Sorry but without SWF this game would be healthier...
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I've met a fair few SWF teams, usually the 2-man teams, that were good sports in the match. They took losing well, and we had a good chat about it afterwards. The problem is, people like to group SWF into these toxic 4-man hitsquads, which I won't deny exist, because I've had them as opponents in matches, but people blow it way out of proportion saying it's nothing BUT 4-mans. I wouldn't want casual SWF's who most likely just play to have a laugh together have their experience ruined because killers demand it removed. As long as BHVR finally make it so killers can have a similar buff to their communication, then there would be no issues anymore.
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That would be very hard with current player count. Maybe if you are very lucky. But 4 player SWF? Impossible
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They wont
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Without SWF, this game would have no player base to speak of. Many players were originally attracted to the game due to the social element of playing with your friends vs an unknown killer. Nearly every person I know that plays was originally attracted due to the SWF element.
Take that away and you have your long que times.
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Did you play solo on red ranks? There are players with 100 and even less hours on rank one. They have no game sense at all and you are telling me I am supposed to die with ######### teammates. No thanks. I don't play in a try hard SWF group. We almost never use items, don't discuss what perks we are taking we are just playing normally with voice chat. If there was no SWF I would be a killer main.
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People who want to play with friends are not gonna waste their time in these que’s, and likely just flat out not play the game. And with the current state of matchmaking, this would significantly worsen the que’s altogether.
Not to say I can’t see where you’re coming from; some players will just shrug it off and play the game but without SWF, matchmaking would take significantly longer than what it is NOW. I often don’t take the game super seriously when playing it, and so does my group when we play together.
Acknowledging weakness and opinions: I regularly use the function; so you can interpret my opinions based off of my relevant experience provided to the topic.
But so many others use this feature; and playing with friends can make the game so much more enjoyable, and KYF (while fun sometimes) just doesn’t feel as good as going in blind and getting BP, in KYF I never feel like I’m productive, per se. Maybe for making edited screenshots, but that’s as far as I draw the line.
EDIT: Grammar is a drag to write with. Yuck.
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If you make the experience miserable enough they will.
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Atm, matchmaking wait time comes down to there being 2 lines...1 for killer and 1 for survivor. The fact that I'm getting instant lobbies as killer but having to wait awhile as survivor implies that the survivor line is bigger than the X4 size it needs to be for the game to function. If that line got shorter, I dont think that would WORSEN queue times. I dont think SWFs are as much of a problem as some people on here, but I'm just failing to see your logic here.
It would be similar to waiting in line for a roller coaster, just to find out that the rollar coaster is setup so groups of people cant sit together. If people leave the line because they cant imagine riding the rollar coaster without sitting next to their friend... That's only going to make things faster and smoother for those remaining.
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There’d be no players. Playing solo sucks most the time and the majority of survivors today are swf on some degree.
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Every time Behavior does anything, like with the recent changes to Hex: Ruin, all the Chicken Little's come out to speak of doom & gloom. The game is still here as strong as ever.
I thought for awhile that having the ability to play SWF, at least 4-people, in Public matches was a mistake & would be better suited for Private matches. The issue there is that 1. people want to play with their friends and 2. no one wants to play Private games because you can't get Bloodpoints.
I read a nice compromise that I thought would be a good idea: show the killer in the lobby who is playing SWF. This way, if the killer doesn't want to deal with it, they can leave the lobby or potentially change their build accordingly. It might make it harder for some teams to get lobbies but that's better than eliminating it entirely.
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Typical unspportable hogwash.
Stop spouting off nonsense, thanks.
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People who call for an end to SWF (or a nerf to it) are just bad killers (or survivors) who haven't spent any amount of time playing SWF.
SWF is a minority. Toxic bullying SWFs are a minority within that minority.
Anybody who wants to criticize SWF needs to spend an entire day playing in SWF on the public official DBD discord in various SWFs and then come back here and complain (if they still want to).
The problem is that killers and solo survivors would rather blame SWF or something about the game than improve their skills.
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pretty sur eit would be dead lol since every time I spent a night, including last night, checking profiles in lobbies where at least one I could see their friend list most lobbies had at least one duo when not two duos or a trio with 4 man being less common though i still came across some of those as well. Obviously I had to stop dodging the double duo lobbies or killer would literal become unplayable for the lobbies I got, the longest I was willing to spend was around 45 minutes to pushing an hour before finally taking the duos to get it over with. yes, I've spent almost a whole hour dodging swf lobbies on more than one occasion once I got fed enough up with them. now with new mmr you won't even have the hope of the rando filling in a trio's lobby being potato enough to make winning possible since it'll eventually only be the solos able to handle themselves. Meaning I'm not gonna waste my money on killer skins any more since I won't be able to enjoy doing well with any specific killer for too many nights in a row unless I afk on them for at least a couple of hours a day to offset any decent matches.
Postscript: Even if the graph above was truthful and accurate (always questionable if it isn't done by a neutral third party and is instead information presented to you by the company protecting it's game and profits especially in today's world) even that picture still shows that about half the games had some sort of swf even it was just duo lol.
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Also add a voice chat you can op out of.
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Please don't be stupid, the dev's arlready said those statistics are innacurate - too many variables. Also it's old statistic's the game has changed a lot Since a year ago.
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I'm sorry, but I would never play this game solo, untill devs solve so many screaming problems like tunneling, facecamping, bad killer balance, bad perk balance and overall fix the game. It's a torture when you are running around for minutes while other randoms crouch around helplessly.
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the first half of which will continue to exist as long as swf does without an option to opt out of those lobbies lmao
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I'd say they should balance around it - under the assumption that they significantly buff solo survivor. If they don't do the latter, they definitely shouldn't do the former.
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SWF is fine and people like you need to get over it. Nothing will ever be done to SWF just get better at dealing with them and enjoy the game. They do any kinds of making swf harder the game will lose a ton of playrs just because you can't play with friends and another thing being any nerfs they gave would be so minor it'd not matter. Peanits has also said it'd never happen because it'd just punish any solo people that get matched with a SWF.
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they've never once said swf was a problem. Buffing killers for swf would further ruin solo players as well.
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Just imagine what that balance is for SWF With top perks combos.
Killers getting 6 perks may be the answer to balancing 4x 4 (4perks per survivor). 🤔
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I Believe you should heed your own words as you just replied to a comment from 7 months ago.
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Sure.... I believe those stats. I'd love to see the breakdown in red ranks. If it's 20% chance or less to have a 3man swf let's have them showcase who is swf and who isn't in the lobby.... shall we?
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You do know the post you just replied too was from 7 months ago.
Its always best to look the date of a post before hand.
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Sorry, but this game would die without SWF.
Current state of queue times should show you how many people are willing to put up with solo survivor.
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And why would the date have a dramatic effect on team composition metrics?
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Because things can and do always change and why most stats are constantly updated.
Who knows there may be more but there may also be less.
They probably won't release anymore as much like you stated you don't believe them anyway many other stated the same because it doesnt fit with what one wants to be true.
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I believe them, they are taking all ranks into account however. Red ranks are not 20%. Not even close.
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Not being mean I love Solo que and never complain and agree that players need to improve their skill. I also have to say using mics and letting each other know where the killer is and not needing to equip perks like Kindred and Dark Sense and Spine Chill, and so many more and being able to equip more useful perks is not skill. I also want to say before the rest of my post that I have played SWF and was not a fan for many reasons but the main one was the lack of needing to really use skill. I mean if my friend said the killer is here I knew for a while I was safe until they said I lost vision. Then I had to look and watch unlike solo ques who have to rely on their skill and eyes and ears to always watch because they don't get this feedback.
Don't you think it takes more skill to play the game the way it was designed and learn that way over finding a way to in a sense break the system so all survivors start built with all vision perks (Comms)? I mean the one reason I do not play on comms or mics and I have tried, is because I feel then the skill level need drops because it becomes a game of knowing where the killer is most the time. Then being able to simply communicate every next step then actually relying on SKILL to look and watch your own area.
Overall I agree with your one thing that yes everytime a killer has a horrible game they assume SWF but your thing about survivors blaming SWF for their lack of skill confuses me. I mean the only thing I see solo que survivors blame SWF for is making things like Keys and Perks look OP that we do not use in solo que because we cannot abuse like these things get abused in SWF. I mean DS and BT are or were at least very used and abused in SWF and keys in SWF were scary and OP and normally ended with a 3 or 4 survivor escape. In a solo que none of that happens and it is not a lack of skill but the lack of communication unlike in SWF were you can tell your team things like, jumping in the locker gonna use my DS or I found the hatch and tell your entire team to come over and escape.
Anyway I hope you have a great day and I hope this new Matchmaking system treats you well. Live long and prosper Nano Nano!!
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Sorry to say but the reason some perks may be broken is because they were considered strong and that is in part thanks to some SWF players abusing them. I am not saying you are one but most the time when a perk gets considered OP it is because SWF use them in such a planned and communicated way, like telling your team to get behind me I have DS and then getting down and using DS. That makes the perk look OP when this happens over and over.
I also think sadly tunneling will always be a thing and that is not easy to fix because they cannot tell the player they can't do it. I mean I was told that is what DS was for but even that doesn't help much.
Also to the torture of running around minutes only to have solo que teammates hiding and doing nothing will always be a thing. I mean I have had games where I ran the nurse no joke for almost 4 full minutes and I only know this because I started a challenge to get chased for 300 seconds and almost completed it. I ran for about 367 seconds only to see one gen pop and I was like ######### but still we managed to get out. It took more work on my part but yeah I get your frustration but once again the devs cannot tell players how to play.
If you like playing SWF then by all means do it but the reasons you give for playing SWF and only SWF is something that cannot be 100% fixed so just simply say I like playing SWF because I like playing games with friends. =)
I hope this new matchmaking treats you well in your future games....well I guess you don't need to worry you dont play solo que so instead good luck in your future games. =) <(^.^)> Live long and prosper NANO NANO!
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Whiny killer as usual the game would be fair if instant kill perks and add on like tombstone would be removed, or killed perks had limits just like survivor , hell the game would be fair if they removed Mori and instant downs but no one is complaining about that now are they . I play both sides , get good
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I hear you.
Actually, SWF does take quite a bit of skill. In fact, it takes different skills.
Communicating is not everyone's best skill. If you are playing in public SWFs, you never know what you're going to get. You could get someone who doesn't talk, someone with a heavy accent, someone brand new to the game, or even a know-it-all. It is a real mixed bag.
When you are with an unfamiliar group, you have added pressure of performing well for them. That doesn't exist in solo. You also have the peer pressure to do exactly what they want or to deal with their sharp personalities.
To assume that every SWF is a well oiled machine and has great advantages due to not having to use Kindred, etc., is not really representative of how it goes. Sure, maybe a minority of SWFs that only play with their set team every week might be represented, but I just don't think that's common. People fall in and out of this game. It's hard to get people to play consistently, so the advantages of the SWF are often compensated for by the quality of the folks in that group and the new challenges that come with communication.
I appreciate that you have played SWF and didn't outright attack it without experience, but you might want to try a refresher. It's actually become even more frustrating with the requirement of adding friends first. Quite often you get to play 2 matches per hour with how long it takes to get things off the ground.
And, to add to the above, if a killer manages to kill off 1 or 2, you lose a lot of the advantages you mentioned in your post as you have far fewer eyes on the killer. Yes, you have spectate, but it doesn't provide the same level of information of having another player in the game.
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It's not getting stomped on that people have a problem with, it's feeling like you never had a chance to begin with, like it was rigged from the start... PS Ormond
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Back when SWF wasn't built into the game people would lobby dodge until they could get matched with their friends, take away the ability to queue for SWF and people will do that again. You cannot keep people from playing with their friends lol. They WILL find ways around it.
If they take away the lobby people will either d/c until they get to play with their friends or drop the game entirely. Also you take away the lobby you take away the ability for Solos to potentially coordinated, and for both killers AND survivors to set up and prepare before match. Which could severely ######### over some killers. Some killers need the extra lobby prep time, as do some survivors.
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People did it all the time in the old days before SWF was a thing, I believe that's part of the reason they added the function actually.
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great bate
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This thread got necroed...let it die. Dont respond to 6+ month old posts.
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SWF doenst need to be removed, it needs to be seperated from solo queue and balanced seperatly. IF both modes are balanced, killers don´t need to opt out. But i would like to keep the solo experience, since i enjoy the uncertainty in the game, and thats what swf and all proposed solo buffs take away.
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These stats are bullshit. Most red ranks survivors play in swf.
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I hate the statement "balance around swf". No. Remove it completely. It wasn't here when the game first released, was way more engaging and fun back then too. People who say it's not a healthy change say that because they can't imagine having to play solo que like the game was intended. I'd say about 30 - 35% of the community actually plays swf while the majority plays solo and I also promise you the game would not die from removing swf. It would just get rid of all the whinny losers that can't play worth a damn anyway. You know how you screw over a red rank swf death squad? Proximity camp a hook as Oni or pyramid head, or have one person hooked and one person slugged. They will always make the mistake of going for their friends because that is just their mentality. Play to win stop playing to please other people's standards of what killer should be.
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only way this will even remotely come close to happening if we get voice comms added, give solo survivors baseline kindred, bond and a totem counter (groups dont need this as they are already at an advantage knowing eachother personally, if anything SWF needs handicaps) and giving the killer more power to match the new psychic telepathic network (voice comms) survivors.
without these changes the game will be heavily skewed in favor of pre-made groups.
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i can see a flaw with this tally chart.
solo survivors would EACH be given one point where as a 4man group would only register as 1 point.
for each 4 solo survivors it would give one point into 4man.
so 100 solo survivors will aways be ahead because each individual registers as a digit while the 4man groups will ALWAYS be behind because 4 people in 1 party is 1 party, hence why all the numbers seem to be cut into sections, 2 man groups is almost exactly 1half of solo, 3 man is almost exactly half of 2 man and 4 man is almost exactly half of 3man groups.
kind of odd dont you think that they are almost all exactly half of eachother?
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Healthier and with a playerbase of 5k
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Thats not how it worked it was 100% of all players and how they joined the match as individuals. A 4 man did not could as 1 but as 4 individuals.
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if that is the case shouldn't 4 man be much closer to 3 man than it is currently? because you will far less likely encounter a 3man than a 4 man because its detrimental to not brind some other friend or person you'd played with before as that 1 random could throw your game by feeding obsession perk stacks and such
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This is an assumption as no one really knows that apart from the devs.
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No becasue people play with who is available or who they want too.
Your argument could also be said for the most popular swf group of 2 In those past stats so qhy not just bring another 2 friends? They may be matched with 2 solo who could throw the game in the same way.
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your argument makes sense but duo's being so high also makes sense, i know alot of "couples" who play any game together without inviting anyone else, likewise there are far more duo of friends in the world playing video games than 3 or 4 man groups, this is easily observed in moba style games or MMO's where their habits are heavily noticed.
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I'd say most people don't worry about "filling the last slot".
Nowadays I pretty much only play duo and solo as survivor as only one friend of mine still really plays, but I used to do 3man, 4man and KYF lobbies depending on how many friends were online (there was about 6 of us, with varying timezones and work/school schedules). If we were a 3man it never crossed our mind to try to find some friend-of-a-friend or sit around waiting for a 4th just to make it a 4man instead.
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Yep but devs are not gonna give us real stats. They make up false stats so they can say that it's balanced
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