Unfun and frustrating to play against: The Ghostface
Comments
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I agree they need to fix GF, many times servers are messed up and I can't stalk anybody :(
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How is playing the killer as intended "abusing" him? I feel like that word gets tossed around too much.
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Honestly, I sometimes feel like I am the only one who has never had a problem revealing GF.
I've had problems getting revealed through objects and stuff.
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Uh oh! They used they keyword to guarantee an Immediate nuke-level Nerf. He's "frustrating" to play against.
His nerf will now be on the level on Ruin. Get to it devs. survivors aren't happy.
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"hIs PoWEr HaS nO cOUntEr PlAy"
Get's revealed behind walls btw...
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Imagine complaining against a M1 killer who is still loopable and victim of the bad map design. I'm sorry but GF is by far the broken killer on dbd.
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In my experience a lot of survivors just don't understand how Ghostface work and try to reveal him at the wrong angle or when he is peeking. If you are not confident in your ability to reveal him, just run away, while he is nice enough to give you a huge headstart by stalking.
Of course a good Ghostface will not waste time trying to stalk when they know its pointless and will just jump you with no TR. But at the end of the day he is just a regular M1 killer who get easy first hits. Not much different from Legion if you think about it.
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They event changed his name to compensate!
He's now known only as 'Face'
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Yeah they need to clean up his reveal for both sides.
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Just keep crying about him, I promise they will nerf him if you do.
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Ghostface is fine except for the reveal mechanic. It is busted from both sides.
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ghostface doesnt need to be nerfed at all, he needs to be fixed because his reveal mechanic is so buggy.
though tbh if they do fix it he’ll probably need a buff cause he’ll most likely become weaker from it, oddly
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Did you take note of his addons? Cause that was a pretty fast stalk on the guy that just left the hook.
I assume you don't have an issue with the other 2 getting stalked right?
Here's why you got stalked. You're not behind cover there. Enough of you is visible. Hide better.
But hey, apparently you have more examples, give me your best one.
OoO was and still is BS.
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The funny thing is, he probably is super frustrating for new players to go against because of his reveal mechanic being so buggy.
Not to mention one shot downs in any form are considered OP by lower rank players.
He Doesn’t need a nerf at all, but if you buy into the Dev excuse of Ruin being changed for that reason GF would be next.
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What is wrong with crouch spamming, you are extremely loud when crouching
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GF is just your standard m1 killer. Thing is he has more mindgame potential and usually he can sneak on you for the first hit. You just need to think a bit and not afkbrain to counter him
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Unfun and frustrating to play against is the new "overperforming" m
emeand excuse to try to nerf everything we don't like into the ground.You know what's legitimately unfun and frustrating that hasn't been addressed or acknowledged by BHVR? The sound issues.
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No need for a rework, just fix the revealing. Its just buggy the whole time. You can literally walk behind him and nothing happens, but the moment he turns around youre exposed.
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Y'all are asking the wrong questions. What you should be asking, is why don't survivors have first person view? Most all horror games do, makes them scarier. If you have fps view but can turn your camera 180 like in other games such as, Rust, or Ark for example, if GF is in your sight, it will insta reveal him. Problem solved for both sides, no more getting revealed from behind giant rocks, and no more not being able to reveal while he is standing directly in front of you with your character facing him. Put car mirrors on gens and BOOM you can see em from the mirror. Why nerf or fix whats not broken? GF wastes a lot of time stalking, and HAS to slug to secure kills if gens go too fast. Alternatively we could give him permo sneak like tier 1 Myers and make stalking an add-on.
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Please stop
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I play mainly survivor btw.
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Spine chill absolutely dumps on ghostface, and is already an S tier perk to begin with. You can also stack it with resilience for the vault build.
If you are struggling with stealth killers, try running it over the meta.
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I personally, heavily dislike playing against Ghostface. Not so much because he is "OP", but moreso because the hit and run, no-stalk style of play that most GF use is boarderline broken in a huge number of scenarios depending on map, and even certain map tiles. Regardless of the fact that he can be looped, there are gens on nearly every map that are in enclosed spaces that don't give you line of sight to see him coming. Sure, you search and do the gens that are in more open areas, but eventually you run out of those. The extreme synergy with Nightshroud and A Nurse's Calling additionally makes it difficult to recover the free hit he tends to start encounters with. This doesn't even mention the extremely campy nature that lot of GF players like employ around hooks by using their stalk mechanic to expose the unhooker. The broken reveal mechanic and ability to act like a whack-a-mole (popping in and out of cover and resetting the reveal duration while gaining stalk) and expose survivors is additionally frustrating to play against. I'd prefer to play against any killer over GF, yes even Nurse and Spirit, all day.
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But it's ok for survivors to t-bag?
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Trickle down balancing. You're wrong.
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I hated GF as a survivor so I started using home when playing killer. Now I find him a lot easier.
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If they would give every killer some form of map pressure they would not need to rely on tunneling.
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The one real problem with Ghostface is that his revealing mechanics are janky to the extreme. Survivors can both reveal him when they have no business to and fail to reveal him when he is in super plain sight.
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Can you survivors please stop to come always with "it is unfun to play against..." (its not the first time for me) up towards the killers that make actual fun for killer-players?
You know... This game is not a 1 way road. Survivors have also a variety of perks and behaviors developed, that are unfun for me as killer player and did you see killers come up with the same apporach like survivors?
To change the basekit is a very deep nerf for every killer (and would be for surivovrs too). Always, no matter if the killer gets better or worse later in the statistics (because the playstyle changes after that dramaticly, most of the time).
Imagine survivors would be treated the same, because XYZ is unfun. Imagine survivors would get basekit changes because of it. What would you say?
Damn man, let other people please a little bit of fun and rob not everything from them.
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If his reveal mechanic wasn't so broken I wouldn't mind facing him.
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They just need to fix his reveal mechanic some and tweak that, then he will be fine.
I had a problem where he was all people played, but once you get rank re-set out of red ranks you see him a lot less thankfully.
If you want to talk against unfun killers I would put pig at the top of that list.
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Things like this deserve usually a bugfix... but I am not sure if that would be good.
The last killer I had love to play and still like enough to play him had 2 exploits and at a minimum 1 op addon that needed to be changed (in my opinion even more addons).
Instead of fixing those things like any other company, bhvr has gone even further and also changed his basekit massivley.
So I am not sure if it is good to ask for a bug fix. I am worried, everytime, since then, that they don't stop there.
Who knows... Maybe they fix it with a stun everytime Ghostface got revealed or something like that... There I prefer the old ways.
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Ghostface needs a bugfix, not nerf, he is completly fine now. Killer standard is not Legion, Clown or Pig, you know?
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Ghostface is my least favorite killer because he has two things I hate playing against, a stealth mechanic and the ability to one shot you. His entire power is buggy and cheesy. I despise Ghostface which is weird because I love the Scream movies.
Even though you don’t like playing against him doesn’t mean he has no counterplay though.
The ONLY thing that should be changed is the reveal mechanic because it’s legit broken. You can stare at him and he’ll still expose you or he’ll get revealed behind a wall.
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He’s not fine now, and before you tell me I don’t know how to reveal him... I Tried in KYF and literally stood and stared at him while he stared at me from opposite ends of shack.
He marked me AND then walked to me and downed him without ever being revealed... fine? No way
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Which part of "Ghostface needs a bugfix" you don't understand
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How is it "frustrating" to verse a Ghostface? Can't you see how happy he looks on the field?
In all seriousness, a big fat NOPE would do.
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This is either the salty ramblings of someone who doesn't understand you need to have him in the center of your screen to break him out of his power, or bait.
Either way it's really sad.
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They realized their steam forums was just an echo chamber of crying so they flooded reddit and here bc survs arent allowed to have any opinion that benefits them at all.
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This discussion is pointless. First of all, DBD isn't a casual game in the first place so casual players don't really exist. Next, Ghostface is one of the only fun killers to go against if the player isn't camping. Unfun would be Spirit because they Mori tunnel and Clown because it's just boring as hell. Ghostface is already underperforming due to stalking never working properly. So if anything he needs to be looked at with positive intentions. If you really have trouble against Ghostface then just run Spine Chillnor OoO.
Edit: When it comes to "looking at a killer" it always means a nerf. So you're just asking for one of the only regularly viable killers to be nerfed. This would leave Nurse, Spirit, Billy, and Huntress.
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Am I the only one that finds it ironic that many people complain if a killer has a power that does not require much effort while the entire role of survivor requires little effort?
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Look, as a killer even I think he needs to be reworked, but we've seen how the devs "rework" stuff. Always against the killer's interests.
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I completely agree. He is the one killer that really makes me hate playing survivor. I say this as someone who has never had an issue with Spirit, and could tolerate old Nurse too. I don't like Legion either but GF is on a whole other level. What I'm trying to stress is that everyone will have killers they like and dislike but to me GF is so bad he ruins the game.
I'll try to give an in-depth post here to try and put my points across. It's not that Ghostface is overwhelmingly OP, although he is really strong I feel a few killers still have an edge on him however the problem with Ghostface is that he feels "cheap".
So to start with - Old Freddy. Despite people complaining he was weak a lot of people did enjoy playing as old Freddy, myself included. What made him fun? he was completely invisible for a start, survivors never knew exactly where you where. Likewise he had wallhacks basically with the aura reading meaning you could track survivors throughout most of the game. On the survivor side however this is what made him so awful to play against. He wasn't overpowered but he felt cheap. You never got that thrill or rewarding feeling of losing him in a chase because as soon as you stepped outside of terror radius he would see your aura before you even had a chance to wake yourself up. He was a cheap and unfair feeling killer. So although I liked playing AS him, I hated playing AGAINST him and I agree he needed to be reworked.
Ghostface provokes those same feelings. I'll try to break it down into the main points...
- Lets start with the reveal mechanic. This is so spotty and seems to have a mind of its own. Sometimes it will work from a mile out without you trying, other times you can be right in front of him and nothing is happening. It doesn't even start to reveal him. More often than not it works in Ghostfaces favour and the survivor has to mess about and spend so long trying to get it to work that by that time Ghostface is either close enough to get a hit because the survivor has run a poor route due to having to stare to hard, or GF has exposed them. I know people say it feels the opposite when playing GF and yes there are some circumstances where you get revealed when behind objects but I've also had situations where I was behind a survivor, they were staring at me and I was staring at them, I'm running after them while stalking, I expose them and they didn't even start to reveal me. I've also had survivors stare at me across pallets and nothing happens. The reveal mechanic is completely busted and is a major source of frustration with Ghostface among players.
- His power. Wraith sneaks up well but then gives a short ding-dong allowing survivors a brief time to react. Likewise The Pig either roars or has to uncrouch giving survivors some time to react. Ghostface gives none. Not only does he give no warning but he isn't slowed down in any way. He's still fast enough to get hits. Why is he so much more powerful than the other two? well he was designed with the 16m audio warning of his cloak, however that got changed and now there's absolutely zero warning if you don't have line of sight. He is guaranteed that hit. Apparently from the last patch notes he is meant to have an 8m noise but with sounds being so broken I can honestly say I've barely heard any sounds from him in months. In addition to this if you don't notice him in time then you get exposed and instadowned. It seems a little bit powerful for someone who has such strong stealth. That's normally how games start with him. Everyone is on a gen, you notice the exposed status appear on one survivor icon then they're downed. Being picked off and instadowned at the start of the game feels very unfair and very cheap and it's not surprising that most survivors disconnect against him.
- In chases. The game was designed around the killer having a red stain and terror radius. Good killers learned that part of being a good player was to hide that red stain and mindgame. Ghostface doesn't have to do any of this. You just tap M2 mid chase at a jungle gym and the survivor has absolutely no warning of where you are or where you're looking. There's no skill involved and it's often just a free hit for Ghostface.
However is Ghostface fun to play? yes he is. His stealth is second to none. Survivors never see you coming. Combine that with Nurse's calling and you can pick survivors off when they're trying to heal. Likewise you get to stalk them and they either can't do anything to stop you, or to stop his stalk they have to try so hard that they end up running into walls and you get a free hit anyway. So like my point about old Freddy, it's the exploitative nature of Ghostface that makes him fun to use but it's also what makes him unbearable to play against.
From his initial launch I do agree he was too easy to reveal and I do agree his 16m audio warning was a little too loud however now they have gone too far in the other direction. I see people instadowned out of nowhere or even yanked off gens all the times. It feels cheap as there is no warning or anything.
So what would I change?
Well bring back the noise for a start. It doesn't need to be as loud as before but it certainly needs to be louder than it is now, if it's even playing a noise at all. Who can tell with all the sound issues? also 8m is far too short. If you feel 16m was too large an area then at least try 12m.
The reveal area needs to be bigger. The center of the screen isn't always what it appears to be. I've noticed some people looking too low for what the game considers the centre even though Ghostface does indeed appear to be central in their screen. Basically it's not intuitive for players where the game wants you to aim.
Also GF shouldn't be able to stalk a second - hide behind a rock, breaking the survivors reveal progress but keeping his own stalk progress. This just feels like an exploit.
I also think his stalk progress should be reset on that specific survivor if that specific survivor reveals him. As it stands now he can stalk a few seconds, you reveal him. Later he will stalk again and you reveal him. On the third time however since he already has progress he is guaranteed to expose you. This feels unfair. If I remember correctly originally revealing him did indeed reset stalk progress? but I think one survivor revealing him reset it for everyone. I'd just make it so that the survivor revealing him gets their progress only reset. That way a good survivor has counterplay to him.
Once again I can not stress how much this killer sucks the fun out of the game for me. I thought Legion was dull but GF is on another level. At least Legion is just dull as well, not cheap and exploitative like Ghostface feels.
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Unfortunately I've had many instances where I'm staring directly at him in plain sight and the reveal does not work. It's totally glitchy. Other than this, I have no issues playing against GF with the exception of the GFs that hide near the hooked survivor so they can mark the person doing the unhooking.
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sorry for the double post but I forgot to add, OP was right about GF with the camping and tunneling. He's so effective at it that it's the go-to strategy for almost every single Ghostface I've ever faced.
At bare minimum Kindred should trump all killer stealth abilities again. Why give protection to campers?
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Yeah i truly don't get the need to put a killer like him in the game when the mechanics involved are so obviously not gonna work properly.
just look at him harder guys
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Again Ghostface's reveal Isn't broken just because you don't know how to do it properly it's middle of the screen with no hitboxs in the way yes that includes your character
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Trying to make another killer not viable in red ranks I see.
The only thing that GF needs is a power that isn't buggy (for now).
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THIS "This killer is totally unfun and frustrating to play against, especially for casual players" is a dangerous sentence to use. Devs actually might look into this now.
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Ghostface is not invisible. Stealth but not invisible. All you have to do is start looking instead of hearing, like with other killers.
2 of the main issues you mentioned are bugs. This means he needs a bugfix, not a rework.
If reveal and sounds worked, you could just look at him from faraway range, and hear if he tries to attack. I disagree with the chase part. His power is supposed to down surviviors quickly if they let you stalk them, just like Shapes super lunge, and ghostface has his stealth. His power depletes quite quickly, so once you notice him you should just loop him.
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