What makes The Spirit "too strong"?
title.
since i saw a huge increase of Spirit hate lately, i got curious on what the community thinks is too strong on her.
due to that, i decided to make this poll and see what the main problem is that people have with her. this could also help us in the future to look for satisfying changes that make everyone happy.
thank you for participating!
and please keep in mind to be respectfull towards each other. if you disagree with someones opinion thats fine, but please accept it as their own opinion and dont hate on them. you can discuss it as much as you want in a respectful manner, thanks! ^^
What makes The Spirit "too strong"? 172 votes
2 votes
5 votes
2 votes
16 votes
9 votes
36 votes
5 votes
48 votes
49 votes
Comments
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Spirit is fine
Personally I find Spirit is fine, and is a good replacement for Nurse now.
7 -
Spirit is fine
She is fine. All the hate is from bad survivors who always DC against her instead of trying to learn her counterplay
9 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
the spirit is not fun to play against period...thats why everyone DCs.
2 -
well, i get that thats how many feel about her, though the sole purpose of this post is to figure out why you think so...
what makes her "unfun" to go up against?
2 -
Spirit is fine
Do you think I have fun when I verse a genrushing SWF team?
And git gud
6 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
multiple things on that list, only able to pick one for the poll.
0 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
the game needs quality of life updates all around. it should be fun to play killer, and to play against killer.
10 -
well... why not click on the "multiple things on this list" option then? xD
also, please tell me which things. i would like to know what you dislike about this killer.
thank you!
0 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Her power can be boiled down to "the survivor has no idea what you're doing for x seconds after activating, or while standing still. When activated you get crack speed.". She gets too much info while the survivors can MAYBE see the tiny shards on her get brighter IF she doesn't have a skin, for the speed she goes at while invisible. Scratch marks, footsteps, grass, breathing, and pain sounds (stridor before anyone mentions IW). Survivors need to bring in perks they might not use otherwise just for a chance against her, and if she's running x perk or y add-on, it won't matter anyway.
Then her add-ons make it even worse. Prayer beads has been beat to death so you already know. Fathers glasses just guarantees that if you're injured your screwed more than her power already does. Saya gives her insane lunge range (like a whole killer shack if not more). Amulet has too many effects in one for the strength they are. A lot of her purple add-ons have pink level effects.
8 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Teach me, how to counter a good Spirit?
8 -
The "Prayer Beads Bracelet" Add-On
I always juke spirits at rank 1 and dont get it. why are people bad. Even one of my fav dbd players, ussylis thinks she broken. Just remove the anal beads.
4 -
None of the above (please elaborate what you think is too strong then)
With the spirit I just think her footsteps need to be louder while in haunting
2 -
Spirit is fine
Brainless survivors are bad at mind games. Who would've thunk.
1 -
The "Prayer Beads Bracelet" Add-On
Spoiler alert : you cant
5 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Brainless survivors are bad at coin tosses. Who would've thunk.
Very absurd to assume, you have any control of mind gaming vs a good spirit. I mean.. how? There is really only one way to actually "know what to do" and that is when you know the guy who plays her. And this guy has to be very uncreative aswell...
Please stop pretending you can "outsmart" her, it is purly random. I dont see much difference between playing on R1 or on R10 when i play Spirit.
Dont get me wrong, the spirit is still not in the worst shape, but there has to be some changes, especially prayer beads and collision.
4 -
The missing vault animation
For me its mainly the prayer beads tbh
1 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Prayer Beads, that add-on with the extended lunge and the inability to tell if the Spirit is phasing or not.
1 -
Spirit is fine
I think first we should worry about the killers that aren't viable at all and get them buffed up before we start nerfing/changing the only 3 viable killers, at least then the game would have some variation instead of Nurse, Spirit and Billy every game. (Legion please come back i miss you) :(
3 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
personally I hate when she vaults and its hard to tell if shes vaulting or phasing and also the fact that shes invisible while phasing seems way too strong. If the duration or speed of phase was adjusted I might be ok with the invis but its too much for me.
2 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
For me: the missing vault animation, being able to bump into survivors and obviously Prayer Beads.
2 -
Spirit is fine
Spirit is fine stop complaining and just fix the other Killers to make them viable.
0 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
It feels pointless to talk about this on the forums when content creators have already done excellent videos on the topic, and when people dont want to have a civil discussion about it. OhTofu and Scott Jund have both done a video on why people dont like Spirit.
2 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
I find it too hard when getting chased by Spirit, it's difficult to know when it's safe to stop running, or when you're even safe at all. Well, except when using Spine Chill.
2 -
The Spirit being able to bump into Survivors while in Yamaokas Haunting
I think The Spirit is fine as she is, but the ability to bump into survivors is a little much. One of the biggest Spirit counterplays is running in one direction and then reversing.
Her ability to bump into you makes that counterplay rough, because she can walk in your initial direction, and then get a free hit on you
1 -
Spirit is fine
Spirit is fine. Git gud.
1 -
Spirit is fine
Ok as a spirit main, I am going to explain what is wrong with most people who play against my spirit:
They do exact same things and run exact same routes as they do vs other killers. In other words, they are extremely predictable, letting me phase to them and hit. It doesn't matter if they are invisible if I can reliably guess where they will be.
It is lunacy to sit and selfheal at a pallet vs a spirit who can just zoom next to you and strike before you have a chance to react. It is stupid to run around a pallet loop vs a spirit that can phase, speedrun against you and bump into you, getting a free hit. Majority of survivors will always run around the map along its edge. All I have to guess is the direction.
Bumping into people only matters if spirit can guess where you are, and they don't need to guess when survivors run the exact same way every time. I dont play at high ranks, but at my own rank thats how it is. The idea of adjusting your playstyle depending who you are up against seems alien to most survivors I play against.
What they SHOULD do is run diagonally opposite to what they would normally run when they hear the phasing sound. Run into the open, not behind jungle gyms. Don't run to the window/pallet, run away from it. Sure, Spirits can hear you, but you don't need to gain much distance until they can't.
Survivors are bad at mindgames because indeed, they arent using any mindgames. Spirit is "OP" simply because you cannot use the same old playstyle against her. Adapt.
1 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Let me try to explain you this, even tho i think, it should be super obvious. Still, people completly ignore that fact:
I am aware of your advises your gave us, and so are you. So you know that i know how to run a spirit. I know that you know that i know how to run a spirit aswell and you know that aswell. How to mindgame that?
For example, should i vault the window? The spirit knows about that many surivor simply quiet slow vault back after they fastvault the window. And the Survivor knows that the Spirit knows. Whats the right joice here?
You guessed it, there is no right pick. It is fliping a coin. All the jukes you can make can be predicted by the spirit, no matter how creative you are. An no juke is really better then the other, it is only hoping, that the Spirit is either over or underestimating you .
I for example try to mix up as much as possible, to stay completly unpredictable. I even just stand at the spot where i stoped sprinting, or just keep running no matter what. And then i try very creative jukes, that are "hard to expect". Still, it wont help me really.
3 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
It's the fact that survivors have very little information on what the Spirit is doing in phase. They have no feedback to what they should do to juke her. You have to guess where the invisible killer is instead of making a calculated decision.
That is something that makes Nurse more fun to go against than the Spirit, the survivors have feedback on what they need to do rather than choosing heads or tails.
Survivors don't have much they can do against her other than running situational perks such as Spine Chill. Perks shouldn't be the only counterplay to a specific killer. That's simply not healthy for the game.
There are other things that are wrong with her such as the lack of vault animation, collision, and how easy it is for the Spirit to track injured survivors without Iron Will in her phase.
While I agree that we should focus on reworking the weaker killer, Spirit is not healthy at all for the game and should be changed in some way. Not gutting her, but making her more interactive to face.
3 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
To me, Meyers is the closest thing to a perfect killer we have (not counting stalk being weird on dedicated servers)
He's fun to play as, fun to play against. He can do some real damage, but he also be beaten by solid play. And his addons allow him to play in simi decent ways (I love this about Freddy, different versions of the killer help expand builds beyond normal meta perks)
So using Meyers as a template, here's where I am on Spirit.
PHASING: Recharge rate is fine.
Her 'rapid phasing' can at times be a lot to deal with. I'd say whenever she leaves phasing, take half of her remaining phase energy left and recharge from there.
[Example: If she phases and uses 100% of her phase duration there is no change.
If she uses 50% of her phase duration, then when she unphases her recharge would begin at 25% energy.]
Her ability to see scratch marks and no the survivor is fine. Her ability to hone in on sound is really fun to do as the spirit, but not fun as a player. My suggestion here is to amplify ALL sound effects she hears while phasing. Crows are louder, slamming a pallet/phase vault is louder. Someone working on a generator/running is louder. Make the spirit work a little harder to isolate sounds, while still keeping it fun for her.
No vault animation is fine and looks spooky, making it hard to play against windows, but we should have a very short 'phasing sound' which would lead into my next change.
Phasing nearby: If you're near Spirit when she phases there's no sound to show it. This is fun as spirit to pretend to phase, but not fun for survivor since you have nothing to go on. My suggestion here is whenever the spirit phases she lets out a cry of pain. This tells survivors you phases. Now, did you instantly unphase and are standing still? Are you moving around? They'll need to make a play, but they'll know your power is on a little bit of a cooldown one way or another because of my above recharge cost, so the spirit can't instantly phase if she makes a bad play.
Prayer Beads: It's stupid fun to scare the hell outta someone and terrifying when it happens, but frustrating because gen tapping is the only option to avoid it. My fix here is to take the Cry of Pain from the change above and make it map wide. When she uses prayer beads, anytime she phases she cries across the map. Survivors have no idea where she is, or if she is still phasing, but they can make an educated play by telling the direction (not distance) of the cry.
2 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Prayer beads, collision, grass/corn not moving.
1 -
Spirit is fine
What do you think "mindgame" means? Obviously it doesn't mean there is one only one correct choice, because then there would be no mind game, right?
Besides, I literally JUST wrote that running to the window is bad. The point is that if you do not know which direction the spirit is coming, the whole vault is a bad idea. The window is a spot that spirit can see while phasing, and can go straight at it with the often correct prediction that survivor is in its close proximity. Therefore the survivor should run AWAY from the vault altogether, which kind of is what I wrote with my previous post.
Survivor should always assume that the spirit has seen you from a distance and is phasing straight at you. Your best bet is to, during the time that the spirit cant see you, move in an unexpected fashion, away from obvious vaults and pallets.
0 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
You just explained me, the Survivor should run away from the window. Great. I am the Spirit now. I know you do that. So i predict the move. Now you will say: Hey, you know that i run away from the window, so now i fault it. But me, the mighty Spirit, knows that you know i know you might vault it now, and because you know that i know what you normally do, you change that. Or you can also try to think deeper.
The endresult of this stays the same: No matter if you vault the window or you run or walk away from it, no matter on what layer you try to think, it stays a 50/50, unless you can read minds.
5 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
The missing vault animation, spirit being able to bump into survivors in yamokas haunting, prayer beads add-on, and the no phasing sound when in her terror radius.
1 -
The "Prayer Beads Bracelet" Add-On
As someone who loves playing Spirit, I will say that I believe Prayer Beads should be an Ultra Rare and Father Glasses a Rare but other than that, I think she's fine.
2 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Her being able to bump into me screwed me over multiple times, as if it wasn't enough she can always hear you, she can also touch you, it almost doesn't make difference that she can't see you.
1 -
Spirit is fine
She’s a hard to learn killer she’s fine
1 -
The Spirits ability to see Scratch Marks while in Yamaokas Haunting
Honestly I do feel bad for not voting the Spirit is fine since even I'm willing to admit us survivor mains complain sooo much, but the ability to see blood trails AND scratch marks seen a bit op, and TBH the ability to see scratch marks should be made into an add on
0 -
she cant see bloodstains without an add on that removes the scratch marks though...
(yeah, she can see old bloodstains, but new ones will not be displayed to her in her base power)
0 -
The Spirits ability to see Scratch Marks while in Yamaokas Haunting
Wait really? I thought it was in her base kit... Did she get Nerf or was it never in her base kit?
0 -
it was a thing for her during the PTB (though they already said this was a bug).
she is only able to see fresh bloodstains uppon equipping the "Father's Glasses" (Ultra Rare) add on, which does not remove scratch marks though - i messed that one up, sorry.
so yeah, she is able to see both, scratchmarks and bloodtrails, but only after equipping an Ultra Rare add on.
1 -
The Spirits ability to see Scratch Marks while in Yamaokas Haunting
Okay you just shined a whole new light to me and made me realize that Spirit isn't that op even with Prayer Beads. I'm glad she could only see Scratch Marks without the add on. Thanks for the info.
1 -
you're welcome ^^
1 -
A different aspect of her power (please elaborate which one)
I feel like both collision and (underrated aspect, needs to be changed) directional hearing. If she did not have directional hearing, I feel she would be a lot more balanced.
1 -
A different aspect of her power (please elaborate which one)
She is mostly fine, the only thing what I would change is that injury sounds should not be directional. So stridor is not that strong with her und that would seperate good spirits with bad spirits. Kind of same as nurse atm.
1 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Prayer Beads, lack of vaulting animation, collision w/ survivors, lack of feedback in general.
2 -
Spirit is fine
Spirit is fine.
However Prayer Beads Bracelet needs a drawback to make it less cheesey to play against. I've suggested this elsewhere, but if you remove the ability to grab during post-phasewalk then it would maintain most of the strength of the add-on while removing the most cheesey aspect of it's use (free gen/totem grabs). Yes she would still get a free hit, but a free hit is way better than a free grab.
When I use Prayer Beads Bracelet I avoid grabbing unless I'm basically forced to do it. Instead I just go for jump scares and normal hits because it's more fun for me and the survivor, and it keeps the game somewhat challenging.
1 -
None of the above (please elaborate what you think is too strong then)
Not knowing when she is phasing even though "YoU cAn SeE tHe ShArdDs LiGhT uP wHeN sHe'S pHaSiNg"
2 -
Multiple of the above (please elaborate which ones you think are too strong)
Prayer Beads, Collision and foliage not moving although that one is debatable.
I'm not a fan of the addons that lets you enter phase quicker because from experience (I am a bad spirit full disclosure) I just use it to run into survivor collisions because I can close the gap too quickly before they can react. It makes it too easy for me to just keep playing poorly rather than improving by actually predicting and reading their movement. I don't know if I am on the receiving end of that but I sometimes assume I am. Just a nitpick though regarding addons but the collision part is why I mention this.
My primary gripe though is I find it hard to learn how to adapt to her at times. I keep getting told she glows blue slightly when she phases but I don't see it and half the time she has cosmetics anyway. Like against a Tombstone Myers for example I know to look for his hand being open or closed. It's subtle but if you're observant enough it can save you or at least prolong your death. Against Spirit I find it hard to read any signs that she is phasing. Also even with these subtle signs against a spirit what am I supposed to do if these are present? They're too hard to see and I can't stop to pay attention because that's how I get hit. There's obviously some game sense involved in predicting when Spirit will phase but some addons make her relentless on how often or quick she can phase.
Also I don't believe Spirit is overpowered it's just in certain circumstances she feels unfair to deal with. Mostly due to various addons. I feel as though her basekit without addons is absolutely fine though.
1 -
The "Prayer Beads Bracelet" Add-On
I think shes fine. I just think the beads addon is a little too powerful.
1 -
You know you can type, right?
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