
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I watched the vid. You played pretty average the whole game and only capitalized on survivor mistakes. At the end you snowballed because of one death. And ruin stayed up very long. Show me a similar result with ruin breaking early and survivors that not run straight forward in the corn.
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I have read your post again if you talk about optimal survivors. I'm not good enough for those but she might still smash them anyway.
Post edited by xllxENIGMAxllx on0
