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Tried playing without ruin
The first few games went well and then I went against good survivors and it went as expected tbaging at the exit gates gens being done in under 5 minutes toolbox’s and keys I mean that’s not enjoyable..you can say “well that’s just one game” yea but the last games I won were against potatoes when you actually go up against a good coordinated team you don’t stand a chance I mean why do you think 80% of players use it?
Comments
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Are you saying that that wouldn't have happened if you had Ruin?
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You would have had the same result with Ruin, if they are really good Survivors. The best Survivors dont really care for Ruin anyway, sometimes I feel they even let it lit to have some form of challenge.
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If ruin stayed up then yes I was also playing doc so that’s also a factor
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You have a better chance with ruin and yeah a good team will likely do gens fast but sometimes it can really help slow down gens and buy time
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Why would you give up chase or tracking potential by using ruin against a good team?
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You would have had the same result with Ruin. Sounds like you just don't know how to apply pressure against them. This is the problem with crutch perks like Ruin, people tend to start depending on it and acquire bad habits, like not applying any pressure on gens or survivors and just tunneling one person while 4 gens pop.
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Ruin is just good to let a killer think they have a chance when in reality the whole team can still hit the skill check anyways.
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I guess. But I have a hard time believing Ruin would have stayed up for long in this match.
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My first game without ruin resulted in 2 DCs for using Corrupt Intervention, Thana and Dying light on Plague >.>
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Applying pressure gets harder when your low mobility and on a large map with ruin they either waste time finding it or or it just slows them down.
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You are playing an anti stealth killer, you can apply a ton of pressure with Doctor. I'm not saying you're bad, just showing the options. That said, the Doctor rework might make the anti stealth a bit harder since they are changing the way his passive works. On a large map, it might be hard to get around, but if you shock everyone enough you should know roughly where they are and what they might be doing.
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If the survivors have toolboxes and keys then Ruin is useless anyway.
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I'm not talking about doctor I like the doctor change I don't like the ruin nerf i was never talking just about the doctor there is other low mobility killers I don't main doctor
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No it's not cause you even with a toolbox ruin still slows people down and keys don't work till there is only 2 or 1 gen
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Thats not how it works when you play low or mid-tier killers. You have no mobility, so it takes ages to get to generators. You have no chase power, so even if you scare them off, you don't get anything from it, because you can only chase one person at a time. And it can take ages to get them eventually, because maps are littered with ultra safe loops.
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You are the first person to understand this I swear
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Fellow red rank killer here, so naturally I know the struggle.
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Yes playing low mobility killers on red forest or rotten fields, feels bad, ruin makes it easier
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Rotten fields is absolutely crazy. Even Nurse doesn't stand a chance on that map, because cornblindness. Whenever I get that map as survivor, I just lean back and am like "Well GG WP, everyone".
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Nerf Doctor
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Playing that map as survivor I'm exactly the same I know most of will likely escape so there's no worry, I've won only a few times and they were either potatoes or I was playing spirit(post-nerfed) all times I needed ruin or else gen rush
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Yeah, I agree. I also know that some people say they lost because Ruin was gone early which is like... Meh. When they get Gens done fast, the Killer is not putting enough pressure (which is not possible sometimes, but thats a map problem and has nothing to do with Ruin.)
I guess thats more of an Plague Issue. I faced a Plague yesterday with Ruin, Thana, PGTW and Corrupt and I was about to vomit (no pun intended), because 4 Slowdown Perks is just lame and boring.
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I can say ruin being gone early or instantly on a small map doesn't effect me that much but on a bigger map it's worse
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Yeah 4 slow down perks are boring but what else can you do? If all of the maps were balanced there wouldn't need to be 4 slow down perks and it's a gamble if you need them or not. My build was overkill because I was on Gas Haven which isn't too bad of a map but if I got another map like Wretched shop or something then my build would have been justified due to the strong structure.
Sometimes you just can't chance having a relaxing build because unless you burn map offerings you have no idea what map you will get and if it will be in your favor, not bad or survivor sided.
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Yeah, but this is something which does not apply to "Ruin gone" or "Ruin not gone". This is simply the amount of Pressure a Killer can apply. This has so many factors, of course the Killers Skill and the Survivor Skill (if the Survivors are better, they also should win. Only because Killer is the Powerrole should not mean that they should win every game). But also the Maps and those are the biggest factor IMO. There is no interaction between Killer and Survivor and a Gen can be done without any interaction happening, because the Killer needs to cross the Map.
But I would say, this has nothing to do with Ruin. You will have a hard time on lets say Disturbance Ward with or without Ruin, because of the size and that stupid Building in the middle. Had one of those games recently, outplaying them at every structure, but once they ran to that building, I needed to let them go there, because I would waste too much time (which again, would lower my pressure). I dont blame Survivors for that, if I am there, I use it myself. But those are things that need change.
And well, like you said, if the Map is small, it does not really matter. e.g. Wreckers Yard, pretty good Map for Killer, small, and some of the worst Totem Spots (like almost all Totems are in T/L-Walls, often enough next to Gens). You can have a pretty good game on that Map even without Ruin (or gone early because it needs to spawn on one of the most obvious places).
In the more recent stats it was Number 1:
Only followed by Haddonfield (which still sucks, even after the BL-Nerf, so everyone who was happy about that will hopefully have a good time on Haddonfield now.../s) and Cowshed, which can have the most stupid RNG (Cow-Loop into Jungle Gym into Long Wall Into Shack into Long Wall into Long Wall into Jungle Gym...).
I mean, not every Map needs to suck like Hawkins when it comes to Pallets (there are two safe Pallets, the rest is pure #########), but I feel that Badham has a good value of Pallets. A lot of them, mostly unsafe, but with safe Pallets in the Buildings. Rotten Fields is also not really enjoyable as Survivor, at least for me, because the only advantage it brings is the size. The Map itself is horrible with the giant Deadzones.
If they would rework a lot of Maps (and I really hope for the new Roadmap to have less chapters and also some game health patches), there could be so much more. Like from those 6 Maps displayed here, all 6 need to be reworked (with Lerys getting it already). Even the Game is not a good map, it is boring to play, because there are mostly safe Pallets and no Vaults, so you can only loop Pallet after Pallet... And it only really benefits the Killer for the size and the Totem Spawns, and if you are not running Ruin (like me), you need to deal with the shitload of safe Pallets without any real benefit.
So yeah, Maps are the problem, not Gens and not Ruin.
Post edited by Aven_Fallen on1 -
I love when people who only play survivor explain that ruin had no effect anyway when in reality every great skillcheck didn't give any progress.
Ruin declared as crutch ok. Each potato that parrots and trolls should do a livestream today. Play clown, no ruin allowed and only cool maps such as ormond or rotten fields. Show us how you apply the pressure.
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Oddly Ruin is one of those perks you don't actually need, but at the same time you get punished for not having it a lot. So it's like a hypothetical perk if someone's says they need it you can argue for or against it and no ones technically wrong.
Problem is without it being in the game the main reason it was used which was for bad map matchups. A lot of players will struggle because of those maps. Removing the perk without solving the issue for what it was used for is honestly a bad idea.
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Thank you! Maps are the real issue.
Devs prefer to nerf perks cause its easier than reworking map. Same was with balanced landing. Heavily abused on Haddonfield and created broken near infinites on Hawkins. Solution? Nerf the perk. As we can see, BL nerf didn't do crap for Haddonfield survival rates. Maybe perks are not the issue?
Ruin helped with early pressure so that you could afford 1-2 more slightly longer chases. It was a gamble, helping very little on small maps and quite strong on bigger maps (if lasted for about 2 mins)
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Have never unlocked ruin and have only played hag once (many years ago and was destroyed so never tried again). Yes generators can go really fast with a SWF but that can happen with ruin anyway but from never using Ruin in my games, I haven’t learned to play without relying on it. Keep in mind I use other perks, discordance and surveillance being my favorite, to keep gens in check.
Long chases is what destroy killer not gen speeds. If I sense a strong loop or survivor I just leave them and mess with those working on gens. Interrupting gens was the best lesson learned over the years. I also play Legion (main), Pig, Plague, and Ghostface and have gotten Red ranks consistently if I play enough.
Also killer mains, try endgame builds it has been so fun changing the games power balance with perks like Blood warden, Remember me, and Rancor. Survivors think they have it in the bag, then BOOM. Surprise lol survivor main btw, everyone can do it! Play both sides you’ll learn a lot.
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Sounds to me like you were underestimating them. Killer main, btw, so no bias here.
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Even with survivor's being that great, even if they land a good skill check with current ruin, they are still at least partially delayed. So it can allow more pressure off survivor mistakes raising your chances for victory. Now under a perfect concept they never miss a great, your outcome would still be slower with ruin, then without due to the great skillcheck bonus.
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Depending on the team a long chase can literally be two fifteen second chases. A big thing never accounted for is killer travel times, to find people.
These minor aspects if you say roughly at the start of the match if you're a killer with a base spped it's roughly 25, to 30 seconds to find someone and that's under perfect circumstance.
But also you loose points for using the end-game collapse to your advantage, both in ranking and BP. It's not rewarded at all, also rancor moris's also aren't rewarded so ya know...yeah.
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honestly as doc it is hard to do basically anything on a large map and ruin is really good on large maps so i cant blame you for complaining after all it is basically impossible to win in that situation regardless of how good you are at the game
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Ruin only worked on potatoes so regardless you will always beat potatoes
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Use a slug build and tunnel the first survivor then you can play without Ruin. I'm not going to play without it until the nerf is here for real. Going to enjoy being killer and survivor until that sad day comes.
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