New ban system
Comments
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That still changes nothing about what I said, sorry you don't agree but my stance on that is still firm.
This is coming from someone dealing with a phobia of their own; which has impacted me in plenty of games too- I do not hold it against the games or other people, nor do I hold them accountable in any form. If they came out with a map tomorrow that was on a sky scraper rooftop or something, I probably wouldn't be able to play it unless the drop below was all shrouded in the fog mist- I would probably dodge those games too because depending on the realism displayed it might make me literally just vomit. Yet I still feel the same way, and hold myself to those same standards I am preaching.
As for your comment about the clown being added later...it's a horror game tackling as many horror themes as possible, the odds were that it was going to happen eventually; and even if that wasn't the case it still wouldn't change anything about the responsibility of you and what is and is not other people's fault. Like I said, if an option to say model swap the clown or something was a thing, yeah that's a great solution totally for that- but making them immune to the leaver penalty is not a fair example.
As for the latter you are wondering about....yeah there is not a lot of info on that yet, guess we will find out tomorrow. I imagine it probably gives you like something super small like 3 minutes or not at all for one leave, but if you leave again lets say before the next daily goes up to mark 24 hours- it goes up to like 15 minutes or something, and then 2 hours, and after that it locks you out for the day. Something akin to what dota 2 does I imagine, but that is all I can do is speculate.
The devs should really have clarified this already; so at least people know.
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I dont really get people that complain about dcs.Like, you get 700 hundred for a hook and 600 for a dc. Isnt the problem the chase you dont get?
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I do not want to be misunderstood, as I said before it is not a lack of talent and of course they are only working, I think it is a complete lack of interest from the CEO of the company.
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I am sorry to hear about your phobia, but you can realistically control your phobia in this game by providing map offerings, the game provides you a built in mechanic to avoid your specific phobia, it has no ways to prevent people from playing a specific killer against you, nor should the game have that functionality. Also due to the way the game world is generated I highly doubt your phobia will be introduced into DBD. However like I said, if it did, you have a way to avoid it at the very least.
Secondly, there was a point on stream that they specifically said they would not release a clown killer due to coulrophobia, god that was forever, I wonder if their twitch video still exists.
But ignoring that completely, here is where our main stances differ. If statistically you only ever DCed against that one very specific thing, I don't think you should be banned, I have no problem with a timeout or other short term punishment, but a straight up ban due to something you mentally can't cope with seems highly unreasonable to me.
It's why depending on how the system works, I will fully support it, if it does it's job of punishing people who are DCing almost every match or many times within a short session, then I am all for it, if it punish's for every single DC no matter the time between or how often, then it will bother me.
My personal favorite solution would be, if you DC once, you get put into a queue, if you DC again you get a time out again for 5 minutes, every time you DC you add an additional 5 minutes to that timeout. The timeout resets completely 24 hours after your last timeout. I would prefer this even over banning.
However, once again, Killer main, so this really doesn't effect me all that much.
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I'd actually say MOST DC because they are sore losers. This isn't something new to games. Gears 5 banned several players FOR TWO YEARS because they were quitting like 80% of their ranked games when they started losing. While I find that a bit extreme, at the same time people like this just need to suck it up and take the L.
Literally 90% of the time when someone DC's when I'm killer it's from being found or chased first. Then another 5% play out the game until they are just about to die, then they DC to save their items (which normally you don't get to keep but they do a special trick I'm not going to explain here). 4% DC to give the last one hatch. The last 1% DC because I had Iri Heads or Prayer Beads or something.
So pretty much in every case, someone is being a sore loser. "Oh my gawd, the killer is using something OP/unbalanced. Oh no, I got Haddonfield as killer." Yea get over it. That's part of the game. Do we need better balance? Sure, won't deny that. But to quit for that reason is being a sore loser plain and simple. It's gross how often some people DC and the reasons they DC.
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I only take issue with your one particular example, beyond that one reasoning; I agree with you.
I mean it should not be punishing people who get a dedicated server error and get kicked out, and that does happen to a fair amount of people recently.
The time out suggestion you have though is way WAY too light, that would still result in pretty much the exact same DC behavior. It NEEDS to scale. First DC excused? Yeah no problem, second DC in 24 hours, a 5 minute lockout, then 30 minutes, then 2 hours, and after that the rest of the day or something along those lines- else people will just DC and watch a youtube video and then queue up again, a lot of the queue times can be 5 minutes already anyways so it won't change anything for most people abusing the DC.
I play killer and survivor, and believe me those survivor DCs over every little thing are very frustrating.
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Just a comment: when the new DLC arrives, the only people playing Oni will be those who buy the killer or buy the DLC, or maybe get an offering to use Oni without any perks. I don't know if the entire player base will rush out and buy the DLC, if they did it would be a huge win for the people who created the new DLC.
That said, its a good chance some, not all, survivors, perhaps those that had experience with Oni as a survivor facing off, might decide to leave the game early. Not because the killer is intrinsically broken or "OP" but they simply dont want to face him. Similar I guess to Spirit dcs.
At the same time we have a ranking system that is used to match players of similar rank and one would assume similar experience... except the balance cannot allow for low rank killers with all purple perks from multiple killers in their collection facing new players at rank 20 or 19 with one or two yellow perks.
You cannot fix the game by saying to the veteran killer , "sorry purple perks are banned in low ranks", but would it not give killers an incentive to raise their rank to 16? and not stay at 17-20 knowing they can only use unique perks.
At the same time, to level the playing field, new players can only only use unique perks until they adept the survivor. I know adepting for killers is utterly broken but I feel it would help new survivors grasp the fundamentals of each perk and gain an achievement as well.
The proposed rank reset may go some way to altering the mix of players, but be aware from 13th this month a rank 17 survivor or killer may have been a rank 13 survivor or killer before with all purple perks from different killers/survivors which they earned through game play.
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I only chose 5 minutes for an example, I think yours is a little extreme. Maybe double the time. Given that queues are never going to be instant.
For the first DC, Free... ######### happens, you mother called or work, you should always get at least 1 DC. Life Happens, you can't always control that.
The Second DC, 5 minute Timeout. Third DC 10 minute timeout. Fourth DC 20 minute timeout. Fifth DC 40 Minute Timeout. Sixth DC 1 hour and 20 minutes, 7th DC 2 hours and 40 minutes.
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More I read you more doubts I have, for the killers they already gave us the kill, so you can really ask anyone and you'll know that it doesn't affect us I mean it's barbecue & chilli for free but for the survivors it would be much worse. I can understand some achievements that you want to accomplish, but that is something that you only have to do once, and the survivors who have a partner who commits suicide on their first hang ti is worse or at least it's the same than a direct disconnection, it is obvious and it would be ridiculous to add a bot or a person in the middle of a game, so whats the true argument for improving the game with a ban?... can someone explain to me what is the benefit of applying that as a solution?, if people disconnect mostly it is because there is something wrong with the game or whatever a disconnection or instant suicide not changes absolutely nothing for anyone, if they want to die quickly they will continue doing it, coming running straight to me and they will continue to ruin the game for others 🤔
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I think it depends on how good their system is at detecting the leave cause. If it is really good at telling if you had an issue, or it was their servers, or anything else... It probably should be a little strict, I mean it's how a fair amount of games do and it works well for the most part.
If it was really bad at detecting your reason, you are probably in a fair ballpark range, it should ramp up a lot more after your fourth DC because after that it's just getting ridiculous. Other than that though I think that would be fine.
If it's really good at detecting your reason, as in it knows you hit leave game or used Alt-f4 and it was not a bug splat, or a server de-sync or anything else, which tbh knowing the game and the dev poewer I doubt it will, then I think what I proposed would be fine as is, maybe a little lighter on your third DC but that would be about all.
(I forgot what it's like to have a civil discussion with someone that doesn't escalate to stupidity; It's nice for a change lol)
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Those points sound reasonable. The whole reason I think the double the timeframe is the best option, because I am not sure who well the devs are at telling when someone leaves a match and why/how they left the match.
(hahahaha, I actually just told someone else in discord that I started a debate on the DBD forums, and said it was weird because it was civil. lol)
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Still no reason to quit the game. Latency is something every online game has to deal with. Sure those hits are BS but you can still play the game.
The only time "technical difficulties" can be legit used as a reason to DC is if the game is completely unplayable. As in you can't even walk a straight line without rubber banding, or the game doesn't let you repair a gen or vault a window, or you get stuck somewhere with no way to get out. But getting a little lag where you got hit. Sorry suck it up and keep playing. That's how the internet works sometimes.
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Given the number of drops I've seen on first down (or even first hit), I'd say this system was long overdue.
LOOOOOONG overdue.
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If I had to guess, I would assume it's probably not going to be great at it. It requires a very specific skillset in network engineering that a lot of smaller game studios just can't pull off. We'll see, but my faith in it is pretty shaky right now, hope I am wrong.
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I totally agree, but tell that to a main survivor, do you know how many people insult me at the end of the games? "you using hacks" "how did you know it was there?" "your hits are super fake" "I'm going to report you" "fu* tunneler" etc. and that when I'm lucky that they stay in the games, most just disconnected . But it's not really fun because I want everyone to enjoy the games and when I put gg at the end they only answer ugly things 😧
In addition, let's be honest, it's always a clear advantage for us, I have many hours and I'm going to be 100% honest, I think I have the ability now, but I get rise in rank and be a good killer because it was extremely easy to hit any survivor in any moment 🤣
In fact, that is why I never play as a survivor, I think that playing killer is 99.99% more fun and I owe it a lot to the great advantage that I have to be able to give a hit in any type of situation, of course I fail 1 in 20 , but ... even if I find it hard to admit it is really a bit unfair 🤫
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In there defense, its quite complicated to determine, because as a programming I can write a script that starts to eat up my ram and cause DBD to crash as a side effect, I can also write a program that simple ends the game process unexpectedly. Neither thing the devs can tell which happened, all they will be able to know is that the game crashed, If I send them the report, they might be able to determine the exact cause, but they can't force me to send the data unless they change there TOS.
Lastly I could also write a program that just starts downloading a large file from a hosting server and give if full priority which would cause me to drop enough frames that their server thinks I lost internet net service, once again, something that is very hard for them to check.
It's probably fairly easy for them to check when someone hits the "Leave Game" button, its the clever people and the people who will write programs that is going to ruin their system.
So it's hard for me to just say, they aren't good enough, its their skill is limited without installing spyware on the users machine, which I don't think any company wants to do at this point. lol
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My latest DC was 2 days ago, on console dedicated servers arent a thing, so during the lobby the ping was green, but when the match started I was rubber-banding like crazy, so I left the game. I have no idea what happened.
Yeah, there's times when you DC because of other reasons and if you get punished for that is kinda unfair, but I'm gonna have to agree that most of the DC's are rage quitters. Last night I got 3 DCs, I was playing trapper :( freaking Chuckles! not even Freddy/Spirit FFS..
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Their CEO won't care as long as they make money and keep their investors happy. Sadly that's how it works unless it's a small studio with CEO directly involved with the game and the community.
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Which is why the timer is incremental. So that when things happen you cant control, you dont get permanent banned.
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I agree but they created a new game, they invested a lot of money and time and now it's free and plans to shut down their servers ... I think Remi didn't make anyone happy with that decision 🤣
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This is my concern too, but I'm getting better internet, soooo hopefully that will rarely be my issue.
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Yes. Naturally, every change a game developer makes to their game would be in the name of improving it. Do you really think a developer would try to sabotage their own game?
The dedicated servers were introduced because the community begged for them for months. And yes, they're still far from perfect, but they're better than they were two months ago, which shows that they are being worked on and improved.
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Exactly.
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I absolutely agree. I was trying to be charitable by using the word "some" 😋
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If you're getting disconnected in 7/10 games, you need to set some time aside, load into some KYF matches, and figure your ######### out. Play with settings, verify your installation, update drivers, get a direct connection instead of playing DbD mobile on McDonalds bathroom WiFi, whatever the solution is. A 70% disconnect rate, no matter the reason, clearly means you should not be allowed in regular games until that is fixed
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people dc thats just how it is , if you don't wana keep playing just dc like the other player and find another game . players should not be forced to play a game/match if they don't want to . there are multiple reasons why people dc and if you have played this game enough you should realize that . I made a post about this saying that if people abuse dcing thus doing it on purpose to grief other players they should get a 15 minute ban but only if they dc like 10 times in a row , and if they do it daily then further action may be required such as a 12 hour ban but if BHVR start to randomly ban people just for dcing people will stop playing , and then the people that wanted the people who dc to get punished would get punished themselves because the wait queues would be even longer because there would be less players , so dc temporary bans are ok but only for players that do it to grief other players , if not the game should stay the way it is .
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Done, done and done. I've covered everything on my end. The funny thing is that DC issues never happen when I play other games. I play 4 other games regularly and flawlessly. It also never happens when I play killer. This problem isn't just happening to me, go check out the bug report forum. Many people are having this problem. This is something on their end, I'm sure of it.
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Sounds like you have a bad case of Noob3,where you have an issue that refuses to be solved by any sane means, and there's nothing for it but to hope something random in a patch un-breaks your experience then
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The dedicated servers were implemented in their new game before in DBD, we asked for them for years and they decided to add them in their new game and as that game became a total failure they decided to add them in DBD because they already had them. I don't think they try to sabotage the game they just don't care the players. If they were really interested in the players, they would make people enjoy playing it and that no one wants to disconnect from their game, but instead they prefer to leave everything as it is and punish the players who are disconnected, that is a clear example that they prefer to do things easily by blaming players for their own problems.
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If the miles of patch notes and pretty much everything they've ever told us in announcements, dev streams, AMAs etc. won't convince you that they're constantly making changes and trying to improve the game to make it more fun (even if they don't always succeed because they're not perfect), then I don't see how anything I say is going to make a difference 🤷
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with the new system I would have been ban for getting kicked from my game great :)
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Literally just got disconnected out of a game brought em to main menu, I said to myself great I’d be banned right now LOL joke
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This video is basically my life in dbd LOOL,
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I only say that they decided to make a new game before putting dedicated servers in DBD, which was their main game and where they had their entire community, they preferred to make a bad decision because they preferred money instead of doing something for the users. I know that the game has changes all the time without updates, but when you only make small changes that do not affect the real problem it is the same as putting a ban system for disconnections instead of fixing for example the hitbox so that people do not want to disconnect after a false hit through a pallet.
What I say is that the developers do not attack the main problem and blame the players for the disconnections when the game is very false and nobody likes to be hit 5 meters away, and in a game so people will prefer disconnect, as I said earlier I prefer that 1 or 2 survivors escape but that we can all have a good game instead of punishing people for a broken game with a punishment that I as a killer (even as a survivor) is not going to help me in anything 🤦♂️
EDIT: I found this a few days ago in the Steam community, do you want to punish a person for wanting to disconnect after this? Isn't it better to make that not happen? 🤔
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To be fair sometimes I’ve seen people disconnecting (And sometimes I’ve experienced it myself) due to a game error, sometimes in instances where it looks like a ragequit (while hooked, downed)... and other times where it didn’t make sense (while on a gen, running to save someone).
I’ve seen it confirmed when I play killer as well, when they were SWF and I let them farm because I thought it was intentional and wasn’t.
The problem is that these incidents aren’t reported as much IMO. So anyone who sees a DC automatically thinks it’s intentional. So my hope is that this new ban system isn’t going to ban the wrong people in the process.
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I said it in my very first comment on this thread, but I'll say it again - of course the developers should be fixing the problems with the game that make people feel like ragequitting.
But it's still 100% that person's responsibility if they decide to disconnect, disadvantaging other players in the process, rather than continue the game. They do deserve the blame for that, and the punishment, because it's still something they have decided, selfishly, to do.
It's not an either/or situation. People should be punished for disconnecting from games, and the devs should be doing everything in their power to make the experience as enjoyable as possible for their players.
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I agree with that, but here you can clearly see that they are punishing the players and not solving the problems. I'm sure you know that there is a glitch that makes the Hunter's axes go through the walls, but instead of fixing it they prefer to punish the player who disconnects after receiving one of those false blows, you I can say that this glitch is new and in order of priority they will first give ban to people who disconnect, but false hits exist since the game was created and they never cared to fix it, first there was the lag switch and for years they don't mind solving it, now after so much time they put dedicated servers (after taking them out in their secondary game). They are taking the easy path and only punish the player and do not solve the problem, and that is why I think it would be better to first solve the problem and then give a punishment, because currently the ban is not justified if the game works badly, it would be a perfectly justified a ban if the game worked well and there was no such obvious reason to disconnect, so I say that the developers do not think about the users since the solution of a ban will not solve anything, as previously mentioned people now they are going to commit suicide and that is what the ban is not going to benefit anyone, they are doing something to punish a person who disconnects instead of helping people not wanting to do it.
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Again though, they're not banning instead of fixing the problems, they're banning for disconnects in general and at the same time they're fixing issues in the game that negatively affect players' enjoyment. For all we know, the hatchet bug is going to be fixed in the next patch.
If they're going to punish one DC, they have to punish all of them, because some disconnects at least do deserve punishment and it's literally impossible for the developers to know what the reason was behind a disconnection. (And no matter what the reason is, the player in question is still screwing over other players by doing so, so arguably a punishment is justified in any case.) The problem is that what you're proposing simply isn't practically enforceable.
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So if you suddenly have someone at your door and have to go do a bunch of things you SHOULDNT be able to leave?
Thats why a leave game button exists. I personally use it if i have to leave to go eat because my family have made dinner. At which point a 5 min timer wont mean anything to me because ill be eating.
The timer is only going to bother those that quit because they got mad they got downed / mad that they have lost all gens and havent downed anyone etc
If not a timer then what? What discourages rage quit dcs?
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I do not say that it always happens, but it happened to me be kicked from the server with the killer at the beginning of the game, you could see at the end of the game that the 2 of us had disconnected, and the same thing happened to me when I played as a killer a few weeks ago I lost a pip for that and I am sure that now I will be banned for that, and I was not the one who disconnected from the game, it was the killer and a survivor because of a game error, so they are going to punish me with a ban because of a game failure and that is totally ridiculous and unacceptable, there is no valid basis for doing such a thing. 😑
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If you get kicked from the game due to connection issues or another player disconnecting, you will not be punished, either by the current ban system or (as far as I'm aware) by the new one. The system only punishes those who disconnect from the game deliberately using the in-game "Leave Match" button.
So rest assured, you aren't going to be banned.
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If I am not punished why did I lose a pip as if it had been an intentional disconnection?
BTW: I am remembering some, a few weeks ago I was watching a stream and the person closed the game for an easy anti cheat error, and it was obvious that I was not using any program since he was live with more than 200 people, but even so his game was closed at least 2 times while I was watching and I assume that a disconnection like that will also have a ban as punishment, there are many reasons to realize that a ban by disconnection is an absurd solution when the game has so many problems and so different variety, so I say that clearly putting a ban when the game has so many flaws is totally ridiculous and proof that the players are not interested in the players and just want to give a "solution" that really does not help in the form of placebo (I want to say that they are giving a sick patient water with sugar to think that it is actually a medicine and he thinks he will feel better) so people think they are doing something good for the community 🤥
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If you have some urgency IRL:
- if it's temporary, just go afk for a couple of minutes
- if it's permanent, just DC. You won't be punished that much if it's a one time thing (let's say, a couple of times per week?)
If you have a lot of urgencies IRL that would make you DC even more than one time a day then play some solo / mobile games, dbd is not for you.
EDIT: on a second read of your post I think we are actually on the same page, so don't take the reply personal, it's not directed (exclusively) to you
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With regards to your own disconnection, that's a bug that a couple of people have been experiencing. Sometimes in the endgame screen it shows that you have lost a pip in that situation, even though in reality you haven't.
If I understood you correctly and you're assuming that the streamer will be banned due to having to close his game or the game itself crashing, that's simply not true.
You seem to be making a lot of assumptions about how the system works without really understanding the facts, which are leading you to all sorts of false conclusions about the developers and their intentions when it comes to punishing disconnects.
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You are saying it clearly, they will punish you for going to eat and what will it affect you? in nothing (you said it). How it will help the other players? in nothing. Can you explain to me what is the point then? 🤣
I personally leave the game AFK and when I return I am dead or I am lucky to continue in the game, I do not like to ruin a game by disconnecting if I can leave the PC on
As I said before, if they solved the errors that the game has and (I say it as personal experience as killer) if they fix the hitbox and the false hits that make people less angry with the game then people could disconnect much less for sure 🙂
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Nah i didnt take it personally :) but yeah i think we are agreeing cause i was meaning an irl urget thing as a reason to dc because the other person was questioning why even have the button in the first place if you are going to punish. I never really have any irl urget matters tbh my family understand some games you cant simply pause haha
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every time I think about pausing a game this video comes to mind (especially 3:10):
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As i said yeah a temporary delay of say 5 mins won't effect someone thats away doing something but thats not the reason for all the dc complaints is it?
I think the temp delay would be good if its for the first couple mins of a game for sure. The amount of times ive seen someone rage quit because they got downed within the first min is crazy at least 1 a day sometimes 2 or 3. People dc to give their friend the hatch i think that should be a thing that should get changed too because thats in no way fair at all it doesnt really give the killer a chance which is what the whole change of the hatch was about anyway stopping stand offs and making it more fair.
Dc punishments will hopefully make the game more fair for both parties. Or at least fair in the sense that if the survivor dcs and you loose the game because of it at least theyre being punished for rage quitting at the start and doing so.
A lot of games have this kind of thing so why not dbd? Why is it fair for other games and not dbd?
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But what if the game crashes, or it is a power failure, or as sometimes happens, the game is frezzing and then I have to close it from task manager. These problems must also be considered.
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I was level 8 and after that forced disconnection because of the game error it was level 9, believe me that I did lose the pip.
I am going to say something a little extreme: if you buy a new car, you are driving at the permitted speed but the brakes do not work and you jam a person, do you think you have to be punished for it? or do you think the fault is from the company that manufactured the defective car? What is happening here is that the driver of the car is being put in jail so that the person who was injured feels better about it, when the real culprit is the company that created the car that does nothing to put better brakes on their cars.
You think that I am against ban for the range quit, but you do not understand that many times that range quit is because of the faulty game, you cannot blame the player for wanting to disconnect if the game malfunctions, you must fix your game and then apply a ban, because the disconnection will not have any justification at this moment there are many range quit that are perfectly justified and it is because of the fact that the game does not work well. I don't say all of them, but most of them.
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