General Discussions
General Discussions
BT rework take 2:
I came with a suggestion on nerfing BT before and took into the consideration the feedback:
My proposal this time:
BT works 1 time - however, it’s only “used up” if the killer hits someone with endurance. Until someone is hit BT still remains active in the match.
If a survivor is unhooking someone with BT they will both get endurance however - if the unhooker is currently healthy, instead of being healthy>injured>deep wound following hits... they instead go healthy>deep wound (so kinda working like legion with a 2 health-state hit then deep wound).
Comments
-
It would still need something against using it during endgame, because that was the main problem with old BT. The new BTs problem is it allows for Survivors to go make braindead plays over and over again and going for instant saves and then calling the killer a 'camper' without even giving them a chance to leave the hook.
3 -
Not fully against this either if it turned out to be necessary... I mean I’d have a “try it out”... if that’s causing a problem... defo make it not work during end-game... my money is on it being necessary to add that too personally.
I think I nailed the base concept for a rework though... less punishing for killers who catch a survivor’s scratch marks - follow them then hit them - if they were healthy now the killer actually gains something and also doesn’t have to go through the perk multiple times.
If the killer’s face-camping the perk could actually be a bit more useful too here. So it’s kinda trade for trade.
0 -
Did you read? He legit said it only has one use so if they save it for endgame, like with deliverance, they deserve a small edge.
0 -
I mean - it’d need testing still... if it’s increasing the escape rate a lot then it can’t objectively for-fill this.
0 -
BT is in a good spot imo. If you play against altruistic survivors it is your job to take note and exploit their carelessness.
2 -
De-pip squad were using it to the max to get 4 man escapes... it’s only been buffed since... a full coordinated SWF can block all the necessary angles to make it happen. It’s not in a “good spot” especially since all the buffs.
0 -
Can you show me a video of the survivors exploiting BT and there is nothing the killer can do?
0 -
BT and DS are both perks without any downside. Just like Ruin, BBQ, Enduring,...
If all of those perks wozld get a downside to them, maybe the meta would change finally.
0 -
Most perks don't have downsides.
0 -
Whispers don't got one, Bond don't got one. But the effects of both perks are not gamechanging, that's the difference.
0 -
https://youtu.be/6Hy3gXDe8bc - BT was used
https://youtu.be/jca5mSiAXpY - 4 man escape
https://youtu.be/68krDaEFXcU - BT into hatch
https://youtu.be/Meg5qHOhW38 - BT escape
https://youtu.be/sI5hdr5wwR8 - Pallet stun so no need to BT but option was there
https://youtu.be/VLPc4uV4mz8 - 4 man escape
I showed the other vids for 4 man escapes where if the killer still got one BT was ready to force a win. That’s 7 out of the last 10 games I quickly looked at the end of.
0 -
I can’t edit on mobile since the site is bugged but those BT escapes allowed for 4 man escapes. SWF are easily capable of forcing this with BT.
edit: Except I can edit this post since it’s not large enough it seems ...
But yeah just to mention these are out of 91-100 last games of emblem squad.
0 -
Thanks for the time stamps. Oh wait. Just give me BT abuse moments I have no patience mate. Side note: I didn't watch the vids did you link them because BT was used 4 or less times? 5 or more seems like abuse if the killer was helpless. Also, vids from killer side only. I know how people get false information from potato killers from survivor gameplay.
0 -
Soo because someone saves off hook before you can run away is making you mad?
What for?
Or is it the fact that you're going off the unhooked instead of the one that did the unhooking.
BT is just for the reason that everyone has stated..Im not saying that you are camping but a lot of killers do and honestly BT needs to stay where it is.
Until killers are punished more for camping and tunneling it doesn't need to be touched
:D
1 -
At least more people would play killer if BT got nerfed. I hope those people enjoy the queue times.
0 -
Do gens or just use BT... this new version would be better for anti-camping and anti-tunnelling.
See the vids I posted... what makes me “mad” That just from a sample of 10 matches... BT created 3 out of 10 4 man escapes or were likely going to secure it in 7/10... if the devs only balance around 4-man SWF... they could atleast rework BT so it’s weaker for them justifying solos to get strong. As a solo survivor it’s not fun playing the game.
0 -
Just no.
BT can be abusable and I know that but nerfing it that way will just make camping and tunneling even worse than it is.
BTW I still dont know why people go for the unhooked user, they should go for the unhooker, cause you get a free hit while they unhook and a potential second hit, I have seen a lot of killers just way for the 15s or instead of hitting the unhooker way for the unhooked guy to be unhook -_- that's a D1C* move..
If any I would like that BT counter campers cause that's the purpose of it and I can accept a big nerf.
1 -
So basically - make the perk useless enough where nobody uses it. Giving BT the Mettle of Man treatment.
0 -
Unhooking as soon as I start to walk away.
0 -
No more perks should be given the mettle of man treatment that was a dumpster fire
0 -
Thats why you don't go after the person that just got unhooked.
That's like bitching that everyone is running DS but yet you're going after the person that just got unhooked.
Yes they said that camping and tunneling is a legit strat but that doesn't mean cry about it when perks are used to allow all their teammates to escape.
In this situation the killer got out smarted and he was just going after the person that was just taken off the hooks..
common sense people
1 -
That means you are either too far to hit the unhooked within 15 seconds or too close for the unhooker to save without getting hit. Like I said, if a killer figures out their survivors are altruistic they can exploit that heavily.
0 -
I'm about 10 meters away with my back turned. Fast enough to get there, not fast enough to hit the unhooker before they unhook.
0 -
Unlucky :)
0 -
Slugging is the counter to hook rush... DS is the anti-tunnel perk... there’s no reason to tunnel while that perk exists... killers don’t tunnel because of BT but plainly DS... killers can just wait 15 seconds and re-hook if DS didn’t exist... BT pretty much acts as a huge time waste for killers being unable to secure momentum... i.e. slugging the downed person who got farmed then going after the farmer and hooking them.
0 -
I'm ok with the current BT - Bad Survivors just use it to farm each other which leads to pretty easy games if you wait the 15s.
0 -
They put DS in the game because of killers that tunnel.
Everything that you're saying is just honestly plain stupid.
Every perk in the game has a counter to it. - Think someone has DS, Don't just chase them after they've been unhooked. Simple as that.
The reason that BT,DS, Unbreakable and perks like that are in the game is because tunneling and camping is allowed. Now if these things are allowed then the perks are too. You don't have to tunnel or camp to win a game. you really don't
If anything, They need to bring back the old DS :D
EDIT-
They have also made it so that BT people have to either mend or keep on running..leaving scratch marks..So yeah a lot easier as killer to be able to find them again, if you have problems with that run blood hound..idk what to tell ya guy..But using Marths videos isn't really saying much.
Not every SWF group can play like that, Honestly I can tell you right now half swf groups aren't even that great..They just wanna play the game with friends and have fun.
0 -
And this is precisely why I suggest the rework... if that survivor rescuing is healthy now you actually gain something as the killer... pushing them into deep wound instead of injured.
I literally do not see the downside people are inferring. You still get to keep the perk if the killers not tunnelling and can use it abit later.
0 -
Borrowed needs a change, it shouldn't be a get out of jail free card.
Keep everything as is, except the requirements.
If the Killer remains in the area of the hooked Survivor for 6 seconds, BT will be avaliable. The only reason you wouldn't like this change is if BT isn't supposed to counter camping and is instead supposed to promote bad plays that a Killer cannot punish.
0 -
Slugging ≠ Tunnelling.
Yeah DS’s concept works... BT’s doesn’t... it destroys the killer’s momentum for free.
0 -
Good idea! I have suggested something similar before, I hope devs take notice that BT needs only a small change to become balanced.
0 -
Ok look at it this way
Same could be said for killers who run NOED
You play like ######### all game but yet a TOTEM is the reason you're able to turn that 0k into a 4k.
I know do totems but do you realize how many people don't?
Like I said everything has a counter
1 -
What’s the counter to DS-BT combo team that hook rush? There isn’t one... they all stay up from the ground/hook. DS is fine on it’s own and it’s one time but with BT the only counter is to hard proxy but then the survivors will do gens... so it’s like trying to force the killer to camp and then actually playing smart for a win if you have enough knowledge as survivor and admit it’s broken.
0 -
Have you tried not camping or tunneling? Works for me. A good way to help you do this is just run bbq or Thrilling Tremors.
0 -
With the survivors all around the hook? Or them actually countering BBQ by going in a locker?
0 -
You can also remember what gens they're working on. If they're all near hook that's free pressure for you.
0 -
So survivors can perform braindead moves as farming without any punishment? only because is good for survivors doesnt mean is good for the game, survivors never waits for the killer to leave always farming specially SWF.
1 -
Try hitting the unhooker then come back and talk.
0 -
No thanks. I'm good with where Borrowed Time is at now. Doesn't need a nerf or buff. But if you twisted my arm and said change BT in some capacity I would do the following.
Borrowed Time: After unhooking a Survivor while the Killer is within 24 meters, for 15 seconds, any damage taken that would put the unhooked Survivor into the Dying State will instead apply the Deep Wound Status Effect. The Survivor has 10/15/20 seconds to mend themselves.
This is both a buff and a nerf. Killers can't just stealth camp to avoid BT but 24 meters is more generous to non-camping killers than 32 meters. This promotes a healthier game overall.
0 -
So if that’s free pressure, how’s that any different when the survivor runs up to the hook to farm another survivor while actual other competent survivors would be hiding and then on gens? You literally just admitted inadvertently that being around the hook in the killers presence isn’t them camping... so why are they punished? If the killer see’s no one of-course they’ll leave or they’ll lose.
If the killer was actually legit camping then BT should be made into a perk for that like the rework proposes but apparently that’d make it a dead perk someone commented... almost like they’re inadvertently suggesting it’s completely bs that killers even camp often? Hmm.
0 -
But BT doesn’t prevent tunnelling/camping. It’s plainly a crutch. It should be counterable... it just counters slugging hook-rushers which are unhealthy for the game.
0 -
I don't even understand your argument. It isn't a crutch and it is counterable. If the killer isn't close to the hook it literally does nothing. That is how you counter it. Find someone else to chase. The only time it has any effect is if the killer is hanging out near the hooked survivor in which case the killer deserves to be punished. If a survivor does a truly unsafe hook rescue before the killer even has a chance to leave the area then the killer is still at an advantage. The killer has 2 viable targets to chase and didn't have to waste time running around looking for a target.
0 -
BT triggers only when the killer is near... survivors can simply just run up and farm the survivor when the killer is near to force the perk to activate... there’s no counter to this except allowing it.
The correct response for the killer was pretty much - slug the unhooked and deny the emblem for the hook-rusher but BT just gives them it for free.
0 -
I think BT is fine, I don’t see a reason to nerf one of the very few perks that can counter a killer who camps / tunnels.
0 -
this is a braindead comment lots of times the killer wont have time to recover and hit twice cause the unhooked guy will take the hit so????? yes is a free escape for both kinda- is a braindead move and 0 counterplay in end game if they have stupid organization with body blocks unless you are bubba or billy, or maybe plague were u can injured them fast and then get a fast hit. so no, if they acre coordinated they can body block there are people who know how to time that ######### corectly and you cant do nothing they both escape due the cooldown being so long unless u have save the best for last...
1 -
Because it doesn’t counter camping/tunnelling... if the killers camping they’ll put you on the hook instead - that’s not a counter but a trade... tunnelling is countered by DS not BT... BT just counters slugging an unhooked person who got farmed creating a situation where according to BT the killer is meant to feel stupid for trying to keep his momentum.
0
