Ruin should be a timed effect instead of a totem
It's clear at this point that when survivors focus on generators the games go by pretty fast, it's no wonder Ruin is such a popular perk. Games should not be decided by totem RNG. When Ruin is found right away it fails to do the 1 thing it's supposed to (slow down the early game), when Ruin is up all match the killer player usually has an easy game as the gens don't get done in time.
Both of these extremes are bad, making Ruin a 2 min effect (like corrupt intervention) would solve both of these scenarios. It's time to balance the game.
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in my opinion, it would make the killer side worser than before. As a survivor, I can merely hide for 2 mins until the effect gone and rush gen. it doesn’t help at all
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The failure in your argument is that corrupt intervention exists and hiding for 2 mins is doing the killer a favor, having a guaranteed 2 mins of Ruin vs having it destroyed right away is worth it for the killer.
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tbh I think that'd make it worse. Ruin is great because people waste time looking for it. If they don't look for it and instead just keep work on gens that'll be a huge nerf
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You can't find people on gens if they're looking for the Ruin instead of working on a gen, and you seem to forget that when Ruin gets found a destroyed right away it wastes no time at all.
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Why not both?
Regular Hex Totem with a timer after destruction.
Like a lingering curse.
20-40s at max would be more than fine.
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That's a good idea for the first problem (Ruin gets destroyed too early) But it doesn't help with the second problem (Ruin lasts all game and gens don't get done).
Totem RNG shouldn't determine the game.
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I'd like to see hex totems move to the next available dull totem when cleansed, except for Haunted Grounds
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Because ruin is already a crutch perk?
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Yes, finally I can use CI with Ruin.
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I knew this would come from a hag main avatar.
No.
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We buffin' meta perks now?
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As far as I'm concerned, you can't complain if you use Ruin without a plan to defend it and it gets cleansed early. And if it's up all the match, it's up to the survivors, push through or learn better the totem spawns.
So no, Ruin is ok.
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I'd like to think of it as "finding a balance" for Ruin. That way, it lasts long enough for Killer to get decent mileage out of it, but not too long that it effectively lasts the whole game. Avoiding "feast or famine" situations, if you will.
TBH, the more I think about it, the more I feel like I am just fundamentally not a fan of Hex perks in general for this reason.
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That's the point of Hex perks though.
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See my edit.
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That's fair. I don't like them either, don't use any of them anymore.
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Then it would be called corrupt intervention.
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If this was the case I would just run CI over Ruin. Not like I use Ruin much anymore I prefer CI anyways. Better results.
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Yes but let it last 60s
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This. Lately when i'm looking for the ruin is every single time the 5th and last totem on the map. Every time. I'm getting mad and triggered a lot lol
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I still don't understand how people can have problem doing gens with ruin in almost 2020...
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many ppl want ruin to get a buff it wont happend no matter what unless its a rework like it happend with noed hex totems its powerful but comes with a risk and thats when a survivor destroy the totem
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Isn't that a kind of backward? Just like the NOED, that was a time-limited perk. The better way is to make a new perk that can keep the hex totem for more time.
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Fun fact: I don't play with Ruin. I rather sacrifice 1-3 gens to spin my net and keep the survivors busy with healing, unhooking and Franklin's to collect their precious items, naturally I trap them. Than relying on a RNG perk that lets me play with only 3 perks after a minute.
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Personally I think Ruin should be a perk and not a hex. Slightly increase the amount regressed by missing a great skill check and and remove the time penalty.
Killers will no longer be annoyed that their ruin is gone. Survivors will no longer be annoyed that their teammates waste time looking for ruin. Too many games have been lost because people just refuse to do gens with ruin.
And that three second wait while the gen is sparking is just frustrating all together. Get rid of it but slightly increase regression rate to compensate. Bumping it by 1-2% should be fine.
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Maybe dont rely on Ruin then? It is not a good Perk. In fact, vs really good Survivors it does way less than vs bad Survivors. Sure, nobody can hit Great Skill Checks 100% of the time, but Red Ranks will be able to have at least 8 out of 10, while green Ranks and below will struggle more.
Furthermore, a timer would be bad for the Killer. It is no problem to just hide from the Killer for two minutes. And no, this does not benefit the Killer at all (except Killers like Trapper of course). Many Killer Players dont play Whispers (I mean, why play the best Tracking Perk when you can have double BP with BBQ, which is worse for tracking...) and if all Survivors are hiding for two minutes, the Killer gains exactly nothing, because no ressources are used.
And lets not forget, there are games where Ruin lasts really long. But apparently Killers "forget" about such situations. Sure, it does not fit their narrative.
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Listen I don't like DS either, I ain't about to defend it.
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Or just make all hex totem effects persist for 40/50/60 seconds(depending on perk tier) after destroyed such as haunted grounds.
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Corruption intervention works because not all survivors go hide in lockers for 2 minutes (hoping out every once in a while to avoid afk crows), if they were to do that the perk would be rendered useless since 2 minutes with no hooks, no gens and no pallet throwns is the same as starting the game 2 minutes later.
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Boring from both perspectives; survivors just hide and killers wander around the map doing nothing. I would agree ruin or gens could use a rework, but I don't think this is a good solution.
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Ruin is slowly becoming a crutch perk for all the M1 killers. That's what I feel anyway, I main Oni at red ranks running Surge/Thrilling Tremors/PGTW/Blood Echoes.
The growing trend I see with dbd is that more Killers have the ability to one shot survivors. With the exception of the spirit but with beads she was a monster anyway.
Learn to play without it, the more games you play without worrying about a totem means the more pressure you can apply on the map itself.
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I feel like Ruin shouldn't be a hex or a timer. Rather, it should be dependent on the amount of healthy survivors. With all 4 in a healthy state, it should be running normally, but it should lose effectiveness by 25% with every injured or hooked survivor. It would also give a buff to No mither, because 4 NM's would completely eliminate ruin, but would also give the killer an instadown.
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Just make the totem entity blocked for 1 minute like that Plague perk for gens
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Why not make killer light up his own totems? That would solve the rng problem.
Game starts with all hexes inactive and killer can see all totem auras - and must physically go to one and put one of the hexes on it. Of course, variations are possible on this - killer could relight cleansed hexes on standing dull totems, but survivors get an audiovisual notification whenever he does so.
Noed should still be auto though.
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ruins fine how it is, if you can't hit the skill check that's on you. If anything they need to fix totem placements so it doesn't get destroyed in the first minute of a match.
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I actually like this idea a lot. The time penalty is absurdly annoying when I play survivor, and the lack of a hex would mean I'd get to start most of my killer games the way I actually want to: finding survivors instead of making a beeline to my totem on the opposite side of the map to go babysit it for the first portion of the game.
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The speed that gens can get done is a crutch within itself
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2minutes???? You must must be like rank 12 ??? 2 minutes is nothing. I cant propose much cause well its a dumb idea to begin with
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So if they don't look for Ruin and power through they're gen rushing and if they're looking for ruin you can't find them is that correct? I hate to break it to you but survivors don't have to look for ruin and it isn't our fault. Gen rushing is NOT a thing when it's the main objective for us to get out.
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If you think gen rush isn't a thing then you're low rank, if you're low rank your opinion on balance is irrelevant and I hate to break it to you but the main factor for applying gen pressure isn't gen times, it's map design. I simply suggested a good rework for an overused perk.
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There are endless different ideas on how to buff totems, not just ruin. Personally I might would like ruin being time perk, it would be an interesting test during the ptb. They don't have to implement it but people can test and give feedback on whether they think it's good or not.
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My idea to "buff" Hex perks: Make them all non-Hex perks and balance them accordingly. :P Use totems for something else.
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I don't know I exactly agree with that. I always said that totems shouldn't spawn till their effects are active. So huntress lullaby shouldn't activate till 1 survivor has been hooked. Devour Hope shouldn't spawn till it gains its first toten.
But I always liked hex totems being "high risk, high reward".
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I used to feel similar to you regarding totems not being lit until the perks do something, but I've recently come to dislike Hex perks being 'feast or famine". It is increasingly reminding me of Bear Trap escapes in that "either luck favors you and screws Survivors, or luck favors Survivors and you get nothing." Not good design IMO.
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They could just rework hex totems and totems all together
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The problem with this game is at higher ranks you need to do everything pretty much perfect to win. You need your perks to also help you out a lot and losing because of this random chance aspect isn't fun. But I think when the high risk does pay off, with perks like huntress lullaby and Devour hope it makes the win that much better.
Bear traps annoy me for a similar reason but I think its works with her character. Now I'd like the first box to guarantee not to have the key everytime but that's just me.
When it comes to hex totems my biggest problem was when they are destroyed you lose everything. When I was writing chapters I wanted to include hex perks where after they were destroyed you don't lose all the effects of the totem.
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That's actually exactly what I was thinking.
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The way I see it, I'd rather current Hex perks just function consistently across the board rather than have some games where they are here forever and some games where you are almost immediately down one or more perks.
Also, wrong Bear Trap. I'm talking about Trapper's Bear Traps and how escaping them is completely up to RNG. Sometimes you are free in one attempt, and the Trapper basically got nothing out of it, and sometimes you can't escape after a gazillion tries and was able to be caught by the Trapper despite him being on the other side of Grim Pantry. That's kinda what (most) Hex perks feel like to me these days. For what it is worth, I 100% agree on your suggestion regarding Jigsaw Boxes, but I digress.
I think Hex perks having lingering effects after being broken can help, but at this point, I'd rather just de-Hexify Hex perks. That's just me, though.
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I stay in the red as survivor and your point is absolutely ridiculous. Idk if you know this, but ranks 1-20 ALL have to do generators to escape. Gen rushing is just doing the MAIN objective of the game regardless if you like it or not. It's so funny how killer mains have this notion that survivors are suppose to be idiots or not do the main objective that leads to victory. That's not how it works, sorry.
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Fair but I think that because of how strong some can be i.e. Devour hope or huntress lullaby they would need changed or nerfed if they weren't hex totems.
The trapper one doesn't bother me as much. Since usually if I'm killer they run into traps when I'm really close. I doesn't bother me if I get unlucky escaping a trap because I just know its luck based and usually the killers close enough I can't do much about it anyway.
It's been a really good discussion on this mate. It has made me think a lot more about hex totems than I had before.
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